Don’t know why it’s a loan to buy but this one really screams of “could go either way”. Let’s hope Under Rodgers Cengiz fulfils his potential.
So much punnery potential as well!
I suspect that's the advantage of loan to buy,
If he doesn't make the grade or is home sick or can't cope with the Premier
No bodies out of pocket
And you don't end up with more players hanging around doing nothing and taking big wages for the privilege,,
Nadidi fuchs under Justin 😳
Didn't really watch Roma much last season but he was quality for them during their CL run the year before.
comment by dublin fox optimistically pessimistic, (now a Cambridge fox)(still can not spell fox) (U1131)
posted 14 minutes ago
I suspect that's the advantage of loan to buy,
If he doesn't make the grade or is home sick or can't cope with the Premier
No bodies out of pocket
And you don't end up with more players hanging around doing nothing and taking big wages for the privilege,,
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Depends if it’s an option or obligation to buy. If it’s an option, it’s as you say, if it’s an obligation then it’s to spread the payments to next year’s accounts.
Beware
All hard work with little end product
This feels like a very average signing to me. It’s hard to see how he’s going to be that much better than Gray, except that he may be more comfortable in the position more than Perez. Sounds like he’ll try hard, which is good, but on the other hand Ghezzal tried hard. I can’t see any likely resale value either. Maybe the level of a young Deulofeu.
I hope he can kick on here, but I think he’ll have a job on.
Ünderwhelming...?
“It’s hard to see how he’s going to be that much better than Gray,”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really?
Doesn’t take too much imagination surely
I don’t know Joby.
Can many players really do 4 lollipops and end up in the same place without achieving anything like Gray can?
I think it will be hard to replace that.
Never heard of him. His recent stats aren’t anything to write home about either, but we need a winger. Let’s hope he does the business.
comment by Your Honour (U17603)
posted 19 minutes ago
Never heard of him. His recent stats aren’t anything to write home about either, but we need a winger. Let’s hope he does the business.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
His biggest contribution at Roma, that corner for that goal
https://youtu.be/rZG0DX0U0Bs
Joby - Considering his stats,
Career trajectory,
The trouble some players have adapting to the English game,
The fact he hasn't had any pre-season with us,
and Roma fans' opinions of him (he's stalled in his development, can have the odd great game but mostly not, not overly bothered about him leaving, might be best for him to move somewhere else),
I think suggesting he'll be at all better than Demarai Gray is potentially generous.
It's a shame Nev isn't around to tell us how every new player is brilliant.
He may turn out to be underrated despite Dunge being underwhelmed. But I think Dunge misunderstands our need for a winger, which shouldn’t be underestimated.
He doesn’t have to wear his underpants outside his trousers, but just has to be better than Gray. He may just be under appreciated at Roma.
I’m not going to make any judgement on this one under any circumstances until I’ve seen him play. We have to understand that we’re not going to sign Eden Hazard and be realistic. These are early days under Congerton so we have to give him time before we make judgement.
So I’ll be cautiously optimistic and wait for him to undergo his medical. Once Under is over the line we might be able to get a few more in.
I’m under the impression there’s a theme running through your post Joby.
Think this is one where we just need to wait and see. He may thrive under a new coach, or he may replace Gray like for like. Time will tell.
McNeil suddenly looks appealing though doesn’t he!
comment by Merseysidefox (U4842)
posted 1 hour, 56 minutes ago
I’m under the impression there’s a theme running through your post Joby.
Think this is one where we just need to wait and see. He may thrive under a new coach, or he may replace Gray like for like. Time will tell.
McNeil suddenly looks appealing though doesn’t he!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose the comparison with other targets is understandable, but sometimes it’s who we can actually get. I think it would take big money to get Dyche to put McNeill asunder, So it might just be a case of value operating under the restrictions of the current market.
The way the deal is structured (under a loan and option to buy) might allow us to also sign players in other positions where we’re under staffed. That wouldn’t have happened under circumstances where we’d thrown big money at a Brooks or McNeill signing.
Scoring in the Serie is much more difficult than the premier league as most teams play very deep and compact.
He is a good technical player but should improve his decision making. BR is good with this kind of players.
Brendan did the same with Coutinho who played at Inter at a young age.
comment by The Mane Man - PL CHAMPIONS (U19731)
posted 1 hour, 29 minutes ago
Scoring in the Serie is much more difficult than the premier league as most teams play very deep and compact.
He is a good technical player but should improve his decision making. BR is good with this kind of players.
Brendan did the same with Coutinho who played at Inter at a young age.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Understood
Thanks for the input
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
comment by a foxes voice (U1133)
posted 50 minutes ago
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dunge is playing Devils Advocate in the absence of Nev
I suppose I started the?
With it being a loan deal,,
If we went for a PSG player it wouldn't be a loan 1st
He's not been playing regularly and he has to adjust to Premier league I'm sure if it was £8 million plus add ons we would buy him outright,
Other points raised
For them
It may have something todo with the tax year,,
Gets his wages off the books
For us
If he doesn't make it the only cost is wages
Allows funds from this year to be spent on other targets
Tiis a bit strange but makes good business sense,
comment by True Blue (U9486)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by a foxes voice (U1133)
posted 50 minutes ago
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dunge is playing Devils Advocate in the absence of Nev
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think Dunge is just feeling a bit under the weather
Feeling under the microscope here.
I don't want people to think I'm writing him off. There's always a range of possibilities with players coming in. He could push on and really prove himself, which would be great. It's just that the mid-range of my expectations for this player is someone who's somewhere between the levels of Perez and Gray inclusive. And I'm not sure £25m for another edge-of-starting-11 player with little prospect of sell on value is top value for money.
Sign in if you want to comment
Cenciz loan deal
Page 1 of 2
posted on 16/9/20
Cengiz Under
posted on 16/9/20
Don’t know why it’s a loan to buy but this one really screams of “could go either way”. Let’s hope Under Rodgers Cengiz fulfils his potential.
So much punnery potential as well!
posted on 16/9/20
I suspect that's the advantage of loan to buy,
If he doesn't make the grade or is home sick or can't cope with the Premier
No bodies out of pocket
And you don't end up with more players hanging around doing nothing and taking big wages for the privilege,,
posted on 16/9/20
Nadidi fuchs under Justin 😳
posted on 16/9/20
Didn't really watch Roma much last season but he was quality for them during their CL run the year before.
posted on 16/9/20
*two years ago rather
posted on 16/9/20
comment by dublin fox optimistically pessimistic, (now a Cambridge fox)(still can not spell fox) (U1131)
posted 14 minutes ago
I suspect that's the advantage of loan to buy,
If he doesn't make the grade or is home sick or can't cope with the Premier
No bodies out of pocket
And you don't end up with more players hanging around doing nothing and taking big wages for the privilege,,
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Depends if it’s an option or obligation to buy. If it’s an option, it’s as you say, if it’s an obligation then it’s to spread the payments to next year’s accounts.
posted on 16/9/20
Beware
All hard work with little end product
posted on 16/9/20
This feels like a very average signing to me. It’s hard to see how he’s going to be that much better than Gray, except that he may be more comfortable in the position more than Perez. Sounds like he’ll try hard, which is good, but on the other hand Ghezzal tried hard. I can’t see any likely resale value either. Maybe the level of a young Deulofeu.
I hope he can kick on here, but I think he’ll have a job on.
Ünderwhelming...?
posted on 16/9/20
Underrated Dunge?
posted on 16/9/20
“It’s hard to see how he’s going to be that much better than Gray,”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Really?
Doesn’t take too much imagination surely
posted on 16/9/20
I don’t know Joby.
Can many players really do 4 lollipops and end up in the same place without achieving anything like Gray can?
I think it will be hard to replace that.
posted on 16/9/20
Never heard of him. His recent stats aren’t anything to write home about either, but we need a winger. Let’s hope he does the business.
posted on 16/9/20
comment by Your Honour (U17603)
posted 19 minutes ago
Never heard of him. His recent stats aren’t anything to write home about either, but we need a winger. Let’s hope he does the business.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
His biggest contribution at Roma, that corner for that goal
https://youtu.be/rZG0DX0U0Bs
posted on 16/9/20
Joby - Considering his stats,
Career trajectory,
The trouble some players have adapting to the English game,
The fact he hasn't had any pre-season with us,
and Roma fans' opinions of him (he's stalled in his development, can have the odd great game but mostly not, not overly bothered about him leaving, might be best for him to move somewhere else),
I think suggesting he'll be at all better than Demarai Gray is potentially generous.
It's a shame Nev isn't around to tell us how every new player is brilliant.
posted on 16/9/20
He may turn out to be underrated despite Dunge being underwhelmed. But I think Dunge misunderstands our need for a winger, which shouldn’t be underestimated.
He doesn’t have to wear his underpants outside his trousers, but just has to be better than Gray. He may just be under appreciated at Roma.
I’m not going to make any judgement on this one under any circumstances until I’ve seen him play. We have to understand that we’re not going to sign Eden Hazard and be realistic. These are early days under Congerton so we have to give him time before we make judgement.
So I’ll be cautiously optimistic and wait for him to undergo his medical. Once Under is over the line we might be able to get a few more in.
posted on 17/9/20
I’m under the impression there’s a theme running through your post Joby.
Think this is one where we just need to wait and see. He may thrive under a new coach, or he may replace Gray like for like. Time will tell.
McNeil suddenly looks appealing though doesn’t he!
posted on 17/9/20
comment by Merseysidefox (U4842)
posted 1 hour, 56 minutes ago
I’m under the impression there’s a theme running through your post Joby.
Think this is one where we just need to wait and see. He may thrive under a new coach, or he may replace Gray like for like. Time will tell.
McNeil suddenly looks appealing though doesn’t he!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose the comparison with other targets is understandable, but sometimes it’s who we can actually get. I think it would take big money to get Dyche to put McNeill asunder, So it might just be a case of value operating under the restrictions of the current market.
The way the deal is structured (under a loan and option to buy) might allow us to also sign players in other positions where we’re under staffed. That wouldn’t have happened under circumstances where we’d thrown big money at a Brooks or McNeill signing.
posted on 17/9/20
Scoring in the Serie is much more difficult than the premier league as most teams play very deep and compact.
He is a good technical player but should improve his decision making. BR is good with this kind of players.
Brendan did the same with Coutinho who played at Inter at a young age.
posted on 17/9/20
comment by The Mane Man - PL CHAMPIONS (U19731)
posted 1 hour, 29 minutes ago
Scoring in the Serie is much more difficult than the premier league as most teams play very deep and compact.
He is a good technical player but should improve his decision making. BR is good with this kind of players.
Brendan did the same with Coutinho who played at Inter at a young age.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Understood
Thanks for the input
posted on 17/9/20
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
posted on 17/9/20
comment by a foxes voice (U1133)
posted 50 minutes ago
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dunge is playing Devils Advocate in the absence of Nev
posted on 17/9/20
I suppose I started the?
With it being a loan deal,,
If we went for a PSG player it wouldn't be a loan 1st
He's not been playing regularly and he has to adjust to Premier league I'm sure if it was £8 million plus add ons we would buy him outright,
Other points raised
For them
It may have something todo with the tax year,,
Gets his wages off the books
For us
If he doesn't make it the only cost is wages
Allows funds from this year to be spent on other targets
Tiis a bit strange but makes good business sense,
posted on 17/9/20
comment by True Blue (U9486)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by a foxes voice (U1133)
posted 50 minutes ago
Dunge, I'm surprised at your negative approach on him given you're one of the more measured posters on here. I say we give him every opportunity and support before writing him off.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dunge is playing Devils Advocate in the absence of Nev
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think Dunge is just feeling a bit under the weather
posted on 17/9/20
Feeling under the microscope here.
I don't want people to think I'm writing him off. There's always a range of possibilities with players coming in. He could push on and really prove himself, which would be great. It's just that the mid-range of my expectations for this player is someone who's somewhere between the levels of Perez and Gray inclusive. And I'm not sure £25m for another edge-of-starting-11 player with little prospect of sell on value is top value for money.
Page 1 of 2