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comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 40 seconds ago
People are caught and charged for drug use but the use is so widespread it's impossible to arrest the situation without a change in strategy

https://twitter.com/MPSEnfield/status/1395881333809876996?s=19

You even have Met Police making embarrassing tweets like the above. Total waste of time and resource.

Stop focussing on everyday use and criminalising addicts who would be better served with a healthcare solution. Also take the industry away from criminals and make it something that can be taxed and regulated
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If people feared arrest and prohibition had actually been enforced over the past 40 years then there wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a health issue.

Is there a serious problem with opiates and coke/meth in the UK? Like in parts of US and Canada?
Are there safe injection sites?
Legalise it but encourage detox and rehab with addiction councillors.

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comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 6 seconds ago
Is that where you buy your cigarettes?

Haven't bought from anyone but a newsagent in 20 years
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You don’t think people buy cigarettes illegally? Or is it because you don’t that it’s not an issue?

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comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 29 seconds ago
Criminals never fear arrest when committing crimes
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Because they don’t think they will get caught, we’re talking about drug users here not hardened professional criminals.

If the thousand and thousand of people that take pills every weekend thought they would get arrested and sent to jail, you think these lovely polite middle class youngsters would take that risk knowingly? And risk actually being jailed?

No chance

The fact is they know they can go to a club, take whatever drugs they like and have a good night where the realistic worst case scenario is that the bouncer takes your drugs off you only to sell them themselves or distribute for free in the VIP room.

comment by son of quebec (U8127)
posted 3 minutes ago
Is there a serious problem with opiates and coke/meth in the UK? Like in parts of US and Canada?
Are there safe injection sites?
Legalise it but encourage detox and rehab with addiction councillors.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Coke is everywhere I think yeah, meth I’m not sure and we don’t have anything like the opiate issue that North America has.

comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted less than a minute ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 6 seconds ago
Is that where you buy your cigarettes?

Haven't bought from anyone but a newsagent in 20 years
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don’t think people buy cigarettes illegally? Or is it because you don’t that it’s not an issue?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't think its a good enough example to counter what I'm saying

The status quo of criminalisation hasn't worked and that's been obvious for sometime, imo the obvious next step is to help addicts and take the means away from criminals
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Criminalisation hasn’t been employed as I’ve pointed out. You can take whatever drugs you like and unless you have quantities on you that could be deemed as distribution, then nothing will happen to you as the police don’t have the time.

You want to treat the millions of drug users with therapy which may or may not work and will take years and years to yield results.

I want to stop the comfort that people have when deciding whether to do drugs or not. I’ve dabbled, the only times I’ve ever been ‘worried’ was when I was 17 and picking up the weed from a dealer. Other than that, I didn’t care. Lots of my mates all went to gatecrasher, cream and such in the late nineties early 2000s where most of the people there were mashed out of their mind on drugs.

How has criminalisation been tried and failed if you have a scenario where there are organised nightclub events filled with drugs every single weekend and the police do nothing about it?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 40 seconds ago
People are caught and charged for drug use but the use is so widespread it's impossible to arrest the situation without a change in strategy

https://twitter.com/MPSEnfield/status/1395881333809876996?s=19

You even have Met Police making embarrassing tweets like the above. Total waste of time and resource.

Stop focussing on everyday use and criminalising addicts who would be better served with a healthcare solution. Also take the industry away from criminals and make it something that can be taxed and regulated
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If people feared arrest and prohibition had actually been enforced over the past 40 years then there wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a health issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean it’s 40 years since Reagan began his war on drugs in the States (which I think is in effect what you are proposing?) and I’m not sure it has been a rip-roaring success tbh bud.

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comment by bmcl1987 (U14177)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 40 seconds ago
People are caught and charged for drug use but the use is so widespread it's impossible to arrest the situation without a change in strategy

https://twitter.com/MPSEnfield/status/1395881333809876996?s=19

You even have Met Police making embarrassing tweets like the above. Total waste of time and resource.

Stop focussing on everyday use and criminalising addicts who would be better served with a healthcare solution. Also take the industry away from criminals and make it something that can be taxed and regulated
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If people feared arrest and prohibition had actually been enforced over the past 40 years then there wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a health issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean it’s 40 years since Reagan began his war on drugs in the States (which I think is in effect what you are proposing?) and I’m not sure it has been a rip-roaring success tbh bud.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No it isn’t. Firstly we have a very different situation over here than in the US but secondly I’m talking about actually enforcing the law. If you do that drug users, future possible drug users will think twice.

When deciding whether to take pills or coke for example, getting caught by the police is not really an issue. Nightclubs filled with people taking coke & pills, filled. Every weekend (well not anymore thanks to covid). If you stop that from happening, you will reduce an awful lot of drug users. Then you can deal with the rest with health care measures or whatever is deemed necessary.

comment by NPEEE (U22521)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by bmcl1987 (U14177)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 40 seconds ago
People are caught and charged for drug use but the use is so widespread it's impossible to arrest the situation without a change in strategy

https://twitter.com/MPSEnfield/status/1395881333809876996?s=19

You even have Met Police making embarrassing tweets like the above. Total waste of time and resource.

Stop focussing on everyday use and criminalising addicts who would be better served with a healthcare solution. Also take the industry away from criminals and make it something that can be taxed and regulated
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If people feared arrest and prohibition had actually been enforced over the past 40 years then there wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a health issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean it’s 40 years since Reagan began his war on drugs in the States (which I think is in effect what you are proposing?) and I’m not sure it has been a rip-roaring success tbh bud.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

'War on Drugs' is a dubious narrative at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy if you want to critique Reagan’s spin.

The substance of the policy was dubious, and IMO ultimately unsuccessful.

comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted less than a minute ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 6 seconds ago
Is that where you buy your cigarettes?

Haven't bought from anyone but a newsagent in 20 years
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don’t think people buy cigarettes illegally? Or is it because you don’t that it’s not an issue?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't think its a good enough example to counter what I'm saying

The status quo of criminalisation hasn't worked and that's been obvious for sometime, imo the obvious next step is to help addicts and take the means away from criminals
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Criminalisation hasn’t been employed as I’ve pointed out. You can take whatever drugs you like and unless you have quantities on you that could be deemed as distribution, then nothing will happen to you as the police don’t have the time.

You want to treat the millions of drug users with therapy which may or may not work and will take years and years to yield results.

I want to stop the comfort that people have when deciding whether to do drugs or not. I’ve dabbled, the only times I’ve ever been ‘worried’ was when I was 17 and picking up the weed from a dealer. Other than that, I didn’t care. Lots of my mates all went to gatecrasher, cream and such in the late nineties early 2000s where most of the people there were mashed out of their mind on drugs.

How has criminalisation been tried and failed if you have a scenario where there are organised nightclub events filled with drugs every single weekend and the police do nothing about it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"You can take whatever drugs you like and unless you have quantities on you that could be deemed as distribution, then nothing will happen to you as the police don’t have the time"

You've proved my point right there... They've been illegal our whole lives and yet millions of people still use them

How would full criminalisation work in your view?

Mandatory drug tests for all?

Stop and search everyone on a daily basis?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They could start with raiding nightclubs for a start. Stop and search everyone in there club and arrest everyone with illegal drugs in their possession and hold them accountable to the law.

Imagine the headlines. Lots of people would think twice.

You keep talking about criminalisation when we haven’t even had it for the last 40 years, it’s a free for all. Only the dealers get dealt with, never the users. Reduce the number of users and the problem gets reduced.

Similar to the healthcare therapy approach only my way would take a lot less time.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

This war on drugs, started in the 1980s? During the decade the CIA helped cocaine dealing contrast sell their drugs? That war on drugs? Okaaaay.

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by bmcl1987 (U14177)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 40 seconds ago
People are caught and charged for drug use but the use is so widespread it's impossible to arrest the situation without a change in strategy

https://twitter.com/MPSEnfield/status/1395881333809876996?s=19

You even have Met Police making embarrassing tweets like the above. Total waste of time and resource.

Stop focussing on everyday use and criminalising addicts who would be better served with a healthcare solution. Also take the industry away from criminals and make it something that can be taxed and regulated
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If people feared arrest and prohibition had actually been enforced over the past 40 years then there wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a health issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean it’s 40 years since Reagan began his war on drugs in the States (which I think is in effect what you are proposing?) and I’m not sure it has been a rip-roaring success tbh bud.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No it isn’t. Firstly we have a very different situation over here than in the US but secondly I’m talking about actually enforcing the law. If you do that drug users, future possible drug users will think twice.

When deciding whether to take pills or coke for example, getting caught by the police is not really an issue. Nightclubs filled with people taking coke & pills, filled. Every weekend (well not anymore thanks to covid). If you stop that from happening, you will reduce an awful lot of drug users. Then you can deal with the rest with health care measures or whatever is deemed necessary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m not sure I agree that enforcing the law as you propose is entirely plausible. As has been mentioned above, without spending significant sums of money on attempted enforcement after a period where funding for the police has been cut by conservative governments then I’m not sure how you think what you propose could be achieved.

You rightly point out we don’t have the extent of the problems that America has (in part driven by their approach to healthcare) and thus I do wonder why you feel (to borrow a phrase) taking a hammer to crack a nut is the optimal approach.

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