Is your formation missing 2 players?
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 20 minutes ago
Is your formation missing 2 players?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope
Thanks, Mersey - I think Maddison came on last night and proved how effective he can be on as a wide forward cutting into free space as a number 10 behind Vardy. A bit like Messi does for Barcelona. Maddison was initially on the right and then reverted to the left when Under came on. He looked dangerous throughout and was instrumental in killing the game.
I think we may see plenty of rotation with Maddison, Praet and Under (and to an extent Perez) on that right side of the front 3. If we go deep in competitions, we will need them all.
Also, re Ndidi, I see no reason why he and Mendy can't simply swap out and rotate game by game if they are playing two games a week... a game a week each is more than enough to stay sharp...
Have we found a new way of playing or are we just reverting to type?
We all know that possession isn't as important as what you do with it. See our 15/16 title win where we were quite happy to concede possession and play on the counter.
We then tried to play a higher possession based game. Failed. Ranieri was sacked and we reverted back to how we won the title.
Puel tried to evolve us, but instead produced the most soporific football we've ever witnessed.
BRodgers has had some success with the evolution. We've played a system under him where we've tried to dominate possession. When it's worked we've looked great. When it's not we've looked toothless.
Perhaps out of necessity, due to injuries, BR has developed this style of low block and then counter. He keeps saying that he likes his teams to dominate and is almost apologetic about it, but it's getting results.
Man City, Arsenal and Leeds have been beaten despite dominating possession, but what about the two games we've lost? We shaded the possession stats against Villa and West Ham we had 70% of the ball. The West Ham game we were totally outplayed and didn't manage a shot on target.
Brendan is having the same issues that every manage has had since promotion. How to evolve the team into one that can dominate sides and isn't reliant on a phenomenal, but ageing, striker.
It will be interesting to see which way he jumps when the other players come back into contention.
Rodgers almost seems to be revelling in having discovered a new way of playing right now. He looks like a kid with a brand new toy.
However, I think this is probably more to do with the run of games we're currently on than what Rodgers wants to do in the long term. We've been playing some big teams away - Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool to come, plus a Leeds side who like to have shown a propensity to commit men forward and like to control possession themselves. I think the likelihood is that, after the Liverpool match, we'll switch to something else. And that's fine.
As for Maddison, I thought he looked effective last night because he had the space to operate in, and because the front 3 of him, Vardy and Under were invited to be fluid. I'm sure he'll get plenty of game time going forward, in this formation or others. The one who should be worried right now is Perez.
comment by The_Dungeon_Master (U4830)
posted 57 minutes ago
Rodgers almost seems to be revelling in having discovered a new way of playing right now. He looks like a kid with a brand new toy.
However, I think this is probably more to do with the run of games we're currently on than what Rodgers wants to do in the long term. We've been playing some big teams away - Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool to come, plus a Leeds side who like to have shown a propensity to commit men forward and like to control possession themselves. I think the likelihood is that, after the Liverpool match, we'll switch to something else. And that's fine.
As for Maddison, I thought he looked effective last night because he had the space to operate in, and because the front 3 of him, Vardy and Under were invited to be fluid. I'm sure he'll get plenty of game time going forward, in this formation or others. The one who should be worried right now is Perez.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're right Dunge. Perez really should be worried. Just imagine where that leaves Gray!
I imagine Gray's given up entirely at this point.
Ndidi walks straight back in for me. I may be in the minority with this - but whilst Mendy has done a decent job he isn’t close at all to Ndidi in my opinion.
Same for me with Maddison. Him and Barnes playing behind Vardy.
I don’t really see Ndidi and Maddison not fitting in a 343 and if you are assuming everyone is 10/10, I think the team 99% of people pick is:
Schmeichel
Castagne
Soyunchu
Evans
Fofana
Ricardo
Ndidi
Tielemans
Barnes
Maddison
Vardy
it’s great to have other players pushing for starts and providing adequate cover as this is something that contributed to us not finishing 3rd last year.
Great insight as always gents.
I think we’ve not reverted to type Joby. Rodgers is way too stubborn and I think we’ll go back to trying to impose our play on more teams once we have more players back.
I think Dunge is right in that he’s almost excited he’s realise lad you can win.l another way. Especially with Vardy in your team. What a class above he looked last night by the way.
I think because Ndidi can’t play I’m a two, 4-1-4-1 will be back when he is.
I’d expect it to look like this:
————-Kasper
——Fofana-Evans-Soyunchu
Ricardo—-—Ndidi———Castagne
—————Tielemans
——Maddison———-Barnes
——————Vardy
I think Ndidi would thrive in that role.
If Evans is back, I think Wolves will be a good indication of Rodger’s long term plan. If he plays 3 at the back again, I expect it to be a formation it sticks with on the whole
That is an interesting 3-3-1-2-1 formation KTF.
I agree with Ndidi operating as lone cover for the back line. I can’t see him fitting in to a 2. I’m still not convinced by Maddison outside of a number 10 role but I’ll wait to see on that one.
I think your personnel are good. I’m just not sur a bs j 3 with Ndidi and Madds works. I expect a back 4 to be deployed for that to work as above.
It’s 343 really. Rodger’s looked to work on the deep midfielder covering with the back three when the wing backs pushed on in pre-season. Maddison would pretty much be a number 10 behind Vardy and Barnes would drift more out wide. Formations are far more fluid and flexible than they used to be. Often just a number on the line up sheet for Sky
I’d possibly go like this with everyone fit:
Schmeichel
Ricardo, Evans, Soyuncu, Castagne
N’didi
Tielemans, Maddison
Under. Vardy Barnes
Subs: Ward, Fofana, Justin, Mendy, Praet, Perez, Nacho
Seeing as we’re doing “if everyone is fit”, I’ll go:
Schmeichel
Fofana, Evans, Soyuncu,
Periera N’didi. Castagne
Tielemans
Praet Maddison Barnes
Vardy
And before you point out the obvious mistake, it’s the only way I can get our best players in their best position.
Maybe I need to accept Ndidi doesn’t play with a back 5 and Maddison doesn’t play in a front 3.
The positive amongst us would call this “options”.
It looks to me like we can't quite decide on our best starting XI?...
Some don't include Fofana, others do... Mersey would prefer 12 starters, based on that last formation... presumably, you would drop Praet, if you had a gun to your head?... I suspect I have also fallen into the trap of the "obvious mistake", but then again, why would you put 12 on the pitch and say "well, it's their best position..."
We can all agree on probably 8/9 starters:
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
That leaves 2. At least one central defender... Evans or Fofana and one other midfielder/attacker - Under or Praet (unless you put both Evans and Fofana at the back in a three and have your two pacey wingbacks in Ricky and Timmy...
As KTF would have it?:
————Schmeichel
——Fofana Evans Soyuncu
Ricardo—-—Ndidi———Castagne
—————Tielemans
——Maddison———-Barnes
——————Vardy
Or...:
————---------------Kasper
Pereira Fofana/Evans Soyuncu Castagne
---------------------------Ndidi———
Under Maddison Tielemans Barnes
---------------------------Vardy
Options:
Ward
Justin (no place for him at all, despite very solid performances)
Evans/Fofana (both very solid)
Morgan (does a decent job whenever called upon)
Fuchs (ditto Morgan - surprisingly so against good/quick attackers - reads it exceptionally well and is a threat from throw'ins and releases counter attacks)
Thomas (needs games, to be integrated gradually still - shows promise)
Praet (solid)
Mendy (becoming a natural replacement / like-for-like with Ndidi to rotate every other fixture)
Albrighton (could do with more games, but delivery still sharp)
Choudhury (probably a bit down the pecking order again, but shows glimpses, amid error-strewn performances)
Perez (needs to improve significantly if he is going to make the grade - could end up like Gray)
Gray (speaking of which - only when we are desperate - clearly an attitude problem somewhere)
Iheanacho (able, willing (I think) but needs a run in the team and good service/support)
Slimani (if he can get on the bench... but unlikely to be utilised, like Gray)
*Obviously Amartey is there too, but for ease, he is properly injured and unsure on his return - versatile and willing as ever though. Did well in the Man City game.
That is some squad, when you look at it. Lots of pedigree in there and experience. Bodes well (once they all get fit / stay fit...) But as to the starting XI, I suspect we will also see that change repeatedly over the coming season. Europe allows 5 subs - we need them. It allows games for fringe players and keeps everyone fairly sharp. Hopefully the medical team are on to it and will keep the cryo chamber door open so they can all spend their midweeks in there before the next match day!
Looking forward to Thursday-Sunday, just hope they can keep it going!
UTF!
New guy here, been reading for years so thought I should sign up and start contributing..
I think once everyone’s fit the back 3 of Cags Fofana and Evans with Ricardo and Castangne as wing backs will be so good we will be able play the more attacking midfielders to create. Just got to wait for them to get fit!
comment by Keep_the_faith1 (U8129)
posted 4 hours, 18 minutes ago
Ndidi walks straight back in for me. I may be in the minority with this - but whilst Mendy has done a decent job he isn’t close at all to Ndidi in my opinion.
Same for me with Maddison. Him and Barnes playing behind Vardy.
I don’t really see Ndidi and Maddison not fitting in a 343 and if you are assuming everyone is 10/10, I think the team 99% of people pick is:
Schmeichel
Castagne
Soyunchu
Evans
Fofana
Ricardo
Ndidi
Tielemans
Barnes
Maddison
Vardy
it’s great to have other players pushing for starts and providing adequate cover as this is something that contributed to us not finishing 3rd last year.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What a team that is, lets hope we can get them all fit at the same time.
Welcome Hamilton Fox. Great to see a new poster.
BTW another example of us going back in time.
When Puel was here I was thinking it wouldn’t be too long before the 2016 immortals were all phased out, but they’ve reappeared for a final swansong. Kasper, Fuchs, Albrighton and Vardy all starting and Morgan coming on for a cameo late on.
Welcome Hamilton!
I've favoured a back three for some time; even more so with really exciting wing backs like Ricardo and Castagne. What is also good is that we now have Justin and Thomas as back ups, both of whom show great potential. Not to mention Fuchs.
Mendy has performed very well in Ndidi's role. Not as good in the air, but covers the ground well and is more creative going forward. Better on the ball than Wilf too. I expect both will get plenty of game time when both are fully fit.
There really does seem to be a fair amount of depth to the squad, although if Vardy is out for any length of time it would be a worry.
The difference it will make with those 5 at the back will be unreal, with all 3 central defenders back we won’t be scared of playing football and the full backs are so good going forward they will push on rather than just sitting back, add in ndidi to cover and I really think we should be making top four. Just depends how long it takes to get them all fit though
The back 5 does look very exciting indeed.
I think Rodgers should work to the talent we have to deliver a new 5-1-3-1 formation.
Ndidi dropping in when the full backs bomb on
Maddison in the 10 flanked by Praet/Barnes and Tilly
Vardy doing what Vardy does.
Oooooooof!
I guess this is what KTF was saying but tweaking formation slightly (even though it’s fluid!)...
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
Forfana
Mendy
Under
Praet
Evans
Never thought I'd see the day when we had 14
must starters.
comment by Appletonsthename (U10074)
posted 12 hours, 9 minutes ago
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
Forfana
Mendy
Under
Praet
Evans
Never thought I'd see the day when we had 14
must starters.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well you won’t.
Coz we’re only allowed eleven
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3-4-2-1 = No Maddison
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posted on 3/11/20
Is your formation missing 2 players?
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 20 minutes ago
Is your formation missing 2 players?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope
posted on 3/11/20
Thanks, Mersey - I think Maddison came on last night and proved how effective he can be on as a wide forward cutting into free space as a number 10 behind Vardy. A bit like Messi does for Barcelona. Maddison was initially on the right and then reverted to the left when Under came on. He looked dangerous throughout and was instrumental in killing the game.
I think we may see plenty of rotation with Maddison, Praet and Under (and to an extent Perez) on that right side of the front 3. If we go deep in competitions, we will need them all.
Also, re Ndidi, I see no reason why he and Mendy can't simply swap out and rotate game by game if they are playing two games a week... a game a week each is more than enough to stay sharp...
posted on 3/11/20
Have we found a new way of playing or are we just reverting to type?
We all know that possession isn't as important as what you do with it. See our 15/16 title win where we were quite happy to concede possession and play on the counter.
We then tried to play a higher possession based game. Failed. Ranieri was sacked and we reverted back to how we won the title.
Puel tried to evolve us, but instead produced the most soporific football we've ever witnessed.
BRodgers has had some success with the evolution. We've played a system under him where we've tried to dominate possession. When it's worked we've looked great. When it's not we've looked toothless.
Perhaps out of necessity, due to injuries, BR has developed this style of low block and then counter. He keeps saying that he likes his teams to dominate and is almost apologetic about it, but it's getting results.
Man City, Arsenal and Leeds have been beaten despite dominating possession, but what about the two games we've lost? We shaded the possession stats against Villa and West Ham we had 70% of the ball. The West Ham game we were totally outplayed and didn't manage a shot on target.
Brendan is having the same issues that every manage has had since promotion. How to evolve the team into one that can dominate sides and isn't reliant on a phenomenal, but ageing, striker.
It will be interesting to see which way he jumps when the other players come back into contention.
posted on 3/11/20
Rodgers almost seems to be revelling in having discovered a new way of playing right now. He looks like a kid with a brand new toy.
However, I think this is probably more to do with the run of games we're currently on than what Rodgers wants to do in the long term. We've been playing some big teams away - Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool to come, plus a Leeds side who like to have shown a propensity to commit men forward and like to control possession themselves. I think the likelihood is that, after the Liverpool match, we'll switch to something else. And that's fine.
As for Maddison, I thought he looked effective last night because he had the space to operate in, and because the front 3 of him, Vardy and Under were invited to be fluid. I'm sure he'll get plenty of game time going forward, in this formation or others. The one who should be worried right now is Perez.
posted on 3/11/20
comment by The_Dungeon_Master (U4830)
posted 57 minutes ago
Rodgers almost seems to be revelling in having discovered a new way of playing right now. He looks like a kid with a brand new toy.
However, I think this is probably more to do with the run of games we're currently on than what Rodgers wants to do in the long term. We've been playing some big teams away - Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool to come, plus a Leeds side who like to have shown a propensity to commit men forward and like to control possession themselves. I think the likelihood is that, after the Liverpool match, we'll switch to something else. And that's fine.
As for Maddison, I thought he looked effective last night because he had the space to operate in, and because the front 3 of him, Vardy and Under were invited to be fluid. I'm sure he'll get plenty of game time going forward, in this formation or others. The one who should be worried right now is Perez.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're right Dunge. Perez really should be worried. Just imagine where that leaves Gray!
posted on 3/11/20
I imagine Gray's given up entirely at this point.
posted on 3/11/20
Ndidi walks straight back in for me. I may be in the minority with this - but whilst Mendy has done a decent job he isn’t close at all to Ndidi in my opinion.
Same for me with Maddison. Him and Barnes playing behind Vardy.
I don’t really see Ndidi and Maddison not fitting in a 343 and if you are assuming everyone is 10/10, I think the team 99% of people pick is:
Schmeichel
Castagne
Soyunchu
Evans
Fofana
Ricardo
Ndidi
Tielemans
Barnes
Maddison
Vardy
it’s great to have other players pushing for starts and providing adequate cover as this is something that contributed to us not finishing 3rd last year.
posted on 3/11/20
Great insight as always gents.
I think we’ve not reverted to type Joby. Rodgers is way too stubborn and I think we’ll go back to trying to impose our play on more teams once we have more players back.
I think Dunge is right in that he’s almost excited he’s realise lad you can win.l another way. Especially with Vardy in your team. What a class above he looked last night by the way.
I think because Ndidi can’t play I’m a two, 4-1-4-1 will be back when he is.
posted on 3/11/20
I’d expect it to look like this:
————-Kasper
——Fofana-Evans-Soyunchu
Ricardo—-—Ndidi———Castagne
—————Tielemans
——Maddison———-Barnes
——————Vardy
I think Ndidi would thrive in that role.
If Evans is back, I think Wolves will be a good indication of Rodger’s long term plan. If he plays 3 at the back again, I expect it to be a formation it sticks with on the whole
posted on 3/11/20
That is an interesting 3-3-1-2-1 formation KTF.
I agree with Ndidi operating as lone cover for the back line. I can’t see him fitting in to a 2. I’m still not convinced by Maddison outside of a number 10 role but I’ll wait to see on that one.
I think your personnel are good. I’m just not sur a bs j 3 with Ndidi and Madds works. I expect a back 4 to be deployed for that to work as above.
posted on 3/11/20
It’s 343 really. Rodger’s looked to work on the deep midfielder covering with the back three when the wing backs pushed on in pre-season. Maddison would pretty much be a number 10 behind Vardy and Barnes would drift more out wide. Formations are far more fluid and flexible than they used to be. Often just a number on the line up sheet for Sky
posted on 3/11/20
I’d possibly go like this with everyone fit:
Schmeichel
Ricardo, Evans, Soyuncu, Castagne
N’didi
Tielemans, Maddison
Under. Vardy Barnes
Subs: Ward, Fofana, Justin, Mendy, Praet, Perez, Nacho
posted on 3/11/20
Seeing as we’re doing “if everyone is fit”, I’ll go:
Schmeichel
Fofana, Evans, Soyuncu,
Periera N’didi. Castagne
Tielemans
Praet Maddison Barnes
Vardy
And before you point out the obvious mistake, it’s the only way I can get our best players in their best position.
Maybe I need to accept Ndidi doesn’t play with a back 5 and Maddison doesn’t play in a front 3.
The positive amongst us would call this “options”.
posted on 3/11/20
It looks to me like we can't quite decide on our best starting XI?...
Some don't include Fofana, others do... Mersey would prefer 12 starters, based on that last formation... presumably, you would drop Praet, if you had a gun to your head?... I suspect I have also fallen into the trap of the "obvious mistake", but then again, why would you put 12 on the pitch and say "well, it's their best position..."
We can all agree on probably 8/9 starters:
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
That leaves 2. At least one central defender... Evans or Fofana and one other midfielder/attacker - Under or Praet (unless you put both Evans and Fofana at the back in a three and have your two pacey wingbacks in Ricky and Timmy...
As KTF would have it?:
————Schmeichel
——Fofana Evans Soyuncu
Ricardo—-—Ndidi———Castagne
—————Tielemans
——Maddison———-Barnes
——————Vardy
Or...:
————---------------Kasper
Pereira Fofana/Evans Soyuncu Castagne
---------------------------Ndidi———
Under Maddison Tielemans Barnes
---------------------------Vardy
Options:
Ward
Justin (no place for him at all, despite very solid performances)
Evans/Fofana (both very solid)
Morgan (does a decent job whenever called upon)
Fuchs (ditto Morgan - surprisingly so against good/quick attackers - reads it exceptionally well and is a threat from throw'ins and releases counter attacks)
Thomas (needs games, to be integrated gradually still - shows promise)
Praet (solid)
Mendy (becoming a natural replacement / like-for-like with Ndidi to rotate every other fixture)
Albrighton (could do with more games, but delivery still sharp)
Choudhury (probably a bit down the pecking order again, but shows glimpses, amid error-strewn performances)
Perez (needs to improve significantly if he is going to make the grade - could end up like Gray)
Gray (speaking of which - only when we are desperate - clearly an attitude problem somewhere)
Iheanacho (able, willing (I think) but needs a run in the team and good service/support)
Slimani (if he can get on the bench... but unlikely to be utilised, like Gray)
*Obviously Amartey is there too, but for ease, he is properly injured and unsure on his return - versatile and willing as ever though. Did well in the Man City game.
That is some squad, when you look at it. Lots of pedigree in there and experience. Bodes well (once they all get fit / stay fit...) But as to the starting XI, I suspect we will also see that change repeatedly over the coming season. Europe allows 5 subs - we need them. It allows games for fringe players and keeps everyone fairly sharp. Hopefully the medical team are on to it and will keep the cryo chamber door open so they can all spend their midweeks in there before the next match day!
Looking forward to Thursday-Sunday, just hope they can keep it going!
UTF!
posted on 3/11/20
New guy here, been reading for years so thought I should sign up and start contributing..
I think once everyone’s fit the back 3 of Cags Fofana and Evans with Ricardo and Castangne as wing backs will be so good we will be able play the more attacking midfielders to create. Just got to wait for them to get fit!
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Keep_the_faith1 (U8129)
posted 4 hours, 18 minutes ago
Ndidi walks straight back in for me. I may be in the minority with this - but whilst Mendy has done a decent job he isn’t close at all to Ndidi in my opinion.
Same for me with Maddison. Him and Barnes playing behind Vardy.
I don’t really see Ndidi and Maddison not fitting in a 343 and if you are assuming everyone is 10/10, I think the team 99% of people pick is:
Schmeichel
Castagne
Soyunchu
Evans
Fofana
Ricardo
Ndidi
Tielemans
Barnes
Maddison
Vardy
it’s great to have other players pushing for starts and providing adequate cover as this is something that contributed to us not finishing 3rd last year.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What a team that is, lets hope we can get them all fit at the same time.
posted on 3/11/20
Welcome Hamilton Fox. Great to see a new poster.
BTW another example of us going back in time.
When Puel was here I was thinking it wouldn’t be too long before the 2016 immortals were all phased out, but they’ve reappeared for a final swansong. Kasper, Fuchs, Albrighton and Vardy all starting and Morgan coming on for a cameo late on.
posted on 4/11/20
Welcome Hamilton!
I've favoured a back three for some time; even more so with really exciting wing backs like Ricardo and Castagne. What is also good is that we now have Justin and Thomas as back ups, both of whom show great potential. Not to mention Fuchs.
Mendy has performed very well in Ndidi's role. Not as good in the air, but covers the ground well and is more creative going forward. Better on the ball than Wilf too. I expect both will get plenty of game time when both are fully fit.
There really does seem to be a fair amount of depth to the squad, although if Vardy is out for any length of time it would be a worry.
posted on 4/11/20
The difference it will make with those 5 at the back will be unreal, with all 3 central defenders back we won’t be scared of playing football and the full backs are so good going forward they will push on rather than just sitting back, add in ndidi to cover and I really think we should be making top four. Just depends how long it takes to get them all fit though
posted on 4/11/20
The back 5 does look very exciting indeed.
I think Rodgers should work to the talent we have to deliver a new 5-1-3-1 formation.
Ndidi dropping in when the full backs bomb on
Maddison in the 10 flanked by Praet/Barnes and Tilly
Vardy doing what Vardy does.
Oooooooof!
I guess this is what KTF was saying but tweaking formation slightly (even though it’s fluid!)...
posted on 4/11/20
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
Forfana
Mendy
Under
Praet
Evans
Never thought I'd see the day when we had 14
must starters.
posted on 5/11/20
comment by Appletonsthename (U10074)
posted 12 hours, 9 minutes ago
Schmeichel
Pereira
Castagne
Soyuncu
Ndidi
Tielemans
Maddison
Barnes
Vardy
Forfana
Mendy
Under
Praet
Evans
Never thought I'd see the day when we had 14
must starters.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well you won’t.
Coz we’re only allowed eleven
Page 1 of 1