Forgot to say one was innocent of any crime right until the time the jury foreman said guilty and the other is still innocent as died before he went to court.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing to do with the police re OJ and Jackson and more to do with having enough money(privilege) to buy the best defence teams possible to get the verdict that money can buy.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing to do with the police re OJ and Jackson and more to do with having enough money(privilege) to buy the best defence teams possible to get the verdict that money can buy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That’s why it’s widely thought police and prosecutors fooked up in both cases.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 second ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You sent a link re sexcrimestats which proves that being black you are twice as likely to commit rape than a white person.
Never mentioned ever that more whites die from police shootings than Blacks,but I take it that stat is also true then as you have not denied it.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 50 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 second ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You sent a link re sexcrimestats which proves that being black you are twice as likely to commit rape than a white person.
Never mentioned ever that more whites die from police shootings than Blacks,but I take it that stat is also true then as you have not denied it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okkk then, if that’s what you believe. I’d love to see you punt that stat about without looking like a racist
Again we’ve gone off on an extreme tangent based on you vociferously defending the police. Unless you think they don’t deserve criticism in how they’ve handled everything both of us have highlighted?
Going back to the topic. Two law abiding citizens are unhappy with the way they were treated whilst going about their business with the family. You, in your expert opinion, think their complaint is invalid. Must be all the racial profiling you’ve experienced
All the while you’re jumping to the defence of a police force you’ve just spent ages discrediting with your own references
Okkk then, if that’s what you believe. I’d love to see you punt that stat about without looking like a racist
Again we’ve gone off on an extreme tangent based on you vociferously defending the police. Unless you think they don’t deserve criticism in how they’ve handled everything both of us have highlighted?
Going back to the topic. Two law abiding citizens are unhappy with the way they were treated whilst going about their business with the family. You, in your expert opinion, think their complaint is invalid. Must be all the racial profiling you’ve experienced
All the while you’re jumping to the defence of a police force you’ve just spent ages discrediting with your own references
----------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be reading things I've never typed.
I will say this for about the 5th time on this thread that until all the evidence is out in the open(hopefully video evidence that can't be disputed) then I am not going to support or chastise those in the car nor the police.
You on the other hand have already said you believe everything that those in the car have said as why would they lie and have said the police have previous in distorting facts evidence and racially profile people.
Do you know those in the car personally and do you know the actual police persons who pulled the car over personally? If not then your opinions of them have as much validity than mine.
Bring up anything I've typed on here that says their complaint is invalid and also bring up where I've typed that I am supporting the police in this matter.
I look forward to your reply and please don't do the old trick of taking a snippet out of context.Show me where I am in support of the police in this particular case.
Oh and can you please refrain from your snide comments trying to profile me as a racist.If you cannot keep it civil I'll just leave you to it
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 38 seconds ago
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So that's enough evidence for me to say there's nothing there to back up your claim.No surprise really because I know what I have said all along.
I will leave you to your own devices as you have really contributed very little to this debate.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 38 seconds ago
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So that's enough evidence for me to say there's nothing there to back up your claim.No surprise really because I know what I have said all along.
I will leave you to your own devices as you have really contributed very little to this debate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’ve backed up what I’ve said hours ago. Not doing it again just because you can’t read
I’ve gone off actual information where as you’ve gone off ‘what if they’re lying’ and fook all else.
How chuffed were you when you thought you’d stumbled across the blackrapist stat
Fook sake lad the state of you
i know i don't have to read it but there seems to be way too many articles non football related.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
-----
Were the crimes of Bill Cosby swept under the carpet for decades?
By whom?
OP, why exactly is this concerning? What negative developments could come about as a result of this? Personally I don't see any cause for concern. The police made a mistake and harrased an innocent couple with their baby and did the right thing in apologising.
Police will make mistakes and its helps their relations with the general public if they can deal with these things honestly. The relationship between the police and the policed is paramount and this kind of honesty will not have the effect you fear it will have. More likely the opposite as it can build trust.
When the police make a mistake, which is bound to happen, do you prefer they dig their heels?
comment by KingKenny (U1961)
posted 7 hours, 42 minutes ago
Hard to comment on individual cases. But you are right about the risks of going too far the other way in an attempt to hit certain PC objectives.
Ultimately the unfortunate fact is that being black makes it more likely that you are poor and therefore more likely that you commit crime so police bias is actually justified. Sort that problem out and you can then think about looking at the police side of things.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The couple was driving a Mercedes and you think it's about financial status?
If that was correct then the fact that they were driving a Mercedes likely means they're not poor and should not have been stopped, no?
Poor people don't drive Mercedes very often so why are people of colour targeted even when driving rich people cars? IMO, the evidence suggests its not just about being poor.
comment by morespurs (U15748)
posted 18 hours, 16 minutes ago
Do beat cops now have to avoid certain people who they feel need to be stopped /spoken to
=========
Police must not be heavy handed with certain members of the community and Not so with others? Police must apply the law equally! If all you see is black youths being stopped you must ask yourself why?
Crime is colourless and yet as soon as the Police see a coloured person driving a nice car, they feel the urge to stop the driver? And they don’t just stop the driver on false pretexts like oh we had reports of some fitting your description up to no goo but in some cases, they are down right condescending and rude.
I have experienced this myself with a mate shoeing me his new car but all we did was go around the area once and the police turned up? Yes you can guess he is black! The excuses bu the police was laughable. The only reason nothing came off of this is because I took my phone out and started recording it!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
At the risk of sounding flippant, I reckon they might just have wanted to get a closer look at the legendary morespurs
More seriously though, have any of you read about the case of Elijah McClain?
I am the type of person who tries to see things from different perspectives rather than rush to conclusions. There is no baseless speculation in what comes below and no twisting of any known facts.
This young man's death might or might not have been as a direct result of the police intervention; it seems at least just as likely that it was partly induced by the ketamine overdose he was administered by the paramedics. But the description of the events and of the 23-year-old himself illustrate for me what an SHOCKINGLY OVER-POLICED system and societal racism are all about.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elijah_McClain
So 'sketchy behaviour' is wearing ski goggles on 25th February in Denver, and walking down the street 'flailing your arms' while wearing EARPHONES?
The phone operator regards it as sketchy enough to dispatch a 3-man patrol? Maybe she is just following protocol.
Hopefully, however, as you read through, and even if you're old and white like me, you'll start to ask yourself what kind of fecking protocol establishes and endorses the measures taken in this case.
So, the patrol drives around and considers it is indeed sketchy enough to not just drive past and say "nothing to see here", but get out and approach the man?
Or, again, perhaps this is just following protocol. In which case... I hope you are getting this by now.
Regardless of conflicting accounts of how the scuffle broke out, all three officers' body cams fall off, despite audio recording one of the officers telling another to take it off?
- I doubt protocol includes taking body cameras off. But, if it does...
The man allegedly reached for one of the officer's guns, although in the audio recording the officer in question is heard saying he does not recall such a thing happening.
The man is held down, handcuffed with his arms behind his back and kept in a chokehold for 15 minutes. He repeatedly vomits, for which he apologises, saying: "I'm sorry, I wasn’t trying to do that, I can't breathe correctly"
Despite this, upon the arrival of a team of paramedics, he is considered to be in a state of "excited delirium" (*) and requires a shot of ketamine to calm him. See below.
He is then judged to weigh "around 200 pounds". He is actually 5ft 6in/167.5cm tall and weighs 140 lb. He is administered a dose of ketamine for someone almost twice his size, because ... protocol?
(*) Excited delirium is not recognized by professional medical associations. No reputable medical organization — not the American Medical Association nor the American Psychological Association — recognize excited delirium as a medical or mental-health condition. (Wikipedia)
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I felt uncomfrotable watching that Bianca WIlliams footage.
Firstly the Police seems a bit full on BUT if it is correct that the car had previously been asked to stop and then drove away, then to ramp up the response when they finally catch up with it is normal and logical, especially as the police were in that area in response to increased amounts of violence that had been taking place.
I found the drivers response to being asked to get out - Why? what have i done? - to be unnecessary. He should just comply. I found BWs response to her boy friend being led away to be hysterical and OTT. She then puts the police in a difficult position in how to deal with her as she gets out of the car, screaming and shouting and filiming it.
If you read some of her comments she says things like, "the police dragged my boyfriend from the car". This is blatantly incorrect, and IMO undermines her version of events as she also said things like, the police spoke to him like he was nothing and his life didnt matter. Very very emotive language in light of the BLM 'slogan' and you question how accurate this is given her other exaggeration(s).
For her to splash this over the media, undertaken inetrviews and call in the LBC Radio, i find to be incredibly poor judgement.
I take the police statement that the car had previously not stopped and driven away, driving suspiciously and on the wrong side of the road on face value and see no issue with their response if this is all true. If it is not, then you really have to question why they stopped the car and why they handcuffed them and searched it. The racial profiling and other accusations then have real grounds. Nonetheless, i also think all parties need to act responsibily. While the police have rightly investigated their actions, the occupants of the car must also. The driver questioning the police and then BWs hysterical response makes the situation 1000% times worse. If they had simply complied in a cooperative way this would be less of an issue and if they felt aggrieved they could then make their formal complaint. Their attitude and subsequent rush to the media was very poor IMO and irresponsible.
I am fully behind the BLM campaign and while i am no racist I understand i can (& i have) increase my knowledge and understanding. However, behaviour like this from BW massively undermines this process and is counter productive IMO.
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 1 hour, 45 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 26 minutes ago
More seriously though, have any of you read about the case of Elijah McClain?
I am the type of person who tries to see things from different perspectives rather than rush to conclusions. There is no baseless speculation in what comes below and no twisting of any known facts.
This young man's death might or might not have been as a direct result of the police intervention; it seems at least just as likely that it was partly induced by the ketamine overdose he was administered by the paramedics. But the description of the events and of the 23-year-old himself illustrate for me what an SHOCKINGLY OVER-POLICED system and societal racism are all about.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elijah_McClain
So 'sketchy behaviour' is wearing ski goggles on 25th February in Denver, and walking down the street 'flailing your arms' while wearing EARPHONES?
The phone operator regards it as sketchy enough to dispatch a 3-man patrol? Maybe she is just following protocol.
Hopefully, however, as you read through, and even if you're old and white like me, you'll start to ask yourself what kind of fecking protocol establishes and endorses the measures taken in this case.
So, the patrol drives around and considers it is indeed sketchy enough to not just drive past and say "nothing to see here", but get out and approach the man?
Or, again, perhaps this is just following protocol. In which case... I hope you are getting this by now.
Regardless of conflicting accounts of how the scuffle broke out, all three officers' body cams fall off, despite audio recording one of the officers telling another to take it off?
- I doubt protocol includes taking body cameras off. But, if it does...
The man allegedly reached for one of the officer's guns, although in the audio recording the officer in question is heard saying he does not recall such a thing happening.
The man is held down, handcuffed with his arms behind his back and kept in a chokehold for 15 minutes. He repeatedly vomits, for which he apologises, saying: "I'm sorry, I wasn’t trying to do that, I can't breathe correctly"
Despite this, upon the arrival of a team of paramedics, he is considered to be in a state of "excited delirium" (*) and requires a shot of ketamine to calm him. See below.
He is then judged to weigh "around 200 pounds". He is actually 5ft 6in/167.5cm tall and weighs 140 lb. He is administered a dose of ketamine for someone almost twice his size, because ... protocol?
(*) Excited delirium is not recognized by professional medical associations. No reputable medical organization — not the American Medical Association nor the American Psychological Association — recognize excited delirium as a medical or mental-health condition. (Wikipedia)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This was definitely a tragedy that should not have happened. However, it was in August not February and wearing a ski mask and having flailing arms isn't normal behaviour. Not enough to warrant arrest, sure, but possibly worth investigating.
As for the dose of ketamine, I have no idea why that we administrated, but I'm not a medical professional. But surely that can't be on the police?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://youtu.be/1hNxC6VT20A
This is the same officer involved in that shooting.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Sign in if you want to comment
Is Bianca Williams now above the law ?
Page 4 of 22
6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10
posted on 8/7/20
Forgot to say one was innocent of any crime right until the time the jury foreman said guilty and the other is still innocent as died before he went to court.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
posted on 8/7/20
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing to do with the police re OJ and Jackson and more to do with having enough money(privilege) to buy the best defence teams possible to get the verdict that money can buy.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 39 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 27 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 49 seconds ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 second ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
That’s what innocent until proven guilty is you loon.
Going back to your laughable Jimmy Saville post earlier.
You do realise that he was never taken to court and obviously was never convicted for what he did.
Does that make him innocent? He would have been innocent of his crimes until proven guilty in court,but does that mean he didn't do the crime until the courts said he did it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and it was a scandal across police, media & politics that’s disgusting. Excellent example of scepticism towards police and how they approach crimes by people of different races.
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Any more examples?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
High profile celebrity who committed horrible crimes over decades and everyone who knew about it kept shut.Did work for charities to keep up the persona of being a decent human being.Victims being ignored time and time again until they couldn't any more and by that time the damage was well and truly done and the criminals involved were into their 70's 80's.I think that is a good comparison don't you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There’s been plenty more examples of positions of power being used to exploit peoplesexually. When you look at it by race though it makes disturbing reading.
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
Added to recent high profile cases of powerful, white, men being given lenient sentences to go on and commit further crimes, Epstein and what’s yet to come out, or not, there.
Further reason to be sceptical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was going to mention OJ Simpson and Michael Jackson,but both were proven innocent of despicable crimes in the eyes of the law.
They didn't even get lenient sentences,they got found innocent.I'm not sceptical at all at the verdicts as they seemed to be straight up genuinely lovely people who you would trust living next door to a school or their ex wives.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be new to the concept of miscarriages of justice. Maybe taking the police at their word, because they’re the police and you can trust them, was misguided.
I’m giving you examples of police misconduct, corruption and incompetence. You’re doing the same
I’m still yet to see in what way you’d say ‘well the police said they were doing it so....’ in the Williams case when you’ve just spent an half an hour joining me in highlighting the police fooking things up in high profile cases.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing to do with the police re OJ and Jackson and more to do with having enough money(privilege) to buy the best defence teams possible to get the verdict that money can buy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That’s why it’s widely thought police and prosecutors fooked up in both cases.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
posted on 8/7/20
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 second ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You sent a link re sexcrimestats which proves that being black you are twice as likely to commit rape than a white person.
Never mentioned ever that more whites die from police shootings than Blacks,but I take it that stat is also true then as you have not denied it.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 50 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 second ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
https://www.rainn.org/statistics/perpetrators-sexual-violence
60% of pop of USA are white,57% of rape in USA are by white people,which is no surprise.
13% of pop of USA are black and yet 27% of rapes are by blacks(that's double).
Thanks for highlighting that bein black in the USA means you are twice as likely to be a rappist than a white person.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, could’ve sworn you were firmly in the “more white people are killed by police in the US than black people“ camp. Are you disputing this now?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You sent a link re sexcrimestats which proves that being black you are twice as likely to commit rape than a white person.
Never mentioned ever that more whites die from police shootings than Blacks,but I take it that stat is also true then as you have not denied it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Okkk then, if that’s what you believe. I’d love to see you punt that stat about without looking like a racist
Again we’ve gone off on an extreme tangent based on you vociferously defending the police. Unless you think they don’t deserve criticism in how they’ve handled everything both of us have highlighted?
Going back to the topic. Two law abiding citizens are unhappy with the way they were treated whilst going about their business with the family. You, in your expert opinion, think their complaint is invalid. Must be all the racial profiling you’ve experienced
All the while you’re jumping to the defence of a police force you’ve just spent ages discrediting with your own references
posted on 8/7/20
Okkk then, if that’s what you believe. I’d love to see you punt that stat about without looking like a racist
Again we’ve gone off on an extreme tangent based on you vociferously defending the police. Unless you think they don’t deserve criticism in how they’ve handled everything both of us have highlighted?
Going back to the topic. Two law abiding citizens are unhappy with the way they were treated whilst going about their business with the family. You, in your expert opinion, think their complaint is invalid. Must be all the racial profiling you’ve experienced
All the while you’re jumping to the defence of a police force you’ve just spent ages discrediting with your own references
----------------------------------------------------------------
You seem to be reading things I've never typed.
I will say this for about the 5th time on this thread that until all the evidence is out in the open(hopefully video evidence that can't be disputed) then I am not going to support or chastise those in the car nor the police.
You on the other hand have already said you believe everything that those in the car have said as why would they lie and have said the police have previous in distorting facts evidence and racially profile people.
Do you know those in the car personally and do you know the actual police persons who pulled the car over personally? If not then your opinions of them have as much validity than mine.
Bring up anything I've typed on here that says their complaint is invalid and also bring up where I've typed that I am supporting the police in this matter.
I look forward to your reply and please don't do the old trick of taking a snippet out of context.Show me where I am in support of the police in this particular case.
posted on 8/7/20
Oh and can you please refrain from your snide comments trying to profile me as a racist.If you cannot keep it civil I'll just leave you to it
posted on 8/7/20
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 38 seconds ago
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So that's enough evidence for me to say there's nothing there to back up your claim.No surprise really because I know what I have said all along.
I will leave you to your own devices as you have really contributed very little to this debate.
posted on 8/7/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 38 seconds ago
Colemansballs
I’m not spending more time rearguing what you’ve been debating the last few hours. The amount of argument you’ve put against them you’d do well working for the CPS if it goes to trail
Stop crying about snide digs. You’ve been making them yourself for ages yourself. Grow a pair or ask Coleman to lend you some.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So that's enough evidence for me to say there's nothing there to back up your claim.No surprise really because I know what I have said all along.
I will leave you to your own devices as you have really contributed very little to this debate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’ve backed up what I’ve said hours ago. Not doing it again just because you can’t read
I’ve gone off actual information where as you’ve gone off ‘what if they’re lying’ and fook all else.
How chuffed were you when you thought you’d stumbled across the blackrapist stat
Fook sake lad the state of you
posted on 8/7/20
i know i don't have to read it but there seems to be way too many articles non football related.
posted on 8/7/20
The prolific crimes of a white man went conveniently ignored and swept under the carpet for decades. Not just by the police but still.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit like Bill Cosby in the States apart from the ethnicity that is
-----
Were the crimes of Bill Cosby swept under the carpet for decades?
By whom?
posted on 8/7/20
OP, why exactly is this concerning? What negative developments could come about as a result of this? Personally I don't see any cause for concern. The police made a mistake and harrased an innocent couple with their baby and did the right thing in apologising.
Police will make mistakes and its helps their relations with the general public if they can deal with these things honestly. The relationship between the police and the policed is paramount and this kind of honesty will not have the effect you fear it will have. More likely the opposite as it can build trust.
When the police make a mistake, which is bound to happen, do you prefer they dig their heels?
posted on 8/7/20
comment by KingKenny (U1961)
posted 7 hours, 42 minutes ago
Hard to comment on individual cases. But you are right about the risks of going too far the other way in an attempt to hit certain PC objectives.
Ultimately the unfortunate fact is that being black makes it more likely that you are poor and therefore more likely that you commit crime so police bias is actually justified. Sort that problem out and you can then think about looking at the police side of things.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The couple was driving a Mercedes and you think it's about financial status?
If that was correct then the fact that they were driving a Mercedes likely means they're not poor and should not have been stopped, no?
Poor people don't drive Mercedes very often so why are people of colour targeted even when driving rich people cars? IMO, the evidence suggests its not just about being poor.
posted on 9/7/20
comment by morespurs (U15748)
posted 18 hours, 16 minutes ago
Do beat cops now have to avoid certain people who they feel need to be stopped /spoken to
=========
Police must not be heavy handed with certain members of the community and Not so with others? Police must apply the law equally! If all you see is black youths being stopped you must ask yourself why?
Crime is colourless and yet as soon as the Police see a coloured person driving a nice car, they feel the urge to stop the driver? And they don’t just stop the driver on false pretexts like oh we had reports of some fitting your description up to no goo but in some cases, they are down right condescending and rude.
I have experienced this myself with a mate shoeing me his new car but all we did was go around the area once and the police turned up? Yes you can guess he is black! The excuses bu the police was laughable. The only reason nothing came off of this is because I took my phone out and started recording it!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
At the risk of sounding flippant, I reckon they might just have wanted to get a closer look at the legendary morespurs
posted on 9/7/20
More seriously though, have any of you read about the case of Elijah McClain?
I am the type of person who tries to see things from different perspectives rather than rush to conclusions. There is no baseless speculation in what comes below and no twisting of any known facts.
This young man's death might or might not have been as a direct result of the police intervention; it seems at least just as likely that it was partly induced by the ketamine overdose he was administered by the paramedics. But the description of the events and of the 23-year-old himself illustrate for me what an SHOCKINGLY OVER-POLICED system and societal racism are all about.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elijah_McClain
So 'sketchy behaviour' is wearing ski goggles on 25th February in Denver, and walking down the street 'flailing your arms' while wearing EARPHONES?
The phone operator regards it as sketchy enough to dispatch a 3-man patrol? Maybe she is just following protocol.
Hopefully, however, as you read through, and even if you're old and white like me, you'll start to ask yourself what kind of fecking protocol establishes and endorses the measures taken in this case.
So, the patrol drives around and considers it is indeed sketchy enough to not just drive past and say "nothing to see here", but get out and approach the man?
Or, again, perhaps this is just following protocol. In which case... I hope you are getting this by now.
Regardless of conflicting accounts of how the scuffle broke out, all three officers' body cams fall off, despite audio recording one of the officers telling another to take it off?
- I doubt protocol includes taking body cameras off. But, if it does...
The man allegedly reached for one of the officer's guns, although in the audio recording the officer in question is heard saying he does not recall such a thing happening.
The man is held down, handcuffed with his arms behind his back and kept in a chokehold for 15 minutes. He repeatedly vomits, for which he apologises, saying: "I'm sorry, I wasn’t trying to do that, I can't breathe correctly"
Despite this, upon the arrival of a team of paramedics, he is considered to be in a state of "excited delirium" (*) and requires a shot of ketamine to calm him. See below.
He is then judged to weigh "around 200 pounds". He is actually 5ft 6in/167.5cm tall and weighs 140 lb. He is administered a dose of ketamine for someone almost twice his size, because ... protocol?
(*) Excited delirium is not recognized by professional medical associations. No reputable medical organization — not the American Medical Association nor the American Psychological Association — recognize excited delirium as a medical or mental-health condition. (Wikipedia)
posted on 9/7/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 9/7/20
I felt uncomfrotable watching that Bianca WIlliams footage.
Firstly the Police seems a bit full on BUT if it is correct that the car had previously been asked to stop and then drove away, then to ramp up the response when they finally catch up with it is normal and logical, especially as the police were in that area in response to increased amounts of violence that had been taking place.
I found the drivers response to being asked to get out - Why? what have i done? - to be unnecessary. He should just comply. I found BWs response to her boy friend being led away to be hysterical and OTT. She then puts the police in a difficult position in how to deal with her as she gets out of the car, screaming and shouting and filiming it.
If you read some of her comments she says things like, "the police dragged my boyfriend from the car". This is blatantly incorrect, and IMO undermines her version of events as she also said things like, the police spoke to him like he was nothing and his life didnt matter. Very very emotive language in light of the BLM 'slogan' and you question how accurate this is given her other exaggeration(s).
For her to splash this over the media, undertaken inetrviews and call in the LBC Radio, i find to be incredibly poor judgement.
I take the police statement that the car had previously not stopped and driven away, driving suspiciously and on the wrong side of the road on face value and see no issue with their response if this is all true. If it is not, then you really have to question why they stopped the car and why they handcuffed them and searched it. The racial profiling and other accusations then have real grounds. Nonetheless, i also think all parties need to act responsibily. While the police have rightly investigated their actions, the occupants of the car must also. The driver questioning the police and then BWs hysterical response makes the situation 1000% times worse. If they had simply complied in a cooperative way this would be less of an issue and if they felt aggrieved they could then make their formal complaint. Their attitude and subsequent rush to the media was very poor IMO and irresponsible.
I am fully behind the BLM campaign and while i am no racist I understand i can (& i have) increase my knowledge and understanding. However, behaviour like this from BW massively undermines this process and is counter productive IMO.
posted on 9/7/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 1 hour, 45 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 26 minutes ago
More seriously though, have any of you read about the case of Elijah McClain?
I am the type of person who tries to see things from different perspectives rather than rush to conclusions. There is no baseless speculation in what comes below and no twisting of any known facts.
This young man's death might or might not have been as a direct result of the police intervention; it seems at least just as likely that it was partly induced by the ketamine overdose he was administered by the paramedics. But the description of the events and of the 23-year-old himself illustrate for me what an SHOCKINGLY OVER-POLICED system and societal racism are all about.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elijah_McClain
So 'sketchy behaviour' is wearing ski goggles on 25th February in Denver, and walking down the street 'flailing your arms' while wearing EARPHONES?
The phone operator regards it as sketchy enough to dispatch a 3-man patrol? Maybe she is just following protocol.
Hopefully, however, as you read through, and even if you're old and white like me, you'll start to ask yourself what kind of fecking protocol establishes and endorses the measures taken in this case.
So, the patrol drives around and considers it is indeed sketchy enough to not just drive past and say "nothing to see here", but get out and approach the man?
Or, again, perhaps this is just following protocol. In which case... I hope you are getting this by now.
Regardless of conflicting accounts of how the scuffle broke out, all three officers' body cams fall off, despite audio recording one of the officers telling another to take it off?
- I doubt protocol includes taking body cameras off. But, if it does...
The man allegedly reached for one of the officer's guns, although in the audio recording the officer in question is heard saying he does not recall such a thing happening.
The man is held down, handcuffed with his arms behind his back and kept in a chokehold for 15 minutes. He repeatedly vomits, for which he apologises, saying: "I'm sorry, I wasn’t trying to do that, I can't breathe correctly"
Despite this, upon the arrival of a team of paramedics, he is considered to be in a state of "excited delirium" (*) and requires a shot of ketamine to calm him. See below.
He is then judged to weigh "around 200 pounds". He is actually 5ft 6in/167.5cm tall and weighs 140 lb. He is administered a dose of ketamine for someone almost twice his size, because ... protocol?
(*) Excited delirium is not recognized by professional medical associations. No reputable medical organization — not the American Medical Association nor the American Psychological Association — recognize excited delirium as a medical or mental-health condition. (Wikipedia)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This was definitely a tragedy that should not have happened. However, it was in August not February and wearing a ski mask and having flailing arms isn't normal behaviour. Not enough to warrant arrest, sure, but possibly worth investigating.
As for the dose of ketamine, I have no idea why that we administrated, but I'm not a medical professional. But surely that can't be on the police?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://youtu.be/1hNxC6VT20A
This is the same officer involved in that shooting.
posted on 9/7/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Page 4 of 22
6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10