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South American Stars at United

We've had a succession of big name Latin American footballers who didn't exactly impress at Old Trafford. I don't understand it personally.

Di Maria was outstanding at Benfica and Real Madrid , came to United and generally struggled and went to PSG where he's been incredible for them.

Sanchez was pretty good a Barcelona , even better at Arsenal but he was never quite right and looked somewhat lost when he came to United for some reason.

Falcao was "El Tigre" at Atletico Madrid , an amazing goal scorer for them and later for Monaco before arriving at Old Trafford where he was a shadow of himself. But in fairness to him he suffered that horrible injury at Monaco and was just never the same again.

Forlan Is an interesting one for me. I always liked him a lot when he played for United but generally our fans weren't as impressed with him.
He went on to be absolutely unstoppable for both Villarreal and later Atletico Madrid , winning the golden boot twice in Spain and was once Europe's top scorer.

So what is it with United and otherwise great players from south america?
Of course there will be the usual nonsense of "they couldn't deal with the premier league" but the likes of Sanchez at Arsenal , Suarez and Coutinho at Liverpool , Aguero at City and quite a few brazilians over the years in the PL prove how stupid and laughable that argument is.

It's a bit of a head scratcher this ...

posted 2 days, 10 hours ago

Valencia
Tevez
Rafael
Romero
Heinze
Hernandez

...were/are all fine signings.

- Forlan... I actually thought he was hard done by here some putting him in a slightly separate category of his own. He was very clearly an excellent player and I always felt he should have been kept. He took a while to adapt to the English game and was desperately unlikely not to get off the mark sooner than he did with us. I recall him hitting the post a few times and that 'hasn't scored yet' tag weighing heavy for a while. Quite probably wouldn't have been considered a success with a bit more patience.

- Fred... jury still out but he won't justify his price tag. Will likely be in the category below in time but willing to reserve judgement for another season based on progress this season.

The reality is that:

- Falcao was past his best, largely owing to injury.
- Di Maria didn't really want to be here/was played in strange positions by LvG.
- Veron was actually a lot better in Europe for us and really wasn't as bad as is made out in the PL.
- Kleberson started well, got a bad injury (shoulder?) and never really kicked on. Wasn't good enough.
- Rojo's been ok when he's played. Prone to a clanger but mostly just injured. Reasonable cover when fit.
- Sanchez... Another case of bad timing. Clearly past his best and lost a yard or two of explosiveness.
- Fabio... a stand out performer on our CL run and came out with credit in the bank after that Wembley final defeat to Barca. Injuries ultimately undid his career.
- Anderson... Injury ravaged and really not as good as some considered him to be.

Essentially when you break the list down, the reality is that we've signed players who were past their best, have suffered injuries or simply weren't very good to begin with.

Di Maria & Veron are the standout disappointments given their fees and obvious quality and standing in the game. They were both signed at their peaks but didn't work out for differing reasons.

I think only five of that list of 16 players could be considered to have been "ready made", top quality players when they were signed (Tevez, Sanchez, Veron, Falcao & Di Maria). That means that roughly 2/3's of the South/Central American players we've signed were mostly lower priced punts, some of which turned out to be excellent signings, others less so. And I'd argue 6 out of 16 were definitely successful players for us. That's not too bad at all really. What's not so good is that only 1 (two at a push) of the 5 players from the "top player" category could be argued as being successful for us.

posted 2 days, 10 hours ago

comment by rosso is done with this (U17054)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by ☼ Great_Red_Shark ☼ (U1711)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
How do you guys rate Rodrigo Possebon?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the best central midfield Academy graduates I’ve seen, full stop.

Would put him in the same group as Pogba and Ravel before Pogatetz attacked him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This is surely a bit mythical at this point? The Pogatetz tackle only kept him out for a few weeks as I recall, and the trajectory of his career post-United never even hinted of a player capable of playing anywhere close to PL level.

I don't doubt his quality at youth level, but it simply can't be true that he was at Pogba or Ravel's level.

posted 2 days, 10 hours ago

Forlan

Was gutted it didn’t work out for him at United. If he’d have played with the confidence he did in Spain then him and Rooney would have been an incredible pair upfront.

comment by IAmMe (U18491)

posted 2 days, 9 hours ago

Forlan, Veron, Anderson and Kleberson were all better than they were given credit for.

Heinze, Tevez and Valencia were the real deal and were largely recognised as such.

Romero and Sanchez were 'meh' and overrated before they arrived. Nothing changed after.

Falcao was never going to be the kind of player that could deal with the EPL. And he wasn't

And the twins were obviously just some sort of cosmic piece of satire perpetrated by SAF who wanted to leave a 'dog droppings' kind of problem for whoever replaced him. Quite a good piece of pranking to be fair to him

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

What Berba said, it’s not necessarily because of their nationality that some didn’t succeed at United but more individual reasons.

Also, I’d say that those who do move to Europe before making the switch the the PL are better suited. I’m pretty sure all the South American’s who have succeeded in the PL have been bought from a European club.

posted 2 days, 1 hour ago

comment by BerbaKing11 (U6256)
posted 8 hours, 38 minutes ago
comment by rosso is done with this (U17054)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by ☼ Great_Red_Shark ☼ (U1711)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
How do you guys rate Rodrigo Possebon?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the best central midfield Academy graduates I’ve seen, full stop.

Would put him in the same group as Pogba and Ravel before Pogatetz attacked him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This is surely a bit mythical at this point? The Pogatetz tackle only kept him out for a few weeks as I recall, and the trajectory of his career post-United never even hinted of a player capable of playing anywhere close to PL level.

I don't doubt his quality at youth level, but it simply can't be true that he was at Pogba or Ravel's level.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s all a matter of opinion, of course. But by the time that Midds game came around, the lad had his own song.

People who follow the youth sides closely were very, very excited about him, and he was demonstrating on the pitch that day why: Pogatetz went in on him like he did (and make no mistake, it was a horror challenge - maybe the worst I have ever seen live) because he and the Midds midfield couldn’t get the ball off him. It was pure frustration about being given the run around by an 18 year old kid.

As CiC has said, that day changed him. The lad has said it himself. Psychologically, that challenge ended his United career.

posted 2 days, 1 hour ago

comment by StringerBell (U11749)
posted 9 hours, 38 minutes ago
Seba Veron will always be the one that hurt the most.
Quality player. During Pre-Season he set up Ruudboy with a glorious pass and a great finish...
I thought ‘here we go, he looks like he could be settled now...’

We go sell him to fackin’ Chelsea... to say I was distraught was an understatement.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Remember the back heel volley thing he scored in training?

posted 2 days ago

comment by rosso is done with this (U17054)
posted 1 hour, 12 minutes ago
comment by BerbaKing11 (U6256)
posted 8 hours, 38 minutes ago
comment by rosso is done with this (U17054)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by ☼ Great_Red_Shark ☼ (U1711)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
How do you guys rate Rodrigo Possebon?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the best central midfield Academy graduates I’ve seen, full stop.

Would put him in the same group as Pogba and Ravel before Pogatetz attacked him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

This is surely a bit mythical at this point? The Pogatetz tackle only kept him out for a few weeks as I recall, and the trajectory of his career post-United never even hinted of a player capable of playing anywhere close to PL level.

I don't doubt his quality at youth level, but it simply can't be true that he was at Pogba or Ravel's level.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s all a matter of opinion, of course. But by the time that Midds game came around, the lad had his own song.

People who follow the youth sides closely were very, very excited about him, and he was demonstrating on the pitch that day why: Pogatetz went in on him like he did (and make no mistake, it was a horror challenge - maybe the worst I have ever seen live) because he and the Midds midfield couldn’t get the ball off him. It was pure frustration about being given the run around by an 18 year old kid.

As CiC has said, that day changed him. The lad has said it himself. Psychologically, that challenge ended his United career.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I can’t find any direct quotes where he talks about that tackle impacting him psychologically. The MEN state it, but the quotes from which they summarise this do t actually say anything of the sort.

posted 1 day, 22 hours ago

Just reading about Possebon now - according to Wikipedia he's only played 82 competitive matches in his whole career (just 29 of those were league matches)

posted 1 day, 22 hours ago

comment by Jalisco Red (U4195)
posted 3 minutes ago
Just reading about Possebon now - according to Wikipedia he's only played 82 competitive matches in his whole career (just 29 of those were league matches)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ravel has played 104.

Both incredibly sad stories (although I have much more sympathy for Possebon than Ravel).

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