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A good debate below on "Competing"

which I enjoyed.
A lot has been made of Ole's style of play and lack of a recognised system.
So what would be the best for us to play with the current squad and what should we aim for.

Under SAF he got it down to a fine art.
A left footed winger, Giggs, backed up by a leftie fullback Evra.
A right winger Becks backed up by Gary.
A CB with pace Rio, and one with power Vidic.
A defensive mid Roy
An attacking mid Scholes
An inside forward Yorke sub Sheringham
Striker Cole sub Ole.

No square pegs in round holes, everybody knew their jobs.
4 - 2 - 4.
Now can we play that now, it's gone out of fashion and we certainly don't have the players.

I would go for 4 - 3 - 3
With one of the mids bolstering the attack.

The problem Ole has been given is that we have no real wingers. So no equal to the Giggs/Evra setup. So the fullbacks have to do it all. I think AWB can grow into the role and hope Williams can.

Our centreback situation is compounded by injuries.
Maguire is the Vidic role. Perhaps Tzuanebe or Bailly could have been a good partner but who knows?
Smalling yes, but the worry is he can't keep his hands to himself in the box, and with VAR it could be fatal.

I am assuming Pogba is gone and Bruno coming.
So Fred defensive midfield, McT box to box and Bruno attacking.
For the moment Rashy, James and Martial upfront.

That looks a more balanced team to me, and then we can buy a player that is better than the current if and when they become available.
Subs are a problem as we don't have good strength in depth to cover injuries, but it will have to be gradual.

I think the criticism of Ole's style of play a little unfair, losing Pogba meant he pretty much had to go with a counter attacking style, especially bearing in mind our pacy forwards.
But we don't have the players to play a style that easily opens stubborn defences
Hopefully Bruno would help us in both situations.

So what is the feeling about the style we should adopt, and what has Ole been doing wrong, and how to put it right, if anything.


posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

I think the importance of being without Pogba - and to a lesser extant McTominay - for large parts of the season has been massively understated (or unacknowledged) by a lot of our fans.

Even City, as good as they are, don't look nearly as good when De Bruyne is out injured. Pogba is that important for us when it comes to unlocking the less ambitious sides in the league.

I have no doubt that we'd be comfortably situated in the top four if we'd had Pogba for even a third of the games he's missed where we've dropped points. As frustrating as I find him, even I have to appreciate what he brings to the team.

It's hard to judge Ole for any perceived playing style when key injuries have limited us to one particular counter-attacking style. I do think that Mata has been severely under-utilised in Pogba's stead, for which the blame does fall at Ole's feet, but Lingard was key to the way we played when Ole first came in, so I can see why he's been loyal to the player.

If we can get Fernandes (whom I haven;'t seen, but I've gotta defer to some of the people on here who claim to have followed him closely), and get a fit Pogba back, as well as this van de beek lad we've been linked to, then I'd expect us to be able to change up our style.

We desperately need an effective #9/false 9 to have more success with the high press. Martial doesn't cut it.

posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

De Bruyne only started 11 PL games last season and they looked pretty good.

I think while Pogba is clearly one of the most talented players (if not most talented) we have it isn’t clear that we are better with him based on his form for us. He had a very good 2-3 months last season but before that was hugely inconsistent and I dont think his absence has been understated because it isn’t clear what Pogba we would have missed.

posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

I'd like to see us far less reliant on pace alone.

posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

De Bruyne only started 11 PL games last season and they looked pretty good.

-

They did, and of course they would with the talent they have. But it’s fair to say that they’re a much better side when he plays. We were still a good side without Ronaldo in 07/08, but we were a different proposition entirely when he played.

posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

Buts it’s an odd comparison to make firstly because City have the squad to replace him to some degree where as we have a poor squad and secondly because Pogba is nowhere near as influential for us as De Bruyne is for City. And as I said, it isn’t clear how much we miss Pogba because it isn’t clear how he’ll perform for us as he’s been hugely inconsistent during his time at the club. There are no guarantees we’ll see the Pogba who played well for 2-3 months last season.

posted 3 days, 1 hour ago

I think the importance of being without Pogba - and to a lesser extant McTominay - for large parts of the season has been massively understated (or unacknowledged) by a lot of our fans.
---------------------
Its huge.

I think the last time we had a fit Paul Pogba was at Southampton in August (not counting the Arsenal game which he was rushed back for). If you told me at the start of the season we'd be without Pogba for 6 months I wouldn't have given us a cat's chance in hell of getting top 4.

It's not necessarily a complete defence of Ole, because I think it was naive to go into a season like this. CM should have been absolute top priority. But I do have some sympathy in that the worst thing that couldve happened injury-wise has happened.

comment by Greg- (U1192)

posted 3 days ago

Difference is with that old team, they all played their hearts out 99% of the time.

This new lot are a lazy bunch of sh!thouses.

Plus you mention Keane being a defensive mid, that guy could also pass and score goals.
Scholes was also a heavy tackler, a good passer and a scorer of a fair few goals.
We had backups Nicky butt who was a decent all rounder too and better than anything we currently have.

posted 3 days ago

comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 55 minutes ago
Buts it’s an odd comparison to make firstly because City have the squad to replace him to some degree where as we have a poor squad and secondly because Pogba is nowhere near as influential for us as De Bruyne is for City. And as I said, it isn’t clear how much we miss Pogba because it isn’t clear how he’ll perform for us as he’s been hugely inconsistent during his time at the club. There are no guarantees we’ll see the Pogba who played well for 2-3 months last season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

It’s only an odd comparison if you’re being obtuse regarding the point being made; that any team would suffer losing their best player, but especially United who don’t have a wealth of quality to absorb it.

posted 3 days ago

Agreed Greg. I'm trying to show that Ole does not have the wealth of talent SAF built up, he had the right player for each position.
Ole doesn't have that luxury yet, so has to try and find a style that suits what he has.

posted 2 days, 21 hours ago

The poster of that thread is of questionable club loyalty IMO and is Ole Out as well as a Flopp Fanboy. One of a handful of alleged Manchester United online "supporters"who make me wonder if maybe they picked the club out of convenience while we were on top and aren't going to stay on board while we're struggling. Ole's doing the best he can and I'm putting my faith in him. He is still learning, and normally managers don't come here to learn. But having Manchester United DNA is something the club wanted a return to, and I'm seeing improvement. With another 4 signings before next season, I think Ole can get us competing on all fronts again. Even Sir alex needed a few seasons to get us out of the "cup team" rut and make us Champions again.

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