Ok, that performance and result were really bad. But overall?
The common saying is the league table doesn't lie and this obviously applies when each team has played each other twice, but what about when we haven't even played each team once?
We have had a very difficult start to the season. We have had to play more games than any other team bar Everton (and how are they doing?) And it has been one of the hardest starts we have endured.
Of our 9 league games so far we have played 7 of the current top 8, And only 2 teams from the bottom half of the table. Add to this a 2 legged tie against a German top 4 team, a game against a Spanish top 4 team and an away game to the Russian champs. In the league cup we had an away game against a premier league opposition (whilst most of our rivals got drawn against lower league teams and so could afford to rotate more).
Despite this, if you compare the points gained this season with the equivalent points last season, we are actually 1 point better off this season. I have substituted Newcastle away with hull away since Newcastle were the best of the teams to come up and hull were the best of the teams to go down. (Can someone double check this for me? That seems a big difference)
What this means is that we have 8 out of our 10 next league games against teams in the bottom half. If we were to lose most of these then there would be a crisis, but there is every possibility we will win and put together a bit of a run.
Just some perspective.
Is it really that bad?
posted on 23/10/17
I agree it’s not too bad.
Yesterday was a sickener as I really fancied us to get a result but unfortunately we made a lot of mistakes.
As Wessie says though, it’s not like we had 20% possession and 20 shots on target against to 3 on target for.
In general play it was a pretty even game but when you make it so easy for the opposition to score it means the result then doesn’t reflect general play.
Obviously we have to stop doing that quickly, but I think we will improve defensively. So far we have been way way worse defensively that last season, with more or less the same players. There’s no real logical reason for that to continue. It will probably even out and we will see goals conceded but not at the current rate of 2 a game. If we get that rate down then we will win plenty of games and move up the table.
It’s a 38 game season and there have been enough good performances to think we are far from a lost cause. Some morons are already writing the season off which is mental.
posted on 23/10/17
comment by Zlatan The King Ibrahimovic (U10026)
posted 13 minutes ago
I disagree it tells you relevant progress but fair enough.
I think there's more merit in your point about you playing the form teams and us playing the teams out of form to gain some perspective.
This is where City are a fair team to judge as they've beaten teams from both.
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Fair enough, it isn't ideal and my main point was The form of the teams. This was just something I was curious about.
However, with much of the current criticism.based around what progress has or hasnt been made, It does make me wonder how you measure progress though.
You mention how form and quality of the opposition teams can change from year to year. So does that mean if we finished 3rd with 5 less points than we had last year,is it progress or lucky that the competition was weak? Similarly, if we finish 5th but with 5 more points than last season have we regressed or was it a tougher league?
posted on 23/10/17
That's an interesting question, and quite a difficult one to answer as it'll be based on a subjective opinion of the strength of the league in those two seasons.
For example, you could get worse but finish higher in the league or get better and finish lower depending on how others are doing.
Ultimately the eye test is probably the best way to judge. I think most people with eyes would look at how Liverpool have played so far and think they look worse than last season.
Not that it will stay that way, but it's a fair claim to make up to this point.
posted on 23/10/17
Agree with most of this. Don't think there's much point in judging where we're at until game 19, same with every side. We could go on a great run up until Christmas now we're playing the 'weaker' sides and suddenly it's all rosy again. We could also carry on at the pace we're going and look terrible.
I back klopp to get it right. He's made mistakes but you don't win what he's won if you're not a good manager. The season is far from over.
posted on 23/10/17
There defense is worse that’s fair to say
posted on 23/10/17
2 of out starting 11 v Spurs werent Klopp signings. So we are basically playing wit the same muck that Rodgers finished with. Klopp needs to start signing some defensively minded players.
posted on 23/10/17
I can only judge Liverpool as I see them.
As far as I can see,going forward they are not as good as some make out,their finishing is pretty woeful and since the return of Coutinho the goals scored per game has fallen.As for the defence,that looks more vulnerable than last season.
Forget analysing scores like for like,just look at the performances in the first 9 league games this season compared to last,they are definately worse
posted on 23/10/17
The common saying is the league table doesn't lie and this obviously applies when each team has played each other twice, but what about when we haven't even played each team once?
...
Of our 9 league games so far we have played 7 of the current top 8, And only 2 teams from the bottom half of the table.
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Both of these comments were made by the OP - the same person.
You've effectively just countered the very point you were seemingly trying to make.
posted on 23/10/17
No, things arent as bad as some like to make out.
Obviously you have to question the managers lack of activity in buying some decent defenders in his previous transfer windows, but no point moaning about that now, as we have to settle with what weve got for the time being.
Weve been without our best player for the most part of the season, and without another vital player in Lallana for every game so far.
Looking on the positive side, we are 3 points off 4th, top of our group in the champions league, and both those players mentioned will be back in the next few weeks.
Also, over the next 3 or 4 weeks, all our rivals for top 4 are playing each other.
United v Spurs, City v Arsenal, Chelsea v United Arsenal v Spurs.
So with a little luck we will be in and around where we hope, and maybe expect to be, sooner rather than later.
posted on 23/10/17
comment by plastic fantastic (U21613)
posted 1 hour, 53 minutes ago
I can only judge Liverpool as I see them.
As far as I can see,going forward they are not as good as some make out,their finishing is pretty woeful and since the return of Coutinho the goals scored per game has fallen.As for the defence,that looks more vulnerable than last season.
Forget analysing scores like for like,just look at the performances in the first 9 league games this season compared to last,they are definately worse
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Actually they are not at all.
Results are, after 9 games last season we were 7 points better off.
Performances are actually very similar.
What has changed is that we have made more defensive mistakes (with the same players mainly), and we have wasted more chances (with the same players mainly).