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Interesting Arteta v Wenger stat

Arsenal need nine wins and 2 draws from last 13 Premier League games to match Arsene Wenger’s WORST season in charge

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/14101798/arsenal-prem-finish-arteta-wenger-record/

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

Fact is Arteta has taken us from a top 6 team to a mid table team. He has made us more defensive and we dont create chances against anyone even remotely set up to stop us.

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 11 hours, 9 minutes ago
That’s fair enough, I know how much you’ve hated those humiliations. But I just think the overall picture of where Arsenal are right now is far more humiliating, looking from the outside. You’ve then got to look at the short, mid and long term financial health of the club, and that’s a mile away from where you were when you had a fairly consistent level with hopes and aspirations of being top dog in England again - and they weren’t massively unreasonable, hence why Wenger needed to leave as he held you back.

Now you’re talking having to have a complete rebuild just to try and get back to the position you were in for all those years.

I’m not trying to put a downer on you, that’s just how see the situations differently.

There is promise, of course. Arsenal football club is too big to remain like this indefinitely. But you’ll probably need to start behaving more like Liverpool, Leicester and Spurs, than Man United.
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If it gets us back to the top, it's much better for us to properly rebuild and accept finishing mid-table, than to carry on with the short-term sticking plaster approach that has seen us gradually slide down the table under Wenger, and then Emery.

There are two things Arteta has done:
(1) made us a team that can defend properly - our defensive record is now one of the best in the league
(2) reduced our attacking potency - we have really struggled to create as many chances or score as many goals, and this has been in long-term decline for a few seasons. Arteta has yet to figure this out, but the emergence of ESR and Saka, as well as Martinelli last season, have helped to offset the decline in performance from Auba and Lacazette. However, our attack is still very hit and miss, and currently very fragile - it only fires when ESR is playing as far as I can see, although maybe Odegaard can start to fill that void. The attacking midfield position is a key piece of the jigsaw in the way Arteta sets out his team, and the idea Willian could play there was a clear mistake.

Our central midfield is still a huge issue. Perhaps had Partey stayed fit we'd be significantly higher up the table, but the truth is all our other CM options are sub-par. We need to sign some better options here if we are going to compete for the top four or higher. Until Arteta has had the chance to improve the midfield this summer, I think it's unfair to pass full judgement. According to statistical analysis, we have improved as a side this season, but whereas last season a lot of the games decided by a single goal went our way, this season they've almost all gone against us especially with red card decisions. Our league position is a bit misleading - according to Fivethirtyeight's analysis: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/soccer-predictions/premier-league/, Arsenal are now the 5th best side in the premier league (based on stats like XG, attack strength vs defensive strength), albeit only slightly head of a whole host of other sides like Leicester, Spurs, West Ham, Villa, Wolves and Everton.

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

The biggest and most important stats would say otherwise though. The league table doesn't lie.

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

Sorry but when you look at that list of finishes, Arsenal fans don't half look a right bunch of s MOANING about finishing there every year

I feel our pain but it's sooo really not a good look

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

We’ve gone from a team that appeared in the CL, without competing in it for years, to being a team that can’t compete in it, because we don’t appear in it.

The only ones losing out are the owners.

You should be made up by that, WB2.

posted 1 week, 1 day ago

comment by Herbie (U7136)
posted 1 day, 2 hours ago
comment by Cinciwolf---A top 20 brand in world football (U11551)
posted 40 minutes ago
I forget already, who took over after Wenger?

I think comparisons are a bit silly, it was clear the mess was coming even before Wenger left and it was largely one he and the club created by failing to address real needs to the squad year on year and buying luxuries instead.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Takes a Wolves fan to actually see there's nuance to this kind of thing and the rot that has set was brought about by and because of the Wenger regime. That said, Arteta is a mess.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nooo.

The "Wenger regime," is the one that revolutionised English football and delivered you your Invincibles, among other glories. As well as keeping your team one of the biggest and best in the PL when it had no financial business being there.

The regime responsible for "the rot" as you put it, well that would be the KROENKE regime. See that's the one that controlled the money. That's the one that when we had 200+ mil of the clubs own money in the bank that could be spanked on whoever Wenger wanted. Told Wenger he couldn't get whoever he wanted and had to just make do. So he could keep as much of the club cash in the club bank acc as possible. See it's worth more in his business portfolio if the cash stays in.

When we should have been buying Cavnani for 60, we got Ozil because he was "a bargain" at 45. When we should have bought VVD at 60, we got Mustafi becuase he was "a bargain for a PL cb" at 30. As Xhaka was "a bargain" potentially in MF, when we could genuinely afford to make an aggressive TM move for someone as good as Veratti. Remember just how Wenger transformed the AFC attack in the first place. This is not a man who has any problem with spending any amount on the right player WHEN LEFT FREE TO DO SO. So this is not a man who would have made the "Ozil (who I don't need) for 45 when I can buy Cavani for 60," decison by choice. Not unless you reckon he enjoyed losing anyway.

There's no better proof that the underlying problem is THE OWNER, than the acquisition of Partey. Absolute steal at modern market rates, desperately needed by AFC, willing to sign on day one of the window. Yet when did Kroenke finally give in on the money??? We're fecking lucky the other major teams are covered in that spot or we'd have lost him. Same as we lost every other top transfer we sniffed at. To clubs whose owners were willing to cough whatever fee it took! THAT'S our problem mate and it's going to hamstring every manager we get until Kroenke learns this isn't America. Here we give CLUBS money every season, as well as players.

comment by (U3265)

posted 6 days, 12 hours ago

comment by WB2 {Tackle Like Tierney} (U8276)
posted 17 hours, 31 minutes ago
comment by Herbie (U7136)
posted 1 day, 2 hours ago
comment by Cinciwolf---A top 20 brand in world football (U11551)
posted 40 minutes ago
I forget already, who took over after Wenger?

I think comparisons are a bit silly, it was clear the mess was coming even before Wenger left and it was largely one he and the club created by failing to address real needs to the squad year on year and buying luxuries instead.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Takes a Wolves fan to actually see there's nuance to this kind of thing and the rot that has set was brought about by and because of the Wenger regime. That said, Arteta is a mess.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nooo.

The "Wenger regime," is the one that revolutionised English football and delivered you your Invincibles, among other glories. As well as keeping your team one of the biggest and best in the PL when it had no financial business being there.

The regime responsible for "the rot" as you put it, well that would be the KROENKE regime. See that's the one that controlled the money. That's the one that when we had 200+ mil of the clubs own money in the bank that could be spanked on whoever Wenger wanted. Told Wenger he couldn't get whoever he wanted and had to just make do. So he could keep as much of the club cash in the club bank acc as possible. See it's worth more in his business portfolio if the cash stays in.

When we should have been buying Cavnani for 60, we got Ozil because he was "a bargain" at 45. When we should have bought VVD at 60, we got Mustafi becuase he was "a bargain for a PL cb" at 30. As Xhaka was "a bargain" potentially in MF, when we could genuinely afford to make an aggressive TM move for someone as good as Veratti. Remember just how Wenger transformed the AFC attack in the first place. This is not a man who has any problem with spending any amount on the right player WHEN LEFT FREE TO DO SO. So this is not a man who would have made the "Ozil (who I don't need) for 45 when I can buy Cavani for 60," decison by choice. Not unless you reckon he enjoyed losing anyway.

There's no better proof that the underlying problem is THE OWNER, than the acquisition of Partey. Absolute steal at modern market rates, desperately needed by AFC, willing to sign on day one of the window. Yet when did Kroenke finally give in on the money??? We're fecking lucky the other major teams are covered in that spot or we'd have lost him. Same as we lost every other top transfer we sniffed at. To clubs whose owners were willing to cough whatever fee it took! THAT'S our problem mate and it's going to hamstring every manager we get until Kroenke learns this isn't America. Here we give CLUBS money every season, as well as players.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Totally agree , the Kroenke's have restricted spending ever since they took over. It would have been interesting to see what Wenger could have done given the money. A lot of his later years were ruined by being restricted financially. He did spend money in his later years , not much of it was on good players either , but he was operating in a market where the top players were simply out of his price range so he had to go for lesser players.

posted 6 days, 12 hours ago

He did spend money in his later years , not much of it was on good players either , but he was operating in a market where the top players were simply out of his price range so he had to go for lesser players.
--------------
Could have got better value for money for the like of Xhaka, Mustafi, Laca, etc.. though.

comment by (U3265)

posted 6 days, 10 hours ago

comment by We've got our Arsenal back (U10012)
posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago
He did spend money in his later years , not much of it was on good players either , but he was operating in a market where the top players were simply out of his price range so he had to go for lesser players.
--------------
Could have got better value for money for the like of Xhaka, Mustafi, Laca, etc.. though.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mustafi was a world cup winner so should have been better player than he turned out to be.

posted 6 days, 9 hours ago

comment by (U3265)
posted 2 hours, 36 minutes ago
---------------------------------------------------------------------Totally agree , the Kroenke's have restricted spending ever since they took over. It would have been interesting to see what Wenger could have done given the money. A lot of his later years were ruined by being restricted financially. He did spend money in his later years , not much of it was on good players either , but he was operating in a market where the top players were simply out of his price range so he had to go for lesser players.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this is partially true, but I also think Wenger was often guilty of trying to do just enough to win the league, and that ended up costing us. The problems started when Dein left the boardroom, because he pushed Arsene to strengthen the squad beyond what was "enough", and try and blow the opposition out of the water. To me Wenger often seemed to be trying to finesse the league by creating very good first teams but leaving a lot of room in his squads for young players to develop. This is fine if everyone stays fit and you don't have any major injuries, but it means if something does happen it can derail your season.

Our first team in 2007-08 were the best side in the league for the first 2/3 of the season and were going to prove Wenger's policy of focusing on the youngsters right. But then the freak injury to Eduardo and the lack of experience in the team meant they dropped points in five consecutive games and ended up 3rd, four points off winners Man Utd.

In the year that Leicester won the league we were poised to take control of the title race after Welbeck's header against them with 12 games to go - instead we saw our reliance on Giroud backfire as he went on a goal-scoring drought and we only won 5/12 in the run in.

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