You guys can slate the article. I just look at the facts, which are easy to depict : We have won NOTHING to justify us being a "big" club and all of those players that have left us in pursuit of winning trophies have done exactly what they set out to do, the ones that have failed still cant be blamed because since they would have less of a chance of doing it at arsenil
----------------------
Define a "big club".
Is a club a "big club" by winning trophies? Birmingham City won a trophy last year. Are they "bigger" than we are?
Or is a "big club" one that remains competitive as a football team and a business in one of the most difficult professional sport environments in the world, consistently so for more than a decade.
We finished 3rd in the Premier League this season just gone. There are only 2 teams in the entire country that did better than us in the league.
We are a big club. You can b|tch and moan all you like about a lack of signings or the trophies you seem so desperate for but it won't change a thing. We are a massive club.
what articles like this completely fail to percevie and account for is that whacking great stadium we have. it has to be paid for.
we elected to pay down the loans on it way ahead of schedule in order to save the club tens of millions of pounds in the long run. All this was spelt out very clearly before we ever started building it.
The economic downturn certainly hasn't helped us, but we still are in an extremely positive position in the long term, even if it has meant in the short term we have had to cut our cloth accordingly.
Bear in mind that every other club that has built a new self paid for stadium has struggled like hell to even stay in the league, whereas we have mananged to stay in the top 4 the whole time.
So how about you put your sticks away, stop beating the manager and board with them and say "thankyou" for not only looking to the longterm future of our club, when most of them won't even be around, but for managing to keep us in the right ball park area of the table at the same time.
'there is no success without failure'
of course all Arsenal fans want to win things but the fans who start throwing their toys out the pram when it doesn't happen just look like spoilt kids.
my team didn't come first it's not fair.
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
I do believe that us gaining the stadium is a trophy of sorts. People always say "in 2050, nobody will remember you came third apart from Arsenal fans."
And I completely agree. Nobody will remember that, just as nobody will also remember that Birmingham won the Carling Cup last year in 40 years time. However, what people will remember and recognise is the freaking massive 60,000 seater stadium glaring down on your.
I honestly would prefer to have a massive stadium that gives us financial security and go 7 or 8 years without a trophy, that gain a poxy cup.
In all honesty winning trophies as a big club, means the Premier League and/or Champions League, maybe a domestic cup double might be OK also.
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
-----------------
By whose standards? Yours? Perhaps you should manage your expectations better.
Or start supporting another team.
I wonder why our top players are so desperate to leave when we are such a massive club, clueless idiots the bunch of them!
probably something to do with being offered double the wages, not rocket science.
probably something to do with being offered double the wages, not rocket science.
---------------------
If a player left Arsenal stating "rocket science" was the reason behind the move, I would stand up from wherever I was sitting and never stop applauding.
Rocket science
I wish they'd take down the surround with all our trophy wins on it.
I for one don't need a banner to know my club's history. It just seems a bit too 'plastic-friendly' to me, which hardly helps matters.
It's just decorative, Lex. Plus I think it helped carry the history from Highbury to the Emirates.
The clock from Highbury helped in that respect as well.
Or probably something to do with us not showing any ambition in the transfer market and players becoming disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies, not rocket science either.
We are the only 'top' club that qualifies for the CL each season yet our squad keeps getting weaker and weaker.
same Lex I was never a big fan of that
Or probably something to do with us not showing any ambition in the transfer market and players becoming disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies, not rocket science either.
--------------------
So what would you consider ambitious? A £40m bid for Gotze? A £50m bid for Lucas Moura? £100 million billion bid for Neymar?
And what evidence do you have that suggests players are becoming "disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies"? Cesc was full of praise for the manager when he left. So was Henry and Vieira. And if, god forbid, RVP were to leave I'm sure he'll be just as complimentary about Wenger as the others who left before him.
comment by Melo -- The internet isn't real. It was all an elaborate hoax and we got you good. (U1089)
posted 19 minutes ago
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
-----------------
By whose standards? Yours? Perhaps you should manage your expectations better.
Or start supporting another team.
___________________________________________
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement !
ambition is a bit of a pointless word nowadays, it basically equates to 'how rich is your owner'. being disillusioned with Wenger's philosophy is purely your opinion, false imo given the respect every player has for him. what attracted the players to City... the philisophy? history? or the huge sums of money, sorry, ambition on offer? Money rules in football nowadays, it's naive to think otherwise.
Now I want us to spend £250m on Messi.
The mere fact that they are so desperate to leave as soon as another club shows a tiny bit of interest in them.
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement !
--------------------------------------------
barcelona recently went several years without winning a thing, prior to building the current dominating team. I'd still say during that time they were a fairly big club, wouldn't you?
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement
-------------------
Like you said, it's all relative.
You may consider 7 trophyless years to be an underachievement but I think that is horribly simplistic. A clubs success is based on more than the number of cups in a cabinet.
comment by 8bit('',) (U2653)
posted 51 seconds ago
ambition is a bit of a pointless word nowadays, it basically equates to 'how rich is your owner'. being disillusioned with Wenger's philosophy is purely your opinion, false imo given the respect every player has for him. what attracted the players to City... the philisophy? history? or the huge sums of money, sorry, ambition on offer? Money rules in football nowadays, it's naive to think otherwise.
___________________________________________
Surely ambition equates to legally striving to be the best you can be. To fulfil your potential !
Hardly a description that would apply to Arsenal since a few years now !
yes i agree, and anyone who thinks we have the same potential as clubs who spend half a billion pounds on their squad is deluded.
comment by Melo -- The internet isn't real. It was all an elaborate hoax and we got you good. (U1089)
posted 3 minutes ago
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement
-------------------
Like you said, it's all relative.
You may consider 7 trophyless years to be an underachievement but I think that is horribly simplistic. A clubs success is based on more than the number of cups in a cabinet.
___________________________________________
That's the good thing about competition,
RESULTS. It IS pretty simple !
After the "game/race/tournament, etc" is over, you either won or you didn't !
We don't have the financial power to compete with City and Chelsea but we do have the resources to compete for players in the £15-20m range.
That's the good thing about competition,
RESULTS. It IS pretty simple !
After the "game/race/tournament, etc" is over, you either won or you didn't !
-----------------------
But not finishing as top dog isn't an underachievement or an indication that a club is not a massive one. All it tells you is that at least one other team did better.
Medals come in other colours than gold.
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Can we be honest?
Page 2 of 3
posted on 29/5/12
You guys can slate the article. I just look at the facts, which are easy to depict : We have won NOTHING to justify us being a "big" club and all of those players that have left us in pursuit of winning trophies have done exactly what they set out to do, the ones that have failed still cant be blamed because since they would have less of a chance of doing it at arsenil
----------------------
Define a "big club".
Is a club a "big club" by winning trophies? Birmingham City won a trophy last year. Are they "bigger" than we are?
Or is a "big club" one that remains competitive as a football team and a business in one of the most difficult professional sport environments in the world, consistently so for more than a decade.
We finished 3rd in the Premier League this season just gone. There are only 2 teams in the entire country that did better than us in the league.
We are a big club. You can b|tch and moan all you like about a lack of signings or the trophies you seem so desperate for but it won't change a thing. We are a massive club.
posted on 29/5/12
what articles like this completely fail to percevie and account for is that whacking great stadium we have. it has to be paid for.
we elected to pay down the loans on it way ahead of schedule in order to save the club tens of millions of pounds in the long run. All this was spelt out very clearly before we ever started building it.
The economic downturn certainly hasn't helped us, but we still are in an extremely positive position in the long term, even if it has meant in the short term we have had to cut our cloth accordingly.
Bear in mind that every other club that has built a new self paid for stadium has struggled like hell to even stay in the league, whereas we have mananged to stay in the top 4 the whole time.
So how about you put your sticks away, stop beating the manager and board with them and say "thankyou" for not only looking to the longterm future of our club, when most of them won't even be around, but for managing to keep us in the right ball park area of the table at the same time.
posted on 29/5/12
'there is no success without failure'
of course all Arsenal fans want to win things but the fans who start throwing their toys out the pram when it doesn't happen just look like spoilt kids.
my team didn't come first it's not fair.
posted on 29/5/12
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
posted on 29/5/12
I do believe that us gaining the stadium is a trophy of sorts. People always say "in 2050, nobody will remember you came third apart from Arsenal fans."
And I completely agree. Nobody will remember that, just as nobody will also remember that Birmingham won the Carling Cup last year in 40 years time. However, what people will remember and recognise is the freaking massive 60,000 seater stadium glaring down on your.
I honestly would prefer to have a massive stadium that gives us financial security and go 7 or 8 years without a trophy, that gain a poxy cup.
posted on 29/5/12
In all honesty winning trophies as a big club, means the Premier League and/or Champions League, maybe a domestic cup double might be OK also.
posted on 29/5/12
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
-----------------
By whose standards? Yours? Perhaps you should manage your expectations better.
Or start supporting another team.
posted on 29/5/12
I wonder why our top players are so desperate to leave when we are such a massive club, clueless idiots the bunch of them!
posted on 29/5/12
probably something to do with being offered double the wages, not rocket science.
posted on 29/5/12
probably something to do with being offered double the wages, not rocket science.
---------------------
If a player left Arsenal stating "rocket science" was the reason behind the move, I would stand up from wherever I was sitting and never stop applauding.
Rocket science
posted on 29/5/12
I wish they'd take down the surround with all our trophy wins on it.
I for one don't need a banner to know my club's history. It just seems a bit too 'plastic-friendly' to me, which hardly helps matters.
posted on 29/5/12
It's just decorative, Lex. Plus I think it helped carry the history from Highbury to the Emirates.
The clock from Highbury helped in that respect as well.
posted on 29/5/12
Or probably something to do with us not showing any ambition in the transfer market and players becoming disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies, not rocket science either.
We are the only 'top' club that qualifies for the CL each season yet our squad keeps getting weaker and weaker.
posted on 29/5/12
same Lex I was never a big fan of that
posted on 29/5/12
Or probably something to do with us not showing any ambition in the transfer market and players becoming disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies, not rocket science either.
--------------------
So what would you consider ambitious? A £40m bid for Gotze? A £50m bid for Lucas Moura? £100 million billion bid for Neymar?
And what evidence do you have that suggests players are becoming "disillusioned with Wenger's philosophies"? Cesc was full of praise for the manager when he left. So was Henry and Vieira. And if, god forbid, RVP were to leave I'm sure he'll be just as complimentary about Wenger as the others who left before him.
posted on 29/5/12
comment by Melo -- The internet isn't real. It was all an elaborate hoax and we got you good. (U1089)
posted 19 minutes ago
If we are a massive club, then we are massively underachieving
-----------------
By whose standards? Yours? Perhaps you should manage your expectations better.
Or start supporting another team.
___________________________________________
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement !
posted on 29/5/12
ambition is a bit of a pointless word nowadays, it basically equates to 'how rich is your owner'. being disillusioned with Wenger's philosophy is purely your opinion, false imo given the respect every player has for him. what attracted the players to City... the philisophy? history? or the huge sums of money, sorry, ambition on offer? Money rules in football nowadays, it's naive to think otherwise.
posted on 29/5/12
Now I want us to spend £250m on Messi.
The mere fact that they are so desperate to leave as soon as another club shows a tiny bit of interest in them.
posted on 29/5/12
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement !
--------------------------------------------
barcelona recently went several years without winning a thing, prior to building the current dominating team. I'd still say during that time they were a fairly big club, wouldn't you?
posted on 29/5/12
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement
-------------------
Like you said, it's all relative.
You may consider 7 trophyless years to be an underachievement but I think that is horribly simplistic. A clubs success is based on more than the number of cups in a cabinet.
posted on 29/5/12
comment by 8bit('',) (U2653)
posted 51 seconds ago
ambition is a bit of a pointless word nowadays, it basically equates to 'how rich is your owner'. being disillusioned with Wenger's philosophy is purely your opinion, false imo given the respect every player has for him. what attracted the players to City... the philisophy? history? or the huge sums of money, sorry, ambition on offer? Money rules in football nowadays, it's naive to think otherwise.
___________________________________________
Surely ambition equates to legally striving to be the best you can be. To fulfil your potential !
Hardly a description that would apply to Arsenal since a few years now !
posted on 29/5/12
yes i agree, and anyone who thinks we have the same potential as clubs who spend half a billion pounds on their squad is deluded.
posted on 29/5/12
comment by Melo -- The internet isn't real. It was all an elaborate hoax and we got you good. (U1089)
posted 3 minutes ago
I wouldn't have thought that a club who are viewed/claim to be of elite status would go 7 years without a winning a competitive competition and call it anything less than underachievement
-------------------
Like you said, it's all relative.
You may consider 7 trophyless years to be an underachievement but I think that is horribly simplistic. A clubs success is based on more than the number of cups in a cabinet.
___________________________________________
That's the good thing about competition,
RESULTS. It IS pretty simple !
After the "game/race/tournament, etc" is over, you either won or you didn't !
posted on 29/5/12
We don't have the financial power to compete with City and Chelsea but we do have the resources to compete for players in the £15-20m range.
posted on 29/5/12
That's the good thing about competition,
RESULTS. It IS pretty simple !
After the "game/race/tournament, etc" is over, you either won or you didn't !
-----------------------
But not finishing as top dog isn't an underachievement or an indication that a club is not a massive one. All it tells you is that at least one other team did better.
Medals come in other colours than gold.
Page 2 of 3