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Must watch video on Fonseca

Really decent insight on our new coach-elect


https://youtu.be/jN4FzNSSoXw

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

We'll be ok under Fonseca

There are better options available but that doesn't mean he's a disaster - the initial reaction from some posters was pretty embarrassing.

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

comment by Christopher (U20930)
posted 4 minutes ago
We'll be ok under Fonseca

There are better options available but that doesn't mean he's a disaster - the initial reaction from some posters was pretty embarrassing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The worry is that like Jose, some fans are almost hoping he fails so they can be angry again at the owners.

On the flip side if he's a succeas then it will be "Levy got lucky as he was 5th choice".

it's a sad state of affairs that many cannot park their OTT hatred of the owners. Expectations are raised because of the progress made but no credit is given for that progress. When things return to normal.al our ability to challenge will also improve as our finances are now much stronger.

This appointment is key though. Fonseca to me seems like a bit of middle ground. Not a back to basics rebuild kinda guy, and not a high profile pedigree instant impact type. I can understand why many may be underwhelmed but its still all just speculation at this stage.

comment by Ace (U22467)

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 24 seconds ago
comment by Christopher (U20930)
posted 4 minutes ago
We'll be ok under Fonseca

There are better options available but that doesn't mean he's a disaster - the initial reaction from some posters was pretty embarrassing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The worry is that like Jose, some fans are almost hoping he fails so they can be angry again at the owners.

On the flip side if he's a succeas then it will be "Levy got lucky as he was 5th choice".

it's a sad state of affairs that many cannot park their OTT hatred of the owners. Expectations are raised because of the progress made but no credit is given for that progress. When things return to normal.al our ability to challenge will also improve as our finances are now much stronger.

This appointment is key though. Fonseca to me seems like a bit of middle ground. Not a back to basics rebuild kinda guy, and not a high profile pedigree instant impact type. I can understand why many may be underwhelmed but its still all just speculation at this stage.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think a lot of credit is given to the owners for the progress made in off the field growth. This has been helped though by 4 years CL money including £100m for reaching the final. The credit for that goes to Pochettino, given that he reached that final in June 2019 having not had a signing sanctioned since January 2018.

The raising of expectations football wise is also down to him given that he was working on a net spend of £20m a season (at best) during his tenure and took us up to 2nd/3rd PL consistently. Hand the reigns to less capable managers either side of him ie AVB and Mourinho, and it’s back to 6th place we go. I give little credit to the owners for the footballing expectations being raised, because it’s a fact that Poch was their 3rd choice and they got lucky, and it’s a fact that they didn’t exactly seize the opportunity to back him when we were on the verge of major honours (ditto Redknapp).

Financially and commercially ENIC have done an excellent job, they make owners of similar sized clubs such as Everton, Villa, Leeds etc look like rank amateurs. Even Arsenal to be honest. But they lack the ambition to push this club on to being a major player. The only way it’s gonna happen is through jammy recruitment, ie finding a manager that can put a top squad together on a budget and get them playing as a whole that’s greater than the sum of its parts. But as we saw with Poch, that is only sustainable for so long and will fade away without being supplemented by continued reinvestment. Levy doesn’t recognise that, his approach was ‘well it’s going well so we don’t need to invest’, but that’s the wrong strategy, that’s actually the best time to invest, and not doing so in the end only leads to stagnation followed by regression.

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

We don`t need a rebuild from scratch, put a competent defensive unit and a top class CM into our team and we will have a great team. We will always score plenty of goals and we have great attacking players, it is the individual defensive errors and failure to dominate central midfield that lets us down.

posted 2 days, 5 hours ago

Let's get this right. The only reason we are unsatisfied with the Fonseca appointment is because of the progression Poch gave us. Sure, off-field business acquisitions, stadiums, training ground and sponsorship have been more in line with the larger clubs for which Levy and the owners do deserve credit but the sole reason for our flirtation with Conte, widely considered to be one of the best managers in world football today, is still down to the platform and awareness Poch provided us with. You can't get close to resigning Poch, then Conte, then Ten Hag and drop right down to someone like Fonseca. You just can't. It's not just the appointment. It's the constant 'downsizing' of choices. If this goes on for another 50 days, I'm expecting Barry Fry to walk through the door.

Fonseca is underwhelming anyway based on his record but when you add in the backdrop of top managers we've allegedly tried to acquire, this stinks even more.

posted 1 day, 23 hours ago

comment by Ace (U22467)
posted 5 hours, 2 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 24 seconds ago
comment by Christopher (U20930)
posted 4 minutes ago
We'll be ok under Fonseca

There are better options available but that doesn't mean he's a disaster - the initial reaction from some posters was pretty embarrassing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The worry is that like Jose, some fans are almost hoping he fails so they can be angry again at the owners.

On the flip side if he's a succeas then it will be "Levy got lucky as he was 5th choice".

it's a sad state of affairs that many cannot park their OTT hatred of the owners. Expectations are raised because of the progress made but no credit is given for that progress. When things return to normal.al our ability to challenge will also improve as our finances are now much stronger.

This appointment is key though. Fonseca to me seems like a bit of middle ground. Not a back to basics rebuild kinda guy, and not a high profile pedigree instant impact type. I can understand why many may be underwhelmed but its still all just speculation at this stage.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think a lot of credit is given to the owners for the progress made in off the field growth. This has been helped though by 4 years CL money including £100m for reaching the final. The credit for that goes to Pochettino, given that he reached that final in June 2019 having not had a signing sanctioned since January 2018.

The raising of expectations football wise is also down to him given that he was working on a net spend of £20m a season (at best) during his tenure and took us up to 2nd/3rd PL consistently. Hand the reigns to less capable managers either side of him ie AVB and Mourinho, and it’s back to 6th place we go. I give little credit to the owners for the footballing expectations being raised, because it’s a fact that Poch was their 3rd choice and they got lucky, and it’s a fact that they didn’t exactly seize the opportunity to back him when we were on the verge of major honours (ditto Redknapp).

Financially and commercially ENIC have done an excellent job, they make owners of similar sized clubs such as Everton, Villa, Leeds etc look like rank amateurs. Even Arsenal to be honest. But they lack the ambition to push this club on to being a major player. The only way it’s gonna happen is through jammy recruitment, ie finding a manager that can put a top squad together on a budget and get them playing as a whole that’s greater than the sum of its parts. But as we saw with Poch, that is only sustainable for so long and will fade away without being supplemented by continued reinvestment. Levy doesn’t recognise that, his approach was ‘well it’s going well so we don’t need to invest’, but that’s the wrong strategy, that’s actually the best time to invest, and not doing so in the end only leads to stagnation followed by regression.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

You see there are 2 things here that really irk me.

"Levy got lucky as Poch was 3rd choice". Firstly, may be we would have done better under our 1st and 2nd choices. May be our 3rd choice, who won nothing, was 3rd for a reason.

Fans seem very confused. Highly critical of our owners as we have won nothing but also highly critical of our owners for sacking Poch who won nothing. I can think of 1 final and 2 SF under Poch where we simply did not turn up and/or Poch made suspect team choices.

Fact is, Poch was 3rd on the list, it was not Luck that we appointed him because he was on the list and the owners took that risk.

People also need to accept that we are run as a business, not a play thing with an open cheque from the owners. In this respect ENIC have had us back punching at our weight. Europe for 15 years after none for about the same period of time.. We site behind the elite clubs with their greater wealth. We cannot expect to compete with them, we can hope. Whatever our net spend is it is what we can afford.

What we need to do to be competitive is to have everything right. The structures, the manager & coaching the recruitment. Then we may be able to punch above our weight.

This is where ENIC/Levy have failed because we have lurched from one setup to another. Some managerial appointments have been disasters (although we are not alone in this, every club does it!), others have been perfect at that time.

For me its the recruitment that has failed us. A lack of long term planning and some poor transfer choices. Our windows with no deals ultimately cost us as our squad tired and aged, but this was not due to lack of funds. Yes there were restrictions as we were building NWHL, but Poch notoriously did not want loan deals and also rejected a number signings, preferring to save his budget for bigger and better in the future.

That was his choice and it was super unfortunate that at the time when we needed to manage the squad well, the stadium limited our ability to do so.

So some of it is out of the owners control, some of it the managers decision and some of it just poor squad management & recruitment.

To lay everything at the door of Levy/ENIC is not justified. Many factors influence the ebb and flow of a clubs fortunes.

The second thing is ambition. Where we do not have unlimited resources, ambition has to be tainted with realism. Every fan could say "why don't our owners spend £250m to make us competitive" and the reality is that it is just a tiny tiny minority who have the ability to spend way beyond their means without any risk. Spurs are like almost every other club, we spend what we can afford from money we generate. Even Utd and Liverpool act in this way. Liverpool almost went bust chasing glory.

People want us to buy success, it aint happening! and so they call this a lack of ambition. The ambition has to be demonstrated in the way we give ourselves the very best chance of success in the way we operate, not how much we spend. Leicester are a great example IMO, brilliantly structured club, very well run, excellent recruitment. The right people in the right positions, not massive spending and they punch above their financial weight.

This is what we need to aspire to do (and at times we have been spot on with this) and then we stand a chance of competing at the top as our financial position is now closer to the elite clubs than it historically was.

Taking some footballing decisions out of Levy's hands is the right start. I hope the next managerial appointment comes with a clear vision and plan.

posted 1 day, 23 hours ago

comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 5 hours, 37 minutes ago
Let's get this right. The only reason we are unsatisfied with the Fonseca appointment is because of the progression Poch gave us. Sure, off-field business acquisitions, stadiums, training ground and sponsorship have been more in line with the larger clubs for which Levy and the owners do deserve credit but the sole reason for our flirtation with Conte, widely considered to be one of the best managers in world football today, is still down to the platform and awareness Poch provided us with. You can't get close to resigning Poch, then Conte, then Ten Hag and drop right down to someone like Fonseca. You just can't. It's not just the appointment. It's the constant 'downsizing' of choices. If this goes on for another 50 days, I'm expecting Barry Fry to walk through the door.

Fonseca is underwhelming anyway based on his record but when you add in the backdrop of top managers we've allegedly tried to acquire, this stinks even more.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Poch was third choice apparently......did that decision stink?. You think Fonseca's record sucks, it smashes Poch's pre-Spurs record out of the park.

I agree underwhelming but you've judged him already based on little more than his CV not being as good as some other candidates.

comment by Ace (U22467)

posted 1 day, 23 hours ago

Given that our first choice was LVG and second was De Boer I think it’s fair to say getting Poch who was third turned out to be a stroke of good fortune for club. Insulting him for winning nothing is pathetic of a Spurs fan and shows a lack of understanding for the job he did; to finish 3/2/3/4 on the budget he did relative to the rest of the rest of the big six requires a high level of consistency and standard of coaching across 38 games x4 seasons that is harder to achieve than winning a League Cup for example, but because he didn’t do that it’s used as a stick to beat him with whereas Jose would’ve been deemed a success had he done it via beating Brentford, Stoke and a bye. You don’t get a trophy for what Poch did but it very much suited the clubs remit at the time which was to establish us as a CL club (and acquire the money for such) as we transitioned via Wembley to the new stadium.

I don’t blame the owners for us not getting over the line in certain finals or semi finals, that’s another deep rooted issue at the club that needs breaking, I do blame the owners for failing to back managers at crucial times, for jumping from one vision to another meaning we are always in transition, for attempting furlough and ESL and for trying to sell the fans champagne tickets for a lemonade club.

As said, ENIC have done a lot of good for THFC but they are far from beyond reproach.

posted 1 day, 22 hours ago

comment by Ace (U22467)
posted 35 minutes ago
Given that our first choice was LVG and second was De Boer I think it’s fair to say getting Poch who was third turned out to be a stroke of good fortune for club. Insulting him for winning nothing is pathetic of a Spurs fan and shows a lack of understanding for the job he did; to finish 3/2/3/4 on the budget he did relative to the rest of the rest of the big six requires a high level of consistency and standard of coaching across 38 games x4 seasons that is harder to achieve than winning a League Cup for example, but because he didn’t do that it’s used as a stick to beat him with whereas Jose would’ve been deemed a success had he done it via beating Brentford, Stoke and a bye. You don’t get a trophy for what Poch did but it very much suited the clubs remit at the time which was to establish us as a CL club (and acquire the money for such) as we transitioned via Wembley to the new stadium.

I don’t blame the owners for us not getting over the line in certain finals or semi finals, that’s another deep rooted issue at the club that needs breaking, I do blame the owners for failing to back managers at crucial times, for jumping from one vision to another meaning we are always in transition, for attempting furlough and ESL and for trying to sell the fans champagne tickets for a lemonade club.

As said, ENIC have done a lot of good for THFC but they are far from beyond reproach.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree mate. The moment I hated most in their tenure is Jols sacking. Totally despicable. I was at the game when at HT we all knew he was getting the boot. They have made a lot of poor judgements but it is how they have managed them which makes it worse. Jose.sacking b4 the final is another decision that probably needed to happen but the timing !!!!

I am.realiatic in my expectations re: success. I just want something I feel I can really connect with and this has happened at times under ENIC but then at other times the club has become cold and detached and lacking any identity and vision we can all get on board with. Its partially just modern football and the fact we have grown and become more expectant. For me the atmosphere and feeling of the club comes.mainly from the manager, its their personality vision and passion that sets the tone. The appointment has to be right with a strong man with strong personality and vision.with being a **** like Jose

posted 1 day, 22 hours ago

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