Thought he had decided to stay..
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11095/7589297/Pogba-agrees-United-deal
That's a fairly old story linked to there. I think it's been widely reported since that he was offered more money and potentially more first team football by Juve and has decided to move on.
Pretty sure he's gone pal. Annoyed because I think hes gonna have a big future, plus he could have easily logged some game time in our patched up CM.
you cant blame him for going tho can you?
hardly had a look in despite the fact our midfield pre scholes return was shocking.
Fergie chose to put pogba on the bench and play rafael and park in cm against blackburn instead
people have said "yeah but if fergie played him and he was poor it would affect him"
B0ll0x is what i say to that, we were at home ffs against blackburn, im not being funny, but if your gonna play any youngster its gonna be at home against a weaker team.
sure we lost, but if one defeat or poor performance is going to affct someone that much then he doesnt have the mentality to be at a club like utd.
Merrysupersteve
Yea notice the date. Just found sth from 25 May.
http://www.unitedrant.co.uk/latest/pogba-deperature-leaves-reds-pondering-youth-future/
duncanedwards_legend
Fergie doesn't exactly have a shabby record when it comes to judging the grey areas of giving young players experience / not putting them in too early. Given his superior judgement based on years of successful practice and the fact that he gets to see his players 100 times longer and closer up than we do, I'd be inclined to keep an open mind about whether he made the right call rather than assume he's an idiot for not seeing something that seems obvious to me. Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
--------------------------------
the thing is he was among the subs, so Fergie must have deemed him ready to some extent to have him there in the first place.
I personally dont blame him for looking elsewhere, the lad wants to play football, and if juventus can offer him that then good luck to him.
what i find annoying is the fact we have lost him for next to nothing.
we spend compo on getting these players, spend money training them, then lose him to someone else because we let his contract run down.
comment by Red Russian (U4715) posted 22 minutes ago
duncanedwards_legend
Fergie doesn't exactly have a shabby record when it comes to judging the grey areas of giving young players experience / not putting them in too early. Given his superior judgement based on years of successful practice and the fact that he gets to see his players 100 times longer and closer up than we do, I'd be inclined to keep an open mind about whether he made the right call rather than assume he's an idiot for not seeing something that seems obvious to me. Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah I agree. But I just think there's a reluctance to give young talent an opportunity unless they've come for a big fee at this time. Take Nick Powell, for example. if (and it's only an if right now) we sign him, if past form is anything to go by, he'll probably be thrown into the Reserves for a season or 2, then get loaned out and eventually maybe get selected for the first team when he's 21 or 22.
Would this help his development more than playing every week for Crewe in League Two (or League One as it will be next season)? I'm just not sure about taht at all.
And even if I am completely wrong about this, the bottom line is that this is the perception I have and if I was a young player, I would give it serious consideration before deciding to make the move. And if that's how I feel, I don't see why some youngsters wouldn't have the same doubts.
I think it is fair to say that Pogba has gone. I expect it will be announced as soon as the window is open.
merrysupersteve
It's hard to balance the needs of the team now and the young player's development, isn't it? Prioritising one is always likely to mean damaging the little to some extent.
We can quibble about certain calls Fergie has made (albeit without knowing why and ultimately whether we were wrong or not). However, we can't argue with the fact that he has a) delievered a huge amount of success and b) done so with quite a lot of players developed by the club (particularly compared with the likes of Chelsea and City). Would we prefer to see youth given more of a chance if the consequence were more frequently having to experience 'transitional' years? Arsenal is a cautionary example in that respect.
Another thing to bear in mind is that the standards of the Premier league have risen since the 1990s and I wonder how many of the Scholes generation would have had the time to learn on the job if they came through now. Moreover, since then we have been constrained by the 90 minute rule. So we were looking for players of a higher standard while recruiting from a smaller talent pool. The club's response of globalising the catchment area has brought some fruits already (the twins, possibly Petrucci to move up) but maybe it's early to judge how well this policy is fairing, given the time lag.
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
I don't blame him for leaving. But he isn't going to get game time with Pirlo and Vidal in the Juve side.
Those still saying Pogba is leaving because he's not getting enough first team games are amazingly naive, aside from the fact SAF knows exactly how many games he should be getting to develop while also keeping us challenging for the title etc.
Why do they think teenage Pogba with no experience of Serie A, Italian football or indeed much experience of top flight football at all, is going to fly over to Juventus, who have just romped to the title, and start playing in the first XI?
Do they know who Juventus have in their current CM? Let alone who they are targeting to try and go for the CL title?
The same people talking like this about Pogba's reasoning were probably also saying Morrison refused to sign a contract because he wasnt getting first team games, despite the actual facts of the situation i.e. SAF didnt want to give him a contract for again obvious reasons.
BTW How did Morrison's first team football go down in the Championship?
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
Pogba, Oh Pogba, where are thou Pogba?
Fergie was never going to start him if he wasnt going to sign a new contract - likewise Pogba was never going to sign unless he was getting a chance. Hardly surprising that he will go......
but wasnt one of the reasons fergie didnt sign a cm player last season was the fact he said he had some good youth players coming through??
comment by Sarcastic_Devil (U1190)
posted 12 minutes ago
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
___________
That's to do with his previous job in Serie B, not Juventus.
comment by BusbysBabes (U9083)
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
------------------------------------
We had 63% of the possession in that match, having 27 shots, 13 of which were on target. Blackburn managed just 3 shots on target, all of which went in. It was just one of those freak games that happen every now and then. I don't think that the midfield cost is. If anything it was the lack of quality in our finishing.
comment by Sarcastic_Devil (U1190)
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
-----------------------------------
The Italian PM called for a suspension of football for 3 years!
The Italian PM called for a suspension of football for 3 years!
------------------------------------
Gab Marcotti was on the radio yesterday saying how the PM thinking out loud about what other people would suggest. he has distanced himself from this being his actual view.
I thought there was an automatic option to extend his contract by a year, whether his agent likes it or not?
Perhaps he`ll get more games this coming season and THEN sign a new long trerm deal.
I thought there was an automatic option to extend his contract by a year, whether his agent likes it or not?
-------------------------------------------------------
was this not Berbatov?
Not as far as i was aware.
They both have the same 1 year option.
Arabian Elvis (U7425)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by BusbysBabes (U9083)
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
------------------------------------
We had 63% of the possession in that match, having 27 shots, 13 of which were on target. Blackburn managed just 3 shots on target, all of which went in. It was just one of those freak games that happen every now and then. I don't think that the midfield cost is. If anything it was the lack of quality in our finishing.
_______________________________________
Elvis, Fergy came out and spoke to the press about Pogba a number of times, suggesting he was ready for first team football and he was one of the reasons we didn't need to buy a new midfielder.
How do you think he felt when we were at Old Trafford vs bottom of the league, and a young right back is starting in centre of midfield?
I remember the game, was it not New Year or something? We were awful that day regardless of what statistics say.
I don't know if he was ready, but what I do know is the boy has huge potential and at a time we can't afford to go head to head with the financial muscle of CIty, Chelsea and co, how can we afford to let go of one of our best talents?
SgtBoscoBaracus
Lots of people were stating this as fact during the first half of last season but I couldn't find any solid evidence to back it up. The only thing was a pre-season interview in which Fergie made passing reference to their contracts, but it didn't sound like an authoritative statement to me, more an off-the-top-of-his-head kind of thing.
In the second half of the season I haven't seen so many people claiming this to be the case, and you'd have thought the club might have brought it up when publicly commenting on the 'will he leave' stories. If there were this convenient fact blew all the rumours out of the water, I tend to think it would have emerged by now.
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Pogba
Page 1 of 2
posted on 30/5/12
Thought he had decided to stay..
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11095/7589297/Pogba-agrees-United-deal
posted on 30/5/12
That's a fairly old story linked to there. I think it's been widely reported since that he was offered more money and potentially more first team football by Juve and has decided to move on.
posted on 30/5/12
Pretty sure he's gone pal. Annoyed because I think hes gonna have a big future, plus he could have easily logged some game time in our patched up CM.
posted on 30/5/12
you cant blame him for going tho can you?
hardly had a look in despite the fact our midfield pre scholes return was shocking.
Fergie chose to put pogba on the bench and play rafael and park in cm against blackburn instead
people have said "yeah but if fergie played him and he was poor it would affect him"
B0ll0x is what i say to that, we were at home ffs against blackburn, im not being funny, but if your gonna play any youngster its gonna be at home against a weaker team.
sure we lost, but if one defeat or poor performance is going to affct someone that much then he doesnt have the mentality to be at a club like utd.
posted on 30/5/12
Merrysupersteve
Yea notice the date. Just found sth from 25 May.
http://www.unitedrant.co.uk/latest/pogba-deperature-leaves-reds-pondering-youth-future/
posted on 30/5/12
duncanedwards_legend
Fergie doesn't exactly have a shabby record when it comes to judging the grey areas of giving young players experience / not putting them in too early. Given his superior judgement based on years of successful practice and the fact that he gets to see his players 100 times longer and closer up than we do, I'd be inclined to keep an open mind about whether he made the right call rather than assume he's an idiot for not seeing something that seems obvious to me. Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
posted on 30/5/12
Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
--------------------------------
the thing is he was among the subs, so Fergie must have deemed him ready to some extent to have him there in the first place.
I personally dont blame him for looking elsewhere, the lad wants to play football, and if juventus can offer him that then good luck to him.
what i find annoying is the fact we have lost him for next to nothing.
we spend compo on getting these players, spend money training them, then lose him to someone else because we let his contract run down.
posted on 30/5/12
comment by Red Russian (U4715) posted 22 minutes ago
duncanedwards_legend
Fergie doesn't exactly have a shabby record when it comes to judging the grey areas of giving young players experience / not putting them in too early. Given his superior judgement based on years of successful practice and the fact that he gets to see his players 100 times longer and closer up than we do, I'd be inclined to keep an open mind about whether he made the right call rather than assume he's an idiot for not seeing something that seems obvious to me. Personally, I'd have plumped for Pogba too. But I'd have based that call on very limited information, no relevant qualifications and to some extent a reckless impatience to see the next big youth talent promoted to the team.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah I agree. But I just think there's a reluctance to give young talent an opportunity unless they've come for a big fee at this time. Take Nick Powell, for example. if (and it's only an if right now) we sign him, if past form is anything to go by, he'll probably be thrown into the Reserves for a season or 2, then get loaned out and eventually maybe get selected for the first team when he's 21 or 22.
Would this help his development more than playing every week for Crewe in League Two (or League One as it will be next season)? I'm just not sure about taht at all.
And even if I am completely wrong about this, the bottom line is that this is the perception I have and if I was a young player, I would give it serious consideration before deciding to make the move. And if that's how I feel, I don't see why some youngsters wouldn't have the same doubts.
posted on 30/5/12
I think it is fair to say that Pogba has gone. I expect it will be announced as soon as the window is open.
posted on 30/5/12
merrysupersteve
It's hard to balance the needs of the team now and the young player's development, isn't it? Prioritising one is always likely to mean damaging the little to some extent.
We can quibble about certain calls Fergie has made (albeit without knowing why and ultimately whether we were wrong or not). However, we can't argue with the fact that he has a) delievered a huge amount of success and b) done so with quite a lot of players developed by the club (particularly compared with the likes of Chelsea and City). Would we prefer to see youth given more of a chance if the consequence were more frequently having to experience 'transitional' years? Arsenal is a cautionary example in that respect.
Another thing to bear in mind is that the standards of the Premier league have risen since the 1990s and I wonder how many of the Scholes generation would have had the time to learn on the job if they came through now. Moreover, since then we have been constrained by the 90 minute rule. So we were looking for players of a higher standard while recruiting from a smaller talent pool. The club's response of globalising the catchment area has brought some fruits already (the twins, possibly Petrucci to move up) but maybe it's early to judge how well this policy is fairing, given the time lag.
posted on 30/5/12
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
I don't blame him for leaving. But he isn't going to get game time with Pirlo and Vidal in the Juve side.
posted on 30/5/12
Those still saying Pogba is leaving because he's not getting enough first team games are amazingly naive, aside from the fact SAF knows exactly how many games he should be getting to develop while also keeping us challenging for the title etc.
Why do they think teenage Pogba with no experience of Serie A, Italian football or indeed much experience of top flight football at all, is going to fly over to Juventus, who have just romped to the title, and start playing in the first XI?
Do they know who Juventus have in their current CM? Let alone who they are targeting to try and go for the CL title?
The same people talking like this about Pogba's reasoning were probably also saying Morrison refused to sign a contract because he wasnt getting first team games, despite the actual facts of the situation i.e. SAF didnt want to give him a contract for again obvious reasons.
BTW How did Morrison's first team football go down in the Championship?
posted on 30/5/12
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
posted on 30/5/12
Pogba, Oh Pogba, where are thou Pogba?
posted on 30/5/12
Fergie was never going to start him if he wasnt going to sign a new contract - likewise Pogba was never going to sign unless he was getting a chance. Hardly surprising that he will go......
posted on 30/5/12
but wasnt one of the reasons fergie didnt sign a cm player last season was the fact he said he had some good youth players coming through??
posted on 30/5/12
comment by Sarcastic_Devil (U1190)
posted 12 minutes ago
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
___________
That's to do with his previous job in Serie B, not Juventus.
posted on 30/5/12
comment by BusbysBabes (U9083)
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
------------------------------------
We had 63% of the possession in that match, having 27 shots, 13 of which were on target. Blackburn managed just 3 shots on target, all of which went in. It was just one of those freak games that happen every now and then. I don't think that the midfield cost is. If anything it was the lack of quality in our finishing.
posted on 30/5/12
comment by Sarcastic_Devil (U1190)
What if Juve are caught up in the current corruption scandal? That might change things, Antonio Conte, the manager, is being questioned I believe
-----------------------------------
The Italian PM called for a suspension of football for 3 years!
posted on 30/5/12
The Italian PM called for a suspension of football for 3 years!
------------------------------------
Gab Marcotti was on the radio yesterday saying how the PM thinking out loud about what other people would suggest. he has distanced himself from this being his actual view.
posted on 30/5/12
I thought there was an automatic option to extend his contract by a year, whether his agent likes it or not?
Perhaps he`ll get more games this coming season and THEN sign a new long trerm deal.
posted on 30/5/12
I thought there was an automatic option to extend his contract by a year, whether his agent likes it or not?
-------------------------------------------------------
was this not Berbatov?
posted on 30/5/12
Not as far as i was aware.
They both have the same 1 year option.
posted on 30/5/12
Arabian Elvis (U7425)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by BusbysBabes (U9083)
He wasn't given the chance to start a single PL game when our midfield consisted of Park and Rafael, who were awful vs Blackburn anyway.
------------------------------------
We had 63% of the possession in that match, having 27 shots, 13 of which were on target. Blackburn managed just 3 shots on target, all of which went in. It was just one of those freak games that happen every now and then. I don't think that the midfield cost is. If anything it was the lack of quality in our finishing.
_______________________________________
Elvis, Fergy came out and spoke to the press about Pogba a number of times, suggesting he was ready for first team football and he was one of the reasons we didn't need to buy a new midfielder.
How do you think he felt when we were at Old Trafford vs bottom of the league, and a young right back is starting in centre of midfield?
I remember the game, was it not New Year or something? We were awful that day regardless of what statistics say.
I don't know if he was ready, but what I do know is the boy has huge potential and at a time we can't afford to go head to head with the financial muscle of CIty, Chelsea and co, how can we afford to let go of one of our best talents?
posted on 30/5/12
SgtBoscoBaracus
Lots of people were stating this as fact during the first half of last season but I couldn't find any solid evidence to back it up. The only thing was a pre-season interview in which Fergie made passing reference to their contracts, but it didn't sound like an authoritative statement to me, more an off-the-top-of-his-head kind of thing.
In the second half of the season I haven't seen so many people claiming this to be the case, and you'd have thought the club might have brought it up when publicly commenting on the 'will he leave' stories. If there were this convenient fact blew all the rumours out of the water, I tend to think it would have emerged by now.
Page 1 of 2