They are as bad as each other in their own ways
Saying Lindelof doesn't have any attributes is a stretch. I think he reads the game relatively well against more technical opposition (why he performs better in European competition). I wouldn't say he was slow (although not particularly fast) as evidenced tonight when he matched Burke who's main attribute is pace.
That said, he is not a dominant defender physically and is woeful in the air, which makes him quite unsuited to the PL. I don't see us winning titles with him at the heart of our defence.
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat.
...
Because he is poor. Maguire is not as bad as him. He just isn’t.
Maguire and Lindelof just don't compliment one another for me. If we had a pacy CB ho's good in the air then both of them would look better alongside the mythical CB.
Unbelievable though with them we've actually won more games away from home this season already than we did winning the title on 2010/11!
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
A DM who can do a combination of what Fred, McT and Matic can do would do wonders for the team.
don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
---
I mean they cause a lot of the issues they are trying to rectify
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 minutes ago
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat.
...
Because he is poor. Maguire is not as bad as him. He just isn’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Disagree! Would rather have Lindeof alongside Bailly as that would be imo our best defence. However, unfortunately Bailly is made of glass! Sick of people thinking Maguire is a god when he is bang average!
Well not really. It’s become quite easy to isolate our cb’s unless we are parking the bus, and even then we have these games where the whole team just lose the ability to play football.
There are regularly weaknesses in front of them, to the side of them and behind them. Not just in terms of individual flaws, but also what we do with and without the ball.
We need better, no doubt. But the way we defend with and without the ball needs a lot of work.
Though this season is a bit mental. I only think City and Spurs have looked strong defensively in the league this year. Everyone else has been really vulnerable.
To be fair we conceded the same amount of goals as Liverpool this season who are top of the league and have allowed fewer expected goals against. Yes we played a game less but we have conceded a ton of soft goals this season.
comment by Posh Mufc Great Hafi Not Arrogant Just Better (U6578)
posted 6 minutes ago
To be fair we conceded the same amount of goals as Liverpool this season who are top of the league and have allowed fewer expected goals against. Yes we played a game less but we have conceded a ton of soft goals this season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because our defence us rubbish! Both of them!
The slow starts are beyond the ridiculous at this stage. What should have been sorted before our champions league exit. How many wake up calls are needed
It’s ridiculous. Spurs and West Brom are the only games we’ve taken the league in the prem. And we still had slow starts in those games.
comment by Giggs with the shot, SHERINGHAM! Name on the t... (U20498)
posted 42 minutes ago
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat. Maguire just as bad but people won't admit it because he's English and cost alot of money!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll happily admit that they're both shiet
That first goal was all down to Maguire.
As Captain, he should not be putting Henderson under pressure like that.
Henderson, a guy who is having his first PL start in goal for United, a kid.
You just don't do it, end of.
The pass to Henderson was pathetic as well, the Sheffield player was already sprinting, it was just lazy, mentally weak play. Not something a captain of United should ever be doing.
Clanger after clanger from our keepers, two different keepers.
Ever thought it's the reta rded centre backs in front of them that are causing the issues?
Not rocket science.
comment by Roy's Keane (U11635)
posted 15 minutes ago
The slow starts are beyond the ridiculous at this stage. What should have been sorted before our champions league exit. How many wake up calls are needed
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sheffield utd ffs could have been 2 up on us tonight
Maguire and Lindleoff have a whole shopping list of mistakes this season.
If Henderson remains in goal I fully expect a few clangers from him due to the amount of pressure our CBs put the keepers under, time and time again.
That was meant to be a reply to Darren
comment by Greg- (U1192)
posted 2 minutes ago
That first goal was all down to Maguire.
As Captain, he should not be putting Henderson under pressure like that.
Henderson, a guy who is having his first PL start in goal for United, a kid.
You just don't do it, end of.
The pass to Henderson was pathetic as well, the Sheffield player was already sprinting, it was just lazy, mentally weak play. Not something a captain of United should ever be doing.
Clanger after clanger from our keepers, two different keepers.
Ever thought it's the reta rded centre backs in front of them that are causing the issues?
Not rocket science.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We’d probably still have won. We keep having all these mental games where we look shiiiiiit and then we’ve scored three goals in the game.
We’ve scored three or more in six of our twelve games. A lot of clubs won’t do that all season.
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
Defending corners.
Who on here wasn’t taught that you have a defender on each post.
Sheffield’s second doesn’t happen last night and probably three or four more we have conceded from corners of late.
comment by rosso - it’s not good enough to be right; you have to be effective (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 12 minutes ago
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is needed, but it’s not a one signing fix. We need many more signings and a better coach. Then we’ll be more secure at the back.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 50 minutes ago
Defending corners.
Who on here wasn’t taught that you have a defender on each post.
Sheffield’s second doesn’t happen last night and probably three or four more we have conceded from corners of late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Very few teams now defend with a player on each post nowadays.
Statistically, you’re better off loading more players into the delivery zone to improve your chances of winning the first ball than you are using two men up on the posts.
This is a good article explaining that (and why):
- defending teams don’t put players on the posts anymore
- it’s better to hammer corners at the near post than aim for the middle of the box or back post
- flick-ons into the six yard box are better than direct attempts
- and more
https://www.espn.com/soccer/english-premier-league/story/4097252/premier-league-leaders-liverpool-might-beg-to-differ-that-corners-are-overrated-for-scoring
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 51 minutes ago
comment by rosso - it’s not good enough to be right; you have to be effective (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 12 minutes ago
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is needed, but it’s not a one signing fix. We need many more signings and a better coach. Then we’ll be more secure at the back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So, just build a new club basically
Sign in if you want to comment
Decent defence
Page 2 of 3
posted on 17/12/20
They are as bad as each other in their own ways
posted on 17/12/20
Saying Lindelof doesn't have any attributes is a stretch. I think he reads the game relatively well against more technical opposition (why he performs better in European competition). I wouldn't say he was slow (although not particularly fast) as evidenced tonight when he matched Burke who's main attribute is pace.
That said, he is not a dominant defender physically and is woeful in the air, which makes him quite unsuited to the PL. I don't see us winning titles with him at the heart of our defence.
posted on 17/12/20
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat.
...
Because he is poor. Maguire is not as bad as him. He just isn’t.
posted on 17/12/20
Maguire and Lindelof just don't compliment one another for me. If we had a pacy CB ho's good in the air then both of them would look better alongside the mythical CB.
Unbelievable though with them we've actually won more games away from home this season already than we did winning the title on 2010/11!
posted on 17/12/20
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
posted on 17/12/20
A DM who can do a combination of what Fred, McT and Matic can do would do wonders for the team.
posted on 17/12/20
don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
---
I mean they cause a lot of the issues they are trying to rectify
posted on 17/12/20
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 3 minutes ago
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat.
...
Because he is poor. Maguire is not as bad as him. He just isn’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Disagree! Would rather have Lindeof alongside Bailly as that would be imo our best defence. However, unfortunately Bailly is made of glass! Sick of people thinking Maguire is a god when he is bang average!
posted on 17/12/20
Well not really. It’s become quite easy to isolate our cb’s unless we are parking the bus, and even then we have these games where the whole team just lose the ability to play football.
There are regularly weaknesses in front of them, to the side of them and behind them. Not just in terms of individual flaws, but also what we do with and without the ball.
We need better, no doubt. But the way we defend with and without the ball needs a lot of work.
Though this season is a bit mental. I only think City and Spurs have looked strong defensively in the league this year. Everyone else has been really vulnerable.
posted on 17/12/20
To be fair we conceded the same amount of goals as Liverpool this season who are top of the league and have allowed fewer expected goals against. Yes we played a game less but we have conceded a ton of soft goals this season.
posted on 17/12/20
comment by Posh Mufc Great Hafi Not Arrogant Just Better (U6578)
posted 6 minutes ago
To be fair we conceded the same amount of goals as Liverpool this season who are top of the league and have allowed fewer expected goals against. Yes we played a game less but we have conceded a ton of soft goals this season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because our defence us rubbish! Both of them!
posted on 17/12/20
The slow starts are beyond the ridiculous at this stage. What should have been sorted before our champions league exit. How many wake up calls are needed
posted on 17/12/20
It’s ridiculous. Spurs and West Brom are the only games we’ve taken the league in the prem. And we still had slow starts in those games.
posted on 17/12/20
comment by Giggs with the shot, SHERINGHAM! Name on the t... (U20498)
posted 42 minutes ago
Everyone uses Lindelof as a scapegoat. Maguire just as bad but people won't admit it because he's English and cost alot of money!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll happily admit that they're both shiet
posted on 17/12/20
That first goal was all down to Maguire.
As Captain, he should not be putting Henderson under pressure like that.
Henderson, a guy who is having his first PL start in goal for United, a kid.
You just don't do it, end of.
The pass to Henderson was pathetic as well, the Sheffield player was already sprinting, it was just lazy, mentally weak play. Not something a captain of United should ever be doing.
Clanger after clanger from our keepers, two different keepers.
Ever thought it's the reta rded centre backs in front of them that are causing the issues?
Not rocket science.
posted on 17/12/20
comment by Roy's Keane (U11635)
posted 15 minutes ago
The slow starts are beyond the ridiculous at this stage. What should have been sorted before our champions league exit. How many wake up calls are needed
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sheffield utd ffs could have been 2 up on us tonight
posted on 17/12/20
Maguire and Lindleoff have a whole shopping list of mistakes this season.
If Henderson remains in goal I fully expect a few clangers from him due to the amount of pressure our CBs put the keepers under, time and time again.
posted on 17/12/20
That was meant to be a reply to Darren
posted on 18/12/20
comment by Greg- (U1192)
posted 2 minutes ago
That first goal was all down to Maguire.
As Captain, he should not be putting Henderson under pressure like that.
Henderson, a guy who is having his first PL start in goal for United, a kid.
You just don't do it, end of.
The pass to Henderson was pathetic as well, the Sheffield player was already sprinting, it was just lazy, mentally weak play. Not something a captain of United should ever be doing.
Clanger after clanger from our keepers, two different keepers.
Ever thought it's the reta rded centre backs in front of them that are causing the issues?
Not rocket science.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 18/12/20
We’d probably still have won. We keep having all these mental games where we look shiiiiiit and then we’ve scored three goals in the game.
We’ve scored three or more in six of our twelve games. A lot of clubs won’t do that all season.
posted on 18/12/20
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
posted on 18/12/20
Defending corners.
Who on here wasn’t taught that you have a defender on each post.
Sheffield’s second doesn’t happen last night and probably three or four more we have conceded from corners of late.
posted on 18/12/20
comment by rosso - it’s not good enough to be right; you have to be effective (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 12 minutes ago
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is needed, but it’s not a one signing fix. We need many more signings and a better coach. Then we’ll be more secure at the back.
posted on 18/12/20
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 50 minutes ago
Defending corners.
Who on here wasn’t taught that you have a defender on each post.
Sheffield’s second doesn’t happen last night and probably three or four more we have conceded from corners of late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Very few teams now defend with a player on each post nowadays.
Statistically, you’re better off loading more players into the delivery zone to improve your chances of winning the first ball than you are using two men up on the posts.
This is a good article explaining that (and why):
- defending teams don’t put players on the posts anymore
- it’s better to hammer corners at the near post than aim for the middle of the box or back post
- flick-ons into the six yard box are better than direct attempts
- and more
https://www.espn.com/soccer/english-premier-league/story/4097252/premier-league-leaders-liverpool-might-beg-to-differ-that-corners-are-overrated-for-scoring
posted on 18/12/20
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 51 minutes ago
comment by rosso - it’s not good enough to be right; you have to be effective (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 12 minutes ago
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 9 hours, 15 minutes ago
I don’t really rate Lindelof and Maguire, but I have some sympathy for then. They have to put out a lot of fires because of what is going on around them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
Both are more competent defenders than they get credit for.
We don’t have a pairing like Bruce and Pallister or Ferdinand or Vidic on our hands, obviously, but people have to appreciate that those are not just two of the best CB partnerships that the club has seen, they were amongst the greatest in English football history and the best in the world in their respective days. We’ve been spoilt in our lifetimes.
Both of those pairings also benefitted from obscenely hardworking central midfielders and wingers working in front of them, different level fullbacks, world class goalkeepers at the peaks of their powers, a better defensively organised side, and playing against less competent attacks most weeks.
Every week I’ve been asking people on here, “Well if you say we need to replace both Maguire and Lindelof, who would you pick?” More often than not I don’t get a single name. There’s a clue: if you aren’t watching other PL sides and thinking, yep, I’d rather have those two in my team than Maguire and Lindelof, then maybe the CBs we have aren’t as catastrophically terrible as you’re making out.
For what it’s worth, I do think we need to strengthen the squad, and I’d prefer to see that done with a young, powerful, imposing and quick player to complement Maguire. But there aren’t loads of them out there at the level people think we should be looking for.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is needed, but it’s not a one signing fix. We need many more signings and a better coach. Then we’ll be more secure at the back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So, just build a new club basically
Page 2 of 3