Bluebells I agree with what you said except for two parts.
There is also a lot of misinformation on another of your points.
"It is no longer enough to just say it was the west what started it, if it ever was justification."
I never said it was justification, there is never justification for taking a life unless that person is trying to take your life.
There are reasons why things happen the though and the cause of terrorism is usually born out of oppression. This doesn't mean that people can go rampaging around the world killing people it means that nations like ours should stop interfering with the politics of other nations.
Our governments have been relentlessly and aggressively interfering with the middle-east for around 100 years.
Britain in fact created the middle-east by drawing those ridiculous borders.
You should read Bin Ladens letter to the west, he blames is cruel acts on western foreign policy.
9/11 wouldn't have happened if Bin Laden was a sane decent individual, it also wouldn't have happened if america didn't arm him to the teeth and then exploit Arab nations for decades.
The ideology of these people is fed by our governments actions.
I'm not taking away responsibility from killers, as a Muslim I believe that every individual is judged on there own actions without any intercession from anybody else.
What I am trying to do is point to the reason why, what used to be a relatively peaceful part of the world has turned into a hell hole.
Britain wouldn't survive with that constant interference, no nation would.
"I would suggest african islamism is not our fault in any form"
That's not the way it works.
The reason why Daesh gain recruits from all over the world in peaceful nations is because disillusioned Muslims see there brothers and sisters in religion getting massacred and want to do something about it.
The same way our government is willing to blow up infrastructure and civilians in Syria because of the attacks in Paris.
"Many muslim nationals wanted Saddam, Gadaffi and the taliban off their backs"
All given power because western governments either armed them, helped them become rulers through force or are successors to past dictators who were deliberately put in power to become puppets (Assads father).
At this point I think it's appropriate to point out that one of the biggest terrorist organisations on this planet is the CIA.
As for the "Arab Spring" do you not find it odd that Muslims in predominately Muslims countries were protesting for western style democracy when Islam teaches that Muslim lands should only be governed by one ruler, a Khalifah?
Kung Fu
Interesting read as ever my friend, and I continue to be a pupil on these matters.
I disagree with some of your emphasis, in that it seems the west is still to blame for it all, always pulling the strings, when throughout history, all nations and people's have sought to gain advantage and influence over others.
It is a small world and politician's and big business will continue to interfere with anything they feel benefits them, so we see China in Africa now.
Empires from Rome, Greece,the Ottoman one, Soviet Russia, Spain and France on tour abroad, and the British and American version's simply reflect man's greed and need for power.
I know that muslim people and states have been oppressed, abused and messed up by outside forces, but as you say, that does not entitle loon's using political islam to oppress, abuse and mess non-muslim's or other muslim's up.
It is complex and as human's we are good and bad, and it would be progress if we saw beyond muslim v west, Christianity v Islam, Jewish Israel v Palestinian, West v Africa/middle east,Arab muslim v African christian etc etc.
To be continued Kung Fu, and I will try to see through any misinformation out there, as I am certain I am being lied to by "the man".
Take care Kung Fu.
Gone off in Paris again
Page 19 of 19
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posted on 16/1/16
Bluebells I agree with what you said except for two parts.
There is also a lot of misinformation on another of your points.
"It is no longer enough to just say it was the west what started it, if it ever was justification."
I never said it was justification, there is never justification for taking a life unless that person is trying to take your life.
There are reasons why things happen the though and the cause of terrorism is usually born out of oppression. This doesn't mean that people can go rampaging around the world killing people it means that nations like ours should stop interfering with the politics of other nations.
Our governments have been relentlessly and aggressively interfering with the middle-east for around 100 years.
Britain in fact created the middle-east by drawing those ridiculous borders.
You should read Bin Ladens letter to the west, he blames is cruel acts on western foreign policy.
9/11 wouldn't have happened if Bin Laden was a sane decent individual, it also wouldn't have happened if america didn't arm him to the teeth and then exploit Arab nations for decades.
The ideology of these people is fed by our governments actions.
I'm not taking away responsibility from killers, as a Muslim I believe that every individual is judged on there own actions without any intercession from anybody else.
What I am trying to do is point to the reason why, what used to be a relatively peaceful part of the world has turned into a hell hole.
Britain wouldn't survive with that constant interference, no nation would.
"I would suggest african islamism is not our fault in any form"
That's not the way it works.
The reason why Daesh gain recruits from all over the world in peaceful nations is because disillusioned Muslims see there brothers and sisters in religion getting massacred and want to do something about it.
The same way our government is willing to blow up infrastructure and civilians in Syria because of the attacks in Paris.
"Many muslim nationals wanted Saddam, Gadaffi and the taliban off their backs"
All given power because western governments either armed them, helped them become rulers through force or are successors to past dictators who were deliberately put in power to become puppets (Assads father).
At this point I think it's appropriate to point out that one of the biggest terrorist organisations on this planet is the CIA.
As for the "Arab Spring" do you not find it odd that Muslims in predominately Muslims countries were protesting for western style democracy when Islam teaches that Muslim lands should only be governed by one ruler, a Khalifah?
posted on 18/1/16
Kung Fu
Interesting read as ever my friend, and I continue to be a pupil on these matters.
I disagree with some of your emphasis, in that it seems the west is still to blame for it all, always pulling the strings, when throughout history, all nations and people's have sought to gain advantage and influence over others.
It is a small world and politician's and big business will continue to interfere with anything they feel benefits them, so we see China in Africa now.
Empires from Rome, Greece,the Ottoman one, Soviet Russia, Spain and France on tour abroad, and the British and American version's simply reflect man's greed and need for power.
I know that muslim people and states have been oppressed, abused and messed up by outside forces, but as you say, that does not entitle loon's using political islam to oppress, abuse and mess non-muslim's or other muslim's up.
It is complex and as human's we are good and bad, and it would be progress if we saw beyond muslim v west, Christianity v Islam, Jewish Israel v Palestinian, West v Africa/middle east,Arab muslim v African christian etc etc.
To be continued Kung Fu, and I will try to see through any misinformation out there, as I am certain I am being lied to by "the man".
Take care Kung Fu.
Page 19 of 19
15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19