Comment deleted by Site Moderator
The idea that this would take away the controversy of marginal decisions is what gets me.
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
There will always be tiny margins involved.
So not so sure this will make it that much different.
I actually agree with him
Not going far enough that
There will still be cases of marginal decisions that have to be scrutinised like they are now. But I guess you could say that those would be much more infrequent than the clear decisions should the rules be changed.
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 9 minutes ago
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats would just make it harder for the lineman surely? Not just having to decide if the palyer was offside, but if the part of his body be touches the ball with is offside.
Too many layers. Just leave it as is. Any part of head body legs, feet ahead of the last defender...offside. Easy.
unless everyone in the stadium can see the player is offside then it's probably close enough that the striker gained no advantage, so just leave it to a crowd vote
What ever the rules are it’s always going to be millimetres in it.
So who get to a stage where do you want the attackers to have more of a chance or the defenders
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by CutMeAndIBleedRed (U7593)
posted 5 minutes ago
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't like that.
The subjective rulings in football are already difficult enough for a ref. Taking away one the the clear black and white calls would just add to confusion and inconsistency.
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 9 minutes ago
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats would just make it harder for the lineman surely? Not just having to decide if the palyer was offside, but if the part of his body be touches the ball with is offside.
Too many layers. Just leave it as is. Any part of head body legs, feet ahead of the last defender...offside. Easy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry should have been clearer, I meant in the event it went to VAR that's what they should do.
I'm OK with the rule at the moment tbh.
The only change I would probably be comfortable with would be making only the position of the feet determine what is offside or not.
Still leaves decisions being judged by millimeters, but that won't go away no matter how the rule is being implemented.
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 40 minutes ago
comment by CutMeAndIBleedRed (U7593)
posted 5 minutes ago
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't like that.
The subjective rulings in football are already difficult enough for a ref. Taking away one the the clear black and white calls would just add to confusion and inconsistency.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's one of the complaints though, is that too much human choice is being taken out of the game. And as discussed - off side isn't clear black and white. The exact point a ball leaves a players foot in conjunction with the exact frame and pixel the player is when this happens leaves way to much open to error.
If you go back and look at all the contentious VAR offside decisions, the gain an advantage question clears 99.9% easily.
Haven't read the thread but agree with the OP, struggling to understand how this is any different.
The problem is that in ridding the game of obvious offside errors, we've gone down the road of looking for perfection for a part of the game that simply didn't need it.
Who the fack cares if a toe is ahead of the last defender?
It has spoilt the game and there's no way back now.
Wenger didnt suggest at all there has to be daylight between the players
comment by Holland's big brother Europe (U1250)
posted 10 minutes ago
Wenger didnt suggest at all there has to be daylight between the players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
His suggestion implies it.
Is there a difference between the idea of daylight between the last defender and the attacker, versus any body part being in live with the last defender?
No there isn't. The idea of 'daylight' means all of your body ahead of the last defender.
Its perfect how it is now. There has to be a line.
Attackers need to be that bit more clever.
Liverpool play it to perfection, thats why theyve the high line that pundits were questioning at start of season.
"There has to be a line."
There really doesn't.
comment by Coutinho's Merkin (U22212)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 3 minutes ago
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It works both ways. You’re either a millimetre on or a millimetre off. VAR was introduced to give us the correct decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not disputing that...this other version however gives the attacker the advantage whereby the defender currently gets it...which isn't good for the game as a spectator sport
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Coutinho's Merkin (U22212)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 3 minutes ago
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It works both ways. You’re either a millimetre on or a millimetre off. VAR was introduced to give us the correct decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not disputing that...this other version however gives the attacker the advantage whereby the defender currently gets it...which isn't good for the game as a spectator sport
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I love a well drilled back line.
Liverpool's offside trap from free kicks is a work of art.
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Wenger's Rubbish Idea
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posted on 19/2/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 19/2/20
The idea that this would take away the controversy of marginal decisions is what gets me.
posted on 19/2/20
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
posted on 19/2/20
There will always be tiny margins involved.
So not so sure this will make it that much different.
posted on 19/2/20
I actually agree with him
posted on 19/2/20
Not going far enough that
posted on 19/2/20
There will still be cases of marginal decisions that have to be scrutinised like they are now. But I guess you could say that those would be much more infrequent than the clear decisions should the rules be changed.
posted on 19/2/20
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 9 minutes ago
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats would just make it harder for the lineman surely? Not just having to decide if the palyer was offside, but if the part of his body be touches the ball with is offside.
Too many layers. Just leave it as is. Any part of head body legs, feet ahead of the last defender...offside. Easy.
posted on 19/2/20
unless everyone in the stadium can see the player is offside then it's probably close enough that the striker gained no advantage, so just leave it to a crowd vote
posted on 19/2/20
What ever the rules are it’s always going to be millimetres in it.
So who get to a stage where do you want the attackers to have more of a chance or the defenders
posted on 19/2/20
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
posted on 19/2/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 19/2/20
comment by CutMeAndIBleedRed (U7593)
posted 5 minutes ago
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't like that.
The subjective rulings in football are already difficult enough for a ref. Taking away one the the clear black and white calls would just add to confusion and inconsistency.
posted on 19/2/20
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
posted on 19/2/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 19/2/20
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 47 minutes ago
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 9 minutes ago
I don't get why they don't simply make it whichever body part that touches the ball has to be onside regardless of the rest of your body.
Take the Firmino goal against Villa. His armpit was supposedly offside but his right foot was onside by a good yard and that's what he scored with.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats would just make it harder for the lineman surely? Not just having to decide if the palyer was offside, but if the part of his body be touches the ball with is offside.
Too many layers. Just leave it as is. Any part of head body legs, feet ahead of the last defender...offside. Easy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry should have been clearer, I meant in the event it went to VAR that's what they should do.
posted on 19/2/20
I'm OK with the rule at the moment tbh.
The only change I would probably be comfortable with would be making only the position of the feet determine what is offside or not.
Still leaves decisions being judged by millimeters, but that won't go away no matter how the rule is being implemented.
posted on 19/2/20
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 40 minutes ago
comment by CutMeAndIBleedRed (U7593)
posted 5 minutes ago
Everyone always forgets the purpose of the offside rule - so stop goal hanging. Is a toe offside goal hanging? The key is the phrase 'gain an advantage'
There is always going to be a degree of accuracy, so instead of judging millimeters, why dont refs judge whether a players gains an advantage - that way, the spirit of the rule remains and the the judgement of a human is still paramount.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't like that.
The subjective rulings in football are already difficult enough for a ref. Taking away one the the clear black and white calls would just add to confusion and inconsistency.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's one of the complaints though, is that too much human choice is being taken out of the game. And as discussed - off side isn't clear black and white. The exact point a ball leaves a players foot in conjunction with the exact frame and pixel the player is when this happens leaves way to much open to error.
If you go back and look at all the contentious VAR offside decisions, the gain an advantage question clears 99.9% easily.
posted on 19/2/20
Haven't read the thread but agree with the OP, struggling to understand how this is any different.
The problem is that in ridding the game of obvious offside errors, we've gone down the road of looking for perfection for a part of the game that simply didn't need it.
Who the fack cares if a toe is ahead of the last defender?
It has spoilt the game and there's no way back now.
posted on 19/2/20
Wenger didnt suggest at all there has to be daylight between the players
posted on 19/2/20
comment by Holland's big brother Europe (U1250)
posted 10 minutes ago
Wenger didnt suggest at all there has to be daylight between the players
----------------------------------------------------------------------
His suggestion implies it.
Is there a difference between the idea of daylight between the last defender and the attacker, versus any body part being in live with the last defender?
No there isn't. The idea of 'daylight' means all of your body ahead of the last defender.
posted on 19/2/20
Its perfect how it is now. There has to be a line.
Attackers need to be that bit more clever.
Liverpool play it to perfection, thats why theyve the high line that pundits were questioning at start of season.
posted on 19/2/20
"There has to be a line."
There really doesn't.
posted on 19/2/20
comment by Coutinho's Merkin (U22212)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 3 minutes ago
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It works both ways. You’re either a millimetre on or a millimetre off. VAR was introduced to give us the correct decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not disputing that...this other version however gives the attacker the advantage whereby the defender currently gets it...which isn't good for the game as a spectator sport
posted on 19/2/20
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Coutinho's Merkin (U22212)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 3 minutes ago
I think the general point is that the advantage will be given more to the attacking player...which has to be a good thing... currently it's farcical giving the defence a huge advantage whereby someone can have a shoulder/toe offside and not the rest of thier body
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It works both ways. You’re either a millimetre on or a millimetre off. VAR was introduced to give us the correct decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not disputing that...this other version however gives the attacker the advantage whereby the defender currently gets it...which isn't good for the game as a spectator sport
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I love a well drilled back line.
Liverpool's offside trap from free kicks is a work of art.
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6 | 7