comment by The Mane Man ( life at this age is rubbish with no money #needajob) (U19731)
posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago
I watch that league week in week out because I am interested in tactics as a youth coach myself.
Majority of the cb's in their league are midgets.
Most of the teams lack pace on the wings and upfront. Getafe would be relegated in the PL.
They have technicall players but if we played those teams we would trash most of those teams.
Every team want to play the same way there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That explains England’s excellent record against Spanish teams in the CL and Europa League last few years and also how Messi definitely hasn’t scored loads of goals against all of the English top 6.
comment by Pride of the North (U6803)
posted 7 hours, 16 minutes ago
"The criteria for choosing these players has always been interesting and debatable and I always had a problem with the opinion that van Dijk was the obvious choice. Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement. Just because he is Messi must never down grade the achievement. Sterling or Mane must never win it just because Ronaldo or Messi have dropped standards.They must win it because they have surpassed the standards. We have all of a sudden created some ridiculous low bar so that other players can win footballs top awards and I find it ridiculous."
If any other player in world football had had the season Messi just had (bar Ronaldo) they would have been by far and away the favourite for the award.
But because it's one of the two it's just expected of them and taken for granted.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why when Salah was not considered for pfa player of the year last year liverpool fans queried it when u saw that he was joint top goal scorer. But I recall most opposition fans were I a agreement he should not been in the reckoning even though he had similar stats to sterling.
comment by The Goofy One (U16087)
posted 8 hours, 51 minutes ago
comment by Pride of the North (U6803)
posted 7 hours, 16 minutes ago
"The criteria for choosing these players has always been interesting and debatable and I always had a problem with the opinion that van Dijk was the obvious choice. Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement. Just because he is Messi must never down grade the achievement. Sterling or Mane must never win it just because Ronaldo or Messi have dropped standards.They must win it because they have surpassed the standards. We have all of a sudden created some ridiculous low bar so that other players can win footballs top awards and I find it ridiculous."
If any other player in world football had had the season Messi just had (bar Ronaldo) they would have been by far and away the favourite for the award.
But because it's one of the two it's just expected of them and taken for granted.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why when Salah was not considered for pfa player of the year last year liverpool fans queried it when u saw that he was joint top goal scorer. But I recall most opposition fans were I a agreement he should not been in the reckoning even though he had similar stats to sterling.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Last season Salah was not the best in the league. I'm not sure where you heard Liverpool fans saying otherwise. The season before last, without a doubt.
Interesting read, this thread.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is an outrageous comment, though.
I have no objection to VVD being recognised for his outstanding contribution but ultimately you have to accept a different criteria to make that happen.
What VVD does on a football pitch is not remotely comparable to what Messi does.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 minute ago
Interesting read, this thread.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is an outrageous comment, though.
I have no objection to VVD being recognised for his outstanding contribution but ultimately you have to accept a different criteria to make that happen.
What VVD does on a football pitch is not remotely comparable to what Messi does.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonsense. Not comparable in the specifics of what they do, obviously but comparable in terms of influence on games, on the pitch.
So in your opinion, what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season? Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
There's nothing a defender can do to be compared to what Messi or Ronaldo has done.
That's the nature of the game.
"Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?"
I said the exact opposite - perhaps you should learn to read.
Your initial comment was laughable.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
There's nothing a defender can do to be compared to what Messi or Ronaldo has done.
That's the nature of the game.
"Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?"
I said the exact opposite - perhaps you should learn to read.
Your initial comment was laughable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So influence on the team and their results cannot be compared? Nonsense.
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
Where did I say that?
You do indeed talk nonsense - largely because it appears you can't read.
Fans of team like player from team
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
Where did I say that?
You do indeed talk nonsense - largely because it appears you can't read.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You said it is laughable to make a comparison and yet you accept that you can, at the least, compare their influence on the team.
Lauagable indeed. Make up your mind.
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You're changing the debate.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is not the same as comparison one specific element, such as influence on the team.
Standard TOOR behaviour to be honest.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You're changing the debate.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is not the same as comparison one specific element, such as influence on the team.
Standard TOOR behaviour to be honest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is exactly what I was stated. VVD's influence on the team and results was comparable with Messi's. Obviously I can not compare them in terms of goals and assists, which was also the earlier point I made before you came in like a bull in a china shop.
Standard Winston behaviour, to be honest. Try reading what was actually said, for a change.
Nobody can or would say that VVD compared with Messi's goals and assists, he's a defender! What I asked people is what would VVD have to do to compare with an attacker. I stated what I believe he did to compare.
Read the thread.
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
I quoted you TOOR, there's no point in re-writing it.
"what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season?"
Both the initial comment and this one is laughable imo.
Completely different players, completely different effects on the game and judged completely differently. Name the best players ever and how many defenders come to mind?
The fact is that Messi will always be a better player than VVD.
The only way you can make a case for VVD to win an award is, as you say, considering specific criteria like influence on the team he is in.
I've read the thread and part way through I laughed at your comment because it is stupid. I have explained why.
Hope this helps.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 20 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
I quoted you TOOR, there's no point in re-writing it.
"what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season?"
Both the initial comment and this one is laughable imo.
Completely different players, completely different effects on the game and judged completely differently. Name the best players ever and how many defenders come to mind?
The fact is that Messi will always be a better player than VVD.
The only way you can make a case for VVD to win an award is, as you say, considering specific criteria like influence on the team he is in.
I've read the thread and part way through I laughed at your comment because it is stupid. I have explained why.
Hope this helps.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, I agree with all that, I never stated anything different. You just failed to read the thread and therefore picked out a specific comment without the context that came before it.
Read the thread.
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You'll deny anything.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
I'm saying this is horsesheite.
Sure, you can take one thing like influence and compare it - but you can't make an overall comparison... it's nonsense, because Messi is a much better player who does a lot more on a football pitch than VVD.
The sentence above actually made me laugh aloud.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 6 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You'll deny anything.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
I'm saying this is horsesheite.
Sure, you can take one thing like influence and compare it - but you can't make an overall comparison... it's nonsense, because Messi is a much better player who does a lot more on a football pitch than VVD.
The sentence above actually made me laugh aloud.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Read the thread. That's all I'm going to say on this matter going forward as it's pointless otherwise.
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 2 hours, 15 minutes ago
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sigh.
"Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement"
It isn't but how do you judge a defender against that? What do they have to do to rival that as a defender?
Which is fair enough. I didn't watch a lot of Messi but his stats say he was one of the best in the world again. I watched a lot of VVD and I say he was one of the best in the world. I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker. He also scored goals, assisted them, was a huge calming influence on the side and built attacks from the back. So for me he was over and above normal defensive work, which he also did outstandingly well.
----------------------------------------------
I've helped you out as you're clearly struggling.
Above is when I asked what people thought a defender had to do to compare against goals and assists. I then went on to explain what I felt VVD as a defender that compared to what Messi did as an attacker, which included his influence on the side.
So what I'm saying is VVD's influence on the side(in was a much as Messi's influence and VVD's influence was on a side that achieved 97 league points and a CL trophy. For me that means VVD was a better player over the past year. It's impossible to compare a defender against the goals and assists of an attacker, just like you can't compare an attacker in terms of blocks, clearances, tackles, take-ons etc. However what you can compare is their influence on the team. This is what I said.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 2 hours, 15 minutes ago
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sigh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Another non-response.. classic TOOR.
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face.
In the post above, you start by asking a fair question but then you ruin it when you try to answer it.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
Dress it up as you like, this is nonsense.
That comparison that you have just tried to make is one of the most ridiculous things I've read on here, which is saying something.
"comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face"
Wow. I'm out.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 minute ago
"comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face"
Wow. I'm out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course you are. You can't defend your comment and you can't admit you're wrong, so you need to leave.
Standard TOOR.
Sign in if you want to comment
Individual Sport Prizes
Page 2 of 2
posted on 24/9/19
comment by The Mane Man ( life at this age is rubbish with no money #needajob) (U19731)
posted 1 hour, 52 minutes ago
I watch that league week in week out because I am interested in tactics as a youth coach myself.
Majority of the cb's in their league are midgets.
Most of the teams lack pace on the wings and upfront. Getafe would be relegated in the PL.
They have technicall players but if we played those teams we would trash most of those teams.
Every team want to play the same way there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That explains England’s excellent record against Spanish teams in the CL and Europa League last few years and also how Messi definitely hasn’t scored loads of goals against all of the English top 6.
posted on 24/9/19
comment by Pride of the North (U6803)
posted 7 hours, 16 minutes ago
"The criteria for choosing these players has always been interesting and debatable and I always had a problem with the opinion that van Dijk was the obvious choice. Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement. Just because he is Messi must never down grade the achievement. Sterling or Mane must never win it just because Ronaldo or Messi have dropped standards.They must win it because they have surpassed the standards. We have all of a sudden created some ridiculous low bar so that other players can win footballs top awards and I find it ridiculous."
If any other player in world football had had the season Messi just had (bar Ronaldo) they would have been by far and away the favourite for the award.
But because it's one of the two it's just expected of them and taken for granted.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why when Salah was not considered for pfa player of the year last year liverpool fans queried it when u saw that he was joint top goal scorer. But I recall most opposition fans were I a agreement he should not been in the reckoning even though he had similar stats to sterling.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by The Goofy One (U16087)
posted 8 hours, 51 minutes ago
comment by Pride of the North (U6803)
posted 7 hours, 16 minutes ago
"The criteria for choosing these players has always been interesting and debatable and I always had a problem with the opinion that van Dijk was the obvious choice. Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement. Just because he is Messi must never down grade the achievement. Sterling or Mane must never win it just because Ronaldo or Messi have dropped standards.They must win it because they have surpassed the standards. We have all of a sudden created some ridiculous low bar so that other players can win footballs top awards and I find it ridiculous."
If any other player in world football had had the season Messi just had (bar Ronaldo) they would have been by far and away the favourite for the award.
But because it's one of the two it's just expected of them and taken for granted.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why when Salah was not considered for pfa player of the year last year liverpool fans queried it when u saw that he was joint top goal scorer. But I recall most opposition fans were I a agreement he should not been in the reckoning even though he had similar stats to sterling.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Last season Salah was not the best in the league. I'm not sure where you heard Liverpool fans saying otherwise. The season before last, without a doubt.
posted on 25/9/19
Interesting read, this thread.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is an outrageous comment, though.
I have no objection to VVD being recognised for his outstanding contribution but ultimately you have to accept a different criteria to make that happen.
What VVD does on a football pitch is not remotely comparable to what Messi does.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 minute ago
Interesting read, this thread.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is an outrageous comment, though.
I have no objection to VVD being recognised for his outstanding contribution but ultimately you have to accept a different criteria to make that happen.
What VVD does on a football pitch is not remotely comparable to what Messi does.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nonsense. Not comparable in the specifics of what they do, obviously but comparable in terms of influence on games, on the pitch.
So in your opinion, what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season? Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
There's nothing a defender can do to be compared to what Messi or Ronaldo has done.
That's the nature of the game.
"Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?"
I said the exact opposite - perhaps you should learn to read.
Your initial comment was laughable.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
There's nothing a defender can do to be compared to what Messi or Ronaldo has done.
That's the nature of the game.
"Does it simply mean that attackers should win it every season, no matter ho good a defender has been?"
I said the exact opposite - perhaps you should learn to read.
Your initial comment was laughable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So influence on the team and their results cannot be compared? Nonsense.
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
Where did I say that?
You do indeed talk nonsense - largely because it appears you can't read.
posted on 25/9/19
Fans of team like player from team
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
Where did I say that?
You do indeed talk nonsense - largely because it appears you can't read.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You said it is laughable to make a comparison and yet you accept that you can, at the least, compare their influence on the team.
Lauagable indeed. Make up your mind.
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You're changing the debate.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is not the same as comparison one specific element, such as influence on the team.
Standard TOOR behaviour to be honest.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You're changing the debate.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
That is not the same as comparison one specific element, such as influence on the team.
Standard TOOR behaviour to be honest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is exactly what I was stated. VVD's influence on the team and results was comparable with Messi's. Obviously I can not compare them in terms of goals and assists, which was also the earlier point I made before you came in like a bull in a china shop.
Standard Winston behaviour, to be honest. Try reading what was actually said, for a change.
Nobody can or would say that VVD compared with Messi's goals and assists, he's a defender! What I asked people is what would VVD have to do to compare with an attacker. I stated what I believe he did to compare.
Read the thread.
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
I quoted you TOOR, there's no point in re-writing it.
"what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season?"
Both the initial comment and this one is laughable imo.
Completely different players, completely different effects on the game and judged completely differently. Name the best players ever and how many defenders come to mind?
The fact is that Messi will always be a better player than VVD.
The only way you can make a case for VVD to win an award is, as you say, considering specific criteria like influence on the team he is in.
I've read the thread and part way through I laughed at your comment because it is stupid. I have explained why.
Hope this helps.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 20 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
I quoted you TOOR, there's no point in re-writing it.
"what does a defender have to do to compare to what Messi did last season?"
Both the initial comment and this one is laughable imo.
Completely different players, completely different effects on the game and judged completely differently. Name the best players ever and how many defenders come to mind?
The fact is that Messi will always be a better player than VVD.
The only way you can make a case for VVD to win an award is, as you say, considering specific criteria like influence on the team he is in.
I've read the thread and part way through I laughed at your comment because it is stupid. I have explained why.
Hope this helps.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, I agree with all that, I never stated anything different. You just failed to read the thread and therefore picked out a specific comment without the context that came before it.
Read the thread.
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You'll deny anything.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
I'm saying this is horsesheite.
Sure, you can take one thing like influence and compare it - but you can't make an overall comparison... it's nonsense, because Messi is a much better player who does a lot more on a football pitch than VVD.
The sentence above actually made me laugh aloud.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 6 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
You'll deny anything.
Here's what you said:
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
I'm saying this is horsesheite.
Sure, you can take one thing like influence and compare it - but you can't make an overall comparison... it's nonsense, because Messi is a much better player who does a lot more on a football pitch than VVD.
The sentence above actually made me laugh aloud.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Read the thread. That's all I'm going to say on this matter going forward as it's pointless otherwise.
posted on 25/9/19
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 2 hours, 15 minutes ago
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sigh.
posted on 25/9/19
"Like since when is 50 goals, 20 assists and CL top scorer considered a small achievement"
It isn't but how do you judge a defender against that? What do they have to do to rival that as a defender?
Which is fair enough. I didn't watch a lot of Messi but his stats say he was one of the best in the world again. I watched a lot of VVD and I say he was one of the best in the world. I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker. He also scored goals, assisted them, was a huge calming influence on the side and built attacks from the back. So for me he was over and above normal defensive work, which he also did outstandingly well.
----------------------------------------------
I've helped you out as you're clearly struggling.
Above is when I asked what people thought a defender had to do to compare against goals and assists. I then went on to explain what I felt VVD as a defender that compared to what Messi did as an attacker, which included his influence on the side.
So what I'm saying is VVD's influence on the side(in was a much as Messi's influence and VVD's influence was on a side that achieved 97 league points and a CL trophy. For me that means VVD was a better player over the past year. It's impossible to compare a defender against the goals and assists of an attacker, just like you can't compare an attacker in terms of blocks, clearances, tackles, take-ons etc. However what you can compare is their influence on the team. This is what I said.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 2 hours, 15 minutes ago
I've read it.
Your comment is laughable and you know it, which is why you're not trying to defend it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sigh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Another non-response.. classic TOOR.
posted on 25/9/19
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face.
In the post above, you start by asking a fair question but then you ruin it when you try to answer it.
"I'd say what he did as a defender is comparable to what Messi did as an attacker."
Dress it up as you like, this is nonsense.
That comparison that you have just tried to make is one of the most ridiculous things I've read on here, which is saying something.
posted on 25/9/19
"comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face"
Wow. I'm out.
posted on 25/9/19
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 minute ago
"comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 8 minutes ago
There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
No - you're now lying to try and save face"
Wow. I'm out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course you are. You can't defend your comment and you can't admit you're wrong, so you need to leave.
Standard TOOR.
Page 2 of 2