comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 29 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 3 minutes ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i thikn they should be allowed to get promoted through the leagues so long as they cant get into top flight.
They need to have goals and things they can win otherwise whats the point, other than just making up the numbers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I respect that opinion but the goal has to be having a career. Dads used to talk about it a lot. Get a career in the championship at £20kpw and you easily ought to be able to have a pension of £1-200kpa when you chuck it if you put 50% away and don’t spunk it on cars and dirty birds. How good is that - sitting doing fack all living off your earnings?
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They are certainly learning about the physical side of the game from a lot of the teams - not your Edinburgh Uni, Stirling Uni types, but your EK's, Bonnyriggs, CSS etc.
It has definitely been useful though. Rangers have played a slightly younger team than Celtic in it and it has clearly been an eye opener for some of them.
Guys like Robbie Ure, Charlie Lyndsay and even Alex Lowry himself have had to learn how to cope with playing against some big 35 year old beasts out to break them in two. You can actually see how some of them have changed parts of their game over the season.
They would certainly be better off in League 2 or League 1 as you wouldnt get the 9-0 games that are just shooty in and are a waste of time.
I am sure some of the pitches in League 2 still arent the best but they have to be better than tattie fields like CSS or terrible astro pitches like Galashiels etc.
I am amazed Bonnyrigg Rose won the Lowland league BTW. Rangers played them off the park at their place. It finished 5-2 but it was only after Charlie McCann had a penalty saved in the last minute to make it 6-1 and they caught us on the hop, broke up the park and grabbed a last kick of the ball consolation.
Lowland might get better now that the junior leagues which are 6th tier but thought to be better standard are allowed promotion into LL but it is gonna a long take time. I am sceptical.
That’s my point, credit to one or two teams but FT fitness, sharpness plus professional training has them running rings as you say. Celtic are playing 16yo too - Doaky and wee Frankie Dean ffs. If they were playing to win it they’d not be loaning out players. It is development only and without trying they will still be near the top and capable of beating top if they try. It’s OK, no better.
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 29 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 3 minutes ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i thikn they should be allowed to get promoted through the leagues so long as they cant get into top flight.
They need to have goals and things they can win otherwise whats the point, other than just making up the numbers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I respect that opinion but the goal has to be having a career. Dads used to talk about it a lot. Get a career in the championship at £20kpw and you easily ought to be able to have a pension of £1-200kpa when you chuck it if you put 50% away and don’t spunk it on cars and dirty birds. How good is that - sitting doing fack all living off your earnings?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean a competitive goal. If essentially the game your playing has no real rewards then the players will not learn how to play under the pressure of winning say a league. Pressure either bursts pipes or makes diamonds.
Players can play with no pressure on them no bother, but thats not what we judge players on we judge them on how they perform when the pressure is on.
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
comment by Humble Hamish (U21959)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but that is my argument , let them progress through the leagues, let them get promoted to perhaps the championship. The higher level they play at the more it will benefit them
At one point Celtic were happy to join the (imperfect) EPPP U23 setup. I realise the politics will likely prevent it but no harm showing ambition.
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted about a minute ago
At one point Celtic were happy to join the (imperfect) EPPP U23 setup. I realise the politics will likely prevent it but no harm showing ambition.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That would surely be the best we could get.
Seems like a random bunch of teams in their u23 leagues.
The lowland league will be great for the kids getting exposure to mens football but after a full season, they won’t develop there.
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Humble Hamish (U21959)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but that is my argument , let them progress through the leagues, let them get promoted to perhaps the championship. The higher level they play at the more it will benefit them
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess one of the problems light be is the B team will most likely be a different team every year or two.
And I know a lot of teams down the leagues will be the same but they will generally be replacing adults with adults.
This current Rangers B team are mostly U19 with a few U18s mixed in. I absolutely think they could cope with League 2 and would maybe even be in the top half of league 1.
But what happens if there is a strong batch of kids a couple of years in a row that got the B team into the championship....then they are getting to be towards 19/20 and they should either be close to the first team or they will be moving on.
If you have to replenish the team that got promoted with 16 -18 year old kids then the chances are the Championship would be a bit of a mare for them?
Its not an easy one to solve.
the counter argument to that is that they will settle into the level they are at. I dont think the the level of the youths varies too much from year to year... no more or less so than any other team in the leagues they are against.
If there is one year that the team is particularly under strength for the level they are playing it well that is just help their development more. the higher the level you play at the better you become. There has to be a poorest team at any level you play at and it needs to be something the youths are exposed to. cant just be better than every team you play against.
Let them get promoted (and demoted) surely its better than constantly playing at a level that is below the players.
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
The shortlist for the 1998 Ballon d’Or will never be matched. Just look at some of the names in this list:
1. Zinedine Zidane: Juventus - 244 points
2. Davor Šuker: Real Madrid - 68 points
3. Ronaldo: Internazionale - 66 points
4. Michael Owen: Liverpool - 51 points
5. Rivaldo: Barcelona - 45 points
6. Gabriel Batistuta: Fiorentina - 43 points
7. Lilian Thuram: Parma - 36 points
8=. Edgar Davids: Juventus - 28 points
8=. Dennis Bergkamp: Arsenal - 28 points
10. Marcel Desailly: Chelsea - 19 points
11. Frank de Boer: Ajax - 17 points
12. Emmanuel Petit: Arsenal - 16 points
13. Roberto Carlos: Real Madrid - 13 points
14=. Laurent Blanc: Marseille - 11 points
14=. Fabien Barthez: Monaco - 11 points
16=. Alessandro Del Piero: Juventus - 10 points
16=. Predrag Mijatović: Real Madrid - 10 points
18=. Didier Deschamps: Juventus - 9 points
18=. Oliver Bierhoff: Milan - 9 points
20. Michael Laudrup: Ajax - 6 points
21=. Ronald de Boer: Ajax - 4 points
21=. Raúl: Real Madrid - 4 points
23=. Brian Laudrup: Chelsea - 3 points
23=. Clarence Seedorf: Real Madrid - 3 points
23=. Marc Overmars: Arsenal - 3 points
26=. Christian Vieri: Lazio - 2 points
26=. Fernando Hierro: Real Madrid - 2 points
28=. David Beckham: Manchester United - 1 point
28=. Luis Enrique: Barcelona - 1 point
28=. Bixente Lizarazu: Bayern Munich - 1 point
28=. Nikos Machlas: Vitesse - 1 point
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 32 seconds ago
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
what evidence do you expect it to produce before a season has been been played? what evidence is there to show that it doesnt help players progress?
In terms of the lona system .... surely that means that they will be playing at a similar level to the B team then? only it will be using inferior training facilities with possibly inferior coaches and means that you are no longer in full observation of the player? I cant see how that is better? if a player is playing at a level too high for the B team they can still be loaned out?
Big Nikos Machlas, he could made that list and i reckon he could also make the step up to the Lowland League
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 32 seconds ago
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
what evidence do you expect it to produce before a season has been been played? what evidence is there to show that it doesnt help players progress?
In terms of the lona system .... surely that means that they will be playing at a similar level to the B team then? only it will be using inferior training facilities with possibly inferior coaches and means that you are no longer in full observation of the player? I cant see how that is better? if a player is playing at a level too high for the B team they can still be loaned out?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Firstly we've got years of data about attendances and the financial 'rewards' of playing against B teams from the cup competition that they're in. The crowds have been pitiful and teams have been making a loss with the games against the B teams.
Secondly, if you look at leagues of a similar size and similar population then very, very rarely are B teams a route to the first team for star players. If we take Croatia as an example, if you look at the star players who have come through from that country, pretty much all of them went straight to the first team and bypassed the B teams.
Other than lots and lots of 'ifs' and 'mights', there is nothing to suggest that this will benefit Scottish football.
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
comment by HB Fash (U21935)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What I'm saying is don't change the entire structure of our game for two clubs when there's no solid evidence that it'll actually help.
I want you guys to bring through more players. It helps our game. If you can demonstrate that B teams will help then I'll get on board.
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by HB Fash (U21935)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What I'm saying is don't change the entire structure of our game for two clubs when there's no solid evidence that it'll actually help.
I want you guys to bring through more players. It helps our game. If you can demonstrate that B teams will help then I'll get on board.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So what are you suggesting Ivan?
Carry on as is?
Is you view that the people that run the Rangers and Celtic academies have got it all wrong?
Just keep doing the same thing and it will magically get better?
Ivan wants Dembele and Lowry on loan
Ivan, you are nothing if not consistent! Don’t see a difference between loaning to league 2 or playing in your own team in league 2?
Looking out for your own interests is what Scottish football is all about because our authorities are so weak in the shadow of the big 2. England would be a blessing.
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 8 minutes ago
Ivan wants Dembele and Lowry on loan
Ivan, you are nothing if not consistent! Don’t see a difference between loaning to league 2 or playing in your own team in league 2?
Looking out for your own interests is what Scottish football is all about because our authorities are so weak in the shadow of the big 2. England would be a blessing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
exactly, if they are gonna play at that level it might as well be whilst using our far far better facilities, coaches and physios.
We would be daft to loan out Lowry and Dundee United would be daft to loan Dembele.
Iniesta, messi, fati, Iniesta, xavi all came through barca b team
Vinicus Jnr, carvajal, vasquez, odegaard, casimeiro all came through reals casilla team.
Only picking these two up cos these need to research and are of the top of my head if I looked into it i would find a lot more.
Not saying the b teams were the reason hey became what they are, but Pep was adamant of its importance to his barca players.
He definitely wants Rangers to bring through more young players.
So do Rangers as it happens. So that is a decent starting point.
Rangers dont think the status quo is particularly effective and have taken the lead in trying to pursuing alternative ways to challenge their young players. They have been proactive at trying to solve what they see is a problem.
If the answers they have come up with so far arent the best long term answers then fair dos. The club are very open to any new suggestions.
But sticking to the old loans systems doesnt really sound like the most progressive idea.
Sign in if you want to comment
Dundee v Rangers
Page 5 of 6
6
posted on 14/3/22
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 29 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 3 minutes ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i thikn they should be allowed to get promoted through the leagues so long as they cant get into top flight.
They need to have goals and things they can win otherwise whats the point, other than just making up the numbers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I respect that opinion but the goal has to be having a career. Dads used to talk about it a lot. Get a career in the championship at £20kpw and you easily ought to be able to have a pension of £1-200kpa when you chuck it if you put 50% away and don’t spunk it on cars and dirty birds. How good is that - sitting doing fack all living off your earnings?
posted on 14/3/22
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 minute ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They are certainly learning about the physical side of the game from a lot of the teams - not your Edinburgh Uni, Stirling Uni types, but your EK's, Bonnyriggs, CSS etc.
It has definitely been useful though. Rangers have played a slightly younger team than Celtic in it and it has clearly been an eye opener for some of them.
Guys like Robbie Ure, Charlie Lyndsay and even Alex Lowry himself have had to learn how to cope with playing against some big 35 year old beasts out to break them in two. You can actually see how some of them have changed parts of their game over the season.
They would certainly be better off in League 2 or League 1 as you wouldnt get the 9-0 games that are just shooty in and are a waste of time.
I am sure some of the pitches in League 2 still arent the best but they have to be better than tattie fields like CSS or terrible astro pitches like Galashiels etc.
I am amazed Bonnyrigg Rose won the Lowland league BTW. Rangers played them off the park at their place. It finished 5-2 but it was only after Charlie McCann had a penalty saved in the last minute to make it 6-1 and they caught us on the hop, broke up the park and grabbed a last kick of the ball consolation.
posted on 14/3/22
Lowland might get better now that the junior leagues which are 6th tier but thought to be better standard are allowed promotion into LL but it is gonna a long take time. I am sceptical.
posted on 14/3/22
That’s my point, credit to one or two teams but FT fitness, sharpness plus professional training has them running rings as you say. Celtic are playing 16yo too - Doaky and wee Frankie Dean ffs. If they were playing to win it they’d not be loaning out players. It is development only and without trying they will still be near the top and capable of beating top if they try. It’s OK, no better.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 29 seconds ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 3 minutes ago
Talk of the B team in Lowland continuing? It is not their level and they should bin it thought the alternatives may not be there? On track to finish 2nd & 3rd without trying very hard.
I would love them to play championship. They would get pumped often and finish near the bottom but they would learn. As it is they are learning little or nothing running rings round academy failures and guys a step up from pub league.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
i thikn they should be allowed to get promoted through the leagues so long as they cant get into top flight.
They need to have goals and things they can win otherwise whats the point, other than just making up the numbers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I respect that opinion but the goal has to be having a career. Dads used to talk about it a lot. Get a career in the championship at £20kpw and you easily ought to be able to have a pension of £1-200kpa when you chuck it if you put 50% away and don’t spunk it on cars and dirty birds. How good is that - sitting doing fack all living off your earnings?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I mean a competitive goal. If essentially the game your playing has no real rewards then the players will not learn how to play under the pressure of winning say a league. Pressure either bursts pipes or makes diamonds.
Players can play with no pressure on them no bother, but thats not what we judge players on we judge them on how they perform when the pressure is on.
posted on 14/3/22
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by Humble Hamish (U21959)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but that is my argument , let them progress through the leagues, let them get promoted to perhaps the championship. The higher level they play at the more it will benefit them
posted on 14/3/22
At one point Celtic were happy to join the (imperfect) EPPP U23 setup. I realise the politics will likely prevent it but no harm showing ambition.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted about a minute ago
At one point Celtic were happy to join the (imperfect) EPPP U23 setup. I realise the politics will likely prevent it but no harm showing ambition.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That would surely be the best we could get.
Seems like a random bunch of teams in their u23 leagues.
The lowland league will be great for the kids getting exposure to mens football but after a full season, they won’t develop there.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Humble Hamish (U21959)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
plus as people have said there is no point in them playing against competition that is beneath them and doesnt test them. that prohibits development.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The question is about available alternatives though.
Playing against the same guys at u20 level that they have played against since they were 13 or 14 wont really help their development.
As much as the lowland league isnt the best option, in the absence of access to League 2 it does provide benefits. I would say about half the games are pretty competitive and the kids do face real challenges.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but that is my argument , let them progress through the leagues, let them get promoted to perhaps the championship. The higher level they play at the more it will benefit them
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess one of the problems light be is the B team will most likely be a different team every year or two.
And I know a lot of teams down the leagues will be the same but they will generally be replacing adults with adults.
This current Rangers B team are mostly U19 with a few U18s mixed in. I absolutely think they could cope with League 2 and would maybe even be in the top half of league 1.
But what happens if there is a strong batch of kids a couple of years in a row that got the B team into the championship....then they are getting to be towards 19/20 and they should either be close to the first team or they will be moving on.
If you have to replenish the team that got promoted with 16 -18 year old kids then the chances are the Championship would be a bit of a mare for them?
Its not an easy one to solve.
posted on 14/3/22
the counter argument to that is that they will settle into the level they are at. I dont think the the level of the youths varies too much from year to year... no more or less so than any other team in the leagues they are against.
If there is one year that the team is particularly under strength for the level they are playing it well that is just help their development more. the higher the level you play at the better you become. There has to be a poorest team at any level you play at and it needs to be something the youths are exposed to. cant just be better than every team you play against.
Let them get promoted (and demoted) surely its better than constantly playing at a level that is below the players.
posted on 14/3/22
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
posted on 14/3/22
The shortlist for the 1998 Ballon d’Or will never be matched. Just look at some of the names in this list:
1. Zinedine Zidane: Juventus - 244 points
2. Davor Šuker: Real Madrid - 68 points
3. Ronaldo: Internazionale - 66 points
4. Michael Owen: Liverpool - 51 points
5. Rivaldo: Barcelona - 45 points
6. Gabriel Batistuta: Fiorentina - 43 points
7. Lilian Thuram: Parma - 36 points
8=. Edgar Davids: Juventus - 28 points
8=. Dennis Bergkamp: Arsenal - 28 points
10. Marcel Desailly: Chelsea - 19 points
11. Frank de Boer: Ajax - 17 points
12. Emmanuel Petit: Arsenal - 16 points
13. Roberto Carlos: Real Madrid - 13 points
14=. Laurent Blanc: Marseille - 11 points
14=. Fabien Barthez: Monaco - 11 points
16=. Alessandro Del Piero: Juventus - 10 points
16=. Predrag Mijatović: Real Madrid - 10 points
18=. Didier Deschamps: Juventus - 9 points
18=. Oliver Bierhoff: Milan - 9 points
20. Michael Laudrup: Ajax - 6 points
21=. Ronald de Boer: Ajax - 4 points
21=. Raúl: Real Madrid - 4 points
23=. Brian Laudrup: Chelsea - 3 points
23=. Clarence Seedorf: Real Madrid - 3 points
23=. Marc Overmars: Arsenal - 3 points
26=. Christian Vieri: Lazio - 2 points
26=. Fernando Hierro: Real Madrid - 2 points
28=. David Beckham: Manchester United - 1 point
28=. Luis Enrique: Barcelona - 1 point
28=. Bixente Lizarazu: Bayern Munich - 1 point
28=. Nikos Machlas: Vitesse - 1 point
posted on 14/3/22
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 32 seconds ago
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
what evidence do you expect it to produce before a season has been been played? what evidence is there to show that it doesnt help players progress?
In terms of the lona system .... surely that means that they will be playing at a similar level to the B team then? only it will be using inferior training facilities with possibly inferior coaches and means that you are no longer in full observation of the player? I cant see how that is better? if a player is playing at a level too high for the B team they can still be loaned out?
posted on 14/3/22
Big Nikos Machlas, he could made that list and i reckon he could also make the step up to the Lowland League
posted on 14/3/22
comment by whodunnit (U22710)
posted 11 minutes ago
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 32 seconds ago
B teams in the professional leagues is a nonsense and there's no evidence of it providing any kind of benefit to either the teams they'll be playing against or the development of players themselves, particularly when you compare it to similar sized leagues.
If you want to give the young lads game time against pros, use the loan system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
what evidence do you expect it to produce before a season has been been played? what evidence is there to show that it doesnt help players progress?
In terms of the lona system .... surely that means that they will be playing at a similar level to the B team then? only it will be using inferior training facilities with possibly inferior coaches and means that you are no longer in full observation of the player? I cant see how that is better? if a player is playing at a level too high for the B team they can still be loaned out?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Firstly we've got years of data about attendances and the financial 'rewards' of playing against B teams from the cup competition that they're in. The crowds have been pitiful and teams have been making a loss with the games against the B teams.
Secondly, if you look at leagues of a similar size and similar population then very, very rarely are B teams a route to the first team for star players. If we take Croatia as an example, if you look at the star players who have come through from that country, pretty much all of them went straight to the first team and bypassed the B teams.
Other than lots and lots of 'ifs' and 'mights', there is nothing to suggest that this will benefit Scottish football.
posted on 14/3/22
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
posted on 14/3/22
comment by HB Fash (U21935)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
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What I'm saying is don't change the entire structure of our game for two clubs when there's no solid evidence that it'll actually help.
I want you guys to bring through more players. It helps our game. If you can demonstrate that B teams will help then I'll get on board.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by IvanGolacIsMagic (U5291)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by HB Fash (U21935)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Ivan is saying through his tangerine spectacles is fook young players trying to make their way in the game if they belong to Rangers and Celtic.
It's our fault these wee stupid clubs like Dundee can barely muster 1000 fans for a Scottish Cup QF. There are crumbs here we are offering and some crumbs are better than no crumbs.
Lay back and take yer erse shegging, think of Scotland (young OF players breaking through and playing for them that is)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What I'm saying is don't change the entire structure of our game for two clubs when there's no solid evidence that it'll actually help.
I want you guys to bring through more players. It helps our game. If you can demonstrate that B teams will help then I'll get on board.
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So what are you suggesting Ivan?
Carry on as is?
Is you view that the people that run the Rangers and Celtic academies have got it all wrong?
Just keep doing the same thing and it will magically get better?
posted on 14/3/22
Ivan wants Dembele and Lowry on loan
Ivan, you are nothing if not consistent! Don’t see a difference between loaning to league 2 or playing in your own team in league 2?
Looking out for your own interests is what Scottish football is all about because our authorities are so weak in the shadow of the big 2. England would be a blessing.
posted on 14/3/22
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 8 minutes ago
Ivan wants Dembele and Lowry on loan
Ivan, you are nothing if not consistent! Don’t see a difference between loaning to league 2 or playing in your own team in league 2?
Looking out for your own interests is what Scottish football is all about because our authorities are so weak in the shadow of the big 2. England would be a blessing.
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exactly, if they are gonna play at that level it might as well be whilst using our far far better facilities, coaches and physios.
posted on 14/3/22
We would be daft to loan out Lowry and Dundee United would be daft to loan Dembele.
posted on 14/3/22
Iniesta, messi, fati, Iniesta, xavi all came through barca b team
Vinicus Jnr, carvajal, vasquez, odegaard, casimeiro all came through reals casilla team.
Only picking these two up cos these need to research and are of the top of my head if I looked into it i would find a lot more.
Not saying the b teams were the reason hey became what they are, but Pep was adamant of its importance to his barca players.
posted on 14/3/22
He definitely wants Rangers to bring through more young players.
So do Rangers as it happens. So that is a decent starting point.
Rangers dont think the status quo is particularly effective and have taken the lead in trying to pursuing alternative ways to challenge their young players. They have been proactive at trying to solve what they see is a problem.
If the answers they have come up with so far arent the best long term answers then fair dos. The club are very open to any new suggestions.
But sticking to the old loans systems doesnt really sound like the most progressive idea.
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