People are fickle.
Now they've gone out and played some dull football in the semis, against a similarly dull and conservative team that contains Messi, Aguero, Higuian, Lavezzi and Di Maria, it means we'll be playing dull football and he's not all he's cracked up to be - despite the fact they actually over achieved anyway.
But his club management has been very different from what he's done in six games at the world cup.
I think that's a better thing to take into consideration when trying to judge what Van Gaal can bring to United. 1000 games of experience at the top level and top clubs.
Not overachieving in 6 games at the world cup.
This is one of my pet hates about the world cup, though I love the tournaments, just how it warps people's perceptions and opinions.
Darren, think opposition fans are just wumming because of who he will manage next season.
They have played some decent football here and there but since the knockout stages no ones be exciting(putting yesterdays game aside).
With the gulf in player class between the Dutch and the Argentinians, this sold have been an ready victory for the latter on paper.
I think you underestimate the fickle nature of 606 when international tournaments are on.
Some will be wumming, but others won't be. Some with have their own fears about what they've seen at the world cup, and others won't.
I love the world cup, but sometimes you cannot take too much from it when judging what is gonna happen at club level.
Ronaldo had a poor world cup. Most of the Spain team did. I don't expect that to mean they'll do the same at club level.
So what a manager does shouldn't either.
Kleberson had a good tournament a few years back. We bought him. Was a flop. Can't judge players in tournaments like this.
It's why I'm not sure if Danny of the Dutch players will be signed by is.
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
comment by CurrentlyInChina84 (U11181)
posted 9 minutes ago
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he couldn't use what he didn't have !
He's a very good manager, the best you could have got...
I hope he fails though
comment by Football_bloodyhell (U17867)
posted 39 minutes ago
comment by CurrentlyInChina84 (U11181)
posted 9 minutes ago
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he couldn't use what he didn't have !
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, someone should tell Roy that.
Pragmatic I agree, in that he thought that their best chance of success was to shut up shop and hope some Robben/RvP/Sneijder magic would see them through, but there's more talent in Dutch footy and this actual Dutch side than he's allowed them to express imo. Some people are making out he had no choice as if all he had was a bunch of grinders, it's not true.
Argentina weren't much attacking either. Both teams put defence first. You could see that from the amount of people on Robben and Messi.
Let's be honest. If LVG wasn't going to manage United, there wouldn't be so much of opposition fans having a go at LVG. They attacked more than the Argentines yet people say they shut up shop.
Neither side attacked too much, that's the truth. I'm not an oppo fan btw, I've not said a bad word about LvG these past few weeks.
ioag, yeah I think that's true to an extent.
Though I think that like Argentina, they have suffered from not having a player in the midfield that can link the play.
Sneijder should be able to do this but he's been crap. Shadow of the player he was four years ago. Classie, from what I've seen, which isn't much, looks like the type of player that could do that but wasn't used until it was too late.
And as I said earlier, most national teams have become pretty cautious over the years. Especially in the ko rounds, Germany vs Brazil being a notable exception.
I also think the 352 has been a wrong decision on his part. Worked brilliantly against Spain but other than that hasn't been something I've been impressed with.
They've looked better when playing 433 overall. I think he made a mistake tonight not switching to 433 and bringing on Depay. Would have got a lot more joy than they did, in my opinion.
Did well in getting them so far. So I'm sure they'll all be happy enough with how they did, even though they possibly could have gone further with a bit more adventure and tactical tweaks.
Sneijder should be able to do this but he's been crap. Shadow of the player he was four years ago. Classie, from what I've seen, which isn't much, looks like the type of player that could do that but wasn't used until it was too late.
--
Agree that they had the staff to be a bit more venturous, and also that the k.o rounds have tended to be increasingly cagey since 1990.
De Guzman isn't what I'd call a creative fulcrum, but he did well early doors, why was he benched and not used again? Not injured afaik. Depay as you said always added something. LvG used almost all of his squad over 6 games; I'm not sure you want to keep tweaking your starting XI so much in a tournament like this.
I dunno really. I thought De Guzman did ok defensively but nobody in that midfield really looked that good with the ball, including Sneijder, and it just seemed to isolate the forwards more.
When they had genuine wingers it was easier to get the ball forward because there was more than one player out wide and they didn't need to play through the middle - something they weren't very good at.
Though whether this is all down to the formation is hard to gauge because it could be simply down to having a sub with pace against tired legs and chasing the game making them more positive.
Shame they didn't have Strootman. I think we'd have seen a more positive display in many of the games had he played.
comment by itsonlyagame - Gracias, Don Alfredo (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 48 minutes ago
Neither side attacked too much, that's the truth. I'm not an oppo fan btw, I've not said a bad word about LvG these past few weeks.
---------------------------
Wasn't refering to you. If you head over to the Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea board, you will see them having pops at LVG for tonight.
The match was boring and there wasn't much between them. The game needed a goal to make things interesting.
I like Van Gaal. Think he is a proper manager, similar to Mourinho/Hiddink/Simeone/Ferguson etc...
Even though Holland were brilliant the group stages, they were poor in the knock out stages.
For 85 mins against Mexico they were awful and deserved to lose. They got a bit lucky with Sneijder scoring a brilliant goal and getting a lucky penalty to win. But maybe Van Gaal had that winning mentality to get them through.
Wtf was he doing playing 5 at the back against Costa Rica? He could have gone for that and won the much earlier on. They could have lost this game and had to rely on penalties.
Vs Argentina...did pretty well to not concede but so did Iran and Switzerland so it's not that hard and they parked the bus the whole game and relied on pens. They didn't score for 2 games of 90 mins plus extra time twice...hahaha!
So to sum up:
1. I think Van Gaal is a great manager tbh. I like him.
2. Holland were brilliant in the first 3 games.
3. Holland were very poor in the last 3 games.
4. Holland did park the bus. ( They really did... )
Nothing wrong with parking the bus! But you really can't deny that this is what they did.
They park the bus yet manage to attack Argentina as much as they were attacked? Thats some parking.
To be honest, both teams were dire. They both set out to stifle the other. But rival fans are jumping up with joy that LVG's team is out and his team didn't perform well (neither sides did, but hardly anyone having a go at Argentina).
Chelsea beat Liverpool 2-0 at Anfield. They still parked the bus! Plus you're always going to create a few chances with Robben and Van Persie upfront.
comment by Who's Kissing Cameras?! (U1703)
posted 10 hours, 44 minutes ago
IAmMe stupidly fogetting Spain's dominance between '08-'14.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not forgotten, because it is not true.
Spain were massively over rated, during that period. They were ugly to watch and their record was not particularly dominant. Argentina were by far and away the best team at the last two world cups.
Mind you, I did kind of expect something along this kind if 'dronelike' response. Nice to not be disappointed.
dom·i·nant
adj.
1. Exercising the most influence or control.
2. Most prominent, as in position; ascendant.
Spain's int'l record from the beginning of 2007 to the start of the 2014 World Cup:
Major int'l tournaments contested: 3
Major int'l tournaments won: 3
Official games only:
P64 W58 D3 L3
Win% 90.6%
Clean sheets 39 (60.1%)
Incl. friendlies:
P109 W90 D11 L8
Win% 82.6%
Clean sheets 65 (59.6%)
Other:
FIFA int'l team of the year: 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013
All-time int'l football records set during the period:
Most consecutive games undefeated
35 (2007–2009)
Most consecutive wins including friendlies
15 (2008–2009)
Most consecutive competitive games undefeated
29 (2010–2013)
I think that might be deemed by most as being at least a bit dominant.
comment by itsonlyagame - Gracias, Don Alfredo (U6426)
posted 11 minutes ago
dom·i·nant
adj.
1. Exercising the most influence or control.
2. Most prominent, as in position; ascendant.
Spain's int'l record from the beginning of 2007 to the start of the 2014 World Cup:
Major int'l tournaments contested: 3
Major int'l tournaments won: 3
Official games only:
P64 W58 D3 L3
Win% 90.6%
Clean sheets 39 (60.1%)
Incl. friendlies:
P109 W90 D11 L8
Win% 82.6%
Clean sheets 65 (59.6%)
Other:
FIFA int'l team of the year: 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013
All-time int'l football records set during the period:
Most consecutive games undefeated
35 (2007–2009)
Most consecutive wins including friendlies
15 (2008–2009)
Most consecutive competitive games undefeated
29 (2010–2013)
I think that might be deemed by most as being at least a bit dominant.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
tiresome fool
how many times did they beat argentina/germany in the past 10 years?
And by the way, only two of those tournament wins were "major".
argentina were the best performing team in the last 2 WCs and germany have been the best team since.
such statistical nonsense can be used to demonstrate that portsmouth, wigan and cardiff are, or have been, one of the top teams in english football over the past 7 years or so.
get a grip please
Sign in if you want to comment
LVG Out
Page 2 of 3
posted on 10/7/14
People are fickle.
Now they've gone out and played some dull football in the semis, against a similarly dull and conservative team that contains Messi, Aguero, Higuian, Lavezzi and Di Maria, it means we'll be playing dull football and he's not all he's cracked up to be - despite the fact they actually over achieved anyway.
But his club management has been very different from what he's done in six games at the world cup.
I think that's a better thing to take into consideration when trying to judge what Van Gaal can bring to United. 1000 games of experience at the top level and top clubs.
Not overachieving in 6 games at the world cup.
This is one of my pet hates about the world cup, though I love the tournaments, just how it warps people's perceptions and opinions.
posted on 10/7/14
Darren, think opposition fans are just wumming because of who he will manage next season.
They have played some decent football here and there but since the knockout stages no ones be exciting(putting yesterdays game aside).
With the gulf in player class between the Dutch and the Argentinians, this sold have been an ready victory for the latter on paper.
posted on 10/7/14
I think you underestimate the fickle nature of 606 when international tournaments are on.
Some will be wumming, but others won't be. Some with have their own fears about what they've seen at the world cup, and others won't.
I love the world cup, but sometimes you cannot take too much from it when judging what is gonna happen at club level.
Ronaldo had a poor world cup. Most of the Spain team did. I don't expect that to mean they'll do the same at club level.
So what a manager does shouldn't either.
posted on 10/7/14
Kleberson had a good tournament a few years back. We bought him. Was a flop. Can't judge players in tournaments like this.
It's why I'm not sure if Danny of the Dutch players will be signed by is.
posted on 10/7/14
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
posted on 10/7/14
posted on 10/7/14
comment by CurrentlyInChina84 (U11181)
posted 9 minutes ago
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he couldn't use what he didn't have !
posted on 10/7/14
He's a very good manager, the best you could have got...
I hope he fails though
posted on 10/7/14
comment by Football_bloodyhell (U17867)
posted 39 minutes ago
comment by CurrentlyInChina84 (U11181)
posted 9 minutes ago
Many*
Also LVG is pragmatic. He used what he had.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well he couldn't use what he didn't have !
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, someone should tell Roy that.
posted on 10/7/14
Pragmatic I agree, in that he thought that their best chance of success was to shut up shop and hope some Robben/RvP/Sneijder magic would see them through, but there's more talent in Dutch footy and this actual Dutch side than he's allowed them to express imo. Some people are making out he had no choice as if all he had was a bunch of grinders, it's not true.
posted on 10/7/14
Argentina weren't much attacking either. Both teams put defence first. You could see that from the amount of people on Robben and Messi.
Let's be honest. If LVG wasn't going to manage United, there wouldn't be so much of opposition fans having a go at LVG. They attacked more than the Argentines yet people say they shut up shop.
posted on 10/7/14
Neither side attacked too much, that's the truth. I'm not an oppo fan btw, I've not said a bad word about LvG these past few weeks.
posted on 10/7/14
ioag, yeah I think that's true to an extent.
Though I think that like Argentina, they have suffered from not having a player in the midfield that can link the play.
Sneijder should be able to do this but he's been crap. Shadow of the player he was four years ago. Classie, from what I've seen, which isn't much, looks like the type of player that could do that but wasn't used until it was too late.
And as I said earlier, most national teams have become pretty cautious over the years. Especially in the ko rounds, Germany vs Brazil being a notable exception.
I also think the 352 has been a wrong decision on his part. Worked brilliantly against Spain but other than that hasn't been something I've been impressed with.
They've looked better when playing 433 overall. I think he made a mistake tonight not switching to 433 and bringing on Depay. Would have got a lot more joy than they did, in my opinion.
Did well in getting them so far. So I'm sure they'll all be happy enough with how they did, even though they possibly could have gone further with a bit more adventure and tactical tweaks.
posted on 10/7/14
Sneijder should be able to do this but he's been crap. Shadow of the player he was four years ago. Classie, from what I've seen, which isn't much, looks like the type of player that could do that but wasn't used until it was too late.
--
Agree that they had the staff to be a bit more venturous, and also that the k.o rounds have tended to be increasingly cagey since 1990.
De Guzman isn't what I'd call a creative fulcrum, but he did well early doors, why was he benched and not used again? Not injured afaik. Depay as you said always added something. LvG used almost all of his squad over 6 games; I'm not sure you want to keep tweaking your starting XI so much in a tournament like this.
posted on 10/7/14
I dunno really. I thought De Guzman did ok defensively but nobody in that midfield really looked that good with the ball, including Sneijder, and it just seemed to isolate the forwards more.
When they had genuine wingers it was easier to get the ball forward because there was more than one player out wide and they didn't need to play through the middle - something they weren't very good at.
Though whether this is all down to the formation is hard to gauge because it could be simply down to having a sub with pace against tired legs and chasing the game making them more positive.
Shame they didn't have Strootman. I think we'd have seen a more positive display in many of the games had he played.
posted on 10/7/14
comment by itsonlyagame - Gracias, Don Alfredo (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 48 minutes ago
Neither side attacked too much, that's the truth. I'm not an oppo fan btw, I've not said a bad word about LvG these past few weeks.
---------------------------
Wasn't refering to you. If you head over to the Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea board, you will see them having pops at LVG for tonight.
The match was boring and there wasn't much between them. The game needed a goal to make things interesting.
posted on 10/7/14
I like Van Gaal. Think he is a proper manager, similar to Mourinho/Hiddink/Simeone/Ferguson etc...
Even though Holland were brilliant the group stages, they were poor in the knock out stages.
For 85 mins against Mexico they were awful and deserved to lose. They got a bit lucky with Sneijder scoring a brilliant goal and getting a lucky penalty to win. But maybe Van Gaal had that winning mentality to get them through.
Wtf was he doing playing 5 at the back against Costa Rica? He could have gone for that and won the much earlier on. They could have lost this game and had to rely on penalties.
Vs Argentina...did pretty well to not concede but so did Iran and Switzerland so it's not that hard and they parked the bus the whole game and relied on pens. They didn't score for 2 games of 90 mins plus extra time twice...hahaha!
So to sum up:
1. I think Van Gaal is a great manager tbh. I like him.
2. Holland were brilliant in the first 3 games.
3. Holland were very poor in the last 3 games.
4. Holland did park the bus. ( They really did... )
Nothing wrong with parking the bus! But you really can't deny that this is what they did.
posted on 10/7/14
They park the bus yet manage to attack Argentina as much as they were attacked? Thats some parking.
posted on 10/7/14
To be honest, both teams were dire. They both set out to stifle the other. But rival fans are jumping up with joy that LVG's team is out and his team didn't perform well (neither sides did, but hardly anyone having a go at Argentina).
posted on 10/7/14
Chelsea beat Liverpool 2-0 at Anfield. They still parked the bus! Plus you're always going to create a few chances with Robben and Van Persie upfront.
posted on 10/7/14
comment by Who's Kissing Cameras?! (U1703)
posted 10 hours, 44 minutes ago
IAmMe stupidly fogetting Spain's dominance between '08-'14.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not forgotten, because it is not true.
Spain were massively over rated, during that period. They were ugly to watch and their record was not particularly dominant. Argentina were by far and away the best team at the last two world cups.
Mind you, I did kind of expect something along this kind if 'dronelike' response. Nice to not be disappointed.
posted on 10/7/14
^
posted on 10/7/14
dom·i·nant
adj.
1. Exercising the most influence or control.
2. Most prominent, as in position; ascendant.
Spain's int'l record from the beginning of 2007 to the start of the 2014 World Cup:
Major int'l tournaments contested: 3
Major int'l tournaments won: 3
Official games only:
P64 W58 D3 L3
Win% 90.6%
Clean sheets 39 (60.1%)
Incl. friendlies:
P109 W90 D11 L8
Win% 82.6%
Clean sheets 65 (59.6%)
Other:
FIFA int'l team of the year: 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013
All-time int'l football records set during the period:
Most consecutive games undefeated
35 (2007–2009)
Most consecutive wins including friendlies
15 (2008–2009)
Most consecutive competitive games undefeated
29 (2010–2013)
I think that might be deemed by most as being at least a bit dominant.
posted on 10/7/14
I am me?
Over to you.
posted on 10/7/14
comment by itsonlyagame - Gracias, Don Alfredo (U6426)
posted 11 minutes ago
dom·i·nant
adj.
1. Exercising the most influence or control.
2. Most prominent, as in position; ascendant.
Spain's int'l record from the beginning of 2007 to the start of the 2014 World Cup:
Major int'l tournaments contested: 3
Major int'l tournaments won: 3
Official games only:
P64 W58 D3 L3
Win% 90.6%
Clean sheets 39 (60.1%)
Incl. friendlies:
P109 W90 D11 L8
Win% 82.6%
Clean sheets 65 (59.6%)
Other:
FIFA int'l team of the year: 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013
All-time int'l football records set during the period:
Most consecutive games undefeated
35 (2007–2009)
Most consecutive wins including friendlies
15 (2008–2009)
Most consecutive competitive games undefeated
29 (2010–2013)
I think that might be deemed by most as being at least a bit dominant.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
tiresome fool
how many times did they beat argentina/germany in the past 10 years?
And by the way, only two of those tournament wins were "major".
argentina were the best performing team in the last 2 WCs and germany have been the best team since.
such statistical nonsense can be used to demonstrate that portsmouth, wigan and cardiff are, or have been, one of the top teams in english football over the past 7 years or so.
get a grip please
Page 2 of 3