Said it last year and got a lot of flak on this site, but this is all part of the Bielsa cycle, he has run those players into the groubd
I think we'll be ok once everyone is back and fit. Raphinha and Bamford won't struggle to score goals so I think we'll be fine for picking up wins. At the moment though, we're probably only better than 2 teams, Norwich and Watford and even then I don't fancy us to go to Carrow Rd and win. This needs to be a wake up call in regards to how we go into a season under prepared. We knew Phillips and Raph we're going to be heavilly involved internationally, plus covid is still a matchday threat. Should have signed OBrien or Winks imo.
Here’s a brilliant explanation of our system - its strengths and its flaws. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NnwIDhsK0i4
comment by Shaun M - Everywhere you go, always take Rapinha with you! (U9955)
posted 1 minute ago
I think we'll be ok once everyone is back and fit. Raphinha and Bamford won't struggle to score goals so I think we'll be fine for picking up wins. At the moment though, we're probably only better than 2 teams, Norwich and Watford and even then I don't fancy us to go to Carrow Rd and win. This needs to be a wake up call in regards to how we go into a season under prepared. We knew Phillips and Raph we're going to be heavilly involved internationally, plus covid is still a matchday threat. Should have signed OBrien or Winks imo.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Please do buy Winks
Please also stay up and get Newcastle relegated
Burn out is quite possible, I'd say, but is it mental rather than physical - or is it both?
Can this be fixed in time with the present small squad and youth players? Greater rotation risks more defeats.
We have played well in games this year and come away with nothing - West Ham, for example. However, there have been three or four when we've been poor. Yesterday's game was really gut-wrenching because we did sweet fa to upset them or generate some pressure. We were just totally bossed in every department. Chucking on Geldhart and Summerville for ten minutes just stank of panic and desperation.
I'm back to wondering which Leeds will be turning up for games again.
My concern is with Bielsa. He seems to have lost his willingness to change games, or to disrupt the opposition before problems arise.
Think back to the Championship where he made, what seemed at the time, crazy substitutions, such as taking KP off after 30 minutes when he wasn't playing well. Or switching formation in defence and midfield to exploit opposition weakness. His changes now are more about how the opposition are playing, reacting to them, not about how we can get at them.
He's bringing in under-23's in pressure-cooker moments, when they should have been playing in our last dozen or so league games of last season when we were safe from relegation, and in our pre-season games.
Now, when he brings in players, they are given 15 minutes to change games. How can that help anyone? How could Forshaw have changed the game when he was given 20 minutes, after a two year lay-off?
These are pretty basic mistakes in my view, and need to be addressed, not by bashing players, who are giving it all they have, but by examining the way Bielsa adapts and changes his game management. He did brilliantly last season, so we know what he can do. He has to change, in my view, if he wants to be successful this season.
I have to agree with everything you said Jonty.
Even with our best players back in the match day squad, we’re not firing on all cylinders like we have done in previous seasons.
I wonder if it’s a morale thing? We saw some strong characters leave at the end of last season and even though they may have been on the bench, the dressing room and training ground are likely to be missing some Influential voices and (for Alioski) energy and craziness.
Combine that with starting this season with some murderous games, plus injuries and you’ve got a squad that’s nowhere near confident now.
I’m worried that we’re not likely to improve this side of Christmas and then we hit our usual New Year slump!
I hope I’m talking rubbish!
Just reading all these comments there seems to be a strong case building, whether you want to face it or not, that sadly Bielsa's midus touch is weakening.
These are not blips but trends and I think if we fail to get 4 points in our next 2 games then even more doubts from fans will creep in.
Putting asside Southampton completely out playing us with key Leeds players missing admittidly , you can't ignore that the players look stale, tired and lacking that spark that was infectious last season.
There is no doubt we have lost our mojo as a team which has coincided with Alioski, Beradi and Hernandez leaving and Bielsa looks like he is really struggling to turn things round and is reminding me a bit of when Cloughie lost his grip at Forest, Wenger at Arsenal and Redknap and Big Sam and Pulis losing theirs too as they got older.
Bielsa will always be loved and adored and have a massive Cult following for what he has done for Leeds but like Ranieri after winning the title for Leicester the next season he was sacked, so unfortunately nothing lasts forever.
Now don't get me wrong I really want Bielsa to turn it round for us and get us to safety and leave us on a high but once there are rumblings of discontent about the manager even one as reveered as much as MB then it usually doesn't end well.
Sorry but that's the truth as I see it at this moment and nothing would give me more pleasure to be saying in 6 games time that I and others were far too knee jerk in writing our great leader off.
Ultimately though if results and performances don't change in the next couple of fixtures at least then my feelings and a growing number of other Leeds fans feelings about whether Bielsa has taken us as far as he can with the squad will grow stronger and stronger.
I missed the game on sat, decided to work. When I looked at the team sheet, I expected us to lose. Not a good sign.
We can't really perform without Phillips, add to that our only on form forward out too and to add more insult to injury, Bamford out.
The injury problems we get, just stifle us. I don't know what the options are, apart from spending 100m to bring in more players for injury rotation.
I always felt last season, without crowds, offered our championship players the chance to adapt against higher standard of opposition in a more neutral environment. Now with crowds back in I think it's a different task in hand. Some maybe aren't as effective. I'm probably talking tosh, but it's my take on it. I still remain confident we'll stay up, but we really need to start stringing results together.
Also - is the training, such intense training, contributing to injuries or recovery time from them?
To play devils advocate, you could quite easily make a case for Bielsa losing his job. We are fourth bottom, the team are playing like they have never met before, the style of play is too regimented and therefore teams are able to pick us (we always play the same way regardless of who we are up against and the man marking isn't working), the level of injuries is indicative of too harsh a training regime (far too many injuries), players that would have enhanced the squad haven't been signed because of Bielsa wanting a small squad and Bielsa doesn't seem to think creatively when making substitutions (always brings the same players on regardless of what is happening in the game).
Have to admit, at the moment, I am losing a little faith in MB.
This, is he/isn't he, when it comes to signing a new contract each season is a clever sleight of hand because it means the management are so invested in him they are very unlikely to want to part company.
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 2 hours, 27 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fully agree
Very good summary Elsbels nearly exactly how I feel maybe don’t put it across as well.Very sad but no one man is bigger than the club.He will always be a big part of the clubs history .Having said all that nothing would give me greater pleasure than to be proved wrong.
comment by Shaun M - Everywhere you go, always take Rapinha with you! (U9955)
posted 1 hour, 12 minutes ago
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 2 hours, 27 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fully agree
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Here, here. Signing James when we were crying out for midfield options is looking more and more silly.
Negatives - No quality No 8 or 10 which impacts on our forwards with lack of service.
People crying out for the U23s to play but we only see them in their own age group, The manager sees them every week against the senior players so must not think they are up to it as otherwise surely they would be in the side,
Positive - West Ham are 7th we more than competed with them and if Klich score its game over, with a strong side out we compete with most sides.
Anyone heard the rumours about Dallas getting the flick from home if true its bound to affect his performances.
4pts min from next two games 6 would be great to kick start the season but squad depth is the worry.
Cant believe i have read the sh**e posted on here.
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 21 hours, 50 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Completely agree on this.
Page 1 of 1
First
Previous
1
Next
Latest
Sign in if you want to comment
What does this season hold now
Page 1 of 1
posted on 17/10/21
Said it last year and got a lot of flak on this site, but this is all part of the Bielsa cycle, he has run those players into the groubd
posted on 17/10/21
I think we'll be ok once everyone is back and fit. Raphinha and Bamford won't struggle to score goals so I think we'll be fine for picking up wins. At the moment though, we're probably only better than 2 teams, Norwich and Watford and even then I don't fancy us to go to Carrow Rd and win. This needs to be a wake up call in regards to how we go into a season under prepared. We knew Phillips and Raph we're going to be heavilly involved internationally, plus covid is still a matchday threat. Should have signed OBrien or Winks imo.
posted on 17/10/21
Here’s a brilliant explanation of our system - its strengths and its flaws. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NnwIDhsK0i4
posted on 17/10/21
comment by Shaun M - Everywhere you go, always take Rapinha with you! (U9955)
posted 1 minute ago
I think we'll be ok once everyone is back and fit. Raphinha and Bamford won't struggle to score goals so I think we'll be fine for picking up wins. At the moment though, we're probably only better than 2 teams, Norwich and Watford and even then I don't fancy us to go to Carrow Rd and win. This needs to be a wake up call in regards to how we go into a season under prepared. We knew Phillips and Raph we're going to be heavilly involved internationally, plus covid is still a matchday threat. Should have signed OBrien or Winks imo.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Please do buy Winks
Please also stay up and get Newcastle relegated
posted on 17/10/21
Burn out is quite possible, I'd say, but is it mental rather than physical - or is it both?
Can this be fixed in time with the present small squad and youth players? Greater rotation risks more defeats.
We have played well in games this year and come away with nothing - West Ham, for example. However, there have been three or four when we've been poor. Yesterday's game was really gut-wrenching because we did sweet fa to upset them or generate some pressure. We were just totally bossed in every department. Chucking on Geldhart and Summerville for ten minutes just stank of panic and desperation.
I'm back to wondering which Leeds will be turning up for games again.
posted on 17/10/21
My concern is with Bielsa. He seems to have lost his willingness to change games, or to disrupt the opposition before problems arise.
Think back to the Championship where he made, what seemed at the time, crazy substitutions, such as taking KP off after 30 minutes when he wasn't playing well. Or switching formation in defence and midfield to exploit opposition weakness. His changes now are more about how the opposition are playing, reacting to them, not about how we can get at them.
He's bringing in under-23's in pressure-cooker moments, when they should have been playing in our last dozen or so league games of last season when we were safe from relegation, and in our pre-season games.
Now, when he brings in players, they are given 15 minutes to change games. How can that help anyone? How could Forshaw have changed the game when he was given 20 minutes, after a two year lay-off?
These are pretty basic mistakes in my view, and need to be addressed, not by bashing players, who are giving it all they have, but by examining the way Bielsa adapts and changes his game management. He did brilliantly last season, so we know what he can do. He has to change, in my view, if he wants to be successful this season.
posted on 17/10/21
I have to agree with everything you said Jonty.
Even with our best players back in the match day squad, we’re not firing on all cylinders like we have done in previous seasons.
I wonder if it’s a morale thing? We saw some strong characters leave at the end of last season and even though they may have been on the bench, the dressing room and training ground are likely to be missing some Influential voices and (for Alioski) energy and craziness.
Combine that with starting this season with some murderous games, plus injuries and you’ve got a squad that’s nowhere near confident now.
I’m worried that we’re not likely to improve this side of Christmas and then we hit our usual New Year slump!
I hope I’m talking rubbish!
posted on 18/10/21
Just reading all these comments there seems to be a strong case building, whether you want to face it or not, that sadly Bielsa's midus touch is weakening.
These are not blips but trends and I think if we fail to get 4 points in our next 2 games then even more doubts from fans will creep in.
Putting asside Southampton completely out playing us with key Leeds players missing admittidly , you can't ignore that the players look stale, tired and lacking that spark that was infectious last season.
There is no doubt we have lost our mojo as a team which has coincided with Alioski, Beradi and Hernandez leaving and Bielsa looks like he is really struggling to turn things round and is reminding me a bit of when Cloughie lost his grip at Forest, Wenger at Arsenal and Redknap and Big Sam and Pulis losing theirs too as they got older.
Bielsa will always be loved and adored and have a massive Cult following for what he has done for Leeds but like Ranieri after winning the title for Leicester the next season he was sacked, so unfortunately nothing lasts forever.
Now don't get me wrong I really want Bielsa to turn it round for us and get us to safety and leave us on a high but once there are rumblings of discontent about the manager even one as reveered as much as MB then it usually doesn't end well.
Sorry but that's the truth as I see it at this moment and nothing would give me more pleasure to be saying in 6 games time that I and others were far too knee jerk in writing our great leader off.
Ultimately though if results and performances don't change in the next couple of fixtures at least then my feelings and a growing number of other Leeds fans feelings about whether Bielsa has taken us as far as he can with the squad will grow stronger and stronger.
posted on 18/10/21
I missed the game on sat, decided to work. When I looked at the team sheet, I expected us to lose. Not a good sign.
We can't really perform without Phillips, add to that our only on form forward out too and to add more insult to injury, Bamford out.
The injury problems we get, just stifle us. I don't know what the options are, apart from spending 100m to bring in more players for injury rotation.
posted on 18/10/21
I always felt last season, without crowds, offered our championship players the chance to adapt against higher standard of opposition in a more neutral environment. Now with crowds back in I think it's a different task in hand. Some maybe aren't as effective. I'm probably talking tosh, but it's my take on it. I still remain confident we'll stay up, but we really need to start stringing results together.
Also - is the training, such intense training, contributing to injuries or recovery time from them?
posted on 18/10/21
To play devils advocate, you could quite easily make a case for Bielsa losing his job. We are fourth bottom, the team are playing like they have never met before, the style of play is too regimented and therefore teams are able to pick us (we always play the same way regardless of who we are up against and the man marking isn't working), the level of injuries is indicative of too harsh a training regime (far too many injuries), players that would have enhanced the squad haven't been signed because of Bielsa wanting a small squad and Bielsa doesn't seem to think creatively when making substitutions (always brings the same players on regardless of what is happening in the game).
Have to admit, at the moment, I am losing a little faith in MB.
This, is he/isn't he, when it comes to signing a new contract each season is a clever sleight of hand because it means the management are so invested in him they are very unlikely to want to part company.
posted on 18/10/21
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
posted on 18/10/21
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 2 hours, 27 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fully agree
posted on 18/10/21
Very good summary Elsbels nearly exactly how I feel maybe don’t put it across as well.Very sad but no one man is bigger than the club.He will always be a big part of the clubs history .Having said all that nothing would give me greater pleasure than to be proved wrong.
posted on 18/10/21
comment by Shaun M - Everywhere you go, always take Rapinha with you! (U9955)
posted 1 hour, 12 minutes ago
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 2 hours, 27 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fully agree
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Here, here. Signing James when we were crying out for midfield options is looking more and more silly.
posted on 18/10/21
Negatives - No quality No 8 or 10 which impacts on our forwards with lack of service.
People crying out for the U23s to play but we only see them in their own age group, The manager sees them every week against the senior players so must not think they are up to it as otherwise surely they would be in the side,
Positive - West Ham are 7th we more than competed with them and if Klich score its game over, with a strong side out we compete with most sides.
Anyone heard the rumours about Dallas getting the flick from home if true its bound to affect his performances.
4pts min from next two games 6 would be great to kick start the season but squad depth is the worry.
posted on 18/10/21
Cant believe i have read the sh**e posted on here.
posted on 19/10/21
comment by Outwood White (U9610)
posted 21 hours, 50 minutes ago
Poor recruitment policy in the summer for me.
We should have strengthened in key areas, mainly midfield.
We signed a new LB and lost one. Jury is still out on Firpo. Last season we had a major issue when KP wasnt playing and that wasn't fulfilled in the summer. We also have never had a direct replacement for Saiz/Pablo and seem to try and shoehorn Rodrigo and Roberts in to that role when neither have shown that they are capable.
To me there were far more crucial recruitments needed before we paid 25m for Dan James.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Completely agree on this.
Page 1 of 1