He’s undoubtedly a very talented player but I guess sometimes progress can stall when there’s a combination of managers coming and going and no discernible style of play for the player to express himself in. Of course his own attitude might be the issue too but I’ll wait and see how he does elsewhere before writing him off as a bad player. Knowing how so many of our other ‘shiiit’ players have done elsewhere he may well be another one
There have been more talented players than him, Ravel comes to mind. But talent is 5%, the other 95% is hardwork and attitude.
For whatever the reasons, it hasn't worked out for him at Utd.
Time to move on.
talent is 5%, the other 95% is hardwork and attitude
---
I know that was probably a throw away comment but I was just having this discussion in the pub. I reckon it's more like 50-50. Young guys especially are often d!ckheads, I reckon in (good PL) academies you'll get a lot of very talented idiots. Then it comes down to how that affects your game (ie Dortmund coped with Sancho and got him to perform) and how much you grow out of it. eg Maddison.
We all know about the high profile top pros like Ronaldo or Kane who were driven to bev the best version of themselves. But there's tons of Neymar's and Rooney's playing every week, I'm sure, that are doing just fine with natural ability and fitness, doing the bare minimum.
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 52 seconds ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it’s that plus we’ve had too many luxury players who don’t put a proper shift in at the same time. A team can handle one player like that even these days but two or three? Too much for the rest of the team to handle.
Also, Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset, he's a deek head attitude, high wort rate, higher expectations in his team mates (which affected him at Dortmund apparently). With the right manager he would have thrived here. Bruno was the closest in mindset (even though I think he got burnt out last year and may be affecting him now).
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 52 seconds ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it’s that plus we’ve had too many luxury players who don’t put a proper shift in at the same time. A team can handle one player like that even these days but two or three? Too much for the rest of the team to handle.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It was a necessity. It is a requirement for underperforming teams, for lower level teams.
“ Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset”
Nothing to say is there? Sancho is snowflake.
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 6 minutes ago
“ Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset”
Nothing to say is there? Sancho is snowflake.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lmao. They are plenty of snowflakes in the world. And as a snowflake he was productive enough to make us want him (granted, it was only us, which says more about our recruitment than anything else)
I was only pointing out that it is the most obvious reason why Bellingham and Sancho have different career paths.
Whilst Sancho was tearing it up for Dortmund.....he never really shone for England before we signed him. It was a bit of a warning sign to me that maybe the Bundesliga is just absolutely crap.
In fact to this day I can't think of a single game where Sancho has played for United or England and left me speechless with how good his performance has been.
Similar to Antony.....the one thing he doesn't have is much pace. Wingers in the PL who aren't fast don't tend to be that good either.
Both of them aren't good enough and never will be. I honestly don't think we'd be any worse off had we signed Demari Gray for £1m for Leicester. That's how bad they both are.
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 51 minutes ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We all know the issues United have had as a team/club in recent years and it certainly isn’t the most conducive environment to producing your best football. However, there is a difference between allowing a player freedom within a team structure and a player not working hard. Sancho is often weak and unproductive as well as lacking workrate, and that’s just in games . If stories are to be believed he can be at times laid back bordering on unprofessional in training as well. That’s massively different to what we see in the example you’ve given with Maddison.
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U212
Both of them aren't good enough and never will be. I honestly don't think we'd be any worse off had we signed Demari Gray for £1m for Leicester. That's how bad they both are.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said this last year and was mocked. I'm at the point where I would rather we get cheaper players than the fancy expensive ones. Btw I'll still take Gray now.
comment by DoireDevilBhoy (U10745)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 51 minutes ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We all know the issues United have had as a team/club in recent years and it certainly isn’t the most conducive environment to producing your best football. However, there is a difference between allowing a player freedom within a team structure and a player not working hard. Sancho is often weak and unproductive as well as lacking workrate, and that’s just in games . If stories are to be believed he can be at times laid back bordering on unprofessional in training as well. That’s massively different to what we see in the example you’ve given with Maddison.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maddison's attitude is different from Sancho, but their use is different. He would be a lot more productive in a similar situation
Maddison's attitude at Leicester when they were struggling and heading down was absolutely shocking too tbf. People forget it now after his good start at Spurs. He's shown already though that when the chips are down he's not the man you need.
Also, Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset, he's a deek head attitude, high wort rate
—
He should probably get those worts checked out
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
Generational Talent.
Slips off the tongue too easily
comment by RB&W - One man down, One nil up (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Generational Talent.
Slips off the tongue too easily
----------------------------------------------------------------------
comment by Kamikaze Blue (U7450)
posted 8 minutes ago
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where I get annoyed with people who back him over the manager. His attitude was a problem at City, also at Dortmund, also with the national team.
I'm not an ETH fanboy who thinks the manager can do no wrong. The way we're playing this season speaks for itself in that regard. We should be better.
But the signing of Sancho is yet another example of our recruitment team (if there actually is one) failing at their job. And ETH exiling him for his attitude and calling him a liar is surely completely reasonable in the circumstances. He doesn't get everything right but he's got this one right
comment by merrysupersteve (relaxed about the situation) (U1132)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Kamikaze Blue (U7450)
posted 8 minutes ago
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where I get annoyed with people who back him over the manager. His attitude was a problem at City, also at Dortmund, also with the national team.
I'm not an ETH fanboy who thinks the manager can do no wrong. The way we're playing this season speaks for itself in that regard. We should be better.
But the signing of Sancho is yet another example of our recruitment team (if there actually is one) failing at their job. And ETH exiling him for his attitude and calling him a liar is surely completely reasonable in the circumstances. He doesn't get everything right but he's got this one right
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah I have some concerns about ETH, still behind him, but he got this one spot on
ETH's handling of disciplinary issues has been consistently very good. No doubt about that.
Would be nice to see something to cling to on the pitch though.
Partly on Sancho partly on the club.
Sanchez, Mata, Pogba, Januzaj, Lukaku, ADM, Depay, Rashford, Sancho.
All top quality or top prospects that have inexplicably failed at United.
#brummieisbesht
--------'
Spoken like a true United fan there 👍
comment by U12215 (U22987)
posted 20 minutes ago
Partly on Sancho partly on the club.
Sanchez, Mata, Pogba, Januzaj, Lukaku, ADM, Depay, Rashford, Sancho.
All top quality or top prospects that have inexplicably failed at United.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You just had to stick Rashford in there didnt you. Has he really failed at Man United. Or has he been one of our best and most valuable player for the last few seasons?
comment by 19 + 6 > 20 + 3 (U22930)
posted 27 minutes ago
#brummieisbesht
--------'
Spoken like a true United fan there 👍
----------------------------------------------------------------------
💯 🫡❤️
Sign in if you want to comment
Sancho
Page 1 of 2
posted on 29/10/23
He’s undoubtedly a very talented player but I guess sometimes progress can stall when there’s a combination of managers coming and going and no discernible style of play for the player to express himself in. Of course his own attitude might be the issue too but I’ll wait and see how he does elsewhere before writing him off as a bad player. Knowing how so many of our other ‘shiiit’ players have done elsewhere he may well be another one
posted on 29/10/23
There have been more talented players than him, Ravel comes to mind. But talent is 5%, the other 95% is hardwork and attitude.
For whatever the reasons, it hasn't worked out for him at Utd.
Time to move on.
posted on 29/10/23
talent is 5%, the other 95% is hardwork and attitude
---
I know that was probably a throw away comment but I was just having this discussion in the pub. I reckon it's more like 50-50. Young guys especially are often d!ckheads, I reckon in (good PL) academies you'll get a lot of very talented idiots. Then it comes down to how that affects your game (ie Dortmund coped with Sancho and got him to perform) and how much you grow out of it. eg Maddison.
We all know about the high profile top pros like Ronaldo or Kane who were driven to bev the best version of themselves. But there's tons of Neymar's and Rooney's playing every week, I'm sure, that are doing just fine with natural ability and fitness, doing the bare minimum.
posted on 29/10/23
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 52 seconds ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it’s that plus we’ve had too many luxury players who don’t put a proper shift in at the same time. A team can handle one player like that even these days but two or three? Too much for the rest of the team to handle.
posted on 29/10/23
Also, Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset, he's a deek head attitude, high wort rate, higher expectations in his team mates (which affected him at Dortmund apparently). With the right manager he would have thrived here. Bruno was the closest in mindset (even though I think he got burnt out last year and may be affecting him now).
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 52 seconds ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it’s that plus we’ve had too many luxury players who don’t put a proper shift in at the same time. A team can handle one player like that even these days but two or three? Too much for the rest of the team to handle.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It was a necessity. It is a requirement for underperforming teams, for lower level teams.
posted on 29/10/23
“ Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset”
Nothing to say is there? Sancho is snowflake.
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 6 minutes ago
“ Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset”
Nothing to say is there? Sancho is snowflake.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lmao. They are plenty of snowflakes in the world. And as a snowflake he was productive enough to make us want him (granted, it was only us, which says more about our recruitment than anything else)
I was only pointing out that it is the most obvious reason why Bellingham and Sancho have different career paths.
posted on 29/10/23
Whilst Sancho was tearing it up for Dortmund.....he never really shone for England before we signed him. It was a bit of a warning sign to me that maybe the Bundesliga is just absolutely crap.
In fact to this day I can't think of a single game where Sancho has played for United or England and left me speechless with how good his performance has been.
Similar to Antony.....the one thing he doesn't have is much pace. Wingers in the PL who aren't fast don't tend to be that good either.
Both of them aren't good enough and never will be. I honestly don't think we'd be any worse off had we signed Demari Gray for £1m for Leicester. That's how bad they both are.
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 51 minutes ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We all know the issues United have had as a team/club in recent years and it certainly isn’t the most conducive environment to producing your best football. However, there is a difference between allowing a player freedom within a team structure and a player not working hard. Sancho is often weak and unproductive as well as lacking workrate, and that’s just in games . If stories are to be believed he can be at times laid back bordering on unprofessional in training as well. That’s massively different to what we see in the example you’ve given with Maddison.
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U212
Both of them aren't good enough and never will be. I honestly don't think we'd be any worse off had we signed Demari Gray for £1m for Leicester. That's how bad they both are.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said this last year and was mocked. I'm at the point where I would rather we get cheaper players than the fancy expensive ones. Btw I'll still take Gray now.
posted on 29/10/23
comment by DoireDevilBhoy (U10745)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 51 minutes ago
There are team structures where the player thrives without having duties involved with hardwork or attitude. Watching Spurs thriving now and it has a lot to do with limiting Maddison's defensive duties. Sancho (though not deserving based on pure ability) would succeed on the work rate requirements.
For years sadly, United has needed 100% work rate from everyone to succeed. We need that to survive now. Even the most productive ones, a slight slack in their work rate has massive performance and result drop offs. We are not ready for he Sancho's of the world now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We all know the issues United have had as a team/club in recent years and it certainly isn’t the most conducive environment to producing your best football. However, there is a difference between allowing a player freedom within a team structure and a player not working hard. Sancho is often weak and unproductive as well as lacking workrate, and that’s just in games . If stories are to be believed he can be at times laid back bordering on unprofessional in training as well. That’s massively different to what we see in the example you’ve given with Maddison.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maddison's attitude is different from Sancho, but their use is different. He would be a lot more productive in a similar situation
posted on 29/10/23
Maddison's attitude at Leicester when they were struggling and heading down was absolutely shocking too tbf. People forget it now after his good start at Spurs. He's shown already though that when the chips are down he's not the man you need.
posted on 29/10/23
Also, Jude is a complete opposite in mental mindset, he's a deek head attitude, high wort rate
—
He should probably get those worts checked out
posted on 29/10/23
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
posted on 29/10/23
Generational Talent.
Slips off the tongue too easily
posted on 29/10/23
comment by RB&W - One man down, One nil up (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Generational Talent.
Slips off the tongue too easily
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 29/10/23
comment by Kamikaze Blue (U7450)
posted 8 minutes ago
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where I get annoyed with people who back him over the manager. His attitude was a problem at City, also at Dortmund, also with the national team.
I'm not an ETH fanboy who thinks the manager can do no wrong. The way we're playing this season speaks for itself in that regard. We should be better.
But the signing of Sancho is yet another example of our recruitment team (if there actually is one) failing at their job. And ETH exiling him for his attitude and calling him a liar is surely completely reasonable in the circumstances. He doesn't get everything right but he's got this one right
posted on 29/10/23
comment by merrysupersteve (relaxed about the situation) (U1132)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Kamikaze Blue (U7450)
posted 8 minutes ago
How did we get it so wrong?
City let him go. Not that they didn't rate him, just that they didn't rate him as highly as he rated himself. That might have been a hint. Bit like SAF letting Pogba go, with 20:20 hindsight he was dead right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is where I get annoyed with people who back him over the manager. His attitude was a problem at City, also at Dortmund, also with the national team.
I'm not an ETH fanboy who thinks the manager can do no wrong. The way we're playing this season speaks for itself in that regard. We should be better.
But the signing of Sancho is yet another example of our recruitment team (if there actually is one) failing at their job. And ETH exiling him for his attitude and calling him a liar is surely completely reasonable in the circumstances. He doesn't get everything right but he's got this one right
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah I have some concerns about ETH, still behind him, but he got this one spot on
posted on 29/10/23
ETH's handling of disciplinary issues has been consistently very good. No doubt about that.
Would be nice to see something to cling to on the pitch though.
posted on 29/10/23
Partly on Sancho partly on the club.
Sanchez, Mata, Pogba, Januzaj, Lukaku, ADM, Depay, Rashford, Sancho.
All top quality or top prospects that have inexplicably failed at United.
posted on 29/10/23
#brummieisbesht
--------'
Spoken like a true United fan there 👍
posted on 29/10/23
comment by U12215 (U22987)
posted 20 minutes ago
Partly on Sancho partly on the club.
Sanchez, Mata, Pogba, Januzaj, Lukaku, ADM, Depay, Rashford, Sancho.
All top quality or top prospects that have inexplicably failed at United.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You just had to stick Rashford in there didnt you. Has he really failed at Man United. Or has he been one of our best and most valuable player for the last few seasons?
posted on 29/10/23
comment by 19 + 6 > 20 + 3 (U22930)
posted 27 minutes ago
#brummieisbesht
--------'
Spoken like a true United fan there 👍
----------------------------------------------------------------------
💯 🫡❤️
Page 1 of 2