Unbelievable!!!
The most dumbest comment from someone who clearly hasn't been educated and refuses to get some knowledge, cos they believe they are right.

Winston told you to go read, so read already!!
Then you will realise why people will always treat Suarez with the lack of respect he deserves, and the reason why people with your lazy attitude will always be dismissed.

Yes, probably. That is not guilty in my book.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 55 seconds ago
There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

Semantics.

He was found guilty in all probability - call it what you like, but he was charged with that offence and punished accordingly.

To complain about chants of that nature following such a charge is bizarre.
--------------------------------------------
Footballers won't get away from such chants as there are too many sheep in the world, so whilst I agree it is silly to complain about it, I disagree that it is "deluded" to think so, as somebody said earlier. Some may feel when given respect, you should expect it in return. I understand this view.

There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

Good for you - ignore independent regulatory panels because you don't agree with them.

Nothing like a little delusion to suit your own ends.

I've read all the cintent Winston and all the claims and counter claims and the pieces where real experts laugh at the findings of the FA's 'experts' and all the other dialogue.

It's all a big farce orchestrated by a drama queen as far as I'm concerned.

Anyway I'll leave you all to it.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 9 seconds ago
There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

Good for you - ignore independent regulatory panels because you don't agree with them.

Nothing like a little delusion to suit your own ends.
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I don't ignore it. They found him probably guilty, I accept that decision, I don't accept that it means he's guilty, as it doesn't they said based on probability. It seems you're ignoring it.

There's that word delusion again. You really are a bunch of sheep.

Whether you can or not is not the point is, the point is he has black friends, is part black himself, has a black grandfather and black teammates yet nothing. No evidence of racism, nothing. Simply he got involved in one incident with a player who happened to be black. He may have racially abused, he may not have, either way, there is massive amounts of evidence to say he isn't a racist but no factual evidence to say that he is. I understand why you don't like this idea though.

****************

Now I think you should be the one to learn to read. I am not discussing whether he is a racist or not, I have my opinion on that but that is not what this thread is about.

My point is that you can NOT say someone is not a racist just because he has black friends. It is an invalid argument..

Winston

It's the implication attached to the chant. We all know the 'you know what you are' means. Like I said I'm sure there are chants about Dave Jones that don't outright call him a peodophile, but do imply it. That doesn't make it acceptable.

Yes Suarez was found guilty. But Suarez himself, the club, and us fans have always questioned the validity of the conviction, and the burden of proof. But that's a completely different discussion .

"It's all a big farce orchestrated by a drama queen as far as I'm concerned."

Presumably that's your opinion because you're a Liverpool fan, which is convenient.

Whereas yours is because you aren't, which is convenient.

Suarez is black. Get over it.

red_man23 (U1669)

You can question the validity all you want - it happened and the crowds are reacting to it.

You might not like it, but I don't think there's much grounds for complaint.

There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

I'm not making any flippant remarks, am I?

You're making childish comments about Evra and dimissing an independent regulatory panel because it suits you.

Let me know when I do something along those lines when forming my opinion.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 20 seconds ago
There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

I'm not making any flippant remarks, am I?

You're making childish comments about Evra and dimissing an independent regulatory panel because it suits you.

Let me know when I do something along those lines when forming my opinion.
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I haven't made any remarks about Evra. Now you're just making things up.

I'm also not dismissing the panel. I told you, I accept that they found himprobably guilty. What I'm saying is, I don't consider probably guilty, as guilty.

Stop making things up.

There'sOnlyOneReds (U1721)

Sorry, I quoted the wrong person.

I think you need to understand how court cases - both legal and civil - work.

Quite often, guilt is decided on the basis of doubt and probabality.

"There's that word delusion again. You really are a bunch of sheep."

Just saw this though.

We're a bunch of sheep because we are not dismissing a civil court case?

Yes, it's obviously us at fault here

I think you need to understand it. You're trying to sound clever trying to talk about cival and common law but none of them apply here as it wasn't court. It was three men who decided that Suarez was probably guilty.

If it was a court, then he would have been found not guilty. It's simple.

So again, I accept they found him probably guilty but not that probably guilty means guilty.

Are you getting it yet?

Winston

It's not the panels verdict that's the main reason for complaint. The reason we are complaining is because a bit of decency on our part wasn't respected, of reciprocated. The 'you know what you are' chant refers to Suarez being a racist. This is despite his accuser, and the independent panel you hold so much stock in, stating he is no such thing.

I'd say that's good reason to complain. We don't like our player being accused of being something he's not. Is that not fair enough?

"you're trying to sound clever"

Cut the bravado and try to have a conversation like an adult.

It was a civil case - go and learn about their validity.

Yes, it involves a higher element of doubt than a legal case, but that doesn't make it an invalid court.

It was three men in a room. It wasn't law. It was rules in a governing body of a sport. It isn't law. Learn.

Again, that isn't the point, the point I made is, probably guilty doesn't mean guilty, to me. If it does to you, fair enough, I'm not going to try to convince you otherwise. Work away.

red_man23 (U1669)

I can understand what you're saying, I just think it's all a bit unlikely, don't you?

The player was found guilty of racially abusing another player.

Does that mean he's a racist? No.

Is it a surprise that fans chant, using suggestion, that he's a racist?

Well, not to me.

And quite frankly, I don't think there's much cause for complaint. Most people chanting know full well the difference between the two, and many will probably be chanting it because he was found guilty of racially abusing someone, not because they think he's a racist.

"It was rules in a governing body of a sport. It isn't law. Learn."

It's you that needs to learn.

Go away and read what the panel was, and it's relationship to the FA.

Then go away and read about civil courts.

The way you're discussing this - withj the sort of bravado only used in forums - suggests you'll never back down, so you'll probably just keep repeating yourself.

But seriously, read up about civil courts. You might learn something.

The reason we are complaining is because a bit of decency on our part wasn't respected, of reciprocated. The 'you know what you are' chant refers to Suarez being a racist.
***************************************************************
Good grief, are Liverpool fans really that sensitive?

Can you truly say that Liverpool fans have never given an opposing player stick or chanted things that are slightly close to the bone?

As a Villa fan it's appreciated the respect you showed to Stan. But did you really all expect Villa fans to clap every time Suarez touched the ball from that moment forth?

Think some of you are getting slightly wound up over nothing.

Sorry I wasn’t around to comment on my own article. Been away from the computer all morning.

When I wrote this article, I didn't imagine it would invite so many angry Man Utd fans. I never thought it would wind people up to the lengths that they felt the need to create another article about it in order to get someone to agree with them. That’s just embarrassing, it’s a forum for god’s sake.

Anyway...

I think the article is lost on the majority of rival fans. While applauding for Petrov didn’t qualify for the same treatment for Suarez, I’m more annoyed with the Villa fans for the reason that Liverpool and Villa have always had a mutual respect for each other. But I guess things change. They seem to have joined the ranks of the majority of opposing fans in firing abuse at Suarez. I’m annoyed because there are a few club's fans who never seem to lower themselves to that level, and I would have put Villa in that bracket before Saturday.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 minute ago
"It was rules in a governing body of a sport. It isn't law. Learn."

It's you that needs to learn.

Go away and read what the panel was, and it's relationship to the FA.

Then go away and read about civil courts.

The way you're discussing this - withj the sort of bravado only used in forums - suggests you'll never back down, so you'll probably just keep repeating yourself.

But seriously, read up about civil courts. You might learn something
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I read the whole report, which adds to my view that I would tend not to consider somebody guilty who was probably guilty.

It wasn't a real court and therefore, probably was enough. If it was real court, it wouldn't be. So it was enough to satisfy a footballing body but not an actual court of which law applies.

Regardless, my point was that probably guilty isn't guilty, in my view.

The way you're going on about it as if those three men were some kind of high court judges suggest that you're too biased to change your mind.