*Nod not nid!
Here's the lyrics - https://www.lyrics.com/lyric/19143578/Monty+Python/Every+Sperm+Is+Sacred
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 4 hours, 22 minutes ago
Are you going to tell us Dwight, after all this, that you think the repeal was a good thing. Ignore legal jargon, was it a good thing for American women?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope.
I’ve stated several times I am pro choice. What I have taken umbrage with is several posters making false comments with zero understanding.
This was never about the rights or wrongs of the decision it was about whether the SCOTUS was legally right and within their right. Which they were.
They have made abortion a legal question. Just like it is in the UK.
Women will have to move around the country to access care. Just as they do in the UK if they’re in Scotland or NI.
The rhetoric on here has been that the US has somehow become more backwards than the UK.
The US has a whole has not. A couple of states have descended to levels below the legal situation currently in the UK. But nobody and I repeat nobody in any state has banned abortion. They have limited access to it to varying medical requirements.
Remember, in the UK a woman cannot just get an abortion out of choice. They have to convince two seperate doctors that she meets one of the several medical requirements.
Contraception and Plan B is going to remain freely available without prescription.
Of the 130 odd million women either in or pre birthing years, 19.8m of them will now be somewhat restricted. So maybe what 12.5% of the female population is highly affected, that’s 12.5% too many but the rhetoric about the US as a whole is clearly incorrect.
I also not a lot of the countries largest employers have publically stated they will pay for abortion travel and costs for all their female workers.
Now I’m not sure how many companies will finally sign up for that initiative, I think it’s at like 15 right now and consists of major banks, retailers and tech companies so hopefully they can bring that 12.5% down some.
One area that’s totally been missed in all of this, is that just because the right to an abortion without reason, has been scrapped in 13 states, the women who won’t be able to travel and get an abortion probably weren’t going to have one anyway.
The cost of an abortion can be highly prohibitive for low income women. This was always an issue even when the no questions asked ‘right’ existed.
But to directly answer you, no taking away the right to choose and restricting it to medical requirements is not a good thing for women.
It is a shame those 13 states have reduced womens rights to those in the UK where there is no right to choose without medical reasoning and approval.
I am glad that a lot of states however will only reenforce the freedom to terminate a pregnancy without reason.
Maybe some of the upset people on here should direct their anger to their own government and get women the right to choose without needing medical grounds and approvals!
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
If we had effective male contraceptive methods then would we have this problem in such magnitude? Problem with male contraception is that it's irreversible, AFAIK.
Even the snip is reversible and they’re rolling a pill out for men now.
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
^ When this argument comes up, it’s also worth reposting that around 93% of US abortions involve fetuses of less than 12 weeks (first trimester). These are inarguably a bunch of cells.
Less than 1% involve fetuses of 20 weeks or more.
(CDC 2019)
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Rosso. Some sense here at last.
I guess that in the US a lot of the anti-abortion lot are fuelled by religion. Well, in the US alone, 1m potential lives are aborted each year via miscarriage. Or, following their logic, by their god.
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 hours, 40 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t disagree, was commenting on your ability to go a bit left field on these things which I find amusing
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Rosso. Some sense here at last.
I guess that in the US a lot of the anti-abortion lot are fuelled by religion. Well, in the US alone, 1m potential lives are aborted each year via miscarriage. Or, following their logic, by their god.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a debate which has far too often focussed on the words of preachers (of one particular denomination of one particular religion) rather than the determinations of the scientific community, which, sadly, appears to be becoming more and more marginalised in the US as far as political debate and policymaking is concerned (cf. mental health, EPA powers, climate policy, scientific isolationism, etc.)
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 hours, 40 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t disagree, was commenting on your ability to go a bit left field on these things which I find amusing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy to be of service! Haha!
I see Dwight still can't get his head around the concept of laws and rights. Rights are provided in law. Those laws, and subsequently rights, can be changed in the UK and in the US (the constitution is just law as well and can be changed).
The US has regressed from allowing all women the opportunity for an abortion (like the UK) with that right guaranteed in law, to banning some of its citizens from having an opportunity for an abortion.
Welshy still doesn’t understand that women in the UK have no right to abortion freely.
In 37 states in the US a woman can say I want an abortion and get one.
In the UK a woman has to meet one of the criteria in the OP and convince two seperate doctors of her eligibility.
In the UK a woman needs permission. In 37 states in the US a woman doesn’t.
You keep lazily saying the US rather than focusing on the 13 states, some of which, have actually got trigger laws extremely similar to the UK, some far worse.
110m women of child bearing years, or pre child bearing years will be able to just turn around and say I want an abortion me get one, no reasoning, just because they want one.
Not a single woman in the UK can say that.
Yet you say the US has the problem…
Once again my feeble minded sparring partner not a single state has outlawed abortion. The 13 aforementioned have created a series of checks and balances to give the woman the opportunity to have an abortion.
Once again just like the UK.
What is the abortion law in England, Scotland and Wales?
Abortions can take place in the first 24 weeks of pregnancy in England, Scotland and Wales.
However, they have to be approved by two doctors. They must agree having the baby would pose a greater risk to the physical or mental health of the woman than a termination.
That’s not a woman having a right to choose, that’s making a woman submit to the opinion of other people to tel her what she can and cannot do.
Basically it’s everything you are saying is wrong with 13 states in the US.
I’m glad we have 37 states where a woman doesn’t need to convince others.
But please keep telling me how the US is backwards and the UK is a utopia for womens rights while ignoring the fact that UK law is basically what 8 of the 13 trigger states are enforcing.
While also ignoring 37 states and over a 100m women have far superior rights than anything in the UK.
It’s comical to listen to frankly, so many of you probably never even knew your own laws, got all hyped up about the media reporting of the US and were outraged completely clueless to the plight of women in your own country.
Because it’s been this way in the UK since 1967.
Why haven’t you been fighting for women to have the right to choose at home all this time.
Because as it stands, women have far more rights in the US as a whole than they do in the UK on this topic
Country A: every woman has the right to book an appointment with 2 seperate doctors, to try and convince them that not terminating her pregnancy will cause her severe medical damage, if it is not the case or ince$t or r@pe (must be examined by a doctor and with a police report). Can’t be because of financial concerns or simply unwanted. Women have to meet strict guidelines. Cannot be simply due to choice. Even within there are varying rules as to age of foetus with one setting the bar as low as ten weeks requiring woman to travel to access abortion once again needing to convince doctors as to a valid reason. All at their own cost.
Country B: 90% of the female population can make a phone call or book online and have a pregnancy terminated with no questions asked as to the reasoning as to why. 10% of the female population will be subjected to providing various degrees of medical reasoning to access abortion in their state or they will have to travel to neighboring states to access no questions asked abortions. Many of the fortune 50 companies who are the nations largest employee have offered to cover the cost.
I know which country or kingdom or union I’d say is the most regressive on womens rights when the facts are laid bare like that
in Country B abortion can be used as a form of birth control then...to me that's immoral and evil
Abortion is often traumatic, often expensive.
I should think very few people view it as birth control.
More commonly women with abusive husbands, mental or physical I'll health, under age girls 'persuaded' by the boy, husbands not wanting another child because of expense.
These are more common reasons imo.
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So if a fetus or person cannot feel pain you would be happy to end their life?
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So if a fetus or person cannot feel pain you would be happy to end their life?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And just why the fack would you think I’d be happy to do that?
And just why the fack would you think I’d be happy to do that?
-------------
Because I said how disgusting it is how blaise people are about aborting a fetus/baby... and your response was some comparision to plants based off not feeling pain...
So presumably you would be ok with ending anyones life if they don't feel pain, or is it just fetuses you draw that conclusion?
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
No, in England a women can decide to have an abortion. It needs to he cleared with medocal professionals (which is exactly the same as the US, unless women there are doing the operation themselves) but the practical application of the law is that the woman can choose to and won't be refused.
Another thing you have gotten wrong in this thread, Dwight.
We get it, you have spent 16 pages defending the idea that women shouldn't be able to choose to get an abortion.
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wasn't the one who mentioned feeling, but anyway you don't if your unconscious, so no they should not be killed. Nor should people in a coma.
In a vegetative state is usually up to relatives.
The point being that the first two examples are not the same as a foetus.
After how many weeks, how should I know, it's up to science.
And, most importantly, it is women who should choose, not men. All God's and Priests appear to be male, so best to keep religion out of it.
And people like you who want a woman to be made to have a baby even if she told her abusive she didn't want one.
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 seconds ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wasn't the one who mentioned feeling, but anyway you don't if your unconscious, so no they should not be killed. Nor should people in a coma.
In a vegetative state is usually up to relatives.
The point being that the first two examples are not the same as a foetus.
After how many weeks, how should I know, it's up to science.
And, most importantly, it is women who should choose, not men. All God's and Priests appear to be male, so best to keep religion out of it.
And people like you who want a woman to be made to have a baby even if she told her abusive she didn't want one.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ooh 400
Sign in if you want to comment
Abortion furore & trigger laws
Page 16 of 18
14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18
posted on 27/6/22
*Nod not nid!
Here's the lyrics - https://www.lyrics.com/lyric/19143578/Monty+Python/Every+Sperm+Is+Sacred
posted on 27/6/22
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 4 hours, 22 minutes ago
Are you going to tell us Dwight, after all this, that you think the repeal was a good thing. Ignore legal jargon, was it a good thing for American women?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope.
I’ve stated several times I am pro choice. What I have taken umbrage with is several posters making false comments with zero understanding.
This was never about the rights or wrongs of the decision it was about whether the SCOTUS was legally right and within their right. Which they were.
They have made abortion a legal question. Just like it is in the UK.
Women will have to move around the country to access care. Just as they do in the UK if they’re in Scotland or NI.
The rhetoric on here has been that the US has somehow become more backwards than the UK.
The US has a whole has not. A couple of states have descended to levels below the legal situation currently in the UK. But nobody and I repeat nobody in any state has banned abortion. They have limited access to it to varying medical requirements.
Remember, in the UK a woman cannot just get an abortion out of choice. They have to convince two seperate doctors that she meets one of the several medical requirements.
Contraception and Plan B is going to remain freely available without prescription.
Of the 130 odd million women either in or pre birthing years, 19.8m of them will now be somewhat restricted. So maybe what 12.5% of the female population is highly affected, that’s 12.5% too many but the rhetoric about the US as a whole is clearly incorrect.
I also not a lot of the countries largest employers have publically stated they will pay for abortion travel and costs for all their female workers.
Now I’m not sure how many companies will finally sign up for that initiative, I think it’s at like 15 right now and consists of major banks, retailers and tech companies so hopefully they can bring that 12.5% down some.
One area that’s totally been missed in all of this, is that just because the right to an abortion without reason, has been scrapped in 13 states, the women who won’t be able to travel and get an abortion probably weren’t going to have one anyway.
The cost of an abortion can be highly prohibitive for low income women. This was always an issue even when the no questions asked ‘right’ existed.
But to directly answer you, no taking away the right to choose and restricting it to medical requirements is not a good thing for women.
It is a shame those 13 states have reduced womens rights to those in the UK where there is no right to choose without medical reasoning and approval.
I am glad that a lot of states however will only reenforce the freedom to terminate a pregnancy without reason.
Maybe some of the upset people on here should direct their anger to their own government and get women the right to choose without needing medical grounds and approvals!
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
posted on 27/6/22
If we had effective male contraceptive methods then would we have this problem in such magnitude? Problem with male contraception is that it's irreversible, AFAIK.
posted on 27/6/22
Even the snip is reversible and they’re rolling a pill out for men now.
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
posted on 27/6/22
^ When this argument comes up, it’s also worth reposting that around 93% of US abortions involve fetuses of less than 12 weeks (first trimester). These are inarguably a bunch of cells.
Less than 1% involve fetuses of 20 weeks or more.
(CDC 2019)
posted on 27/6/22
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Rosso. Some sense here at last.
I guess that in the US a lot of the anti-abortion lot are fuelled by religion. Well, in the US alone, 1m potential lives are aborted each year via miscarriage. Or, following their logic, by their god.
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 hours, 40 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
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Trust you
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It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
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I don’t disagree, was commenting on your ability to go a bit left field on these things which I find amusing
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Rosso. Some sense here at last.
I guess that in the US a lot of the anti-abortion lot are fuelled by religion. Well, in the US alone, 1m potential lives are aborted each year via miscarriage. Or, following their logic, by their god.
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This is a debate which has far too often focussed on the words of preachers (of one particular denomination of one particular religion) rather than the determinations of the scientific community, which, sadly, appears to be becoming more and more marginalised in the US as far as political debate and policymaking is concerned (cf. mental health, EPA powers, climate policy, scientific isolationism, etc.)
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 hours, 40 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t disagree, was commenting on your ability to go a bit left field on these things which I find amusing
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Happy to be of service! Haha!
posted on 27/6/22
I see Dwight still can't get his head around the concept of laws and rights. Rights are provided in law. Those laws, and subsequently rights, can be changed in the UK and in the US (the constitution is just law as well and can be changed).
The US has regressed from allowing all women the opportunity for an abortion (like the UK) with that right guaranteed in law, to banning some of its citizens from having an opportunity for an abortion.
posted on 27/6/22
Welshy still doesn’t understand that women in the UK have no right to abortion freely.
In 37 states in the US a woman can say I want an abortion and get one.
In the UK a woman has to meet one of the criteria in the OP and convince two seperate doctors of her eligibility.
In the UK a woman needs permission. In 37 states in the US a woman doesn’t.
You keep lazily saying the US rather than focusing on the 13 states, some of which, have actually got trigger laws extremely similar to the UK, some far worse.
110m women of child bearing years, or pre child bearing years will be able to just turn around and say I want an abortion me get one, no reasoning, just because they want one.
Not a single woman in the UK can say that.
Yet you say the US has the problem…
Once again my feeble minded sparring partner not a single state has outlawed abortion. The 13 aforementioned have created a series of checks and balances to give the woman the opportunity to have an abortion.
Once again just like the UK.
posted on 27/6/22
What is the abortion law in England, Scotland and Wales?
Abortions can take place in the first 24 weeks of pregnancy in England, Scotland and Wales.
However, they have to be approved by two doctors. They must agree having the baby would pose a greater risk to the physical or mental health of the woman than a termination.
That’s not a woman having a right to choose, that’s making a woman submit to the opinion of other people to tel her what she can and cannot do.
Basically it’s everything you are saying is wrong with 13 states in the US.
I’m glad we have 37 states where a woman doesn’t need to convince others.
But please keep telling me how the US is backwards and the UK is a utopia for womens rights while ignoring the fact that UK law is basically what 8 of the 13 trigger states are enforcing.
While also ignoring 37 states and over a 100m women have far superior rights than anything in the UK.
It’s comical to listen to frankly, so many of you probably never even knew your own laws, got all hyped up about the media reporting of the US and were outraged completely clueless to the plight of women in your own country.
Because it’s been this way in the UK since 1967.
Why haven’t you been fighting for women to have the right to choose at home all this time.
Because as it stands, women have far more rights in the US as a whole than they do in the UK on this topic
posted on 27/6/22
Country A: every woman has the right to book an appointment with 2 seperate doctors, to try and convince them that not terminating her pregnancy will cause her severe medical damage, if it is not the case or ince$t or r@pe (must be examined by a doctor and with a police report). Can’t be because of financial concerns or simply unwanted. Women have to meet strict guidelines. Cannot be simply due to choice. Even within there are varying rules as to age of foetus with one setting the bar as low as ten weeks requiring woman to travel to access abortion once again needing to convince doctors as to a valid reason. All at their own cost.
Country B: 90% of the female population can make a phone call or book online and have a pregnancy terminated with no questions asked as to the reasoning as to why. 10% of the female population will be subjected to providing various degrees of medical reasoning to access abortion in their state or they will have to travel to neighboring states to access no questions asked abortions. Many of the fortune 50 companies who are the nations largest employee have offered to cover the cost.
I know which country or kingdom or union I’d say is the most regressive on womens rights when the facts are laid bare like that
posted on 27/6/22
in Country B abortion can be used as a form of birth control then...to me that's immoral and evil
posted on 27/6/22
Abortion is often traumatic, often expensive.
I should think very few people view it as birth control.
More commonly women with abusive husbands, mental or physical I'll health, under age girls 'persuaded' by the boy, husbands not wanting another child because of expense.
These are more common reasons imo.
posted on 27/6/22
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So if a fetus or person cannot feel pain you would be happy to end their life?
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by And... Rosso... Though its... Yeah and... That... (U17054)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 3 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 4 hours, 3 minutes ago
comment by Ole dirty Baztard - penited and penandes (U19119)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 7 minutes ago
We're aborting potentially millions of lives every time we choose not to have seex. Won't anyone think of those poor sperm?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Trust you
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is true though. I'm fed up of people talking about the sanctity of life when it comes to a small amount of cells. I certainly don't want abortions everywhere all the time but I do want them to be an option for all women. Women shouldn't be made to feel guilty for making that choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bunch of cells?
People are aborting "fetuses" that can feel, grasp, kick, hear sounds...
What makes your life any more important than that fetus?
Disgusting how blaise people are around ending another individuals life.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Some plants can perceive sensations, grasp and even respond to sounds.
That doesn’t mean that they’re conscious, able to feel pain or perceive emotions.
Modern science has a pretty clear position on abortion as far as the fetus is concerned. The biology is pretty well understood; and although there are obviously more questions around elective procedures around 21-24 weeks, arguing for proposals for, for example, six week limits based on the sentience and independence of the fetus is unscientific:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-absurd-pregnancy-math-behind-the-lsquo-six-week-rsquo-abortion-ban/
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So if a fetus or person cannot feel pain you would be happy to end their life?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And just why the fack would you think I’d be happy to do that?
posted on 27/6/22
And just why the fack would you think I’d be happy to do that?
-------------
Because I said how disgusting it is how blaise people are about aborting a fetus/baby... and your response was some comparision to plants based off not feeling pain...
So presumably you would be ok with ending anyones life if they don't feel pain, or is it just fetuses you draw that conclusion?
posted on 27/6/22
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
posted on 27/6/22
No, in England a women can decide to have an abortion. It needs to he cleared with medocal professionals (which is exactly the same as the US, unless women there are doing the operation themselves) but the practical application of the law is that the woman can choose to and won't be refused.
Another thing you have gotten wrong in this thread, Dwight.
We get it, you have spent 16 pages defending the idea that women shouldn't be able to choose to get an abortion.
posted on 27/6/22
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
posted on 27/6/22
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wasn't the one who mentioned feeling, but anyway you don't if your unconscious, so no they should not be killed. Nor should people in a coma.
In a vegetative state is usually up to relatives.
The point being that the first two examples are not the same as a foetus.
After how many weeks, how should I know, it's up to science.
And, most importantly, it is women who should choose, not men. All God's and Priests appear to be male, so best to keep religion out of it.
And people like you who want a woman to be made to have a baby even if she told her abusive she didn't want one.
posted on 27/6/22
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 seconds ago
comment by Ron (U1646)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 47 minutes ago
If you cannot tell the difference between a foetus at an early stage, and person who maybe unconscious then I think your posts on this topic should be regarded as dubious at best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who mentioned someone being unconscious? You're the one who mentioned someone feeling pain.
What about somebody in a coma? Somebody in a vegetative state, should they be killed?
What cutoff point do you like for abortion? 12 weeks? 24 weeks? 40 weeks?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I wasn't the one who mentioned feeling, but anyway you don't if your unconscious, so no they should not be killed. Nor should people in a coma.
In a vegetative state is usually up to relatives.
The point being that the first two examples are not the same as a foetus.
After how many weeks, how should I know, it's up to science.
And, most importantly, it is women who should choose, not men. All God's and Priests appear to be male, so best to keep religion out of it.
And people like you who want a woman to be made to have a baby even if she told her abusive she didn't want one.
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Ooh 400
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