Santi Cazorla or Joe Allen?

I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for. By the sounds of it he is a 'winger' in the style of Pires or Kranjcar - not an orthodox down-the-line merchant - and if this is the case then I don't see him playing a deep role for you

He could play any position in the spurs team.

I know very little about him, but from what I gather he has never played a deep-midfield role for any of the sides he has played for.
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Indeed he has. As this blog points out.

http://thebottomcorner.wordpress.com/2012/08/06/santi-cazorla-solves-a-lot-of-problems-for-arsenal/

He is one of the best players in Liga. And because he can actually play anywhere in the midfield is the type Arsene is trying to build a midfield around.

Arteta was only allowed to play on the wing or behind the striker at Everton. However at Arsenal he has predominantly played in Wilshere's position. Thats the type of pass/move flexible midfield that is the core of Arsenal. Swansea tried to copy that when Martinez was in charge. Rodgers very much built on his style. I doubt very much he can transform Liverpool unless he changes the entire squad beginning with Gerrard (whose passing quality is quite average).

So a comparison between Allen and Cazorla can be made. However to be fair the quality gap is so great that its more sensible to compare Ramsey and Allen. But then Aaron really shouldn't be a starter for us at this point in his career and Arsene has solved that problem with the Carzola acquisition.

comment by Donald Vito (U4098) posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago

He could play any position in the spurs team.

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If our side is that shabby you need to hold the mirror up - it means he'd be able to do the same for you. A few years ago, yes, but if you think you are anything special now you need to splash some water on your face.




Jenius, we'll see if he plays a deeper position for Arsenal - i'm not convinced he will. I don't agree with the Arteta statement by the way, he always played a central role when we played them and they usually had Osman/Coleman and Pienaar as the wide players.

we'll see if he plays a deeper position for Arsenal - i'm not convinced he will.
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Unfortunately this is where many pundits as well as many gooners get confused about our formation.

We don't play with any restrictive positions on the pitch.

Our front 3 rotate. And our central midfield 3 also rotate. Thats why Song had so many assists last year. Gooners were often criticizing Song for going forward when that was actually by design. Just that Ramsey was often lacking whenever he was required to cover. Our win rate was almost 70% when Song, Arteta, Rosicky were playing in combination because Rosicky was covering whenever he was required to do. Now Rosicky is hardly a defensive midfield player!

So you will see Cazorla start in the Cesc position. But during the game, he will be playing defensive as well as on the wing when our players rotate. Thats why Spain and Barca are so successful. Players are required to perform multiple roles, with equal technical ability. The only British player able to do that in central midfield the premier league is Wilshere. Thats why Arsene is developing Theo on the wing to play as a rounded striker. And Ox will also get training in the midfield in multiple positions. Coquelin is learning as cover for full backs to be a central midfield player.

Barca/Spain still have a Busquets (Senna, Keita) there though - that's why it works so well. Xavi sitting deeper, with Iniesta being predominantly the more advanced. Although fluid, they still have their roles in the side.

What you have explained sounds lovely in theory, but id be very surprised to see this lad(albeit with 2nd hand info on him and what you have said) being anything other than an attacking mid or wide forward. Only time will tell

Although fluid, they still have their roles in the side.
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As do our players at the start of the game. Essentially Arsene tries to work player instincts in combinations rather than set roles.

For example Song was trained/brought up as a central defender. His natural instincts are defensive. Now Arsene does not force him to stay south of the half way line as other teams would do. But Arsene knows that most of the time he will hold. Thats why I talk of Coquelin (a future replacement for Song) being trained in the full backs position compared to Ox ( a future attacking central midfield) getting his training on the wing and in a more attacking midfield positions. This is the Cryuff/dutch total football system. Its actually one step ahead of Barca. Arsene was doing that at Monaco. He and Cryuff go way back.

Barca were implementing the Cryuff system to its absolute in their pomp but as players have gotten older they have found it harder to fit those styles. Barca had a young crop that all came up together. Their present crop of youngsters don't have the same quality. Xavi just doesn't have the legs to arrive late in the box as he used to. They were unable to replace David Villa when he was injured. Tello wasn't as good. Those instincts are are very important but the capacity to play multiple positions is more important. This is why Barca were less effective last year. Thats why they always look to Arsenal as first port of call to steal a player.

I wouldn't call Barca buying Fabregas stealing exactly considering they produced him, you stole him and sold him back for £30m or whatever it was

Petit, Overmars, Gio, Sylvinhio, Henry, Cesc, Hleb, approached Afobe. To name just a few in recent years.

Its almost Barca need Wenger's validation on the technical ability of the player before buying. They could have bought most of those players at any time before they joined us.

Cesc only proves the point. Cesc's dad asked the technical director at the time if he had a chance at Barca to get a pro contract. The reply was not very positive so Cesc joined us. In fact thats why they were awarded so little in the court case that followed.

Cazorla or Allen? Hmmm.