I must admit to not watching anything of the womens Euros happening right now. But i did happen to see the Sport on the BBC news channel as they reported on England Lionesses' 8-0 win over Norway.
As Ellen White slid in to tap in her 2nd of the game, the news reader said something along the lines of, "Ellen White scored another 2 to take her within X goals of Wayne Rooney's England goal scoring record"
Errrrr. NO!!!!!! You cannot talk about the womens game and the mens game in the same breath when it comes to breaking records. Same sport, yeah, but men and womens catergories are utterly and completely separate.
You dont hear commentators mix the 2 up in other sports. In a Mens 100m race, the last guy over the line is probably quicker than the womens 100m WR ...You dont hear them scream "and X comes over the line last but smashes the womens WR"
Tennis, rugby golf, cricket, cycling swimming, Athletics etc etc There is no reference between the records of the respected male and female participants.
I am not belittling women or womens sport, but some people, and in this case the Beeb, go way too far in trying to assimilate the mens and womens game. Rant over!
England goal sccoring record
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 20 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 58 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 10 minutes ago
Who cares? They are only saying it to provoke a reaction and get debate started on women's sport. And they've achieved that.
We all know the two sports are worlds apart we don't have to keep convincing ourselves of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonesense!
There is an agenda but it isnt to provoke reaction and debate. and even if it is it fails. Broadcasters like BT often announce WSL games coming up for broadcast without actually stating its WSL, it will just say Arsenal vs Man City coming up 2pm next whenever! It annoys fans of the male game because its misleading and the distinction needs to be clear , rather than blurring the lines between the male and female game.
Proper promotion of the female game should be done on the merits of the women's game, not through false comparisons with the male game and misleading info to almost fool you into watching it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right but here we are discussing it, which in turn is elevating the profile of the women's game. Is that not exactly what they want?
And, as I say, who cares? It's not the first controversial thing ever said and it certainly won't be the last. Sometimes you just need to let people live our their delusions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think you are missing the point. Its not said to be controversial, it is part of an agenda to align the female game as equal with the mens, borne out of the worthy objective of sexual equality....but it goes too far the other way, in that sexual equality is about men and women being treated the same, as equals, and not discriminated against on the basis of gender, but this should not mean that a clear distinction shouldnt be made between the two. The approach taken by the BBC for example is that this is football, its not mens or women's its just football, which is a complete nonesense
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The approach by the Beeb is based entirely on the fact it is the only football that they have TV rights to cover.
Of course they are going to promote the hell out of it, with trying to make some sort of comparison with the men's game part of their strategy.
Take a minute to listen to the commentary ( which btw is even worse than the football ) and you will hear non stop gushing to the point that every touch of the ball, every segment of play is either brilliant, amazing or ( that phrase again ) world class.
The fact that the average keeper is about 5 foot 3, literally any lob or shot vaguely near the corners is a goal.
Personally I don't have a problem with Women's football, and hope England do win it. But I do have a problem with blatant false or over exaggerated promotion of the level of skills seen. Televise it. Get behind it by all means, but please don't try telling me it is a world class standard.
And maybe, just maybe have more recognisable men involved in it's TV presentation to give the wider audience they are clearly seeking a reason to believe the standards will improve. It really doesn't need to be a women vs men war that appears to be the case at present. If they make this all about "this is women only presentation" then it will take longer to catch on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's funny in skateboarding competitions. They judge the women's competition by the exact same standards as the men's.
A great score in the men's comp will be 9 out of 10
A great score in the women's comp will be something like 4 out of 10.
It is quite strange to see but it's the reality of the huge difference in levels.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You'd think that male or female doesnt have any natural physical or biological advantage in skateboarding...seems like men a re better as they have been doing it longer and, while it is an inclusive sport, its probably been harder for women to get involved and feel accepted so they are playing catch up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You get some absolutely incredible kids of say 13/14 years old who physically would be way behind adult men and women (although to a lesser degree).
It's a very technical skill for the most part but it's also incredibly physically demanding particularly in a competition setting.
Skateboarding participation is much higher for men which will make some difference too.
Even in such a technical thing the genetic physical advantages men have do in the end significantly effect average levels at the top
Something like darts or chess might be a field where women can compete in the same competitions successfully
posted on 14/7/22
The only good thing about womens football is the comedy value to it.
The womens USA team got mugged off by a team of 15 year olds.
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 35 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 20 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 58 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 10 minutes ago
Who cares? They are only saying it to provoke a reaction and get debate started on women's sport. And they've achieved that.
We all know the two sports are worlds apart we don't have to keep convincing ourselves of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonesense!
There is an agenda but it isnt to provoke reaction and debate. and even if it is it fails. Broadcasters like BT often announce WSL games coming up for broadcast without actually stating its WSL, it will just say Arsenal vs Man City coming up 2pm next whenever! It annoys fans of the male game because its misleading and the distinction needs to be clear , rather than blurring the lines between the male and female game.
Proper promotion of the female game should be done on the merits of the women's game, not through false comparisons with the male game and misleading info to almost fool you into watching it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right but here we are discussing it, which in turn is elevating the profile of the women's game. Is that not exactly what they want?
And, as I say, who cares? It's not the first controversial thing ever said and it certainly won't be the last. Sometimes you just need to let people live our their delusions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think you are missing the point. Its not said to be controversial, it is part of an agenda to align the female game as equal with the mens, borne out of the worthy objective of sexual equality....but it goes too far the other way, in that sexual equality is about men and women being treated the same, as equals, and not discriminated against on the basis of gender, but this should not mean that a clear distinction shouldnt be made between the two. The approach taken by the BBC for example is that this is football, its not mens or women's its just football, which is a complete nonesense
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The approach by the Beeb is based entirely on the fact it is the only football that they have TV rights to cover.
Of course they are going to promote the hell out of it, with trying to make some sort of comparison with the men's game part of their strategy.
Take a minute to listen to the commentary ( which btw is even worse than the football ) and you will hear non stop gushing to the point that every touch of the ball, every segment of play is either brilliant, amazing or ( that phrase again ) world class.
The fact that the average keeper is about 5 foot 3, literally any lob or shot vaguely near the corners is a goal.
Personally I don't have a problem with Women's football, and hope England do win it. But I do have a problem with blatant false or over exaggerated promotion of the level of skills seen. Televise it. Get behind it by all means, but please don't try telling me it is a world class standard.
And maybe, just maybe have more recognisable men involved in it's TV presentation to give the wider audience they are clearly seeking a reason to believe the standards will improve. It really doesn't need to be a women vs men war that appears to be the case at present. If they make this all about "this is women only presentation" then it will take longer to catch on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so on one hand you're saying that the records aren't comparable because the men's and women's game should be thought of separately.
But then when you're watching the top level of women's football, you're upset they're referring to it as world class because it's not as good as men's football?
Do you see that makes no sense?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think the point still stands though about the exaggeration of every touch being "world class" which is what it often feels like while trying to get through a game at the women's Euros.
It would also wind me up if I'm watching the England men's team doing something very basic and there's an idiotic commentator shrieking about it being world class - it just completely devalues actual moments of brilliance
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's very fair.
But world class in the women's game will look different to world class in the men's game.
Don't get me wrong I get quite bored of this constant desperate need to thrust the women's game into our faces. It's tedious and rather detached from reality.
But you can just ignore it...
posted on 14/7/22
I wonder what FA level in the mens game the best female player would fit into . Would they even be competitive at League 2?
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 28 minutes ago
I wonder what FA level in the mens game the best female player would fit into . Would they even be competitive at League 2?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd be surprised if they could play in National League North/South level. Players even at that level are seriously decent and in great physical shape
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 35 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 20 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 58 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 10 minutes ago
Who cares? They are only saying it to provoke a reaction and get debate started on women's sport. And they've achieved that.
We all know the two sports are worlds apart we don't have to keep convincing ourselves of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonesense!
There is an agenda but it isnt to provoke reaction and debate. and even if it is it fails. Broadcasters like BT often announce WSL games coming up for broadcast without actually stating its WSL, it will just say Arsenal vs Man City coming up 2pm next whenever! It annoys fans of the male game because its misleading and the distinction needs to be clear , rather than blurring the lines between the male and female game.
Proper promotion of the female game should be done on the merits of the women's game, not through false comparisons with the male game and misleading info to almost fool you into watching it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right but here we are discussing it, which in turn is elevating the profile of the women's game. Is that not exactly what they want?
And, as I say, who cares? It's not the first controversial thing ever said and it certainly won't be the last. Sometimes you just need to let people live our their delusions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think you are missing the point. Its not said to be controversial, it is part of an agenda to align the female game as equal with the mens, borne out of the worthy objective of sexual equality....but it goes too far the other way, in that sexual equality is about men and women being treated the same, as equals, and not discriminated against on the basis of gender, but this should not mean that a clear distinction shouldnt be made between the two. The approach taken by the BBC for example is that this is football, its not mens or women's its just football, which is a complete nonesense
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The approach by the Beeb is based entirely on the fact it is the only football that they have TV rights to cover.
Of course they are going to promote the hell out of it, with trying to make some sort of comparison with the men's game part of their strategy.
Take a minute to listen to the commentary ( which btw is even worse than the football ) and you will hear non stop gushing to the point that every touch of the ball, every segment of play is either brilliant, amazing or ( that phrase again ) world class.
The fact that the average keeper is about 5 foot 3, literally any lob or shot vaguely near the corners is a goal.
Personally I don't have a problem with Women's football, and hope England do win it. But I do have a problem with blatant false or over exaggerated promotion of the level of skills seen. Televise it. Get behind it by all means, but please don't try telling me it is a world class standard.
And maybe, just maybe have more recognisable men involved in it's TV presentation to give the wider audience they are clearly seeking a reason to believe the standards will improve. It really doesn't need to be a women vs men war that appears to be the case at present. If they make this all about "this is women only presentation" then it will take longer to catch on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so on one hand you're saying that the records aren't comparable because the men's and women's game should be thought of separately.
But then when you're watching the top level of women's football, you're upset they're referring to it as world class because it's not as good as men's football?
Do you see that makes no sense?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think the point still stands though about the exaggeration of every touch being "world class" which is what it often feels like while trying to get through a game at the women's Euros.
It would also wind me up if I'm watching the England men's team doing something very basic and there's an idiotic commentator shrieking about it being world class - it just completely devalues actual moments of brilliance
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's very fair.
But world class in the women's game will look different to world class in the men's game.
Don't get me wrong I get quite bored of this constant desperate need to thrust the women's game into our faces. It's tedious and rather detached from reality.
But you can just ignore it...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't ignore it if you want to watch a match with commentary though, which I would like to do. It's completely unnecessary and kind of insulting/patronising to the women playing
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 35 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 20 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 58 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 10 minutes ago
Who cares? They are only saying it to provoke a reaction and get debate started on women's sport. And they've achieved that.
We all know the two sports are worlds apart we don't have to keep convincing ourselves of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonesense!
There is an agenda but it isnt to provoke reaction and debate. and even if it is it fails. Broadcasters like BT often announce WSL games coming up for broadcast without actually stating its WSL, it will just say Arsenal vs Man City coming up 2pm next whenever! It annoys fans of the male game because its misleading and the distinction needs to be clear , rather than blurring the lines between the male and female game.
Proper promotion of the female game should be done on the merits of the women's game, not through false comparisons with the male game and misleading info to almost fool you into watching it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right but here we are discussing it, which in turn is elevating the profile of the women's game. Is that not exactly what they want?
And, as I say, who cares? It's not the first controversial thing ever said and it certainly won't be the last. Sometimes you just need to let people live our their delusions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think you are missing the point. Its not said to be controversial, it is part of an agenda to align the female game as equal with the mens, borne out of the worthy objective of sexual equality....but it goes too far the other way, in that sexual equality is about men and women being treated the same, as equals, and not discriminated against on the basis of gender, but this should not mean that a clear distinction shouldnt be made between the two. The approach taken by the BBC for example is that this is football, its not mens or women's its just football, which is a complete nonesense
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The approach by the Beeb is based entirely on the fact it is the only football that they have TV rights to cover.
Of course they are going to promote the hell out of it, with trying to make some sort of comparison with the men's game part of their strategy.
Take a minute to listen to the commentary ( which btw is even worse than the football ) and you will hear non stop gushing to the point that every touch of the ball, every segment of play is either brilliant, amazing or ( that phrase again ) world class.
The fact that the average keeper is about 5 foot 3, literally any lob or shot vaguely near the corners is a goal.
Personally I don't have a problem with Women's football, and hope England do win it. But I do have a problem with blatant false or over exaggerated promotion of the level of skills seen. Televise it. Get behind it by all means, but please don't try telling me it is a world class standard.
And maybe, just maybe have more recognisable men involved in it's TV presentation to give the wider audience they are clearly seeking a reason to believe the standards will improve. It really doesn't need to be a women vs men war that appears to be the case at present. If they make this all about "this is women only presentation" then it will take longer to catch on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so on one hand you're saying that the records aren't comparable because the men's and women's game should be thought of separately.
But then when you're watching the top level of women's football, you're upset they're referring to it as world class because it's not as good as men's football?
Do you see that makes no sense?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think the point still stands though about the exaggeration of every touch being "world class" which is what it often feels like while trying to get through a game at the women's Euros.
It would also wind me up if I'm watching the England men's team doing something very basic and there's an idiotic commentator shrieking about it being world class - it just completely devalues actual moments of brilliance
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's very fair.
But world class in the women's game will look different to world class in the men's game.
Don't get me wrong I get quite bored of this constant desperate need to thrust the women's game into our faces. It's tedious and rather detached from reality.
But you can just ignore it...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't ignore it if you want to watch a match with commentary though, which I would like to do. It's completely unnecessary and kind of insulting/patronising to the women playing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh, I just ignore the sport in its entirety . Same as I do plenty of other sports.
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 35 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 29 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 20 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 58 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 10 minutes ago
Who cares? They are only saying it to provoke a reaction and get debate started on women's sport. And they've achieved that.
We all know the two sports are worlds apart we don't have to keep convincing ourselves of it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonesense!
There is an agenda but it isnt to provoke reaction and debate. and even if it is it fails. Broadcasters like BT often announce WSL games coming up for broadcast without actually stating its WSL, it will just say Arsenal vs Man City coming up 2pm next whenever! It annoys fans of the male game because its misleading and the distinction needs to be clear , rather than blurring the lines between the male and female game.
Proper promotion of the female game should be done on the merits of the women's game, not through false comparisons with the male game and misleading info to almost fool you into watching it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right but here we are discussing it, which in turn is elevating the profile of the women's game. Is that not exactly what they want?
And, as I say, who cares? It's not the first controversial thing ever said and it certainly won't be the last. Sometimes you just need to let people live our their delusions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think you are missing the point. Its not said to be controversial, it is part of an agenda to align the female game as equal with the mens, borne out of the worthy objective of sexual equality....but it goes too far the other way, in that sexual equality is about men and women being treated the same, as equals, and not discriminated against on the basis of gender, but this should not mean that a clear distinction shouldnt be made between the two. The approach taken by the BBC for example is that this is football, its not mens or women's its just football, which is a complete nonesense
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The approach by the Beeb is based entirely on the fact it is the only football that they have TV rights to cover.
Of course they are going to promote the hell out of it, with trying to make some sort of comparison with the men's game part of their strategy.
Take a minute to listen to the commentary ( which btw is even worse than the football ) and you will hear non stop gushing to the point that every touch of the ball, every segment of play is either brilliant, amazing or ( that phrase again ) world class.
The fact that the average keeper is about 5 foot 3, literally any lob or shot vaguely near the corners is a goal.
Personally I don't have a problem with Women's football, and hope England do win it. But I do have a problem with blatant false or over exaggerated promotion of the level of skills seen. Televise it. Get behind it by all means, but please don't try telling me it is a world class standard.
And maybe, just maybe have more recognisable men involved in it's TV presentation to give the wider audience they are clearly seeking a reason to believe the standards will improve. It really doesn't need to be a women vs men war that appears to be the case at present. If they make this all about "this is women only presentation" then it will take longer to catch on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so on one hand you're saying that the records aren't comparable because the men's and women's game should be thought of separately.
But then when you're watching the top level of women's football, you're upset they're referring to it as world class because it's not as good as men's football?
Do you see that makes no sense?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Think the point still stands though about the exaggeration of every touch being "world class" which is what it often feels like while trying to get through a game at the women's Euros.
It would also wind me up if I'm watching the England men's team doing something very basic and there's an idiotic commentator shrieking about it being world class - it just completely devalues actual moments of brilliance
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No that's very fair.
But world class in the women's game will look different to world class in the men's game.
Don't get me wrong I get quite bored of this constant desperate need to thrust the women's game into our faces. It's tedious and rather detached from reality.
But you can just ignore it...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't ignore it if you want to watch a match with commentary though, which I would like to do. It's completely unnecessary and kind of insulting/patronising to the women playing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh, I just ignore the sport in its entirety. Same as I do plenty of other sports.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I see the same situation in my future if they don't stop being so annoying
posted on 14/7/22
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Luke Combs - FJB (U3979)
posted 37 minutes ago
---------------------
No that's very fair.
But world class in the women's game will look different to world class in the men's game.
Don't get me wrong I get quite bored of this constant desperate need to thrust the women's game into our faces. It's tedious and rather detached from reality.
But you can just ignore it...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't ignore it if you want to watch a match with commentary though, which I would like to do. It's completely unnecessary and kind of insulting/patronising to the women playing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats how i see it - potentially insulting/patronising.
I dont get the drive to make things be equally across the board so that gender isnt part of the discussion, whether in the work place or in sport etc There are fundamental differences between men and women but rather than being allowed to talk about them and embrace them people are instead being accused of generalising or stereotyping.
posted on 15/7/22
comment by Two Balls, One Saka (U19684)
posted 1 day, 2 hours ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 28 minutes ago
I wonder what FA level in the mens game the best female player would fit into . Would they even be competitive at League 2?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd be surprised if they could play in National League North/South level. Players even at that level are seriously decent and in great physical shape
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Considering that the under 15 boys team beat USA women 5-2, probably much lower.
I'm a woman but even this is irritating me