OK Sandy, as you dug up this particular old chestnut of yours yet again...
Please explain why, despite sports scientists globally agreeing rest is a requirement for all physical exercise, do you believe it's not the case?
I sat through a presentation from one of our Olympic rowers who stated categorically "athletes don't manage training days, they work their training around rest days...this is how you keep peak performance". Pretty convincing statement when it's backed up with passing a gold medal around the room
So a player that was injured in 1890s also suffered from burn out, so not a modern thing then.
=======
There were of course injuries caused by burn-out. Far more a modern thing though.
It should also be noted that in modern times the top level of players fitness is so much higher, thus to be competitive players have to be fit and fresh. A small drop can be very evident in performance.
Back in the old days, when training and medical standards were no where near todays, players could get away with not being at a high fitness level. Mainly because the majority of their opponents were also below that level.
Modern players could play 4 games a week, they could play through a lot of the injuries that keep them out. But the performance and the long term effects (that players of the past suffer) is not beneficial to any party.
Raheem Sterling
There's no scientific explanation for burn out, several studies have proven its existence. I had to read a few articles about it in college, cba to find them though.
Burn out isn't just physical it's mental is well. It's the whole reason why squad rotation exists, if it didn't exist the same 11 players would play week after week.
"As England were not at Euro 2008 they have yet to receive Ekstrand's report. Capello's medical team, Dr Ian Beasley and Gary Lewin, are looking forward to getting a copy and considering its findings, although both are aware of talk generally within the medical world about the possible dangers of NSAIDs.
Ekstrand invariably talks sense. In the past, he has conducted research that discovered Premier League footballers are five times more likely to suffer an injury in the later stages of the season (like David Beckham and Wayne Rooney before the World Cups of 2002 and 2006 respectively) than counterparts in countries who do have a winter break.
The impact on players' bodies of not pausing for breath in January was confirmed by Sir Alex Ferguson with anecdotal evidence about his Manchester United players."
South Africa World Cup organising head Danny Jordaan says Fifa needs to look again at the issue of player burn-out before the 2014 tournament in Brazil.
There has been disappointment that some of the world's best players have failed to perform in South Africa.
"Player freshness is always an issue at the World Cup," said Jordaan. "How many matches can the body of a player take?
"It seems at the end of a season the body cannot take the pressure and extra energy required for the World Cup."
The five-week long tournament in South Africa - the first on African soil - draws to a close on Sunday with the final between Netherlands and Spain at Soccer City.
We have to make sure these players do have a rest before they come to a very demanding World Cup in Brazil
Danny Jordaan
While the leading players for the Dutch and Spanish sides have largely performed well, many of the top stars from across the globe have failed to hit the heights they are capable of.
Argentina's world player of the year Lionel Messi, Brazilian Kaka and England's Wayne Rooney did not manage a goal between them, while Cristiano Ronaldo scored only once for Portugal in a 7-0 drubbing of North Korea and Spain's Fernando Torres heads into Sunday's final yet to score.
Messi and Rooney each played more than 50 games during the 2009/10 season and the Manchester United man, Kaka and Torres all came into the World Cup less than fully fit after injuries.
"The players we expected to score many goals did not score a single one," added Jordaan.
Look I am not disputing you all think burn-out is prevalent, but I need some names of players currently playing in the premiership that are or will be suffering from burn-out by playing too much football.
And don`t give me Wilshire, Walcott, the Ox etc, they are just sicknotes, and very rarely get on the pitch, so they cannot be suffering from burn-out.
Give me the players that will supposedly be dropping like flies from fatigue, and I will bow to your greater knowledge, not too much to ask is it.
Vertonghen Groove *100% WUM free*
OK Sandy, as you dug up this particular old chestnut of yours yet again...
Please explain why, despite sports scientists globally agreeing rest is a requirement for all physical exercise, do you believe it's not the case?
I sat through a presentation from one of our Olympic rowers who stated categorically "athletes don't manage training days, they work their training around rest days...this is how you keep peak performance". Pretty convincing statement when it's backed up with passing a gold medal around the room
If everybody that did a manual job applied that sort of nonsense to their daily lives, the world would come to a grinding halt.
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences. You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
Burn out is the reason why most clubs employ sports scientists and analysists. Most clubs avoid the burn out of players by giving them adequate rest. Clubs don't say it to public even if we one of their players are suffering from burn out, so there aren't many definite evidence of it.
One famous case was Alexis Sanchez. Wenger said he was playing in red zone last season, but he didn't rest him because half of the arsenal squad is suffering from injuries. This led to a below par couple of months for sanchez.
Wenger naturally never admitted he was suffering from burn out but most arsenal fans knew that was the case
I don't think anyone said it was prevalent. What is evident is that most professional clubs seek to manage the risk of burnout by resting players as often as is possible.
Most people see this as sensible, you seem to see it as pampering because they didn't do it in the 1930s
Chelsea looked pretty burnt out mentally at the end of last season.
Poch insists on his players running more than almost any other side. We are relentless. If that drops off we lose our potency.
Do you seriously think a player will be able to give his full capacity after travelling to Azerbaijan, playing 90 minutes, staying at a hotel, flying back Friday and having one day off before a Midday game on Sunday?
Wenger has said the same of Sanchez now.
He played in the Copa America, missed the start, came in and scored a few goals and now looks drained. Half the player he usually is. But he has to play every game because Arsenal are light
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences. You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
-----------------
And that Statement id perfrect proof you really don't have a fackin clue what you're talking about
and that one of mine is evidence I should spell check first
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences
...........
Clueless
You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
======
Nope. But if you want to be a top level footballer you need all the advantages you can get.
Sports scientists, and other such developments over time, is why levels are higher across all top level sports.
That is why even white sprinters run the 100m in a quicker time than the great Jesse Owens ever managed. It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds. It is also why they are getting injured more often.
It is also why so many have to use substances outside what is considered legal, tbf.
It isn't 1930 anymore. Levels are far higher, and as such fitness is more key than ever.
Sandy I have a question for you.
If a player had a drop in form as you put it would you drop them?
It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds.
--
PED's
comment by Barney. (U3579)
posted 4 seconds ago
It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds.
--
PED's
----------------------------------------------------------------------
that is a development in sports science.
Hengy
Sandy I have a question for you.
If a player had a drop in form as you put it would you drop them?
Possibly, but that is a loss of form, nothing to do with burn-out. Players, clubs have always had dips in form ever since the game was invented, that is why you get winners and losers. But to blame loss of form on burn-out is nonsense.
Players, clubs have always had dips in form ever since the game was invented,that is why you get winners and losers.
=========
Nothing to do with higher quality of player, tactics, training or fitness?
Everybody has the same level of ability, obviously, it is just who is in better form?
D'Jeezus Mackaroni
It isn't 1930 anymore. Levels are far higher, and as such fitness is more key than ever.
Not sure why you keep bringing up 1930s, I wasn`t around then, neither were you. Sure footballers run faster now, but they also have so many more things in their favour, better pitches, lighter balls, boots, etc. So all in all footballers of years back should have burnt out much quicker playing on glue-pots of pitches, and they never did. They got injuries yes, but nowhere near as many as today`s players, who seem to get a muscle strain and take a couple of months out.
Love how Sandy takes one bit of a comment and then asks a question that has already been answered by the part of the comment he omitted.
OK, then seeing as no poster has come up with any names of current footballers that are burning-out or will burn out, then I think we can all move on .
Sign in if you want to comment
There seems to be a notion from a lot
Page 2 of 3
posted on 23/11/15
OK Sandy, as you dug up this particular old chestnut of yours yet again...
Please explain why, despite sports scientists globally agreeing rest is a requirement for all physical exercise, do you believe it's not the case?
I sat through a presentation from one of our Olympic rowers who stated categorically "athletes don't manage training days, they work their training around rest days...this is how you keep peak performance". Pretty convincing statement when it's backed up with passing a gold medal around the room
posted on 23/11/15
So a player that was injured in 1890s also suffered from burn out, so not a modern thing then.
=======
There were of course injuries caused by burn-out. Far more a modern thing though.
It should also be noted that in modern times the top level of players fitness is so much higher, thus to be competitive players have to be fit and fresh. A small drop can be very evident in performance.
Back in the old days, when training and medical standards were no where near todays, players could get away with not being at a high fitness level. Mainly because the majority of their opponents were also below that level.
Modern players could play 4 games a week, they could play through a lot of the injuries that keep them out. But the performance and the long term effects (that players of the past suffer) is not beneficial to any party.
posted on 23/11/15
Raheem Sterling
There's no scientific explanation for burn out, several studies have proven its existence. I had to read a few articles about it in college, cba to find them though.
Burn out isn't just physical it's mental is well. It's the whole reason why squad rotation exists, if it didn't exist the same 11 players would play week after week.
posted on 23/11/15
"As England were not at Euro 2008 they have yet to receive Ekstrand's report. Capello's medical team, Dr Ian Beasley and Gary Lewin, are looking forward to getting a copy and considering its findings, although both are aware of talk generally within the medical world about the possible dangers of NSAIDs.
Ekstrand invariably talks sense. In the past, he has conducted research that discovered Premier League footballers are five times more likely to suffer an injury in the later stages of the season (like David Beckham and Wayne Rooney before the World Cups of 2002 and 2006 respectively) than counterparts in countries who do have a winter break.
The impact on players' bodies of not pausing for breath in January was confirmed by Sir Alex Ferguson with anecdotal evidence about his Manchester United players."
posted on 23/11/15
South Africa World Cup organising head Danny Jordaan says Fifa needs to look again at the issue of player burn-out before the 2014 tournament in Brazil.
There has been disappointment that some of the world's best players have failed to perform in South Africa.
"Player freshness is always an issue at the World Cup," said Jordaan. "How many matches can the body of a player take?
"It seems at the end of a season the body cannot take the pressure and extra energy required for the World Cup."
The five-week long tournament in South Africa - the first on African soil - draws to a close on Sunday with the final between Netherlands and Spain at Soccer City.
We have to make sure these players do have a rest before they come to a very demanding World Cup in Brazil
Danny Jordaan
While the leading players for the Dutch and Spanish sides have largely performed well, many of the top stars from across the globe have failed to hit the heights they are capable of.
Argentina's world player of the year Lionel Messi, Brazilian Kaka and England's Wayne Rooney did not manage a goal between them, while Cristiano Ronaldo scored only once for Portugal in a 7-0 drubbing of North Korea and Spain's Fernando Torres heads into Sunday's final yet to score.
Messi and Rooney each played more than 50 games during the 2009/10 season and the Manchester United man, Kaka and Torres all came into the World Cup less than fully fit after injuries.
"The players we expected to score many goals did not score a single one," added Jordaan.
posted on 23/11/15
Look I am not disputing you all think burn-out is prevalent, but I need some names of players currently playing in the premiership that are or will be suffering from burn-out by playing too much football.
And don`t give me Wilshire, Walcott, the Ox etc, they are just sicknotes, and very rarely get on the pitch, so they cannot be suffering from burn-out.
Give me the players that will supposedly be dropping like flies from fatigue, and I will bow to your greater knowledge, not too much to ask is it.
posted on 23/11/15
Vertonghen Groove *100% WUM free*
OK Sandy, as you dug up this particular old chestnut of yours yet again...
Please explain why, despite sports scientists globally agreeing rest is a requirement for all physical exercise, do you believe it's not the case?
I sat through a presentation from one of our Olympic rowers who stated categorically "athletes don't manage training days, they work their training around rest days...this is how you keep peak performance". Pretty convincing statement when it's backed up with passing a gold medal around the room
If everybody that did a manual job applied that sort of nonsense to their daily lives, the world would come to a grinding halt.
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences. You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
posted on 23/11/15
Burn out is the reason why most clubs employ sports scientists and analysists. Most clubs avoid the burn out of players by giving them adequate rest. Clubs don't say it to public even if we one of their players are suffering from burn out, so there aren't many definite evidence of it.
One famous case was Alexis Sanchez. Wenger said he was playing in red zone last season, but he didn't rest him because half of the arsenal squad is suffering from injuries. This led to a below par couple of months for sanchez.
Wenger naturally never admitted he was suffering from burn out but most arsenal fans knew that was the case
posted on 23/11/15
I don't think anyone said it was prevalent. What is evident is that most professional clubs seek to manage the risk of burnout by resting players as often as is possible.
Most people see this as sensible, you seem to see it as pampering because they didn't do it in the 1930s
posted on 23/11/15
Chelsea looked pretty burnt out mentally at the end of last season.
Poch insists on his players running more than almost any other side. We are relentless. If that drops off we lose our potency.
Do you seriously think a player will be able to give his full capacity after travelling to Azerbaijan, playing 90 minutes, staying at a hotel, flying back Friday and having one day off before a Midday game on Sunday?
posted on 23/11/15
Wenger has said the same of Sanchez now.
He played in the Copa America, missed the start, came in and scored a few goals and now looks drained. Half the player he usually is. But he has to play every game because Arsenal are light
posted on 23/11/15
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences. You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
-----------------
And that Statement id perfrect proof you really don't have a fackin clue what you're talking about
posted on 23/11/15
and that one of mine is evidence I should spell check first
posted on 23/11/15
Sports scientist is like a modern name for people earning money under false pretences
...........
Clueless
posted on 23/11/15
You don`t need a fecking sports scientist to kick a football.
======
Nope. But if you want to be a top level footballer you need all the advantages you can get.
Sports scientists, and other such developments over time, is why levels are higher across all top level sports.
That is why even white sprinters run the 100m in a quicker time than the great Jesse Owens ever managed. It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds. It is also why they are getting injured more often.
It is also why so many have to use substances outside what is considered legal, tbf.
It isn't 1930 anymore. Levels are far higher, and as such fitness is more key than ever.
posted on 23/11/15
Sandys had a mare here.
posted on 23/11/15
Sandy I have a question for you.
If a player had a drop in form as you put it would you drop them?
posted on 23/11/15
It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds.
--
PED's
posted on 23/11/15
comment by Barney. (U3579)
posted 4 seconds ago
It is why sprinters are now regularly timing under 10 seconds.
--
PED's
----------------------------------------------------------------------
that is a development in sports science.
posted on 23/11/15
Hengy
Sandy I have a question for you.
If a player had a drop in form as you put it would you drop them?
Possibly, but that is a loss of form, nothing to do with burn-out. Players, clubs have always had dips in form ever since the game was invented, that is why you get winners and losers. But to blame loss of form on burn-out is nonsense.
posted on 23/11/15
Players, clubs have always had dips in form ever since the game was invented,that is why you get winners and losers.
=========
Nothing to do with higher quality of player, tactics, training or fitness?
Everybody has the same level of ability, obviously, it is just who is in better form?
posted on 23/11/15
D'Jeezus Mackaroni
It isn't 1930 anymore. Levels are far higher, and as such fitness is more key than ever.
Not sure why you keep bringing up 1930s, I wasn`t around then, neither were you. Sure footballers run faster now, but they also have so many more things in their favour, better pitches, lighter balls, boots, etc. So all in all footballers of years back should have burnt out much quicker playing on glue-pots of pitches, and they never did. They got injuries yes, but nowhere near as many as today`s players, who seem to get a muscle strain and take a couple of months out.
posted on 23/11/15
Love how Sandy takes one bit of a comment and then asks a question that has already been answered by the part of the comment he omitted.
posted on 23/11/15
OK, then seeing as no poster has come up with any names of current footballers that are burning-out or will burn out, then I think we can all move on .
posted on 23/11/15
We have. Loads!
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