Whats done is done, and whilst nobody agrees with it, it is hard to change it.
Throwing those new settlers of the lands they now occupy, by your view means they then have the right to become extremists and have the right to fight back with terror campaigns.
Which again highlights that fighting is not the way forward.
ha, palestine now wants to accept the egypt proposal, the one Israel accepted 3 weeks ago and Palestine knocked back
3 weeks needless killing
They have continued to expand settlements in recent years. They have purposefully set up the settlements in Palestinian areas on the areas with water. No one is talking about going back over 40 years we are talking about the vital parts of a potential Palestinian state Israel has stolen in recent times.
It's like taking over a desert country snatching up almost every useful part of the county and then offering the natives the dirt that is left over.
Good for making your people's lives better, good for making the natives lives miserable and causing extremism. Good for war....
Bad for peace...
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
So all the terrorism stopped before and after the peace deal...
Interesting bit of revisionist history there. Where can I read more about this alternate timeline?
comment by Cinciwolf (U11551)
posted 16 minutes ago
ha, palestine now wants to accept the egypt proposal, the one Israel accepted 3 weeks ago and Palestine knocked back
3 weeks needless killing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You hit someone enough you can get them to accept almost anything.
Lets all applaud the Israelis for beating the Palestinians to submission
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
So what your saying then....
Is no it didn't...
Interesting.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 7 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 30 minutes ago
I do not have hatred for any specific religious group. But, I am sick of religious groups having organised agenda for killing innocent people in thousands because of 'perceived' injustice.
A member of Group B says something that is 'perceived' as offensive by members of Group A. Immediately, Group A fanatics organise themselves up on orders of their group leader and start killing members that belongs Groups B, C, D, E, ....X, Y, and Z.
It doesn't take much to offend the Group A cult. They are offended by a cartoon, they are offended when they give their pet dog an affectionate name. They are offended even a member of their own cult writes a book questioning their cult beliefs.
If Group A feels slighted by a comment made by Group B, then please deal with it directly with Group B. If you start killing people that belong to Groups C, D, E,...X,Y, and Z, then you are not liked by most people.
When Group C shows its generosity and allows Group A to live with them in their community, it is ungrateful of Group A members to organise themselves to plot against the kind Group C people. There will be resentment, if not hatred, for Group C against Group A.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How is it justified that Group A, which when feels slighted by Group B, starts killing members of Groups C,D,E,...X,Y,Z?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They say our religion is peaceful and does not preach violence, but sad fact is, unless otherwise proven, all terrorists belong to this religion. They can't resolve conflicts in any other way. Hamas is not the only terrorist organisation, there dozens of dozens and almost all belong to one religion, and are killing innocent people in the name of their religion.
I echo the main sentiment Cinciwolf has expressed that it is sad to find many people here are supporting terrorism by saying it is justified.
So why don't you spit out what you really want to say robbie84. Come on. Stop beating around the bush.
Surely Robbie you realise the conflict, Israel-Palestine and the whole West vs Muslims conflict is slightly more complicated than dem Muslims r crazy?
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
Firstly a lot of wars are over land, all countries who goto war are willing to sacrifice their people for land, often they have little chance of winning.
You are also being short sighted the unrealistic aims of Hamas make the Palestinians cause no less just.
====================================
No, no country ever wants to sacrifice innocent civilians for land. If anything they'd rather take actions to avoid the deaths of their innocent brothers and sisters.
Also Hamas was born out of hatred of the hatred of Israel and Jews, just like Al qaeda was born out of hatred of America and the west. Hamas had to become more political to look legitimate, but their goals has never changed. That goal is to wipe out the state of Israel regardless of legitimate agreements and until the last Jew leaves they wont stop terrorising the Jewish state.
Someone could also ague that the "aggressive" state of Israel was born as a result of Arab states' aggression, however that doesn't matter now. Until the likes of Hamas change their view and get eliminated, then nothing productive is going to happen, only continued death of innocent civilians.
You talk of IR.A, but they had to stop the violence to have any chance of being heard/peace.
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
SAF, I recognise that Palestinians are suffering and have suffered immensely for several years for I do not ever wish to be in their position. Nevertheless, terrorism invites retaliation and Israel being stronger and has US support, the methods of their fight are not helping their cause.
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 17 minutes ago
Sinn Fein's military wing gave up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly..
comment by Mr Chelsea ✪ (U3579)
posted 14 seconds ago
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Let me put it this way. If I am flying from the US to Europe, I am the least bit concerned about a wealthy Mr Rosenbaum sitting next to me, but I do get concerned about my safety and that of fellow passenger when I see a look-alike of that English cricketer with a very long beard reading a religious book and exchanging glances with another person looking like that. Call it stereotype or prejudice, as human beings, we rely on repeated observation and make certain inferences which guide us. Terrorism may be perpetrated now and then by others too, but one religion stands out as the identity of terrorism and people have not formed this impression without repeated observations.
comment by Mr Chelsea ✪ (U3579)
posted 4 minutes ago
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"use of f̶o̶r̶c̶e̶ or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating [instilling fear] or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or p̶o̶l̶i̶t̶i̶c̶a̶l̶ reasons."
No, no country ever wants to sacrifice innocent civilians for land. If anything they'd rather take actions to avoid the deaths of their innocent brothers and sisters.
.....................................................
Well in WW2 the UK knew very well its innocent citizens were going to suffer harm by being in the war. France did too.... In fact most of the allies did (USA might not have expected civilian casualties and joined in after them)
If you are trying to defend yourself against a powerful aggressive conquering nation you are almost certain to take civilian casualties...
I don't think that makes mass surrender the appropriate moral choice in world war 2 when faced by the Germans.
.........................................................
Also Hamas was born out of hatred of the hatred of Israel and Jews, just like Al qaeda was born out of hatred of America and the west. Hamas had to become more political to look legitimate, but their goals has never changed. That goal is to wipe out the state of Israel regardless of legitimate agreements and until the last Jew leaves they wont stop terrorising the Jewish state.
..................................................
Hamas was created in reaction to the Israeli occupation, its hardly surprising it doesn't have friendly goals towards Israel.
Although whilst Hamas talk about destroying Israel, Israel actually destroy Palestine..
Why saying bad things is considered a lot worse than actually doing bad things I will never know. Chalk that one up as another win for PR I guess.
Al Qaeda was funded by the CIA If I remember rightly, another in a long list of USA's meddling in the Middle East...
......................................................
Someone could also ague that the "aggressive" state of Israel was born as a result of Arab states' aggression, however that doesn't matter now. Until the likes of Hamas change their view and get eliminated, then nothing productive is going to happen, only continued death of innocent civilians.
..................................................
Was born out of Arab's state aggression?
I don't know if you can really call self defense aggression.... If you stuck a brand new country in New York and kicked the locals out the whole of America would fight back...
Don't think that would then justify taking even more of America...
If self defence is a good excuse for continued expansion and aggression then the Soviets were perfectly justified in building their European empire, they had a hell of a lot more justification than Israel...
Hell once the Na.zi's started expanding people started fighting back, I suppose aside from the whole holocaust thing they were perfectly justified as well...
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 13 minutes ago
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All I want to say is people should be allowed to defend themselves and fight back, especially when they have been driven to poverty and thrown off their lands.
comment by {honestlivpool~five~times} 👽 🐎 (U1661)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 17 minutes ago
Sinn Fein's military wing gave up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The terrorism didn't stop straight away though did it...
It took time, Britain had to offer a fair peace.
It seems blindingly obvious but some people seem to refuse to believe it because maybe it doesn't fit in with their ideology...
You really want to kill a terrorist group like Hamas offer the Palestinians a fair peace (like I keep asking for)
You really want to keep Hamas going or get them replaced by even worse extremists then keep up your unrealistic demands that the Palestinians stop fighting back as Israel continues to steal their land and ensure they have nothing left by the time any deal gets made.
Let me put it this way. If I am flying from the US to Europe, I am the least bit concerned about a wealthy Mr Rosenbaum sitting next to me, but I do get concerned about my safety and that of fellow passenger when I see a look-alike of that English cricketer with a very long beard reading a religious book and exchanging glances with another person looking like that. Call it stereotype or prejudice, as human beings, we rely on repeated observation and make certain inferences which guide us. Terrorism may be perpetrated now and then by others too, but one religion stands out as the identity of terrorism and people have not formed this impression without repeated observations.
.............................................
Don't worry it may be a bit of stereotyping but it is based on some underlying logic I guess.
In the same way I imagine Muslims look at Western leaders and suspect they would kill thousands of them in order to change their leaders into something more to their liking...
Not all Muslims are going to blow up the plane you are sat on, not all powerful Western leaders are going to start a war that will kill thousands of people for their countries economic self interest...
Based on their previous though it is hardly surprising people on both sides are a little wary.
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine (U5768)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 13 minutes ago
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All I want to say is people should be allowed to defend themselves and fight back, especially when they have been driven to poverty and thrown off their lands.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I do agree that they need to defend themselves, but they should weight in the pros and cons of their actions because an improper action invites stronger retaliation which then leads to more suffering.
I also do not approve of addtional terrorism perpetrated by allied groups elsewhere saying they are doing so because of sympathy for Palestinians. For example, killing an Argentinian drinking coffee at a restaurant in Mumbai because one wishes to demonstrate their sympathy of the Palestinian cause is not justified. Unfortunately, this sort of behaviour has become a way of life for one religious group.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Benayoun is a Disgrace
Page 114 of 146
115 | 116 | 117 | 118 | 119
posted on 4/8/14
Whats done is done, and whilst nobody agrees with it, it is hard to change it.
Throwing those new settlers of the lands they now occupy, by your view means they then have the right to become extremists and have the right to fight back with terror campaigns.
Which again highlights that fighting is not the way forward.
posted on 4/8/14
ha, palestine now wants to accept the egypt proposal, the one Israel accepted 3 weeks ago and Palestine knocked back
3 weeks needless killing
posted on 4/8/14
They have continued to expand settlements in recent years. They have purposefully set up the settlements in Palestinian areas on the areas with water. No one is talking about going back over 40 years we are talking about the vital parts of a potential Palestinian state Israel has stolen in recent times.
It's like taking over a desert country snatching up almost every useful part of the county and then offering the natives the dirt that is left over.
Good for making your people's lives better, good for making the natives lives miserable and causing extremism. Good for war....
Bad for peace...
posted on 4/8/14
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 4/8/14
So all the terrorism stopped before and after the peace deal...
Interesting bit of revisionist history there. Where can I read more about this alternate timeline?
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Cinciwolf (U11551)
posted 16 minutes ago
ha, palestine now wants to accept the egypt proposal, the one Israel accepted 3 weeks ago and Palestine knocked back
3 weeks needless killing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You hit someone enough you can get them to accept almost anything.
Lets all applaud the Israelis for beating the Palestinians to submission
posted on 4/8/14
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 4/8/14
So what your saying then....
Is no it didn't...
Interesting.
posted on 4/8/14
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 7 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 30 minutes ago
I do not have hatred for any specific religious group. But, I am sick of religious groups having organised agenda for killing innocent people in thousands because of 'perceived' injustice.
A member of Group B says something that is 'perceived' as offensive by members of Group A. Immediately, Group A fanatics organise themselves up on orders of their group leader and start killing members that belongs Groups B, C, D, E, ....X, Y, and Z.
It doesn't take much to offend the Group A cult. They are offended by a cartoon, they are offended when they give their pet dog an affectionate name. They are offended even a member of their own cult writes a book questioning their cult beliefs.
If Group A feels slighted by a comment made by Group B, then please deal with it directly with Group B. If you start killing people that belong to Groups C, D, E,...X,Y, and Z, then you are not liked by most people.
When Group C shows its generosity and allows Group A to live with them in their community, it is ungrateful of Group A members to organise themselves to plot against the kind Group C people. There will be resentment, if not hatred, for Group C against Group A.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How is it justified that Group A, which when feels slighted by Group B, starts killing members of Groups C,D,E,...X,Y,Z?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They say our religion is peaceful and does not preach violence, but sad fact is, unless otherwise proven, all terrorists belong to this religion. They can't resolve conflicts in any other way. Hamas is not the only terrorist organisation, there dozens of dozens and almost all belong to one religion, and are killing innocent people in the name of their religion.
I echo the main sentiment Cinciwolf has expressed that it is sad to find many people here are supporting terrorism by saying it is justified.
posted on 4/8/14
So why don't you spit out what you really want to say robbie84. Come on. Stop beating around the bush.
posted on 4/8/14
Surely Robbie you realise the conflict, Israel-Palestine and the whole West vs Muslims conflict is slightly more complicated than dem Muslims r crazy?
posted on 4/8/14
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
posted on 4/8/14
Firstly a lot of wars are over land, all countries who goto war are willing to sacrifice their people for land, often they have little chance of winning.
You are also being short sighted the unrealistic aims of Hamas make the Palestinians cause no less just.
====================================
No, no country ever wants to sacrifice innocent civilians for land. If anything they'd rather take actions to avoid the deaths of their innocent brothers and sisters.
Also Hamas was born out of hatred of the hatred of Israel and Jews, just like Al qaeda was born out of hatred of America and the west. Hamas had to become more political to look legitimate, but their goals has never changed. That goal is to wipe out the state of Israel regardless of legitimate agreements and until the last Jew leaves they wont stop terrorising the Jewish state.
Someone could also ague that the "aggressive" state of Israel was born as a result of Arab states' aggression, however that doesn't matter now. Until the likes of Hamas change their view and get eliminated, then nothing productive is going to happen, only continued death of innocent civilians.
You talk of IR.A, but they had to stop the violence to have any chance of being heard/peace.
posted on 4/8/14
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
posted on 4/8/14
SAF, I recognise that Palestinians are suffering and have suffered immensely for several years for I do not ever wish to be in their position. Nevertheless, terrorism invites retaliation and Israel being stronger and has US support, the methods of their fight are not helping their cause.
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 17 minutes ago
Sinn Fein's military wing gave up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly..
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Mr Chelsea ✪ (U3579)
posted 14 seconds ago
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Let me put it this way. If I am flying from the US to Europe, I am the least bit concerned about a wealthy Mr Rosenbaum sitting next to me, but I do get concerned about my safety and that of fellow passenger when I see a look-alike of that English cricketer with a very long beard reading a religious book and exchanging glances with another person looking like that. Call it stereotype or prejudice, as human beings, we rely on repeated observation and make certain inferences which guide us. Terrorism may be perpetrated now and then by others too, but one religion stands out as the identity of terrorism and people have not formed this impression without repeated observations.
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Mr Chelsea ✪ (U3579)
posted 4 minutes ago
How are you defining terrorism? When a Muslim kills it's terrorism?
What are Israel doing right now?
Ticking the tummies of the Palestinian people?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"use of f̶o̶r̶c̶e̶ or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating [instilling fear] or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or p̶o̶l̶i̶t̶i̶c̶a̶l̶ reasons."
posted on 4/8/14
No, no country ever wants to sacrifice innocent civilians for land. If anything they'd rather take actions to avoid the deaths of their innocent brothers and sisters.
.....................................................
Well in WW2 the UK knew very well its innocent citizens were going to suffer harm by being in the war. France did too.... In fact most of the allies did (USA might not have expected civilian casualties and joined in after them)
If you are trying to defend yourself against a powerful aggressive conquering nation you are almost certain to take civilian casualties...
I don't think that makes mass surrender the appropriate moral choice in world war 2 when faced by the Germans.
.........................................................
Also Hamas was born out of hatred of the hatred of Israel and Jews, just like Al qaeda was born out of hatred of America and the west. Hamas had to become more political to look legitimate, but their goals has never changed. That goal is to wipe out the state of Israel regardless of legitimate agreements and until the last Jew leaves they wont stop terrorising the Jewish state.
..................................................
Hamas was created in reaction to the Israeli occupation, its hardly surprising it doesn't have friendly goals towards Israel.
Although whilst Hamas talk about destroying Israel, Israel actually destroy Palestine..
Why saying bad things is considered a lot worse than actually doing bad things I will never know. Chalk that one up as another win for PR I guess.
Al Qaeda was funded by the CIA If I remember rightly, another in a long list of USA's meddling in the Middle East...
......................................................
Someone could also ague that the "aggressive" state of Israel was born as a result of Arab states' aggression, however that doesn't matter now. Until the likes of Hamas change their view and get eliminated, then nothing productive is going to happen, only continued death of innocent civilians.
..................................................
Was born out of Arab's state aggression?
I don't know if you can really call self defense aggression.... If you stuck a brand new country in New York and kicked the locals out the whole of America would fight back...
Don't think that would then justify taking even more of America...
If self defence is a good excuse for continued expansion and aggression then the Soviets were perfectly justified in building their European empire, they had a hell of a lot more justification than Israel...
Hell once the Na.zi's started expanding people started fighting back, I suppose aside from the whole holocaust thing they were perfectly justified as well...
posted on 4/8/14
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 13 minutes ago
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All I want to say is people should be allowed to defend themselves and fight back, especially when they have been driven to poverty and thrown off their lands.
posted on 4/8/14
comment by {honestlivpool~five~times} 👽 🐎 (U1661)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 17 minutes ago
Sinn Fein's military wing gave up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The terrorism didn't stop straight away though did it...
It took time, Britain had to offer a fair peace.
It seems blindingly obvious but some people seem to refuse to believe it because maybe it doesn't fit in with their ideology...
You really want to kill a terrorist group like Hamas offer the Palestinians a fair peace (like I keep asking for)
You really want to keep Hamas going or get them replaced by even worse extremists then keep up your unrealistic demands that the Palestinians stop fighting back as Israel continues to steal their land and ensure they have nothing left by the time any deal gets made.
posted on 4/8/14
Let me put it this way. If I am flying from the US to Europe, I am the least bit concerned about a wealthy Mr Rosenbaum sitting next to me, but I do get concerned about my safety and that of fellow passenger when I see a look-alike of that English cricketer with a very long beard reading a religious book and exchanging glances with another person looking like that. Call it stereotype or prejudice, as human beings, we rely on repeated observation and make certain inferences which guide us. Terrorism may be perpetrated now and then by others too, but one religion stands out as the identity of terrorism and people have not formed this impression without repeated observations.
.............................................
Don't worry it may be a bit of stereotyping but it is based on some underlying logic I guess.
In the same way I imagine Muslims look at Western leaders and suspect they would kill thousands of them in order to change their leaders into something more to their liking...
Not all Muslims are going to blow up the plane you are sat on, not all powerful Western leaders are going to start a war that will kill thousands of people for their countries economic self interest...
Based on their previous though it is hardly surprising people on both sides are a little wary.
posted on 4/8/14
comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine (U5768)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Robbie84 (U17946)
posted 13 minutes ago
All I want to say is that terrorism should not be a way of life because religious cult leaders say so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All I want to say is people should be allowed to defend themselves and fight back, especially when they have been driven to poverty and thrown off their lands.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I do agree that they need to defend themselves, but they should weight in the pros and cons of their actions because an improper action invites stronger retaliation which then leads to more suffering.
I also do not approve of addtional terrorism perpetrated by allied groups elsewhere saying they are doing so because of sympathy for Palestinians. For example, killing an Argentinian drinking coffee at a restaurant in Mumbai because one wishes to demonstrate their sympathy of the Palestinian cause is not justified. Unfortunately, this sort of behaviour has become a way of life for one religious group.
posted on 4/8/14
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Page 114 of 146
115 | 116 | 117 | 118 | 119