i have my doubts if hamilton and rosberg are actually good enough to win it
-----------------------------------

You do know Hamilton has won it before, don't you?

Rosberg last three years in Monaco 7-11-2
Schumacher 12-ret-ret

Quali.
Rosberg 6-7-3
Schumacher 7-5-1*

Against a 7 time WDC, 5 time winner of Monaco (7 podiums) thats not a bad record Martial

Mercedes have a car that can qualify well, it is nowhere near the fastest on the grid.

I think this year is all about trying to improve for them. A championship is way out of the question. They will be lucky to win a race this year

t and a

yes i know all about 2008 t and a - the level of competition has improved considerably since then --

n six 0 six

fair play to rosberg nsix his record around monaco is not the worse i have ever seen -
however ------------- i suspect alonso and vettel will have there own agenda"s on sunday week -

fluck me i am going to look a bit of a belll end if rosberg actually wins around there

man unt devil

i believe the merc is the fastest car on the grid manx , but the point i was making is it cant sustain that speed in race trim because of its tire issues ,

i would"nt write merc off just yet if costa and his boffins and the might of the mercedes wonga that will be thrown at the problem along with pirelli adding durability to there rubber might make the W04 a pretty potent force in the very near future --

Hey Martial, The Ferrari seems to have the best overall package at the moment but Monaco is a pretty special kind of circuit so it could go any way. Of course you should never write off Vettel in any Newey car and judging by the season Lotus could be there to.

I expect at least one Merc on the front row but no amount of blocking will get either of them on the podium come sunday

They say sector 3 of Barcelona is a good gauge for Monaco form. Partly due to its layout and partly because its usually right before Monaco so the cars won't change to much. the top 6 in S3 in Spain were:

Nico Rosberg 27.738
Lewis Hamilton 27.795
Sebastian Vettel 28.097
Sergio Perez 28.100
Mark Webber 28.216
Fernando Alonso 28.249

This backs up the thought that Merc could well get pole only to fall back but also shows that McLaren could well be fighting the Red Bulls and Ferrari's to

I think the Merc's could get a 1-2 in quali, but if they translate that to a 1-2 in the race I will be very surprised.
When Monaco comes around I always seem to miss Kubica

n six 0 six

yeh i must admit the combination of alonso and his f138 chassis is a potent force at the minute and he would be my favourite to win on sunday week ,to be honest i just cant call it as any one of 8 drivers could win it ,

as for merc , i just believe they are going to have a very strong car there and with passing being just about impossible i can see hamilton and rosberg being right in the mix ,
i just dont think hamilton has the talent to win round there with the high level of competition there is around at the moment -- not sure about rosberg , his aggression has improved this year so he might be in with a shout ,

not sure about mclaren either -- button normally finds a way to fluck up in qualifying which makes me think what he does on saturday will reflect on what he achieves on sunday ----- nothing

fluck me nsix if rosberg , hamilton or button win you will be able to tell me i am talking out of the hole that is not connected to my head

aristodemus

i am with you about kubica , his talent and ability before his accident was right up there with alonso ,
one of the best drivers i have ever seen and his loss to the sport is immense -

Then you're very safe, it will take a Miracle for either Ros, Ham or But to win.

I think you're putting Hamilton down a little there, like Rosberg his record around Monaco is nothing to be ashamed of.

In 2007 he was a rookie of 5 races and was only just outdone by a two time champion. In 2008 he won whilst his team mate came 8th. In 2009 with a knackered car he did ok but his team mate dnf so can't compare.

In 2010 he beat his wdc team mate in quali but then of course Buttons car was screwed over by his team for the race (wasn't it a block left in the radiator or something). 2011 he was beaten by Button this time round in 'that race' .

Finally we move to 2012 (phew), where he somewhat embarrassed Button he was that far ahead. Not sure what happened with Button there...

So all in all theres far worse records in Monaco. You could argue that Webber is the current king of Monaco (strange he's not been mentioned yet) with wins in 2012 and 2010.

n six 0 six

dont get me wrong nsix i have to say it as i see it , hamiltons record at monaco is not too shabby but he has never really impressed me around there -

his one lucky win was by virtue of the fact that his 2008 mp4/23 was superglued to the tarmac in wet / damp conditions and the ferrari at the time was severely allergic to the same conditions not to mention massa the leader was screwed over in that race

but as i say hamiltons overall record there is not that bad , i just believe there are better drivers than him around at the minute around monaco -

yeh i suppose webber is also in the mix for the race , not quite sure that his head is correct to beat his german mucker this year -

I agree that Hamilton has better tracks than Monaco, such as Canada which may or may not be interesting with none delaminating tyres.

But its kind of a irrelevant subject since a driving god would struggle with the current Mercedes on a Sunday. For me the race is a Alonso, Vettel, Webber podium.

comment by martial artist (U9033)
posted 4 hours, 12 minutes ago
man unt devil

i believe the merc is the fastest car on the grid manx , but the point i was making is it cant sustain that speed in race trim because of its tire issues ,
----

Actually it isn't. It's a fast car in quali trim, not the fastest but up there. Their pace in practice shows that they are a 1 lap wonder. I personally believe they've got a few questionable gizmos on board that help them qualify well but they are by no means the fastest car on the grid at the moment.

That's the Ferrari and the Lotus

man unt devil

think we are at cross purposes on this one manx -

i still believe the WO4 is fundamentally the quickest car out there but cannot show its true pace in the race because of its tire issues - what can it run in qual trim that it cant run in race spec ?
---- never mind its not worth bickering about ---

i am in my benevolent mood this evening manx think somebody must have slipped me a happy pill or something today

Now its fundamentally, based on what? Do Sauber have the fastest car because Guitierrez set the fastest lap?

man unt devil

there is no comparison between a fastest lap set in the race because there are so many other variables involved and a balls out lap in q3 --

a balls out lap in q3 is just that -- a balls out lap when the 10 fastest cars are doing the same thing under the same conditions and so far the mercs have had the legs on everybody when it comes to ultimate pace , but as we know the mercs are hampered in race spec because of there tyre issues ,

what exactly is it the mercs can run in qual spec that they cant run in race trim then ?

Less fuel, different power setting, the drs

man unt devil

its all relative manx as all the top ten cars in q3 will all be running on fumes , different power settings ,drs etc ,which makes me believe that when everybody is running with the same spec the merc is the quickest package -

It is the quickest quali package but not the quickest car on the grid. It's pace in long runs it's nowhere near the top teams. Therefore it cannot be the fastest car on the grid.

Does Hamilton drive it MUDD? If yes, it is the fastest car on the grid

man unt devil

the mercs long runs were comparable with others at barcelona , however long runs in practice tell us nothing as everybody will be trying out different aerodynamic bits and pieces , different fuel loads etc ,

you are missing the point manx -- i have never said the merc is the quickest in race trim because its tyre issues are holding it back but when tyre issues are not an issue it has proved itself to be the quickest package ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Q3

aristodemus

fluck me aristo sky must be putting different races on my goggle box , i never realised lewis has been cleaning up this season -
--- ill have to get on to sky about this maybe my set top box is on the blink

So when have tyres not been an issue martial?

man unt devil

not quite sure i fully understand your question manx , tyres are never really an issue for any team in qual and thats when the mercs have shown us what they can really do this season --