If you listen to Sky, you’d think racism was prevalent in English football.
Gary Neville and others amongst him pointed the finger at those at the top of our game to get tough on racism - which I don’t think anybody disputes.
But the idea that we have a problem in English football is wide of the mark.
After listening to pundits virtue signal as to who could condemn racism the most, I checked the stats on racist incidents across the English game for last season and there was a total of 184 incidents across the Professional game - which I assume to be the 4 main tiers of our football league structure.
I then checked the aggregate attendance for the Premier League and that was 14.5million people through turnstiles. Yes, that’s just the Premier League.
So why do these pundits continue to say that there is a problem with racism in the English game?
Based on the available data, I’d conclude that racism is not a problem in English football. Does racism exist within society ? Yes and that will never change so long as people can think. Not pleasant, but objectively true but let’s not condemn the millions of people who attend games all season and do nothing but support their teams.
The real answer is that racism exists and every now and again it spills onto the terraces. That’s it.
If anything, our game is as diverse as any profession. There’s not many places in the UK where two Muslim lads get treated like Kings. They do at Anfield.
Football isn’t the problem, individuals are.
Racism in the English Game
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 4 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
Imagine if defining a problem were done exclusively in percentages.
We’d probably have no drink driving laws, no seatbelt laws and no compulsory driving insurance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I acknowledged it was a problem but not reflective of the English game.
I've said this about 20 times now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your article literally says it isn’t a problem.
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On the contrary - I suggest that it's a problem that those in power should try and resolve but it is one that is not indicative of the Premier League and the English game in general - which has made huge strides to eradicate abuse from the terraces and the Premier League is undoubtedly one of the best showcases of diversity in the world.
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 1 hour, 3 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 50 minutes ago
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 48 minutes ago
comment by Roys Keane (U11635)
posted 25 minutes ago
What's the OP's take on knife crime in the UK ?
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When you divide the number of stabbing by the number of daily knife users how can people say it’s a problem
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I don't think the nation is being accused of being knife wielding maniacs so the argument falls. Next
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Around 70 knife related murders in London alone this year.
It’s just a small problem.
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Isolating London ?
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Nationwide there have been 44,000 incidents involving a knife/sharp object and 230+ murders in year uproar June and over 400 attempted murders.
But when you water it down it’s not a problem at all.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ahhh so you've changed the narrative
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Take a boo (U21318)
posted 1 hour, 10 minutes ago
I’m struggling to see any reasonable logic in your article.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not sure why. The argument is that the English game, which has been a beacon of diversity for the last 30 years is now being tarnished by people who believe that it's facing a crisis over racial slurs from crowds.
In reality, its a small number of idiots. Average attendances are also up as well as social media engagement - so it's inevitable that abuse will go up as the means to report it have improved.
I've also just read that the 184 were merely reported incidents - not even proven racial incidents.
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 1 hour, 3 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 50 minutes ago
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by Arouna Jagielka oooh I wanna take ya, Heitinga Nikica come on pretty mama (U1308)
posted 48 minutes ago
comment by Roys Keane (U11635)
posted 25 minutes ago
What's the OP's take on knife crime in the UK ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When you divide the number of stabbing by the number of daily knife users how can people say it’s a problem
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't think the nation is being accused of being knife wielding maniacs so the argument falls. Next
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Around 70 knife related murders in London alone this year.
It’s just a small problem.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isolating London ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nationwide there have been 44,000 incidents involving a knife/sharp object and 230+ murders in year uproar June and over 400 attempted murders.
But when you water it down it’s not a problem at all.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ahhh so you've changed the narrative
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think it’s better than a Star Wars defence.
Just accept the stun son.
posted on 24/12/19
But the idea that we have a problem in English football is wide of the mark.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The purpose of the article, as I understand it, is to suggest that English football doesn’t have a problem with racism. Yet the statistical data you’ve used shows that on average it occurs in 10% of games, this clearly is a problem.
Racists have thankfully always been a minority over recent years. The argument made by Gary Neville isn’t that there are now more racists in the stands, it’s that the minority of racists in the crowd feel empowered to the point where they are now openly shouting racist abuse. This is a problem.
Common sense suggests that the actual number of racist incidents is far higher than what’s actually reported. I mean if you witnessed someone making a racist remark would you report it? Would you even know how or who to? Chances are whilst most don’t agree with racist comments in the terraces they simply turn a blind eye rather than reporting it to someone in an official capacity.
The guy caught on camera at the City game making Monkey gestures for instance, you really think this is the first time he’s made a racist gesture or just the first time he’s been caught, live on tv. Same goes for the two incidents of racism at the Spurs v Chelsea game. Are these simply anomalies or an indication that there is an issue which needs addressing within the English game?
posted on 24/12/19
"you really think this is the first time he’s made a racist gesture or just the first time he’s been caught,"
Undoubtedly the latter....as I said yesterday it's endemic in a percentage of society...at all ages & demographics probably
I posted a link showing that a large percentage of brexit leavers were voting on the immigration ticket...this is not a huge leap to racism (for a small percentage)
You'd really hope the millenials (22-37) & post millenials (21 or less) are a bit better educated & less inclined to it...if they're not it'll always be with us
posted on 24/12/19
Oh I’ve no doubt the two are linked, the whole brexit debate essentially gave a platform for those with extreme views, on either side, to air them publicly on social media.
It’s no surprise that those of a racist nature have now spilled onto the terraces, no doubt empowered by recent political events and holding little fear of punishment having witnessed how poor Fifa have been in combating the issue.
As I said to the OP, I don’t believe there are more racists in the stands, rather that the few that are there seem to have found their voice.
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 3 hours, 43 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 4 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
Imagine if defining a problem were done exclusively in percentages.
We’d probably have no drink driving laws, no seatbelt laws and no compulsory driving insurance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I acknowledged it was a problem but not reflective of the English game.
I've said this about 20 times now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your article literally says it isn’t a problem.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On the contrary - I suggest that it's a problem that those in power should try and resolve but it is one that is not indicative of the Premier League and the English game in general - which has made huge strides to eradicate abuse from the terraces and the Premier League is undoubtedly one of the best showcases of diversity in the world.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the idea that we have a problem in English football is wide of the mark.“
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 22 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 3 hours, 43 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 4 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
Imagine if defining a problem were done exclusively in percentages.
We’d probably have no drink driving laws, no seatbelt laws and no compulsory driving insurance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I acknowledged it was a problem but not reflective of the English game.
I've said this about 20 times now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your article literally says it isn’t a problem.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On the contrary - I suggest that it's a problem that those in power should try and resolve but it is one that is not indicative of the Premier League and the English game in general - which has made huge strides to eradicate abuse from the terraces and the Premier League is undoubtedly one of the best showcases of diversity in the world.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the idea that we have a problem in English football is wide of the mark.“
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, that’s 2 different statements.
It’s a problem to have people using racial slurs.
It’s not an English football problem. On the contrary, English football is as good a defence of diversity and race as any forum/medium in the UK because it takes people on the basis of ability and character over race and culture.
Compare that to the BBC for example who regularly use ethnicity quotas etc.
posted on 24/12/19
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 22 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 3 hours, 43 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 4 minutes ago
comment by Metro.⚽️ (U6770)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
Imagine if defining a problem were done exclusively in percentages.
We’d probably have no drink driving laws, no seatbelt laws and no compulsory driving insurance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I acknowledged it was a problem but not reflective of the English game.
I've said this about 20 times now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your article literally says it isn’t a problem.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On the contrary - I suggest that it's a problem that those in power should try and resolve but it is one that is not indicative of the Premier League and the English game in general - which has made huge strides to eradicate abuse from the terraces and the Premier League is undoubtedly one of the best showcases of diversity in the world.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the idea that we have a problem in English football is wide of the mark.“
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, that’s 2 different statements.
It’s a problem to have people using racial slurs.
It’s not an English football problem. On the contrary, English football is as good a defence of diversity and race as any forum/medium in the UK because it takes people on the basis of ability and character over race and culture.
Compare that to the BBC for example who regularly use ethnicity quotas etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Read that back. Makes absolutely no sense.
Anyway, you’ve admitted we do have a problem and hopefully you’ve now seen the ridiculous of using percentages to try and prove otherwise, so it’s all good.