Greater Germany, sorry, I mean the EU, is an anti-democratic, outdated, flawed and rapidly failing project. that will inevitably fall apart in the future. Thank Christ we voted to leave. Nuff said!

Then have our government push for change in the EU, not leave and cripple our country. Is it typical liberal to moan about something until you get it? How long had Nigel Farage been moaning about a referendum. Hardly a paragon of liberal virtues.

comment by Lubo - Feed The Sogg and He Will Score (U14008)
posted 59 seconds ago
Then have our government push for change in the EU, not leave and cripple our country. Is it typical liberal to moan about something until you get it? How long had Nigel Farage been moaning about a referendum. Hardly a paragon of liberal virtues.
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How is/will brexit cripple our country.?

comment by Lubo - Feed The Sogg and He Will Score (U14008)
posted 21 minutes ago
Then have our government push for change in the EU, not leave and cripple our country. Is it typical liberal to moan about something until you get it? How long had Nigel Farage been moaning about a referendum. Hardly a paragon of liberal virtues.
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We’ve tried that for years and been given nothing more than scant regard and been scoffed at. Take it or leave it. Nothing and no individual country will ever change the route this self serving EU juggernaut wishes to take.

Well, we’ve left it.

So everytime we have a vote and we don't like the outcome, we just have a march to demonstrate against the vote to have it overturned. Sounds like a great way forward for democracy. Suppose the remain get their way, and then the leavers demonstrate, does that mean it gets overturned and then we are back to leaving ?. And on it goes.

Just wanted to add that Leeds voted more for remain.

Leeds voted Remain but only by the very narrowest of margins. The UK voted to leave by only the very narrowest of margins. It was a surprise result - nobody expected it. Coincidentally, Trump also surprised everyone by winning the presidential election.

We have now learned that there has been lots of lying and duplicity going on and that these results may have been fraudulently manipulated on a scale and with an efficiency never seen before. We may never get to the bottom of it.

We also now know that the UK economy will take a big hit, and the UK will be looking for new deals just at the wrong time. Trump, Xi and Putin are all aggressive nationalists who won't be taking any prisoners or giving special deals.

In addition to paying more for imports, the UK will be competing with the EU on a global basis and getting a worse deal on a regional basis in commerce.

For the future, leaving the EU may well also result in greater deregulation and exploitation, more dodgy "international" capital sloshing around, and you'll be no doubt seeing wages plummet further because immigration from outside the EU will continue to rise. That will make paying for the soon-to-be privatised healthcare system more difficult, particularly as services which have been starved of cash for seven years are already at breaking point.

Meanwhile, two Russians get whacked in Salisbury, the latest in quite a long list of sudden deaths of Russians. It's all very high profile, and the Russian embassy is taking the michael on Twitter, wondering whether we need to send for Hercule Poirot! What does all that mean? It means the UK is the butt of a joke that's now gone global. You can be sure that Vlad is larfing his head off!

But in recalling its ambassador from Moscow, something May has not yet done, the EU has sent out the strongest reminder that it stands in solidarity with the UK, even after everything that has happened with Brexit. They could have left May isolated but they didn't.

Solidarity is a principle that UK citizens who voted to leave would do well to consider a little more deeply. If nothing else, I would ask you to reconsider your positions for the sake of your kids. They will be the ones who will bear the brunt of the permanent scheisse-storm that's heading our way if we don't turn it around quickly!

Wake up! Don't you know the world's on fire?

But in recalling its ambassador from Moscow, something May has not yet done, the EU has sent out the strongest reminder that it stands in solidarity with the UK, even after everything that has happened with Brexit. They could have left May isolated but they didn't.
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The EU need us on-board with respect to anything defence-related.

They haven't got their army yet.

Jaz 63

I think you need to "wake up" and look at the result of the referendum...also when wasn't the world on fire?!

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

NJS - it was a dodgy result...it should be null and void.

and yes, the world's always had wars going on, but wouldn't you agree that what has been going on recently, in the last twenty years or so, has been more and more extraordinary? First 9/11 and the wars in the ME; then the 2008 subprime crash; and then a black American gets in the White House ffs! World trade is just starting to pick up again and then BANG, Brexit and Trump, out of the blue - and we're back to talk of protectionism and war. It's all a bit too much of a coincidence...we've clearly entered a new phase in geopolitical development - of fire-setting...

5,000 apparently turned out in Leeds for the march, which is not a small number, particularly in a city that was more or less split down the middle.

The tragedy is that, now, knowing what we now know - that Brexit will have a negative economic impact particularly in those areas already struggling - a straight-talking Labour leader with no baggage who committed to Remain, to overturning that dodgy referendum result (which was only intended to be advisory in any case), thereby keeping us in the EU, would clean up at the next general election AND stand in good stead for leading a movement to reform the EU.
I agree it's out of balance and lots of work needs to be done to sort it out.

comment by Jaz63 (U8369)
posted 2 hours, 19 minutes ago
NJS - it was a dodgy result...it should be null and void.

and yes, the world's always had wars going on, but wouldn't you agree that what has been going on recently, in the last twenty years or so, has been more and more extraordinary? First 9/11 and the wars in the ME; then the 2008 subprime crash; and then a black American gets in the White House ffs! World trade is just starting to pick up again and then BANG, Brexit and Trump, out of the blue - and we're back to talk of protectionism and war. It's all a bit too much of a coincidence...we've clearly entered a new phase in geopolitical development - of fire-setting...

5,000 apparently turned out in Leeds for the march, which is not a small number, particularly in a city that was more or less split down the middle.

The tragedy is that, now, knowing what we now know - that Brexit will have a negative economic impact particularly in those areas already struggling - a straight-talking Labour leader with no baggage who committed to Remain, to overturning that dodgy referendum result (which was only intended to be advisory in any case), thereby keeping us in the EU, would clean up at the next general election AND stand in good stead for leading a movement to reform the EU.
I agree it's out of balance and lots of work needs to be done to sort it out.



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You're living in a world of your own if you think Brexiteers have changed their mind, every single leaver I know are even more determined to leave. You bang on about lies, what about the doom that was predicted once we voted leave? The doom mongers who predicted we'd suffer if we didn't join the the Euro were wrong so why should we believe them now? You want to believe the negative because you want to remain in the EU

“A dodgy result”

“Now we know”



Honestly, still on this trail that somehow millions upon millions were so duped they went out to ballet boxes to demonstrate their stupidity. Because that’s what it must be right?

Everyone I know wanted out, whether that cost would be. Nobody asked for preconditions to their vote. Anyone who had doubt wanted to and voted to remain.

They still do. They just want to get on with it yet are being held back by the minority trying their utmost to eke something back out of it because it didn’t go their way.

That’s what our government is doing during these protracted negotiations. All that’s happened is you’ve extended the deadline and set us back from whatever road we were on.

Gingernuts, you don't know what road you're on? Says it all, really - you should be lead negotiator! At least half of the UK say you're on the road to nowhere and you're dragging them with you.

All you leavers have fallen for ONE BIG FAT LIE! The UK will be considerably worse off after leaving the EU, particularly if it happens without a deal - which is more than possible.

I just can't believe that you willingly put your trust in people like Johnson, Gove, Fox, May, Redwood, - and Rees-Mogg, ffs! Do you really believe they are working in the best interests of you and your kids?

comment by Jaz63 (U8369)
posted 36 minutes ago
Gingernuts, you don't know what road you're on? Says it all, really - you should be lead negotiator! At least half of the UK say you're on the road to nowhere and you're dragging them with you.

All you leavers have fallen for ONE BIG FAT LIE! The UK will be considerably worse off after leaving the EU, particularly if it happens without a deal - which is more than possible.

I just can't believe that you willingly put your trust in people like Johnson, Gove, Fox, May, Redwood, - and Rees-Mogg, ffs! Do you really believe they are working in the best interests of you and your kids?
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Ok then who should we trust? I hear Turkey are stamping their feet demanding to join the EU? The quicker we leave the better.

The only ones who'll lose are the EU, they sell more to us than we do to them, other countries including Commonwealth Nations and the US are queuing up to trade with us and Brussels are bricking it because they won't be able to impose their taxes on us.
We can take back our sovereignty and our fishing grounds, we can shut the doors and tell em to stuff their quotas.
We weren't asked if we wanted to join in the first place ffs we were frogmarched into europe..........we should just walk

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Jaz63 (U8369)
posted 1 hour, 26 minutes ago
Gingernuts, you don't know what road you're on? Says it all, really - you should be lead negotiator! At least half of the UK say you're on the road to nowhere and you're dragging them with you.

All you leavers have fallen for ONE BIG FAT LIE! The UK will be considerably worse off after leaving the EU, particularly if it happens without a deal - which is more than possible.

I just can't believe that you willingly put your trust in people like Johnson, Gove, Fox, May, Redwood, - and Rees-Mogg, ffs! Do you really believe they are working in the best interests of you and your kids?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The people were offered a choice, I never voted for a conservative government......but I accept they are in power.

People pro remain should march for a general election which will only be won by a pro EU government.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Jaz63 (U8369)
posted 11 hours ago
Gingernuts, you don't know what road you're on? Says it all, really - you should be lead negotiator! At least half of the UK say you're on the road to nowhere and you're dragging them with you.

All you leavers have fallen for ONE BIG FAT LIE! The UK will be considerably worse off after leaving the EU, particularly if it happens without a deal - which is more than possible.

I just can't believe that you willingly put your trust in people like Johnson, Gove, Fox, May, Redwood, - and Rees-Mogg, ffs! Do you really believe they are working in the best interests of you and your kids?
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What?

That’s my point ffs. We voted not knowing all the details. How could we? We’d essentially had enough of what the EU was becoming and had a genuine fear as to where it was going. We were prepared to take the risks whatever they may be. We knew it would be difficult over many years but not how those difficulties might manifest themselves.

I’d happily accuse you of sleepwalking into a complete unknown by staying in the EU. Is it what you voted for or more likely is it all you’ve ever known?

Anyone who voted to be in Europe voted to be in a Common Market. That was it. Nothing else. Take that from where we are now. That’s the fear that most voted to leave.

As for lies, both sides lied. Doesn’t make it right but don’t sit all cosy pointing your finger in one direction. They still are lying. And not one element of those lies are based on fact. Indeed more likely scaremongering and in many cases wishful thinking.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

And now watch Germany and France being asked to make up the deficit when the transition period is over.

Let’s not forget that most of the financial payment calculation was based on not a lot more than protecting the livelihoods and pensions of the remaining Eurocrats.

Tells you all you need to know that a sensible deal will come out of this after the next couple of years of posturing. Wait and see a soft border in Ireland despite the notion it was a make or break scenario. And now guess what; suddenly Gibraltar isn’t an issue any longer. It’s all part of negotiation so for every march and every politician mooting a second referendum, just know you put those negotiations back as Europe see it as a sign of weakness.

Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed so their pensions are still at risk. Quite bloody right too.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

😂 Doesn’t happen often mate.