comment by Chronic (U3423)
posted 13 minutes ago
problem with Redknapp is that while overall he did a good job, the same thing happened again and again to his teams and he had no answer to it. his team also probably underachieved.
Modric and Bale are probably two of the best players in the Madrid team, and we had them both at spurs, along with some other top class players. King, VDV, to name a few. with hindsight, that team should have delivered a trophy of some kind.
He also couldn't keep his mouth shut, and it kept landing him into hot water.
as for AVB, he had to go, as by the end he had not flexibility in his team or style of play, and it wasn't working.
getting banged up 0-3 by west ham at home is totally unacceptable, and that result shortly followed by 0-5 home to Liverpool meant he had to go.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can argue that this current team/squad is better than that one under Redknapp, so possibly it will be as much underachievement under Poch if we don't win a trophy.
comment by Spurtle2 (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Chronic (U3423)
posted 13 minutes ago
problem with Redknapp is that while overall he did a good job, the same thing happened again and again to his teams and he had no answer to it. his team also probably underachieved.
Modric and Bale are probably two of the best players in the Madrid team, and we had them both at spurs, along with some other top class players. King, VDV, to name a few. with hindsight, that team should have delivered a trophy of some kind.
He also couldn't keep his mouth shut, and it kept landing him into hot water.
as for AVB, he had to go, as by the end he had not flexibility in his team or style of play, and it wasn't working.
getting banged up 0-3 by west ham at home is totally unacceptable, and that result shortly followed by 0-5 home to Liverpool meant he had to go.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can argue that this current team/squad is better than that one under Redknapp, so possibly it will be as much underachievement under Poch if we don't win a trophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i would say the competition is fiercer now, but ultimately yes, this team needs to win something
the season avb was in charged bale carried us with worldies when we got that record points tally
comment by Phenom (U20037)
posted 18 seconds ago
the season avb was in charged bale carried us with worldies when we got that record points tally
----------------------------------------------------------------------
to be fair, AVB set up the team to play to Bale's strengths
had we not had Bale i am sure we would have played a completely different way
I think it is hard to compare exactly in hindsight. I mean just looking at the squads i would take Harrys squad Bale, modric, vdv, king world class players and Rose, kane, walker were still a part of the squad.
I do think Harry should of done better that season we should of won something but he was sacked for other reasons that are well documented.
Avb does not get enough credit for losing modric who absoloutely was the heartbeat of our side. Trying to do something different with the side to get a records point tally was amazing. I think if he would of had the support that Poch had to freeze players out things perhaps would of been different.
Both managers unlucky but we are still sort of progressing year on year which is promising. Best training complex, best stadium, good young squad, good manager but we have been a top 7 aggregate side for the past 10 seasons we should be breaking that glass ceiling soon.
If you include ALL matches as manager, then Poch's stats are much better than Sherwood's.
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
Martin Jol had a 57.72% win rate from 149 games.
These are figures covering all games in charge at Spurs.
So can we please dispel this myth that Sherwood's record is the best of the modern day managers at Spurs.
If he had been in charge for say 100 games, I can guarantee his win rate would have been much lower. His managerial exploits since have endorsed that view too.
He is currently at Swindon as Director of Football. During the FA Cup match versus Eastleigh, he came down from the stand and sat in the dug out, and then started to shout instructions from the touchline to the Swindon players
If I had been the Swindon manager I would have grabbed him and pushed him down the tunnel!
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I said deck him, not eat him
I wouldn't have trusted Harry to make the right decisions on and off the pitch as we looked to enter a new era with our new stadium. He was the perfect catalyst for a revival post Ramos but as others have said, with the players at his disposal he may have under-achieved over his 4 year stay.
AVB was never trusted to sign the players he wanted (moutinho, willian) and was essentially given players to manage - and most of those were duds. He shored up our tactical approach - something which wound me up with Redknapp no end, and as a result we became somewhat turgid to watch but the results on paper were mostly good. A lot of spurs fans couldn't accept this as they demand a certain brand of football, but given the fact AVB is basically Mourinho's apprentice, i was prepared to accept a certain brand of football so long as it delivered the points.
Sherwood was always going to be a transitional appointment unless he took to it like a duck to water. He was way out of his depth but did a decent short term patch up job. No way i wanted him in charge the following season - he had no tactics as far as i could see.
With the benefit of hindsight it's a case of good riddance to all of the above. Levy has played the hire and fire game pretty well on reflection i'd say. All while plotting in the background a new future for the club - i do think he is this clubs biggest asset tbh
comment by GeniusGreaves Optimist Supreme (U1302)
posted 13 hours, 32 minutes ago
If you include ALL matches as manager, then Poch's stats are much better than Sherwood's.
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
Martin Jol had a 57.72% win rate from 149 games.
These are figures covering all games in charge at Spurs.
So can we please dispel this myth that Sherwood's record is the best of the modern day managers at Spurs.
If he had been in charge for say 100 games, I can guarantee his win rate would have been much lower. His managerial exploits since have endorsed that view too.
He is currently at Swindon as Director of Football. During the FA Cup match versus Eastleigh, he came down from the stand and sat in the dug out, and then started to shout instructions from the touchline to the Swindon players
If I had been the Swindon manager I would have grabbed him and pushed him down the tunnel!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Premier League is the bread and butter Greaves. As it stands Sherwood has the best points per game of any coach.
Nobody is saying he was our best coach, but that fact is there until Poch inevitably overtakes him . As AVB's points record is still there
Incidentally.....
Overall win records will be padded out with the many easy Europa qualifying and group games we have virtually every season. Sherwood only managed to get Dnipro (finalists the next year) and the eventual winners Benfica. Eventual FA cup winners Arsenal away. Oh, and West Ham
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
=========
Those overall win percentages are wrong too
You don't need to be a mathematician to see Sherwood winning 14 of 28 is 50%, not 57.14%
AVB is 55%
Poch 51.65%
Harry 49.49%
comment by HRH King Ledley (U20095)
posted 8 minutes ago
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
=========
Those overall win percentages are wrong too
You don't need to be a mathematician to see Sherwood winning 14 of 28 is 50%, not 57.14%
AVB is 55%
Poch 51.65%
Harry 49.49%
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just clicked on the link, pretty sure 'overall record' is percentage of games not lost.
Pretty sure 'win %' is.... percentage of games won? Whoever posted those stats on here has had a shocker
comment by Ledders The King - Football Manager Icon (U20121)
posted 4 minutes ago
Just clicked on the link, pretty sure 'overall record' is percentage of games not lost.
Pretty sure 'win %' is.... percentage of games won? Whoever posted those stats on here has had a shocker
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just looked at the link myself....the win % is innthe column next to it
The overall figure includes drawn games as well. You are correct stating his win record was 50%
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Redknapp/AVB - Undeserved sackings?
Page 3 of 3
posted on 13/3/17
comment by Chronic (U3423)
posted 13 minutes ago
problem with Redknapp is that while overall he did a good job, the same thing happened again and again to his teams and he had no answer to it. his team also probably underachieved.
Modric and Bale are probably two of the best players in the Madrid team, and we had them both at spurs, along with some other top class players. King, VDV, to name a few. with hindsight, that team should have delivered a trophy of some kind.
He also couldn't keep his mouth shut, and it kept landing him into hot water.
as for AVB, he had to go, as by the end he had not flexibility in his team or style of play, and it wasn't working.
getting banged up 0-3 by west ham at home is totally unacceptable, and that result shortly followed by 0-5 home to Liverpool meant he had to go.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can argue that this current team/squad is better than that one under Redknapp, so possibly it will be as much underachievement under Poch if we don't win a trophy.
posted on 13/3/17
comment by Spurtle2 (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Chronic (U3423)
posted 13 minutes ago
problem with Redknapp is that while overall he did a good job, the same thing happened again and again to his teams and he had no answer to it. his team also probably underachieved.
Modric and Bale are probably two of the best players in the Madrid team, and we had them both at spurs, along with some other top class players. King, VDV, to name a few. with hindsight, that team should have delivered a trophy of some kind.
He also couldn't keep his mouth shut, and it kept landing him into hot water.
as for AVB, he had to go, as by the end he had not flexibility in his team or style of play, and it wasn't working.
getting banged up 0-3 by west ham at home is totally unacceptable, and that result shortly followed by 0-5 home to Liverpool meant he had to go.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can argue that this current team/squad is better than that one under Redknapp, so possibly it will be as much underachievement under Poch if we don't win a trophy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i would say the competition is fiercer now, but ultimately yes, this team needs to win something
posted on 13/3/17
the season avb was in charged bale carried us with worldies when we got that record points tally
posted on 13/3/17
comment by Phenom (U20037)
posted 18 seconds ago
the season avb was in charged bale carried us with worldies when we got that record points tally
----------------------------------------------------------------------
to be fair, AVB set up the team to play to Bale's strengths
had we not had Bale i am sure we would have played a completely different way
posted on 13/3/17
still
posted on 13/3/17
I think it is hard to compare exactly in hindsight. I mean just looking at the squads i would take Harrys squad Bale, modric, vdv, king world class players and Rose, kane, walker were still a part of the squad.
I do think Harry should of done better that season we should of won something but he was sacked for other reasons that are well documented.
Avb does not get enough credit for losing modric who absoloutely was the heartbeat of our side. Trying to do something different with the side to get a records point tally was amazing. I think if he would of had the support that Poch had to freeze players out things perhaps would of been different.
Both managers unlucky but we are still sort of progressing year on year which is promising. Best training complex, best stadium, good young squad, good manager but we have been a top 7 aggregate side for the past 10 seasons we should be breaking that glass ceiling soon.
posted on 13/3/17
If you include ALL matches as manager, then Poch's stats are much better than Sherwood's.
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
Martin Jol had a 57.72% win rate from 149 games.
These are figures covering all games in charge at Spurs.
So can we please dispel this myth that Sherwood's record is the best of the modern day managers at Spurs.
If he had been in charge for say 100 games, I can guarantee his win rate would have been much lower. His managerial exploits since have endorsed that view too.
He is currently at Swindon as Director of Football. During the FA Cup match versus Eastleigh, he came down from the stand and sat in the dug out, and then started to shout instructions from the touchline to the Swindon players
If I had been the Swindon manager I would have grabbed him and pushed him down the tunnel!
posted on 13/3/17
Or decked him
posted on 13/3/17
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 13/3/17
I said deck him, not eat him
posted on 13/3/17
I wouldn't have trusted Harry to make the right decisions on and off the pitch as we looked to enter a new era with our new stadium. He was the perfect catalyst for a revival post Ramos but as others have said, with the players at his disposal he may have under-achieved over his 4 year stay.
AVB was never trusted to sign the players he wanted (moutinho, willian) and was essentially given players to manage - and most of those were duds. He shored up our tactical approach - something which wound me up with Redknapp no end, and as a result we became somewhat turgid to watch but the results on paper were mostly good. A lot of spurs fans couldn't accept this as they demand a certain brand of football, but given the fact AVB is basically Mourinho's apprentice, i was prepared to accept a certain brand of football so long as it delivered the points.
Sherwood was always going to be a transitional appointment unless he took to it like a duck to water. He was way out of his depth but did a decent short term patch up job. No way i wanted him in charge the following season - he had no tactics as far as i could see.
With the benefit of hindsight it's a case of good riddance to all of the above. Levy has played the hire and fire game pretty well on reflection i'd say. All while plotting in the background a new future for the club - i do think he is this clubs biggest asset tbh
posted on 14/3/17
comment by GeniusGreaves Optimist Supreme (U1302)
posted 13 hours, 32 minutes ago
If you include ALL matches as manager, then Poch's stats are much better than Sherwood's.
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurManagersRecords1898-2009.html
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
Martin Jol had a 57.72% win rate from 149 games.
These are figures covering all games in charge at Spurs.
So can we please dispel this myth that Sherwood's record is the best of the modern day managers at Spurs.
If he had been in charge for say 100 games, I can guarantee his win rate would have been much lower. His managerial exploits since have endorsed that view too.
He is currently at Swindon as Director of Football. During the FA Cup match versus Eastleigh, he came down from the stand and sat in the dug out, and then started to shout instructions from the touchline to the Swindon players
If I had been the Swindon manager I would have grabbed him and pushed him down the tunnel!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Premier League is the bread and butter Greaves. As it stands Sherwood has the best points per game of any coach.
Nobody is saying he was our best coach, but that fact is there until Poch inevitably overtakes him . As AVB's points record is still there
Incidentally.....
Overall win records will be padded out with the many easy Europa qualifying and group games we have virtually every season. Sherwood only managed to get Dnipro (finalists the next year) and the eventual winners Benfica. Eventual FA cup winners Arsenal away. Oh, and West Ham
posted on 14/3/17
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
=========
Those overall win percentages are wrong too
You don't need to be a mathematician to see Sherwood winning 14 of 28 is 50%, not 57.14%
AVB is 55%
Poch 51.65%
Harry 49.49%
posted on 14/3/17
comment by HRH King Ledley (U20095)
posted 8 minutes ago
Poch has been in charge for 151 games, winning 78, drawing 38 and losing 35 giving him a win % of 64.24.
Sherwood was in charge for 28 games, winning 14, drawing 4 and losing 10, giving him a win % of 57.14.
Harry had 198 games, winning 98, drawing 50 and losing 50. Giving him a win % of 62.12
Surprisingly the best stats belong to AVB, 80 games, 44 wins, 20 draws and 16 losses, giving him a win % of 67.50.
=========
Those overall win percentages are wrong too
You don't need to be a mathematician to see Sherwood winning 14 of 28 is 50%, not 57.14%
AVB is 55%
Poch 51.65%
Harry 49.49%
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 14/3/17
Just clicked on the link, pretty sure 'overall record' is percentage of games not lost.
Pretty sure 'win %' is.... percentage of games won? Whoever posted those stats on here has had a shocker
posted on 14/3/17
comment by Ledders The King - Football Manager Icon (U20121)
posted 4 minutes ago
Just clicked on the link, pretty sure 'overall record' is percentage of games not lost.
Pretty sure 'win %' is.... percentage of games won? Whoever posted those stats on here has had a shocker
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just looked at the link myself....the win % is innthe column next to it
posted on 15/3/17
The overall figure includes drawn games as well. You are correct stating his win record was 50%
Page 3 of 3