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Lampard's Expectations Next Season

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posted on 9/8/20

comment by Devil D.A. (U6522)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
comment by Blue in the face ⚽️ (U22288)
posted 36 minutes ago

comment by Devil D.A. (U6522)
posted 1 hour, 17 minutes ago
comment by Blue in the face ⚽️ (U22288)
posted 6 minutes ago

comment by Kunta Kante (U1641)
posted 41 minutes ago
75 points minimum in league
Show a statistical and visible improvement in defence
And probably get to quarter finals CL, and good runs I’m Cup competitions
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This. Although u would say 80 points.
----------------------------------------------------
With three new first team attacking options in the team at once, ideally half a new XI with further buys, that's a big ask. You're expecting them to gel very quickly to achieve 80+
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Genuinely the reasons you lost are why I expext 80 points.

Also CL quarters is a non negotiable for me. Been much too long.
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All three attacking players come with debate surrounding their best positions, Havertz alone has people saying he can play four equally well, this stuff's gunna take a bit of time (I give it half a year) to figure out tactically. We should expect 40pts from the 19 games in the second half of the season, I'll agree to that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I have no interest in agreeing with you This is a debate forum

I think we need to finish next season in a position where we can feasibly win the league in 2021/22.

Squabble about points if you wish but frankly I think 80 is modest. What we need to show progress is comfortable CL qualification where we are not in a race with Arsenal, Spurs or Leicester.

To get the total I am advocating,which we managed in 13/14 with a weaker squader than we are likely to have next year, Lampard needs to improve the defensive shape of the team. That should be doable.

14 more points means 4 fewer defeats and converting one of our draws to a win. Considering we lost 12 this season that is plausible.

Anyway you should change your name to The Pessimists Pessimist

posted on 9/8/20

comment by Imran The King Khan (U10026)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
I’m not assuming you will, but the strength of those team obviously does impact on the points total that Chelsea will get as they can take between 12 and 0 from them games. And that’s just two team, how others address their issues impacts things as well. Points totals are not totally dependent on what one team does in the transfer market, there are many factors to account for. That’s why I think it’s difficult to really have expectations for 80+ at this stage.

City and Liverpool are the only teams that can, in my opinion, as they’re the only two in the league with the proven quality and consistency to achieve it, regardless of others.
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I will be very surprised if City or Liverpool can maintain this level for more than maybe one more year. Liverpool are two injuries away from mortality due to the thin squad below their incredible first XI and City really aren't that impressive right now outside of the cups.

posted on 9/8/20

Scoring over 100 premier league goals is pretty impressive.

posted on 9/8/20

Lost 9 games, 79 points, and even we somehow beat them.

If we cant reach City’s current level of inconsistent chaos after £250m spending, and same goes for United whose fans should also be demanding more, then we need a new manager frankly.

posted on 9/8/20

81 points, won 26. City have been inconsistent by their really high standards. By most teams standards is a pretty consistent season. Teams that win 25+ games are usually teams in with a chance of winning the league. I really don’t think 80+ is a modest expectation. Especially when the transfer window hasn’t closed and Chelsea’s squad still needs a lot of work.

posted on 9/8/20

I have clarified many times mate, I am referring to after £250m of spending if we get our targets.

That was literally the whole premise of this discussion, so I have no clue what the point of your window point is really, and how much work we allegedly need.

80 points would win you the league I think twice since 1992-1993, I am not suggesting we need to win next year.

But I think it is perfeclty reasonable to suggest Havertz, a LB, CB and GK on top of Ziyech and Werner should be enough for 80 points and not to be in the top four race.

In order to achieve that level we will need to improve systematically and become less vulnerable to set pieces and counter attacks.

Anyway this is going in circles. I see you are a United fan - all I will add is if United and Chelsea cant pull clearly ahead of Arsenal, Spurs and Leicester with their current market supremacy - serious,serious questions have to be asked.

NB. Chelsea getting 80 points is a 14 point increase on their current increase. I am not even asking for Chelsea to cut Liverpool’s lead in half ffs, they would be 19 points ahead of us on current tally.

posted on 9/8/20

But it would have you not far off the title winners in most seasons. It’s a pretty big points total.

I know what you are saying, but I think bringing in six players - of first team quality - and thinking it a modest points total when you need all these players to workout in the league and gel as a team is actually very optimistic. If Chelsea achieve that they’ll probably have done very well considering all the obstacles in the way.

From our perspective it’s a little different. We won’t be making anywhere near as many changes to the team. So adding some quality where needed, and some depth, to a pretty well established spine leaves more expectation of consistent results.

If we don’t achieve that big questions need to be asked. If Chelsea don’t I think it’s to be expected given all the changes.

The context around the results obviously need to be looked at, and the performances, but if we are giving expectations right now, based on a lot of assumptions, I think this is where we are at.

posted on 9/8/20

comment by Blue in the face ⚽️ (U22288)
posted 1 hour, 27 minutes ago

comment by Devil D.A. (U6522)
posted 1 hour, 11 minutes ago
comment by Blue in the face ⚽️ (U22288)
posted 36 minutes ago

comment by Devil D.A. (U6522)
posted 1 hour, 17 minutes ago
comment by Blue in the face ⚽️ (U22288)
posted 6 minutes ago

comment by Kunta Kante (U1641)
posted 41 minutes ago
75 points minimum in league
Show a statistical and visible improvement in defence
And probably get to quarter finals CL, and good runs I’m Cup competitions
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This. Although u would say 80 points.
----------------------------------------------------
With three new first team attacking options in the team at once, ideally half a new XI with further buys, that's a big ask. You're expecting them to gel very quickly to achieve 80+
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Genuinely the reasons you lost are why I expext 80 points.

Also CL quarters is a non negotiable for me. Been much too long.
-----------------------------------------------------
All three attacking players come with debate surrounding their best positions, Havertz alone has people saying he can play four equally well, this stuff's gunna take a bit of time (I give it half a year) to figure out tactically. We should expect 40pts from the 19 games in the second half of the season, I'll agree to that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I have no interest in agreeing with you This is a debate forum

I think we need to finish next season in a position where we can feasibly win the league in 2021/22.

Squabble about points if you wish but frankly I think 80 is modest. What we need to show progress is comfortable CL qualification where we are not in a race with Arsenal, Spurs or Leicester.

To get the total I am advocating,which we managed in 13/14 with a weaker squader than we are likely to have next year, Lampard needs to improve the defensive shape of the team. That should be doable.

14 more points means 4 fewer defeats and converting one of our draws to a win. Considering we lost 12 this season that is plausible.

Anyway you should change your name to The Pessimists Pessimist
------------------------------------------------------
I agree we need to be challenging in 21-22, but next season's points tally will have little baring towards that on it's own. I look at next season a bit like City 16-17 or Pool 17-18 (who got between 75-80pts, then 95+ the following year), in that the new signings will make us a great team with one or two pieces missing - for City it was FB's, Pool GK & CB.

Squabbling about points aside that is the meat of it, ultimately being in a position where top 4 is seen as an eventuality by the half way stage & the battle becomes about our position within that top 4. Minimum is 4th but we should aim for 3rd, and if the league continues to be a bit of a c!usterf*ck 75-80pts will get 3rd easy.

And pessimist implies I don't think we can achieve more, not true, you just think I have low standards. Have I mentioned I don't mind the Europa League?

posted on 9/8/20

comment by Imran The King Khan (U10026)
posted 13 minutes ago

But it would have you not far off the title winners in most seasons. It’s a pretty big points total.

I know what you are saying, but I think bringing in six players - of first team quality - and thinking it a modest points total when you need all these players to workout in the league and gel as a team is actually very optimistic. If Chelsea achieve that they’ll probably have done very well considering all the obstacles in the way.

From our perspective it’s a little different. We won’t be making anywhere near as many changes to the team. So adding some quality where needed, and some depth, to a pretty well established spine leaves more expectation of consistent results.

If we don’t achieve that big questions need to be asked. If Chelsea don’t I think it’s to be expected given all the changes.

The context around the results obviously need to be looked at, and the performances, but if we are giving expectations right now, based on a lot of assumptions, I think this is where we are at.
---------------------------------------------------------


If we finished above you handsomely next year, 6 points or more roughly, I would question Solskjaer a bit if I was a United fan - assuming you get Sancho & one or two others.

I expect us to be in a fight for 3rd next year (oh the dizzy heights lol), but where we should aim for it, you should be expecting it.

posted on 9/8/20

comment by Imran The King Khan (U10026)
posted 33 minutes ago
But it would have you not far off the title winners in most seasons. It’s a pretty big points total.

I know what you are saying, but I think bringing in six players - of first team quality - and thinking it a modest points total when you need all these players to workout in the league and gel as a team is actually very optimistic. If Chelsea achieve that they’ll probably have done very well considering all the obstacles in the way.

From our perspective it’s a little different. We won’t be making anywhere near as many changes to the team. So adding some quality where needed, and some depth, to a pretty well established spine leaves more expectation of consistent results.

If we don’t achieve that big questions need to be asked. If Chelsea don’t I think it’s to be expected given all the changes.

The context around the results obviously need to be looked at, and the performances, but if we are giving expectations right now, based on a lot of assumptions, I think this is where we are at.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, we do not share expectations, I think our team is comparable on paper to United’s as it stands and after both get their transfers.

Liverpool are rare in improving with few signings, most clubs thrive on movements in the markets. Our best seasons, aside from Ancelotti’s 2009/10 season but he is a master of maximising performance from ageing players, have come from deeply productive windows.

We need change, we need instability if anything to shake up a saturated squad.

posted on 9/8/20

Also United ‘s best window is Sancho, a CM, a DM, a CB and at least a full back. That’s a lot of upheaval.

posted on 9/8/20

Devil, yeah I’d go along with that. We’ve an advantage going into the season knowing what will be our strongest team, pretty much. And that they’ll have played quite a bit of football together already.

Even if we only signed Sancho I could tell you ten players that will start the majority of our games next season. Depth could fack us up, especially with the congested schedule, but there’s a decent foundation to work off from the start.

I don’t think anyone has a clue how Chelsea will be lining up next year. And it might take a little while for Lampard to work that out as well. It’s obviously been an issue this season given the amount of chopping and changing. Six new players, potentially as important first team players, makes life difficult to establish that core group you need in a team to consistently win football matches.

Both teams should be nailed on for top four given their firepower, however. Especially as the schedule will test Arsenal, Leicester and Spurs’ squads.

posted on 9/8/20

I also maintain my view, points totals aside, that there is no way IF we sign our targets - that we should be bogged down with Spurs, Arsenal and Leicester.

As I don’t think we will get all our targets, I expect us to be in the top four battle again, and it is my expectation.

My point was - if we got our first choice targets, then 80 points and comfortable CL qualifications is legitimate as a target.

My actual expectations will end up being lower as I dont think we will buy all the players we need.

posted on 9/8/20

We won’t make that many signings. I’ll be surprised it we make more than three. But if we do I don’t see more than two being first team regulars. I don’t think Ole wants mass upheaval given our form since we’ve established a core group in the squad.

posted on 9/8/20

comment by Imran The King Khan (U10026)
posted 8 seconds ago
We won’t make that many signings. I’ll be surprised it we make more than three. But if we do I don’t see more than two being first team regulars. I don’t think Ole wants mass upheaval given our form since we’ve established a core group in the squad.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Without a credible alternative to Matic, and a creative option off the bench when Bruno’s hot streak ends then I think United won’t really progress.

posted on 9/8/20

Likewise, a fast CB to accompany Maguire, and a full back to replace the departing Dalot seem pretty urgent,

Not just Sancho needed imo.

posted on 9/8/20

I don’t disagree with you. But what we need and what we’ll actually do in the market are always two very different things where United are concerned.

So much will depend on outgoings as well. We’ve got a very bloated squad, with a lot of average players earning good money. But we won’t need such a big squad next season, so we’ll probably see more go out than come in.

posted on 9/8/20

There is a whole XI of players United could feasibly offload.

Ighalo
Lingard Mata Chong
Perreira Fred
Rojo Jones Smalling Dalot
Grant

Then there is the question of which young guns should be in the squad from Garner, Tuanzebe, and Fosu-Mensah.

Plus Dean Henderson conundrum.

But, I maintain your first XI plus Sancho is very good and if you had a great transfer window you should pull ahead of the teams below Chelsea and also finish a bit above is.

posted on 9/8/20

Turning this to United - they could afford the likes van der Beek, Tonali, Sancho. Surprised if they don’t look to the make the most of being one of maybe three clubs with money to spend this summer

posted on 9/8/20

Yeah there are a lot of players there that don’t have much of a future at the club. Depth will remain an issue when we are going to invest so much in Sancho. If we can get another attacker that should be enough for us to beat up the small teams and get comfortably into the CL places.

But I know all too well it can quite easily go tiiiits up at United.

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