comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
The answer is no, not exactly. Invitations were actually sent out for all the major FAs to enter their national champions. It was only when some of them turned down the invitation that the list of entrants was completed with other clubs. Owing to its success, the tournament was immediately taken up by UEFA, so your claim only holds partially true for the maiden edition, and the FAs who opted out that one only have themselves to blame for missing out.
Fun fact, the whole idea of creating the European Cup is said to have arisen because some journo, in typically arrogant English fashion, declared Wolves "Champions of the World" because they beat Honved in a friendly at Molineux. It's explained here:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/dec/13/wolves-world-champions-honved-molineux-hungary-wembley
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We have and it annoyed you just as much then.
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh yes, it was you.
https://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/444662
No point going over it again, then.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh yes, it was you.
https://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/444662
No point going over it again, then.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh go on.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 48 seconds ago
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hilarious! You could have saved yourself the embarrassment by reading the link I posted for you, but instead you're talking shɪt again.
After turning their noses up at the first three editions of the World Cup, England finally accepted to enter in 1950 - without actually accepting to pit themselves against any continental side to get there - only to get sent home with their tails between their legs after defeats to the United States and Spain dumped them out at the group stage. That's several years before you were humiliated by Hungary.
English club football followed a similar route. Arrogantly self-proclaiming yourselves the best, only to endure years of humiliation before you could legitimately make that claim.
Fast forward 70-odd years, still shooting your mouths off and watching Madrid lifting the cup. You're just as full of crap as ever!
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 48 seconds ago
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hilarious! You could have saved yourself the embarrassment by reading the link I posted for you, but instead you're talking shɪt again.
After turning their noses up at the first three editions of the World Cup, England finally accepted to enter in 1950 - without actually accepting to pit themselves against any continental side to get there - only to get sent home with their tails between their legs after defeats to the United States and Spain dumped them out at the group stage. That's several years before you were humiliated by Hungary.
English club football followed a similar route. Arrogantly self-proclaiming yourselves the best, only to endure years of humiliation before you could legitimately make that claim.
Fast forward 70-odd years, still shooting your mouths off and watching Madrid lifting the cup. You're just as full of crap as ever!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You!
I'm not English.
I'm just going by what I read having not been born until several decades later
https://www.thefootballhistoryboys.com/2016/11/the-birth-of-european-cup-lequipe-los.html
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 23 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello? The link you posted earlier doesn't say that, so where the quote from?
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, actually turns out it isn't a fact, but another concocted statistic. I suppose it must refer to defeats on English soil to teams not from the UK - Ireland in 1949, I think. There were many defeats before then to Scotland, including a 5-1 humbling at Wembley. Don't know about Wales or N.I., but definitely not the first, far from it.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 23 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello? The link you posted earlier doesn't say that, so where the quote from?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wikipedia. Although I did get it from a proper article when we last talked about this.
I'm pretty sure I disproved all of that the last time, but I'm not going to go digging again over a conversation we already had months ago.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 hours, 14 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, actually turns out it isn't a fact, but another concocted statistic. I suppose it must refer to defeats on English soil to teams not from the UK - Ireland in 1949, I think. There were many defeats before then to Scotland, including a 5-1 humbling at Wembley. Don't know about Wales or N.I., but definitely not the first, far from it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct. To teams outside the UK on home soil.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
I'm pretty sure I disproved all of that the last time, but I'm not going to go digging again over a conversation we already had months ago.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You didn't. How can you? It's a fact that the French magazine invited the teams for the first five years. The first two didn't include any English teams.
It isn't a fact at all, TOOR. You've mislearned or are misremembering stuff, but I really can't be bothered. It's all there in the other thread if you want to go and look, and if you want to stick to what you think is correct, then fine.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 20 minutes ago
It isn't a fact at all, TOOR. You've mislearned or are misremembering stuff, but I really can't be bothered. It's all there in the other thread if you want to go and look, and if you want to stick to what you think is correct, then fine.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is a fact. Nowhere reports it any differently. Even the Madrid website states the French magazine organised it for the first five years.
"French journalist Gabriel Hanot dreamed up a competition that would bring together the champions of each European league. His colleague Jacques Ferrán joined the project. Between them they drew up some regulations that reached the headquarters of the Union of European Football Associations (UEFA). The proposal was much to the liking of the heads of French publication ‘L’Equipe’, which organised the tournament."
Santiago Bernabeu himself was VP of the commission with Lequippe who invited the clubs.
"In 1955, acting upon the idea proposed by the L'Équipe journalist Gabriel Hanot and building upon the Copa Latina (a tournament involving clubs from France, Spain, Portugal, and Italy), Bernabéu met in the Ambassador Hotel in Paris with Bedrignan and Gustav Sebes and created what was at first a loosely constructed tournament played among invited teams, but which over time developed into what is today the Champions League. Under the administration of UEFA, it is the world's premier club tournament."
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe on the basis that they were representative and prestigious clubs in Europe.[1] When the tournament started, Real Madrid, Anderlecht, Milan, Rot-Weiss Essen, Stade de Reims, Djurgården and AGF Aarhus were the reigning champions of their respective national leagues. English champions Chelsea initially agreed to compete and were drawn against Swedish side Djurgården; however, under pressure from the Football League, who saw the tournament as a distraction to domestic football, they later withdrew from the competition,[2][3] and were replaced by Gwardia Warszawa of Poland. Scottish champions Aberdeen withdrew under similar circumstances. In addition, Holland Sport, Honvéd and AB rejected the opportunity to represent the Netherlands, Hungary and Denmark respectively, being replaced by PSV Eindhoven, Vörös Lobogó and AGF Aarhus (PSV and Vörös Lobogó becoming the last teams until 1997–98 to qualify for the European Cup not by either winning a domestic league or being current title holders). This was also the only UEFA tournament to include a representative of Saarland, unified into West Germany in 1957.
The first round pairings were fixed by the organisers and not drawn as would be the case for all future European Cup matches."
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/General/02/59/07/69/2590769_DOWNLOAD.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwilq7-TuZ_7AhXFS8AKHYqkDNUQFnoECBgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw138WNhX8aneqngo89F4bLk
Can we settle on that it's a fact now or do you need more?
"How did you pick them, then?
We picked them based on how good they
looked … Real Madrid from Spain, of course,
Milan from Italy, Chelsea from England … We
sent them a letter of invitation – all expenses
paid, travel, rooms at the Ambassador Hotel
on Boulevard Haussmann in Paris, close to
L’Équipe, the Lido cabaret club, restaurants,
etc., and two days of meetings chaired by
Jacques Goddet at the Ambassador Hotel."
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 43 minutes ago
Can we settle on that it's a fact now or do you need more?
"How did you pick them, then?
We picked them based on how good they
looked … Real Madrid from Spain, of course,
Milan from Italy, Chelsea from England … We
sent them a letter of invitation – all expenses
paid, travel, rooms at the Ambassador Hotel
on Boulevard Haussmann in Paris, close to
L’Équipe, the Lido cabaret club, restaurants,
etc., and two days of meetings chaired by
Jacques Goddet at the Ambassador Hotel."
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, we certainly cannot accept it as fact, because the Wikipedia page for the "5 years" reference claims a L'Equipe article as its source. Yet the article it links to makes no mention whatsoever of the 5-year timeframe, so if the source for the claim doesn't back it up, then it's very clearly unsubstantiated.
https://blog.lequipe.fr/histoire/2-avril-1955-lequipe-cree-la-coupe-deurope-de-football/
How can you say nowhere reports it differently, when I have already posted other links here, when UEFA itself says it took charge, and when the other link you posted says it took charge of the competition from its maiden edition.
This is from the very same source you posted containing the interview with Jacques Ferran on the creation of the European Cup.
After explaining the meetings held at the Ambassador Hotel, it goes on to say:
"And to organise a draw?
No, we decided not to have a draw because we didn’t want to end up with the two favourites playing each other in the first round. I think
it was the only round of a European Cup that didn’t involve domestic champions or a draw. But, of course, as soon as we turned our backs, UEFA – at the behest of FIFA – decided to take over after all, and since that day it has done
a pretty good job of organising it. We took a gamble, because there was no way we or the clubs could organise such a big competition. How would we appoint referees? How would we punish players or the clubs themselves? It simply wasn’t possible. We would have had to establish a committee, and so on. It was much better for UEFA to take care of it."
We already went through all of this back in May.
Sign in if you want to comment
True European Champions
Page 4 of 4
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
The answer is no, not exactly. Invitations were actually sent out for all the major FAs to enter their national champions. It was only when some of them turned down the invitation that the list of entrants was completed with other clubs. Owing to its success, the tournament was immediately taken up by UEFA, so your claim only holds partially true for the maiden edition, and the FAs who opted out that one only have themselves to blame for missing out.
Fun fact, the whole idea of creating the European Cup is said to have arisen because some journo, in typically arrogant English fashion, declared Wolves "Champions of the World" because they beat Honved in a friendly at Molineux. It's explained here:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/dec/13/wolves-world-champions-honved-molineux-hungary-wembley
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We have and it annoyed you just as much then.
posted on 8/11/22
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh yes, it was you.
https://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/444662
No point going over it again, then.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC {Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 2 hours, 55 minutes ago
Barry back to his best
However Liverpool won the league and European Cup the following season three times:
League won in the years 75/76; 76/77; 79/80; 81/82
European Cup won in following campaigns 76/77; 77/78; 80/81; 82/83
That puts us tied with Real
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We'd already done that 4 times before you'd even won a single European Cup, you turnip. The OP is specifically about the CL era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was that not back when a magazine in France invited the participants, rather than it officially being league winners?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't we had this discussion before, or was it with some of your fellow Liverpool fans?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh yes, it was you.
https://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/444662
No point going over it again, then.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh go on.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 48 seconds ago
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hilarious! You could have saved yourself the embarrassment by reading the link I posted for you, but instead you're talking shɪt again.
After turning their noses up at the first three editions of the World Cup, England finally accepted to enter in 1950 - without actually accepting to pit themselves against any continental side to get there - only to get sent home with their tails between their legs after defeats to the United States and Spain dumped them out at the group stage. That's several years before you were humiliated by Hungary.
English club football followed a similar route. Arrogantly self-proclaiming yourselves the best, only to endure years of humiliation before you could legitimately make that claim.
Fast forward 70-odd years, still shooting your mouths off and watching Madrid lifting the cup. You're just as full of crap as ever!
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 48 seconds ago
Well actually they were declared Champions of the World as after they won the league they did what English clubs normally did, who were considered the best in the world, with the national team only ever losing one game up to that point. They toured the world beating everyone, which included a Hungarian team, with several players from the Hungarian national team who had now been newly proclaimed as the best in the world having beaten England.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hilarious! You could have saved yourself the embarrassment by reading the link I posted for you, but instead you're talking shɪt again.
After turning their noses up at the first three editions of the World Cup, England finally accepted to enter in 1950 - without actually accepting to pit themselves against any continental side to get there - only to get sent home with their tails between their legs after defeats to the United States and Spain dumped them out at the group stage. That's several years before you were humiliated by Hungary.
English club football followed a similar route. Arrogantly self-proclaiming yourselves the best, only to endure years of humiliation before you could legitimately make that claim.
Fast forward 70-odd years, still shooting your mouths off and watching Madrid lifting the cup. You're just as full of crap as ever!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You!
I'm not English.
I'm just going by what I read having not been born until several decades later
posted on 8/11/22
https://www.thefootballhistoryboys.com/2016/11/the-birth-of-european-cup-lequipe-los.html
posted on 8/11/22
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
posted on 8/11/22
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 23 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello? The link you posted earlier doesn't say that, so where the quote from?
posted on 8/11/22
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nah, actually turns out it isn't a fact, but another concocted statistic. I suppose it must refer to defeats on English soil to teams not from the UK - Ireland in 1949, I think. There were many defeats before then to Scotland, including a 5-1 humbling at Wembley. Don't know about Wales or N.I., but definitely not the first, far from it.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 hours, 20 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 23 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
From the link you posted:
'UEFA’s website records how in their very first Congress in March 1955, Hanot and Ferran arrived to present their project to the congregated national associations. UEFA and many associations agreed so with FIFA’s backing, in June 1955, it was stated: ”It is recognised that this Cup will indeed be organised by the European Union (UEFA) itself.” One country would be missing though… In quite classic FA style, English clubs would not be entering this new-fangled tournament as it could distract from the domestic game.'
Bye.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe".
Hello.
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Hello? The link you posted earlier doesn't say that, so where the quote from?
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Wikipedia. Although I did get it from a proper article when we last talked about this.
posted on 8/11/22
I'm pretty sure I disproved all of that the last time, but I'm not going to go digging again over a conversation we already had months ago.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 hours, 14 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 28 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 6 minutes ago
Although having read again, it seems it was on home soil England had only lost one game to that point.
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Yeah, it's a pretty well know fact.
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Wasn't to me. I'm not quite up to speed with England games pre 90s, nevermind pre 60s.
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Nah, actually turns out it isn't a fact, but another concocted statistic. I suppose it must refer to defeats on English soil to teams not from the UK - Ireland in 1949, I think. There were many defeats before then to Scotland, including a 5-1 humbling at Wembley. Don't know about Wales or N.I., but definitely not the first, far from it.
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Correct. To teams outside the UK on home soil.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
I'm pretty sure I disproved all of that the last time, but I'm not going to go digging again over a conversation we already had months ago.
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You didn't. How can you? It's a fact that the French magazine invited the teams for the first five years. The first two didn't include any English teams.
posted on 8/11/22
It isn't a fact at all, TOOR. You've mislearned or are misremembering stuff, but I really can't be bothered. It's all there in the other thread if you want to go and look, and if you want to stick to what you think is correct, then fine.
posted on 8/11/22
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 hour, 20 minutes ago
It isn't a fact at all, TOOR. You've mislearned or are misremembering stuff, but I really can't be bothered. It's all there in the other thread if you want to go and look, and if you want to stick to what you think is correct, then fine.
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It is a fact. Nowhere reports it any differently. Even the Madrid website states the French magazine organised it for the first five years.
"French journalist Gabriel Hanot dreamed up a competition that would bring together the champions of each European league. His colleague Jacques Ferrán joined the project. Between them they drew up some regulations that reached the headquarters of the Union of European Football Associations (UEFA). The proposal was much to the liking of the heads of French publication ‘L’Equipe’, which organised the tournament."
Santiago Bernabeu himself was VP of the commission with Lequippe who invited the clubs.
"In 1955, acting upon the idea proposed by the L'Équipe journalist Gabriel Hanot and building upon the Copa Latina (a tournament involving clubs from France, Spain, Portugal, and Italy), Bernabéu met in the Ambassador Hotel in Paris with Bedrignan and Gustav Sebes and created what was at first a loosely constructed tournament played among invited teams, but which over time developed into what is today the Champions League. Under the administration of UEFA, it is the world's premier club tournament."
posted on 8/11/22
"The participating clubs in the first five seasons of the European Cup were selected by French football magazine L'Equipe on the basis that they were representative and prestigious clubs in Europe.[1] When the tournament started, Real Madrid, Anderlecht, Milan, Rot-Weiss Essen, Stade de Reims, Djurgården and AGF Aarhus were the reigning champions of their respective national leagues. English champions Chelsea initially agreed to compete and were drawn against Swedish side Djurgården; however, under pressure from the Football League, who saw the tournament as a distraction to domestic football, they later withdrew from the competition,[2][3] and were replaced by Gwardia Warszawa of Poland. Scottish champions Aberdeen withdrew under similar circumstances. In addition, Holland Sport, Honvéd and AB rejected the opportunity to represent the Netherlands, Hungary and Denmark respectively, being replaced by PSV Eindhoven, Vörös Lobogó and AGF Aarhus (PSV and Vörös Lobogó becoming the last teams until 1997–98 to qualify for the European Cup not by either winning a domestic league or being current title holders). This was also the only UEFA tournament to include a representative of Saarland, unified into West Germany in 1957.
The first round pairings were fixed by the organisers and not drawn as would be the case for all future European Cup matches."
posted on 8/11/22
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/General/02/59/07/69/2590769_DOWNLOAD.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwilq7-TuZ_7AhXFS8AKHYqkDNUQFnoECBgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw138WNhX8aneqngo89F4bLk
posted on 8/11/22
Can we settle on that it's a fact now or do you need more?
"How did you pick them, then?
We picked them based on how good they
looked … Real Madrid from Spain, of course,
Milan from Italy, Chelsea from England … We
sent them a letter of invitation – all expenses
paid, travel, rooms at the Ambassador Hotel
on Boulevard Haussmann in Paris, close to
L’Équipe, the Lido cabaret club, restaurants,
etc., and two days of meetings chaired by
Jacques Goddet at the Ambassador Hotel."
posted on 8/11/22
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 1 hour, 43 minutes ago
Can we settle on that it's a fact now or do you need more?
"How did you pick them, then?
We picked them based on how good they
looked … Real Madrid from Spain, of course,
Milan from Italy, Chelsea from England … We
sent them a letter of invitation – all expenses
paid, travel, rooms at the Ambassador Hotel
on Boulevard Haussmann in Paris, close to
L’Équipe, the Lido cabaret club, restaurants,
etc., and two days of meetings chaired by
Jacques Goddet at the Ambassador Hotel."
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No, we certainly cannot accept it as fact, because the Wikipedia page for the "5 years" reference claims a L'Equipe article as its source. Yet the article it links to makes no mention whatsoever of the 5-year timeframe, so if the source for the claim doesn't back it up, then it's very clearly unsubstantiated.
https://blog.lequipe.fr/histoire/2-avril-1955-lequipe-cree-la-coupe-deurope-de-football/
How can you say nowhere reports it differently, when I have already posted other links here, when UEFA itself says it took charge, and when the other link you posted says it took charge of the competition from its maiden edition.
This is from the very same source you posted containing the interview with Jacques Ferran on the creation of the European Cup.
After explaining the meetings held at the Ambassador Hotel, it goes on to say:
"And to organise a draw?
No, we decided not to have a draw because we didn’t want to end up with the two favourites playing each other in the first round. I think
it was the only round of a European Cup that didn’t involve domestic champions or a draw. But, of course, as soon as we turned our backs, UEFA – at the behest of FIFA – decided to take over after all, and since that day it has done
a pretty good job of organising it. We took a gamble, because there was no way we or the clubs could organise such a big competition. How would we appoint referees? How would we punish players or the clubs themselves? It simply wasn’t possible. We would have had to establish a committee, and so on. It was much better for UEFA to take care of it."
We already went through all of this back in May.
posted on 19/11/22
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