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Barca Fire Sale?

So all the reports are that Barca are skint and are having to take a loan out for the Griezman transfer. Their wage bill is absolutely massive compared to their turnover and they are nearly a billion in debt apparently. Think it’s fair to say they may need to shift a few so I have listed a few players, what I think is good and bad about them and who in the league they may fit. I have tried to take into account what teams need on paper and whether they can actually afford them.

Can you multi-board this admin please?

Coutinho the most talked about. Not had the best of times at Barca but his numbers are hardly poor and he knows the Prem. Be expensive though and would doubtless wants CL footy but money talks. PSG would be my guess but there are a few English team that could be a good fit too.
Teams that fit: Liverpool, Utd and Spurs

Dembele: As above really. Versatile but has had some injuries. Couple of disciplinary issues also but bags of talent.
Teams that fit: Liverpool, Utd, Spurs

Suarez: May be getting on a bit but he’s as fit as a fiddle, doesn’t drink, smoke or get injured. Never relied on pace either and has bundles of experience. I can’t imagine he would command that higher a fee either which may bring other clubs into play.
Teams that fit: Liverpool, Utd, Spurs, Arsenal

Arthur: I like this kid. Tekkers coming out of his ass, takes care of the ball and can also use it, can play at DM or CM and at 22 has a lot of game time in him.
Teams that fit: Liverpool, Utd, Spurs, Arsenal, City, Everton, Wolves

Rakitic: Legs have gone imo and Liverpool’s midfield ran him over. More like to leave than Arthur too and would not be that expensive. Guy has class though and a goal in him.
Teams that fit: Utd, Arsenal, Wolves, Everton, Leicester

Semedo: Attacking RB who is excellent going forward and has bags of pace but suspect defensively.
Teams that fit Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal, Everton

Vidal Getting on but bags of class and experience, goal in him, good passing range and works hard.
Teams that fit: Utd, Arsenal

Lenglet: Not a huge fan myself and looks rammal one on one but he is decent with the ball at his feet
Teams that fit Spurs, Arsenal, Everton, Wolves, Leicester

Malcom: Great balance and pace and has a goal in him. Not the finished article by any means but has a high ceiling imo.
Teams that fit: Liverpool, Utd, Arsenal, Spurs, Everton, Wolves, Leicester

Who would you go for and why?


comment by Busby (U19985)

posted on 15/7/19

If he weren't such a cant, Suarez would be exactly what we need right now. A winner, a goalscorer, experience and a leader.

posted on 15/7/19

comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 6 hours, 52 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 17 seconds ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 56 seconds ago
One problem with such a debt is that the clubs mostly over value their assets. So its amazingly difficult to buy from them. They never reduce their price to sell because that actually 'realizes' their value as a loss on the balance sheet.
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Malcom and Rakitic apparently going reasonably 'cheap' though. Think Malcom would be a good signing for Arsenal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You really don't know how much they are asking for those players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I should have written "reportedly" instead of "apparently" maybe but what with this being a sports debating site I thought it would be okay.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No its fair enough but let me explain.

Players are treated as assets. Those assets have a value usually what the club paid for them. They are then depreciated or revalued depending on age, performance etc.

Now if Barca spent £60m on Malcom and they sell him for less Barca make a loss on the player on the balance sheet. That means the club is worth less by the amount they lost on the player. That means the interest rates on that goes up. So Barca cannot sell players for less than they bought them. Now obviously someone like Rakitic has depreciated on the balance sheet so any thing they get for him is a profit. However again that doesn't mean they will sell for a discount. They will try to get the max they can get for him precisely because they want to pay the debt.

So the idea that if a club is in heavy debt they have to sell players cheap is actually the opposite of what happens. Usually clubs that are doing well but don't want the player's salary clogging up FFP tend to sell players cheaply.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're not quite right there.

Barca signed Malcom for EUR41m on a five year contract. That contract will amortise linearly over five years as far as FFP is concerned, so his value for the purposes of the discussion is now around EUR33m.

If they were to keep him for the next twelve months, they'd lose another EUR8m or so in the amortisation of his contract, as well as his wages.

If he's on EUR50k per week (I've got no idea what the actual figure is, this is just for argument's sake), they'd be shelling out EUR2.5m in wages, bringing the total cost of keeping him to EUR10.5m as far as the accountants are concerned.

However, if they didn't bring a replacement in (again, just for argument's sake), selling him now for EUR23m would actually leave them better off in the eyes of the FFP rules in twelve months' time.

posted on 16/7/19

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 10 hours, 49 minutes ago
If he weren't such a cant, Suarez would be exactly what we need right now. A winner, a goalscorer, experience and a leader.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You guys hired Moyes & Mourinho...

posted on 16/7/19

comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimat... (U6374)
posted 15 hours ago
Hi Sheriff

Yes gladly. It's a complex algorithm for some but you'll see Utd are listed on all midfielders and right sided attackers as I feel they need midfielders and right sided attackers. Furthermore you will notice Chelsea are not listed at all as they are not allowed to sign players due to cheating.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah...your point about Chelsea is on the money (so to speak)...however i think you've evaded the main question

And if you think Utds problems are just in those areas you really are making it up

posted on 16/7/19

No I dont think that. I was just explaining why I thought some players on my list would be a good fit for certain teams in my opinion. Because it's an opinion piece there's not really a system or anything really and it is indeed "made up".

Just a thread for a light hearted sports discussion forum.

posted on 16/7/19

comment by rosso is facking happy (U17054)
posted 13 hours, 8 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 6 hours, 52 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 17 seconds ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 56 seconds ago
One problem with such a debt is that the clubs mostly over value their assets. So its amazingly difficult to buy from them. They never reduce their price to sell because that actually 'realizes' their value as a loss on the balance sheet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Malcom and Rakitic apparently going reasonably 'cheap' though. Think Malcom would be a good signing for Arsenal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You really don't know how much they are asking for those players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I should have written "reportedly" instead of "apparently" maybe but what with this being a sports debating site I thought it would be okay.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No its fair enough but let me explain.

Players are treated as assets. Those assets have a value usually what the club paid for them. They are then depreciated or revalued depending on age, performance etc.

Now if Barca spent £60m on Malcom and they sell him for less Barca make a loss on the player on the balance sheet. That means the club is worth less by the amount they lost on the player. That means the interest rates on that goes up. So Barca cannot sell players for less than they bought them. Now obviously someone like Rakitic has depreciated on the balance sheet so any thing they get for him is a profit. However again that doesn't mean they will sell for a discount. They will try to get the max they can get for him precisely because they want to pay the debt.

So the idea that if a club is in heavy debt they have to sell players cheap is actually the opposite of what happens. Usually clubs that are doing well but don't want the player's salary clogging up FFP tend to sell players cheaply.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're not quite right there.

Barca signed Malcom for EUR41m on a five year contract. That contract will amortise linearly over five years as far as FFP is concerned, so his value for the purposes of the discussion is now around EUR33m.

If they were to keep him for the next twelve months, they'd lose another EUR8m or so in the amortisation of his contract, as well as his wages.

If he's on EUR50k per week (I've got no idea what the actual figure is, this is just for argument's sake), they'd be shelling out EUR2.5m in wages, bringing the total cost of keeping him to EUR10.5m as far as the accountants are concerned.

However, if they didn't bring a replacement in (again, just for argument's sake), selling him now for EUR23m would actually leave them better off in the eyes of the FFP rules in twelve months' time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I wasn't being exact just trying to make the point that a fire sale is not what a club does when it is in debt. The point is Barca are not worried about ffp. They are more concerned about rising interest rates and their asset values. Though I am sure the ECB are obsessed with negative rates.

posted on 16/7/19

comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by rosso is facking happy(U17054)
posted 13 hours, 8 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 6 hours, 52 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 17 seconds ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimate objects since 2017 (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Jenius99 (U4918)
posted 56 seconds ago
One problem with such a debt is that the clubs mostly over value their assets. So its amazingly difficult to buy from them. They never reduce their price to sell because that actually 'realizes' their value as a loss on the balance sheet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Malcom and Rakitic apparently going reasonably 'cheap' though. Think Malcom would be a good signing for Arsenal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You really don't know how much they are asking for those players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I should have written "reportedly" instead of "apparently" maybe but what with this being a sports debating site I thought it would be okay.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No its fair enough but let me explain.

Players are treated as assets. Those assets have a value usually what the club paid for them. They are then depreciated or revalued depending on age, performance etc.

Now if Barca spent £60m on Malcom and they sell him for less Barca make a loss on the player on the balance sheet. That means the club is worth less by the amount they lost on the player. That means the interest rates on that goes up. So Barca cannot sell players for less than they bought them. Now obviously someone like Rakitic has depreciated on the balance sheet so any thing they get for him is a profit. However again that doesn't mean they will sell for a discount. They will try to get the max they can get for him precisely because they want to pay the debt.

So the idea that if a club is in heavy debt they have to sell players cheap is actually the opposite of what happens. Usually clubs that are doing well but don't want the player's salary clogging up FFP tend to sell players cheaply.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're not quite right there.

Barca signed Malcom for EUR41m on a five year contract. That contract will amortise linearly over five years as far as FFP is concerned, so his value for the purposes of the discussion is now around EUR33m.

If they were to keep him for the next twelve months, they'd lose another EUR8m or so in the amortisation of his contract, as well as his wages.

If he's on EUR50k per week (I've got no idea what the actual figure is, this is just for argument's sake), they'd be shelling out EUR2.5m in wages, bringing the total cost of keeping him to EUR10.5m as far as the accountants are concerned.

However, if they didn't bring a replacement in (again, just for argument's sake), selling him now for EUR23m would actually leave them better off in the eyes of the FFP rules in twelve months' time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I wasn't being exact just trying to make the point that a fire sale is not what a club does when it is in debt. The point is Barca are not worried about ffp. They are more concerned about rising interest rates and their asset values. Though I am sure the ECB are obsessed with negative rates.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fair enough

comment by Busby (U19985)

posted on 16/7/19

comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 5 hours, 5 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 10 hours, 49 minutes ago
If he weren't such a cant, Suarez would be exactly what we need right now. A winner, a goalscorer, experience and a leader.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You guys hired Moyes & Mourinho...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think there's just too much bad blood. Don't think the fans would take to him and he needs to feel loved.

posted on 16/7/19

comment by Robbing_Hoody - condoning assaults on inanimat... (U6374)
posted 5 hours, 7 minutes ago
No I dont think that. I was just explaining why I thought some players on my list would be a good fit for certain teams in my opinion. Because it's an opinion piece there's not really a system or anything really and it is indeed "made up".

Just a thread for a light hearted sports discussion forum.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fair enough then....I just find there are too many on here who write things without actually backing them up...on our board especially at times...hence the question

If it's just an opinion...I'm fine with it

posted 3 weeks, 6 days ago

the 888 million debt is operating debt ofcourse

most football clubs run on an operating debt as they loan money from banks

how does that debt compare with their revenues and assets ?

comparing loan repayments to revenues and assets is the true way to gauge the financial health of a club

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