Many are fuming for that exact reason lauders, many agree the real problem at Arsenal is the board. But also plenty of others say the board, and Arsene, are the only reason we are still at playing at the top of the football world despite an expensive ground move and no sugar daddy to foot the bill.
HenrysCat
But surely with the revenue you create you should still be spending more even if you don't have a "sugar-daddy"?
Wenger is working under difficult constraints by the board...but there are certain things he can be held responsible for too, though.
As long as the fans continue to accept your short comings and pay these inflated prices, nothing will change
Regardless if Wenger won't spend or if the board won't allow it, they are under no pressure to change it just now.
Spot on, Lauders.
"To the car-park!"
Yes, and no - we have one the highest wage bills in the league (although this is changing pretty quickly too with others rapidly upping their outgoings), so the board do spend plenty on the team, just not the headline grabbing 'silly' transfers.
We don't have the ability to absorb an expensive flop like some teams, the money is spent carefully - that's not to say we don't buy duds, I'm sure we could both list a long line of those.
That's just not true lauders, they are under plenty of pressure - it's kinda funny to pretend otherwise, and a common wind up, but it's not actually true. You know that.
Is the manager in any real pressure to end this drought?
From the fans, yes, but most realise the situation and accept that we aren't at the front of the queue when it comes to buying top talent. Frankly, and I know this is no good for your jokes, we are doing pretty well all points considered. And if you sit back and look at it without your wumming hat on, you'll probably agree.
I disagree, a couple of folk on forums and phone ins aside, what pressure?
You keep paying crazy rates for no trophies. Why would they ever invest more than necessary or more than received in transfers as it has seemed lately. They will do no more than needed to sustain current income and growth.
I can accept Arsenal cannot compete for top talent...but that shouldn't stop them from holding onto the talent they develop themselves.
Seems like Wenger is constantly building a house of cards for the board to walk in and blow it over.
Joking aside I actually think Arsenal do "hold their own" league and Champions League wise, but even with financial constraints that's the minium you should expect as a fan. To not win a trophy in 7 years is definately under achieving.
But the growth cannot be sustained without winning trophies, with kids these days 'supporting' ht elikes ManC and Chelsea - and the board know that. We picked up plenty of kids getting into football 10-15 years ago and benefi from that today.
And, as much as you will argue otherwise, it really isn't all about winning trophies - you don't go to a football match to watch a team win a trophy, you go to see them win the match. A trophy at the end of the season is a bonus few people will see - if it was just about trophies Basingstoke Town would have no fans at all, but that simply isn't true.
The ONLY reason people bang on about our 7 year "drought" is because of the contrast it shows to the previous decade of success. A level-headed fan knows only one team can win the league, only one team can win a cup - if you've got to the point of actually expecting your team to win a trophy you're already lost to the world of fandom.
" if you've got to the point of actually expecting your team to win a trophy you're already lost to the world of fandom."
Sorry, by this I mean you're probably not the sort of 'long term' fan that clubs really need to keep going in the long run.
People are trying to debate with HenrysCat
A foolish mistake, HenrysCat is always right.
But the fact that Arsenal fans are resigned to their chances of success becoming slimmer and slimmer then shows that they are declining, so shouldn't the Supporters Trust or whatever it is that applies to Arsenal, be doing more?
It isn't all about trophies...but British football is dominated mainly by tribalism. I think if you finished 3rd you'd be happy this season and call it a good season. However, if Spurs finished 4th and you watched them win the FA Cup, then more fans would regard it as a poorer season than they would have one week previously, in my opinion?
"Seems like Wenger is constantly building a house of cards for the board to walk in and blow it over."
True, but the club needs to sell players to fund spending, but few teams don't. We do alright despite that though. The only serious losses, for me, were Fab and maybe RvP, but we won't know how much of a loss he was for a while - we have bought in some good players.
True, but the club needs to sell players to fund spending
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Really?
You obviously no better than me your own club's expenditure, but you must create so much revenue that it seems strange for me that you NEED to sell players just to fund transfers.
Even clubs such as Stoke, don't have to actually do that, so I find it strange a club of Arsenal's size and revenue streams needs to do it? How much is your stadium debt, and is that the reason?
It isn't "all about trophies" but there has to be some sort of progression, ambition and advancement in the club. Celtic are under greater financial constraints than Arsenal, and are obviously a fair bit behind them, but the board acknowledge what the fans want and set goals to go further in Europe each season etc.
To me Arsenal just happy being better than the rest but not challenging the likes of Barca, Man Utd, Real and Chelsea.
And I would probably agree with you Henrik. I'm older than some on here, and have been up and down with the club for a while - I'm in it for the long haul, so yes finishing third is a good result and the end of the season when you look at the competition as a whole. This doesn't mean I don't want to win something, just that I am realistic and I remember when we would regularly finish mid-table - which is something most of the Celtic fans here simply won't understand and probably never will.
On the plus side, I have never and probably will never see Arsenal outside the top flight. Which is nice.
Sorry, having dragged this into a sensible discussion I have to go and do something more useful. Nice chatting.
Goodbye, HenrysCat.
Good luck for the season.
I know, whit you like! Sensible discussions are no fun
Arsenal are so bad that even Craig Whyte didnt want anything to do with you.
He ditched the Arsenal shares as quickly as he could, yet tried to hold onto his shares in Rangers till they were basically prised from his hands.
3rd Division Scottish Team > Arsenal.
FACT
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ARSENAL'S TROPHY DROUGHT
Page 6 of 8
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posted on 30/9/12
Many are fuming for that exact reason lauders, many agree the real problem at Arsenal is the board. But also plenty of others say the board, and Arsene, are the only reason we are still at playing at the top of the football world despite an expensive ground move and no sugar daddy to foot the bill.
posted on 30/9/12
HenrysCat
But surely with the revenue you create you should still be spending more even if you don't have a "sugar-daddy"?
Wenger is working under difficult constraints by the board...but there are certain things he can be held responsible for too, though.
posted on 30/9/12
As long as the fans continue to accept your short comings and pay these inflated prices, nothing will change
Regardless if Wenger won't spend or if the board won't allow it, they are under no pressure to change it just now.
posted on 30/9/12
Spot on, Lauders.
"To the car-park!"
posted on 30/9/12
Yes, and no - we have one the highest wage bills in the league (although this is changing pretty quickly too with others rapidly upping their outgoings), so the board do spend plenty on the team, just not the headline grabbing 'silly' transfers.
We don't have the ability to absorb an expensive flop like some teams, the money is spent carefully - that's not to say we don't buy duds, I'm sure we could both list a long line of those.
posted on 30/9/12
That's just not true lauders, they are under plenty of pressure - it's kinda funny to pretend otherwise, and a common wind up, but it's not actually true. You know that.
posted on 30/9/12
Is the manager in any real pressure to end this drought?
posted on 30/9/12
From the fans, yes, but most realise the situation and accept that we aren't at the front of the queue when it comes to buying top talent. Frankly, and I know this is no good for your jokes, we are doing pretty well all points considered. And if you sit back and look at it without your wumming hat on, you'll probably agree.
posted on 30/9/12
I disagree, a couple of folk on forums and phone ins aside, what pressure?
You keep paying crazy rates for no trophies. Why would they ever invest more than necessary or more than received in transfers as it has seemed lately. They will do no more than needed to sustain current income and growth.
posted on 30/9/12
I can accept Arsenal cannot compete for top talent...but that shouldn't stop them from holding onto the talent they develop themselves.
Seems like Wenger is constantly building a house of cards for the board to walk in and blow it over.
posted on 30/9/12
^^ this
posted on 30/9/12
Joking aside I actually think Arsenal do "hold their own" league and Champions League wise, but even with financial constraints that's the minium you should expect as a fan. To not win a trophy in 7 years is definately under achieving.
posted on 30/9/12
But the growth cannot be sustained without winning trophies, with kids these days 'supporting' ht elikes ManC and Chelsea - and the board know that. We picked up plenty of kids getting into football 10-15 years ago and benefi from that today.
And, as much as you will argue otherwise, it really isn't all about winning trophies - you don't go to a football match to watch a team win a trophy, you go to see them win the match. A trophy at the end of the season is a bonus few people will see - if it was just about trophies Basingstoke Town would have no fans at all, but that simply isn't true.
The ONLY reason people bang on about our 7 year "drought" is because of the contrast it shows to the previous decade of success. A level-headed fan knows only one team can win the league, only one team can win a cup - if you've got to the point of actually expecting your team to win a trophy you're already lost to the world of fandom.
posted on 30/9/12
" if you've got to the point of actually expecting your team to win a trophy you're already lost to the world of fandom."
Sorry, by this I mean you're probably not the sort of 'long term' fan that clubs really need to keep going in the long run.
posted on 30/9/12
People are trying to debate with HenrysCat
A foolish mistake, HenrysCat is always right.
posted on 30/9/12
But the fact that Arsenal fans are resigned to their chances of success becoming slimmer and slimmer then shows that they are declining, so shouldn't the Supporters Trust or whatever it is that applies to Arsenal, be doing more?
It isn't all about trophies...but British football is dominated mainly by tribalism. I think if you finished 3rd you'd be happy this season and call it a good season. However, if Spurs finished 4th and you watched them win the FA Cup, then more fans would regard it as a poorer season than they would have one week previously, in my opinion?
posted on 30/9/12
"Seems like Wenger is constantly building a house of cards for the board to walk in and blow it over."
True, but the club needs to sell players to fund spending, but few teams don't. We do alright despite that though. The only serious losses, for me, were Fab and maybe RvP, but we won't know how much of a loss he was for a while - we have bought in some good players.
posted on 30/9/12
True, but the club needs to sell players to fund spending
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Really?
You obviously no better than me your own club's expenditure, but you must create so much revenue that it seems strange for me that you NEED to sell players just to fund transfers.
Even clubs such as Stoke, don't have to actually do that, so I find it strange a club of Arsenal's size and revenue streams needs to do it? How much is your stadium debt, and is that the reason?
posted on 30/9/12
It isn't "all about trophies" but there has to be some sort of progression, ambition and advancement in the club. Celtic are under greater financial constraints than Arsenal, and are obviously a fair bit behind them, but the board acknowledge what the fans want and set goals to go further in Europe each season etc.
To me Arsenal just happy being better than the rest but not challenging the likes of Barca, Man Utd, Real and Chelsea.
posted on 30/9/12
And I would probably agree with you Henrik. I'm older than some on here, and have been up and down with the club for a while - I'm in it for the long haul, so yes finishing third is a good result and the end of the season when you look at the competition as a whole. This doesn't mean I don't want to win something, just that I am realistic and I remember when we would regularly finish mid-table - which is something most of the Celtic fans here simply won't understand and probably never will.
On the plus side, I have never and probably will never see Arsenal outside the top flight. Which is nice.
posted on 30/9/12
Sorry, having dragged this into a sensible discussion I have to go and do something more useful. Nice chatting.
posted on 30/9/12
Goodbye, HenrysCat.
Good luck for the season.
posted on 30/9/12
I know, whit you like! Sensible discussions are no fun
posted on 30/9/12
Arsenal are so bad that even Craig Whyte didnt want anything to do with you.
He ditched the Arsenal shares as quickly as he could, yet tried to hold onto his shares in Rangers till they were basically prised from his hands.
3rd Division Scottish Team > Arsenal.
FACT
posted on 30/9/12
,
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