about something more cheerful. BREXIT.
The country is broken, and going nowhere. The Tories are bringing the country to its knees, no doubt they will now try to blame the Labour Party for this mess. But it is 100 per cent at their door. They called the Brexit Vote, they called a General Election and lost their majority. They agreed on the Withdrawal Agreement, and failed spectacularly with a 230+ odd vote defeat, the biggest defeat of any Government this century, or probably ever. Yet May is still refusing to go. Has that woman no shame.
Shamefully as well, the Tories will back her to a man or woman in today`s confidence vote, for fear of them losing their jobs and the Government falling. So where do we go from here? A Government that is being propped by a few extreme Right Wing Northern Ireland MPs, who May had to bribe to come onside, if ever it was the case of the tail wagging the dog, this is it. Aamazing how so few MPs can hold the whole country to ransom.
Only one way forward in my book, Government falls, coalition Government, get through Brexit with a deal of some sort, leave, then have a General Election to try to sort out the way forward after leaving Europe. No Second Referendum, No Leaving with No Deal, No Staying. Just Leave now, and let the Tory Party suffer at the Polls for its years and years of infighting over Europe, and the end game being bringing Britain to its knees.
Right Over to you Fellas, keep it civil. And if anybody can come up with the way forward for Spurs whilst you are at, would be happy to take that on board as well.
Away from football for a bit, let`s talk
posted on 16/1/19
It's depressing that “no deal” is still being mooted. (copied from another thread).
For the avoidance of any doubt a no deal scenario is not something any functioning/competent government would consider.
Most leavers recognise this but the disaster capitalists (ERG and co) continually misrepresent what WTO terms actually mean.
The government's own sectoral impact assessments (which concur with every single proficient public and private analysis) is evidence enough:
There are no WTO protocols for data sharing, aviation, policing, counter terrorism, security, atomic energy etc etc.
"48.A complete ‘no deal’ outcome would be deeply damaging for the UK. It would bring UK-EU cooperationon matters vital to the national interest, such as counter-terrorism, police, justice and security matters, nuclear safeguards, data exchange and aviation, to a sudden halt. It would place the status of UK nationals in the EU, and EU nationals in the UK, in jeopardy, and would necessarily lead to the imposition of controls at the Irish land border.
49.The wider economic impact of an abrupt departure from the EU single market and customs union, and the adoption of WTO conditions for trade, would be felt across a range of sectors, including financial services, the agri-food sector, and aviation. It would have a particularly disruptive impact on cross-border supply chains. The short-term impact on trade in goods would also be grave: the UK’s ports would be overwhelmed by the requirement for customs and other checks. There is simply not enough time to provide the necessary capacity, IT systems, human resource and expertise to deal with such an outcome."
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201719/ldselect/ldeucom/46/4602.htm
posted on 16/1/19
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
posted 5 minutes ago
It's depressing that “no deal” is still being mooted. (copied from another thread).
For the avoidance of any doubt a no deal scenario is not something any functioning/competent government would consider.
Most leavers recognise this but the disaster capitalists (ERG and co) continually misrepresent what WTO terms actually mean.
The government's own sectoral impact assessments (which concur with every single proficient public and private analysis) is evidence enough:
There are no WTO protocols for data sharing, aviation, policing, counter terrorism, security, atomic energy etc etc.
"48.A complete ‘no deal’ outcome would be deeply damaging for the UK. It would bring UK-EU cooperationon matters vital to the national interest, such as counter-terrorism, police, justice and security matters, nuclear safeguards, data exchange and aviation, to a sudden halt. It would place the status of UK nationals in the EU, and EU nationals in the UK, in jeopardy, and would necessarily lead to the imposition of controls at the Irish land border.
49.The wider economic impact of an abrupt departure from the EU single market and customs union, and the adoption of WTO conditions for trade, would be felt across a range of sectors, including financial services, the agri-food sector, and aviation. It would have a particularly disruptive impact on cross-border supply chains. The short-term impact on trade in goods would also be grave: the UK’s ports would be overwhelmed by the requirement for customs and other checks. There is simply not enough time to provide the necessary capacity, IT systems, human resource and expertise to deal with such an outcome."
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201719/ldselect/ldeucom/46/4602.htm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What if the EU are planning to make an example of us in order to discourage others from leaving? Should we capitulate and wave the white flag?
No Deal is undesirable but if we are not going to get a good deal that work for both parties, then we have no choice but to leave without a deal.
The govt had 2 years after submission of Article 50 to plan for our leaving. If they did not do that, then the voters would make their feelings known at the next election.
But Leave we must.
posted on 16/1/19
Mancini.
The UK and the EU have both published hundreds of papers, preparedness notices, objectives etc throughout the Brexit process.
Whilst the EU have repeatedly told the UK the integrity (four freedoms) of the TEU are indivisible and non-negotiable, this has never been understood by the UKG. Chequers for example sought FoM for goods only.
For reference:
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/department-for-exiting-the-european-union
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/brexit-negotiations_en
As I mentioned previously no deal would be a complete and utter disaster for the UK. Read the preparedness notices if you are in any doubt.
Thankfully there is not a majority for one in the HoCs. And even if TM somehow gets her deal through, it does not represent anything like what many Leave voters wanted.
TM is also now in a much weaker position insofar as negotiating potential concessions. In that the EU know any concessions made she’s currently around 230 votes short of getting a withdrawal agreement passed.
And *any* withdrawal agreement will have to include a backstop which the attorney general affirmed to parliament before Xmas.
posted on 16/1/19
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Why do people keep saying that a no deal would be a disaster for the UK?
Many businesses that I know of have already planned for no deal.
Can you give me a specific example of the disaster you are thinking about in the case of a no deal?
posted on 16/1/19
comment by mancini (U7179)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Why do people keep saying that a no deal would be a disaster for the UK?
Many businesses that I know of have already planned for no deal.
Can you give me a specific example of the disaster you are thinking about in the case of a no deal?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where do you start?
How can logistics for example restructure their JiT operating models which they have used for decades in only three months? How long do you think it would take to build warehouses, expand ports, infrastructure etc?
The Port of Dover handles up to 10,000 vehicles each day but the FTA (freight transport association) stated only 1k export permits will be available. Do the maths. A sizeable chunk of UK exports will not be permitted to cross the channel.
https://fta.co.uk/compliance-and-advice?motid=1496
In the UKG’s own no deal preparedness notices advise businesses that they may have to move operations outside of the UK to maintain market access. Many have already. The UKG is actually recommending UK businesses their ‘best bet’ is to relocate outside of the UK in the event of a failure to agree withdrawal.
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/how-to-prepare-if-the-uk-leaves-the-eu-with-no-deal
Who do you believe. Every recognised impact study, or hedge funders, investment bankers etc who back the likes of the ERG who are exploiting Brexit for their own financial interests?
posted on 16/1/19
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
posted 50 minutes ago
comment by mancini (U7179)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Why do people keep saying that a no deal would be a disaster for the UK?
Many businesses that I know of have already planned for no deal.
Can you give me a specific example of the disaster you are thinking about in the case of a no deal?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where do you start?
How can logistics for example restructure their JiT operating models which they have used for decades in only three months? How long do you think it would take to build warehouses, expand ports, infrastructure etc?
The Port of Dover handles up to 10,000 vehicles each day but the FTA (freight transport association) stated only 1k export permits will be available. Do the maths. A sizeable chunk of UK exports will not be permitted to cross the channel.
https://fta.co.uk/compliance-and-advice?motid=1496
In the UKG’s own no deal preparedness notices advise businesses that they may have to move operations outside of the UK to maintain market access. Many have already. The UKG is actually recommending UK businesses their ‘best bet’ is to relocate outside of the UK in the event of a failure to agree withdrawal.
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/how-to-prepare-if-the-uk-leaves-the-eu-with-no-deal
Who do you believe. Every recognised impact study, or hedge funders, investment bankers etc who back the likes of the ERG who are exploiting Brexit for their own financial interests?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
WWSPD , no doubt someone will jump on your factual post screaming “ Project Fear , Project Fear “ . There’s none so blind as those that won’t see .
posted on 16/1/19
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
posted 1 hour, 3 minutes ago
comment by mancini (U7179)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Why do people keep saying that a no deal would be a disaster for the UK?
Many businesses that I know of have already planned for no deal.
Can you give me a specific example of the disaster you are thinking about in the case of a no deal?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where do you start?
How can logistics for example restructure their JiT operating models which they have used for decades in only three months? How long do you think it would take to build warehouses, expand ports, infrastructure etc?
The Port of Dover handles up to 10,000 vehicles each day but the FTA (freight transport association) stated only 1k export permits will be available. Do the maths. A sizeable chunk of UK exports will not be permitted to cross the channel.
https://fta.co.uk/compliance-and-advice?motid=1496
In the UKG’s own no deal preparedness notices advise businesses that they may have to move operations outside of the UK to maintain market access. Many have already. The UKG is actually recommending UK businesses their ‘best bet’ is to relocate outside of the UK in the event of a failure to agree withdrawal.
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/how-to-prepare-if-the-uk-leaves-the-eu-with-no-deal
Who do you believe. Every recognised impact study, or hedge funders, investment bankers etc who back the likes of the ERG who are exploiting Brexit for their own financial interests?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We already experienced "operation stack" of around 200 days even while in the EU.
Many components of factories come from outside the EU yet JIT still goes on. It's just a question of rearranging "lead time".
The Mayor of Calais has come out to say that No Deal would not affect BAU.
We already import from across the world on WTO rules and it takes on average, 6 seconds for goods to pass through our ports.
Somehow, you make it sound like the UK is some kind of back water country which is unable to cope with the challenges posed by Brexit.
No doubt there may be some short term disruption. But it will not be the disaster that you are making it out to be.
Also, Esther Mcveigh recently stated that the govt has signed a number of bilateral agreements with the EU in the case of No Deal to minimise disruption. but the govt has kept this from the public for whatever reason.
posted on 16/1/19
comment by mancini (U7179)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
posted 1 hour, 3 minutes ago
comment by mancini (U7179)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Why do people keep saying that a no deal would be a disaster for the UK?
Many businesses that I know of have already planned for no deal.
Can you give me a specific example of the disaster you are thinking about in the case of a no deal?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where do you start?
How can logistics for example restructure their JiT operating models which they have used for decades in only three months? How long do you think it would take to build warehouses, expand ports, infrastructure etc?
The Port of Dover handles up to 10,000 vehicles each day but the FTA (freight transport association) stated only 1k export permits will be available. Do the maths. A sizeable chunk of UK exports will not be permitted to cross the channel.
https://fta.co.uk/compliance-and-advice?motid=1496
In the UKG’s own no deal preparedness notices advise businesses that they may have to move operations outside of the UK to maintain market access. Many have already. The UKG is actually recommending UK businesses their ‘best bet’ is to relocate outside of the UK in the event of a failure to agree withdrawal.
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/how-to-prepare-if-the-uk-leaves-the-eu-with-no-deal
Who do you believe. Every recognised impact study, or hedge funders, investment bankers etc who back the likes of the ERG who are exploiting Brexit for their own financial interests?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We already experienced "operation stack" of around 200 days even while in the EU.
Many components of factories come from outside the EU yet JIT still goes on. It's just a question of rearranging "lead time".
The Mayor of Calais has come out to say that No Deal would not affect BAU.
We already import from across the world on WTO rules and it takes on average, 6 seconds for goods to pass through our ports.
Somehow, you make it sound like the UK is some kind of back water country which is unable to cope with the challenges posed by Brexit.
No doubt there may be some short term disruption. But it will not be the disaster that you are making it out to be.
Also, Esther Mcveigh recently stated that the govt has signed a number of bilateral agreements with the EU in the case of No Deal to minimise disruption. but the govt has kept this from the public for whatever reason.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not being funny but this flies in the face of all the evidence, should you care to read it.
Countries do not tend to trade on their WTO commitments if possible (no such thing as WTO rules) as they are the baseline of how to trade.
The UK has over 750 of preferential agreements, (mutual recognition/economic partnership agreements for example) across the globe as well as circa 70 global FTAs to ensure goods (especially manufacturing) and commodities can be imported/exported as quick as possible.
There's not a single developed economy on the planet that trade on it's WTO obligations.
The EU (and by default the UK) also agreed an Everything but Arms (EBA) treaty in 2001. All imports into the EU from the 45 most underdeveloped countries are therefore duty / quota free.
Going forward I'd urge you to read some of the UKG's own notices to businesses and stakeholders for further clarification.
posted on 16/1/19
comment by What would Stuart Pearce do? (U3126)
Are you suggesting then that we should remain in the EU in spite of the referendum result?
Are you suggesting that we keep paying £10bn+ net every year to the EU when our public services are being cut to shreds due to lack of funds?
No doubt there will be disruption but we are more than capable to overcome them.
And like I mentioned earlier, most businesses are already one step ahead planning for a no deal scenario.
posted on 16/1/19
The UK EU budgetary contribution (MFF) equates to less than 1% of total annual government spending.
Check the back of your tax return if you don’t believe me.
The SM generates between £62/78 billion to the economy each year not to mention the other preferential global trading arrangements we have thanks to the common commercial policy.
For info:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/theukcontributiontotheeubudget/2017-10-31