Good post Foxello. Just want to be clear my own personal opinion that we’re going backwards is purely based on what I’m watching, nothing else.
To counter your narrative, my view is that things are going wrong. Like they did under Peter Taylor, who also had us top of the league. I’m not suggestkngbts that dire, but you can see things aren’t right. Players playing below themselves, wins looking more fortunate than deserved. Players looking confused by tactics.
That’s why I think we’re going backwards. Puel, in my opinion, is doing a poor job of getting the most out of his squad. That’s purely how I see it with the football I’m watching.
You cant really challenge a highly subjective view of where our club currently are as a whole by simply analysing stats - although of course league positions and points are a part of it.
There is no fact here - this is not the same as fake news- because we, the concerned supporters are expressing our subjective opinion - we are not attempting to state facts. It’s completelh different. It’s a narrative based on what we see - and the league finishing positions tell only half of a more complex situation.
Do the league positions you represented above tell the story around how successful our transfer policy has been? Nope. You know as well as me that it’s more in-depth than that.
‘Like they did under Peter Taylor, who also had us top of the league’
While I wouldn’t compare our situation to the Peter Taylor era, this is an excellent example of how a clubs league position (particularly mid way through a season) is no indication on its own of ultimate progress.
Taylor had us top of the league. We were awful and picking up points, even Izzet has stated he doesn’t know how. But the performances were telling a different story - one which eventually proved any concerned supporter correct.
It’s too early to tell if I’m right about Leicester - but bear in mind I have been airing concerns about the direction of the club LONG before Puel ever got into position.
I have to disagree on the direction of the club BS. I still think we’re being run very well.
Yes we’ve got a couple of transfer windows badly wrong since the title win, but it was always going to be hard to deal with that situation.
All in all, I see us investing from the bottom up, holding on to our key players and investing in each window to improve. The owners did do under a amanger they felt could deliver the long term plan.
It’s the manager I have my reservations about.
Puel is no peter taylor and Maddison is no junior Lewis. I am disapointed with my mate Stringer because they are driving the agenda to waiting a few seconds to see if there was booing and then almost sounding disapointed when it happens.
Good post Foxy we have just come off a seven game unbeaten run without a sixty million quid player this season. Good recruitment for once this summer but no back up strikers,and managing the hardest thing in life change.
As for losing top players each season we have lost a star player and i expect Harry to go to Man utd in the summer. Until Chilwell can get the mistake out of his game he's around for a bit.
Puel will be given this season to get it to work no one needs another managerial change this season and stabiliy is what is needed.
There are some supporters who would may not say it out loud but would like to fall into the bottom three to get ri of the boring frenchman and we can see how tht worked out down south.
Finally nice to hear another voice on here to few post these days
comment by Merseysidefox (U4842)
posted 37 minutes ago
I have to disagree on the direction of the club BS. I still think we’re being run very well.
Yes we’ve got a couple of transfer windows badly wrong since the title win, but it was always going to be hard to deal with that situation.
All in all, I see us investing from the bottom up, holding on to our key players and investing in each window to improve. The owners did do under a amanger they felt could deliver the long term plan.
It’s the manager I have my reservations about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Going backwards and being run well as a club can actually co-exist.
Financially for example the club is in fantastic health. It’s being run well. A new training facility, state of the art, is in development, an increase to the stadium and a global presence that far exceeds where we have been before. It’s not that aspect of the club I’m concerned with.
Claude Puel however didn’t appoint himself as manager. And neither did Shakespeare. Puel is t keeping himself in a job. The appointment of Macia as head of recruitment (which didn’t really work) wasn’t down to him.
The on the pitch progress is ultimately down to the owners decision making - and its been hit and miss of late. If the club does go backwards - from a footballing perspective, then it’s down to decisions at the top. I wouldn’t want any other owner of course - but the financial progress will be impacted if the footballing decisions are poor
‘There are some supporters who would may not say it out loud but would like to fall into the bottom three to get ri of the boring frenchman’
You have got to stop with this nonsense. No one wants bottom 3. If I had to choose right now I would go with Puel for the next 20 years if the alternative was getting relegated and hiring a new manager.
I do not want to see Puel sacked at any cost to the club. If he’s boring and gets us 6th place I would be delighted. I’d love to bore our way into Europe. Please stop making out that we want him sacked at any cost to the club, you’re far better than that
To discuss the analogy in the OP, I don't think we're "going backwards". I think we're going forwards into thicker fog and need to think about whether we really want to go this way.
As I've put elsewhere, our whole game plan seems to involve sitting back rather than showing some intensity - or at least showing periods of intensity like we did in the league-winning season. We don't (can't) press for a whole match but we can do at times - so called trigger points where everyone goes at once. And I see no evidence that Puel plans to change this. I don't believe that what we're seeing is a transition in terms of style. We might be in transition in terms of practising it and making it work effectively, but what we're seeing is an attempt at what we're aiming for. My concern is that it's outdated and that we're heading in the wrong direction even trying to make it work. After all, there's more than one way to play football with greater possession stats.
All that said, the helicopter accident has had a massive effect in many ways. One of those will be that the family will be trying to get to grips with clubs and businesses right now, with any number of vultures around in Thailand waiting to challenge King Power on the basis that all's fair in war and business. They will want as little upheaval as possible right now, so practically I can't see anything changing here until the summer unless we get dragged into a relegation scrap.
By the way - the title of my thread was treading water rather than “going backwards”. That said, ultimately, if our star players move on at the end of the season because they can’t see the progression then we will be on a slow decline in my opinion. That’s what I was trying to say
Where is the Treading Water Thread and the large part of the fanbase saying we are going backwards?
While I would more or less agree with that than not I don't think I've really ever seen that stated on here, maybe once?
I understand there's an Agenda at work here but seriously comparing this Season with our First back in the Premier League, where virtually the whole Club were Premier League Virgins against today's Seasoned Premier League Club is just a Joke and makes the OPs point virtually ridiculous.
Comparing this Season's favourable Fixture List with Shakeys first extremely tough 9-10 Games is also a laugh, how much better have we done in this Seasons comparable Fixtures?
We've lost to everyone we've played in the Top 7, we've drawn with the bottom 4 so far!
While games against the Top Clubs have seen us play better Football in general, there is a definite 'luck' about many of the points we've picked up, many Fans of Oppo teams such as Wolves, Watford, Fulham, Brighton etc will wonder how they didn't get all 3 points.
So are we going forwards or backwards, there's no fake news in the fact that now Foxello has brought it up we are going backwards, something he himself asserts when he says 'we have stalled', well if your not going forwards, your going backwards, there is no pause as life, Business and Football moves at a fast pace, it's so easy to get left behind, that stalled has now lasted nearly a Season.
Pule has recently stated we need European Football to keep our top Players, that just emphasizes his catastrophic error last season in changing our dynamic exciting Football that he created when he arrived utilising the players in their best form linked with good passing sequences to DULL Boring Possession Yesteryear Football.
He is our own Teresa May with Brexit issues, hardly anyone understands what he's trying to achieve, how he thinks he's going to do it and a growing majority think he'll fail yet he persists with his blinkered 'plan'.
We've seen what he can do, he just needs to use what he's got to their best abilities!
a friend of mine who is a Fulham season ticket holder said we were the worst side he has see at the cottage this season so far.
Backwards, treading water call it what you like but you all know there is only one way this will end
Every manager gets the chop eventually even Wenger but don't think is going to happen anytime soon.
The owners have backed Puel and will want to see what he can do and who we would bring in one of the losers on the English manager merry go round?
comment by Nevsaysagoal2city (U5194)
posted 8 minutes ago
Every manager gets the chop eventually even Wenger but don't think is going to happen anytime soon.
The owners have backed Puel and will want to see what he can do and who we would bring in one of the losers on the English manager merry go round?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You really don’t like English managers do you!
In terms of appointments we could look at;
Rafa Benitez - My preferred option and it’s a miracle he’s still at Newcastle. Miles better than Puel. Would he come though?
Eddie Howe - Far from being an English loser this guy is taking Bournemouth to where Leicester should be headed. There’s no chance of him leaving a club he loves so much however. It would be a sideways step right now
Marcelo Bielsa - Doing an amazing job at Leeds - the father of the Pochettino style of intense pressing football. Would absolutely love to get him
I agree there aren’t loads of great English managers right now but they aren’t as bad as people make out. They are just given less of a chance
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"Going backwards"
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posted on 9/12/18
Good post Foxello. Just want to be clear my own personal opinion that we’re going backwards is purely based on what I’m watching, nothing else.
To counter your narrative, my view is that things are going wrong. Like they did under Peter Taylor, who also had us top of the league. I’m not suggestkngbts that dire, but you can see things aren’t right. Players playing below themselves, wins looking more fortunate than deserved. Players looking confused by tactics.
That’s why I think we’re going backwards. Puel, in my opinion, is doing a poor job of getting the most out of his squad. That’s purely how I see it with the football I’m watching.
posted on 9/12/18
You cant really challenge a highly subjective view of where our club currently are as a whole by simply analysing stats - although of course league positions and points are a part of it.
There is no fact here - this is not the same as fake news- because we, the concerned supporters are expressing our subjective opinion - we are not attempting to state facts. It’s completelh different. It’s a narrative based on what we see - and the league finishing positions tell only half of a more complex situation.
Do the league positions you represented above tell the story around how successful our transfer policy has been? Nope. You know as well as me that it’s more in-depth than that.
posted on 9/12/18
‘Like they did under Peter Taylor, who also had us top of the league’
While I wouldn’t compare our situation to the Peter Taylor era, this is an excellent example of how a clubs league position (particularly mid way through a season) is no indication on its own of ultimate progress.
Taylor had us top of the league. We were awful and picking up points, even Izzet has stated he doesn’t know how. But the performances were telling a different story - one which eventually proved any concerned supporter correct.
It’s too early to tell if I’m right about Leicester - but bear in mind I have been airing concerns about the direction of the club LONG before Puel ever got into position.
posted on 9/12/18
I have to disagree on the direction of the club BS. I still think we’re being run very well.
Yes we’ve got a couple of transfer windows badly wrong since the title win, but it was always going to be hard to deal with that situation.
All in all, I see us investing from the bottom up, holding on to our key players and investing in each window to improve. The owners did do under a amanger they felt could deliver the long term plan.
It’s the manager I have my reservations about.
posted on 9/12/18
Puel is no peter taylor and Maddison is no junior Lewis. I am disapointed with my mate Stringer because they are driving the agenda to waiting a few seconds to see if there was booing and then almost sounding disapointed when it happens.
Good post Foxy we have just come off a seven game unbeaten run without a sixty million quid player this season. Good recruitment for once this summer but no back up strikers,and managing the hardest thing in life change.
As for losing top players each season we have lost a star player and i expect Harry to go to Man utd in the summer. Until Chilwell can get the mistake out of his game he's around for a bit.
Puel will be given this season to get it to work no one needs another managerial change this season and stabiliy is what is needed.
There are some supporters who would may not say it out loud but would like to fall into the bottom three to get ri of the boring frenchman and we can see how tht worked out down south.
Finally nice to hear another voice on here to few post these days
posted on 9/12/18
comment by Merseysidefox (U4842)
posted 37 minutes ago
I have to disagree on the direction of the club BS. I still think we’re being run very well.
Yes we’ve got a couple of transfer windows badly wrong since the title win, but it was always going to be hard to deal with that situation.
All in all, I see us investing from the bottom up, holding on to our key players and investing in each window to improve. The owners did do under a amanger they felt could deliver the long term plan.
It’s the manager I have my reservations about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Going backwards and being run well as a club can actually co-exist.
Financially for example the club is in fantastic health. It’s being run well. A new training facility, state of the art, is in development, an increase to the stadium and a global presence that far exceeds where we have been before. It’s not that aspect of the club I’m concerned with.
Claude Puel however didn’t appoint himself as manager. And neither did Shakespeare. Puel is t keeping himself in a job. The appointment of Macia as head of recruitment (which didn’t really work) wasn’t down to him.
The on the pitch progress is ultimately down to the owners decision making - and its been hit and miss of late. If the club does go backwards - from a footballing perspective, then it’s down to decisions at the top. I wouldn’t want any other owner of course - but the financial progress will be impacted if the footballing decisions are poor
posted on 9/12/18
‘There are some supporters who would may not say it out loud but would like to fall into the bottom three to get ri of the boring frenchman’
You have got to stop with this nonsense. No one wants bottom 3. If I had to choose right now I would go with Puel for the next 20 years if the alternative was getting relegated and hiring a new manager.
I do not want to see Puel sacked at any cost to the club. If he’s boring and gets us 6th place I would be delighted. I’d love to bore our way into Europe. Please stop making out that we want him sacked at any cost to the club, you’re far better than that
posted on 9/12/18
To discuss the analogy in the OP, I don't think we're "going backwards". I think we're going forwards into thicker fog and need to think about whether we really want to go this way.
As I've put elsewhere, our whole game plan seems to involve sitting back rather than showing some intensity - or at least showing periods of intensity like we did in the league-winning season. We don't (can't) press for a whole match but we can do at times - so called trigger points where everyone goes at once. And I see no evidence that Puel plans to change this. I don't believe that what we're seeing is a transition in terms of style. We might be in transition in terms of practising it and making it work effectively, but what we're seeing is an attempt at what we're aiming for. My concern is that it's outdated and that we're heading in the wrong direction even trying to make it work. After all, there's more than one way to play football with greater possession stats.
All that said, the helicopter accident has had a massive effect in many ways. One of those will be that the family will be trying to get to grips with clubs and businesses right now, with any number of vultures around in Thailand waiting to challenge King Power on the basis that all's fair in war and business. They will want as little upheaval as possible right now, so practically I can't see anything changing here until the summer unless we get dragged into a relegation scrap.
posted on 9/12/18
By the way - the title of my thread was treading water rather than “going backwards”. That said, ultimately, if our star players move on at the end of the season because they can’t see the progression then we will be on a slow decline in my opinion. That’s what I was trying to say
posted on 9/12/18
Where is the Treading Water Thread and the large part of the fanbase saying we are going backwards?
While I would more or less agree with that than not I don't think I've really ever seen that stated on here, maybe once?
I understand there's an Agenda at work here but seriously comparing this Season with our First back in the Premier League, where virtually the whole Club were Premier League Virgins against today's Seasoned Premier League Club is just a Joke and makes the OPs point virtually ridiculous.
Comparing this Season's favourable Fixture List with Shakeys first extremely tough 9-10 Games is also a laugh, how much better have we done in this Seasons comparable Fixtures?
We've lost to everyone we've played in the Top 7, we've drawn with the bottom 4 so far!
While games against the Top Clubs have seen us play better Football in general, there is a definite 'luck' about many of the points we've picked up, many Fans of Oppo teams such as Wolves, Watford, Fulham, Brighton etc will wonder how they didn't get all 3 points.
So are we going forwards or backwards, there's no fake news in the fact that now Foxello has brought it up we are going backwards, something he himself asserts when he says 'we have stalled', well if your not going forwards, your going backwards, there is no pause as life, Business and Football moves at a fast pace, it's so easy to get left behind, that stalled has now lasted nearly a Season.
Pule has recently stated we need European Football to keep our top Players, that just emphasizes his catastrophic error last season in changing our dynamic exciting Football that he created when he arrived utilising the players in their best form linked with good passing sequences to DULL Boring Possession Yesteryear Football.
He is our own Teresa May with Brexit issues, hardly anyone understands what he's trying to achieve, how he thinks he's going to do it and a growing majority think he'll fail yet he persists with his blinkered 'plan'.
We've seen what he can do, he just needs to use what he's got to their best abilities!
posted on 9/12/18
a friend of mine who is a Fulham season ticket holder said we were the worst side he has see at the cottage this season so far.
posted on 10/12/18
Backwards, treading water call it what you like but you all know there is only one way this will end
posted on 10/12/18
Every manager gets the chop eventually even Wenger but don't think is going to happen anytime soon.
The owners have backed Puel and will want to see what he can do and who we would bring in one of the losers on the English manager merry go round?
posted on 10/12/18
comment by Nevsaysagoal2city (U5194)
posted 8 minutes ago
Every manager gets the chop eventually even Wenger but don't think is going to happen anytime soon.
The owners have backed Puel and will want to see what he can do and who we would bring in one of the losers on the English manager merry go round?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You really don’t like English managers do you!
In terms of appointments we could look at;
Rafa Benitez - My preferred option and it’s a miracle he’s still at Newcastle. Miles better than Puel. Would he come though?
Eddie Howe - Far from being an English loser this guy is taking Bournemouth to where Leicester should be headed. There’s no chance of him leaving a club he loves so much however. It would be a sideways step right now
Marcelo Bielsa - Doing an amazing job at Leeds - the father of the Pochettino style of intense pressing football. Would absolutely love to get him
I agree there aren’t loads of great English managers right now but they aren’t as bad as people make out. They are just given less of a chance
Page 1 of 1