Firstly let me say I think Jose should go. It appears that the relationships with the players and board have either broken down completely or are very close to that.
Jose is a manager who requires absolutely everything within the club pulling in the same direction. Players need to buy into his ideas fully, boards need to support him not just with the cash but the trust that the players he wants will be the players to take the club for. I don't think Jose has either at the club. That's mostly his fault but partly not. You could say players are paid buy the club, they should automatically buy into whatever the manager is selling, but they are also humans. Some of them have been dug out in the press, seen their mates dug out and wonder when they will be next if they have a bad game, misplace a pass or take a shot when a pass was the better option. There seems to be an element of fear about playing for United at the minute.
What I feel can't be helped with Mourinho's situation is Woodward. The guy has been great at bringing revenue into the club, but I don't think I'm overreaching by saying he is not a fountain of football knowledge. Woodward has been determined in recent years to increase sponsorship revenue. With big name signing after big name signing that hasn't worked out, you have to wonder how much they were simply to satisfy the sponsors.
All this ignores the nonsensical negative tactics, which far from helping the team actually exposes the weakest part of our side. The culmination of this it what we are seeing on the pitch.
Horses for Courses
posted on 20/8/18
I didn't actually say they weren't playing for the manager and have downed tools. I believe a lot don't fully buy into his ideas and also believe that others are playing with a fair amount of fear, that is a long way from deliberately not playing for the managers
posted on 20/8/18
Jose got little financial backing shows me the board/owners arent convinced he can buy good investments.
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You can argue this is the case when it comes to the CB malarky. Jose played the 2 CBs he asked the board to buy in the last 2 seasons, and they produced a woeful performance yesterday.
I can understand why the board wouldn't be keen on Jose's recommendations now. They also sanctioned Mkhitaryan who was out the door in 18 months for a player Jose wanted (Sanchez) who is yet to produce.
I'm glad we didn't sign Boateng, a vastly overrated defender who was awful in the World Cup. The lad also can't stay fit.
posted on 20/8/18
comment by rosso is facking happy (U17054)
posted 6 minutes ago
Where's the evidence that the players aren't playing for Mourinho?
1. Mourinho has repeatedly praised efforts in training since the players have been back, as a group and individually.
2. When he is displeased with their efforts, he says so, as we well know. He hasn't done that other than with Martial since the players have been back.
3. The players have performed as asked to in the opening two games of the season. They have followed instructions and I see no evidence that the boss has been unhappy with their application in either game.
4. Everyone has shown up to training (barring Martial being late), and nobody's agent has been in the press criticising the club's manager or his training staff.
5. Yesterday we were poor, but we didn't perform in terms of approach any differently to any number of games in the last two seasons.
So where's the counterevidence?
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Well Jose said the players didnt execute the game plan, as they have lost confidence, or something to that effect.
He did say he wasnt going to pick out players, as he has got criticism for it previously, although Pogba has kinda refused to engage with the press when asked about Jose.
He has had a chance to praise Jose and say they have no issues and it just struck me as strange the way he was talking, compared to what you usually see/hear.
If you saw Joses face yesterday when Pogba was caught dallying on the ball outside is own box, or when United conceded some freekicks, he looked anything but happy.
I personally think he isnt a right fit for your club. He doesnt conduct himself i the right way and never accepts any criticism. If United arent going to challenge for the league, fans im sure at least want to see them playing the right way.
I hate to say it but Jose could sign Mbape and Neymar and I think United would still play counter attack football.
Man U have lost the swagger of the Fergie teams, he generally made average players good where as Jose seems to make good players average, on recent form.
posted on 20/8/18
To add, there is a reason why there is an active recruitment process now for a Sporting Director.
posted on 20/8/18
He also came out and said he no longer considers himself a ' manager', more a 'coach.' now.
posted on 20/8/18
comment by Mumbai Martial (U3867)
posted 28 minutes ago
I didn't actually say they weren't playing for the manager and have downed tools. I believe a lot don't fully buy into his ideas and also believe that others are playing with a fair amount of fear, that is a long way from deliberately not playing for the managers
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"It appears that the relationships with the players... have either broken down completely or are very close to that."
I don't see any persuasive evidence to support that statement.
posted on 20/8/18
comment by scholayScholes (U13961)
posted 59 minutes ago
He also came out and said he no longer considers himself a ' manager', more a 'coach.' now.
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I see him more of an eye gougingcunt
posted on 20/8/18
comment by rosso is facking happy (U17054)
posted 2 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by Mumbai Martial (U3867)
posted 28 minutes ago
I didn't actually say they weren't playing for the manager and have downed tools. I believe a lot don't fully buy into his ideas and also believe that others are playing with a fair amount of fear, that is a long way from deliberately not playing for the managers
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"It appears that the relationships with the players... have either broken down completely or are very close to that."
I don't see any persuasive evidence to support that statement.
----------------------
Martial's agent saying he needs to move.
Pogba saying he can't say what he really wants for fear of being fined.
His captain admitting he didn't try as hard as he should have.
A total lack of effort from the players.
posted on 20/8/18
comment by Greatteamswinit4times- a terrible enemy (U6008)
posted 6 hours, 12 minutes ago
I doubt that Woodward has much say in terms of the players coming in. No way Jose would accept players being bought for him, that he hasn't identified. Mourinho tells him who he wants, then it is up to Woodward and co to get the deal done.
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Woodward does however have a say in awarding utterly daft contracts to the likes of Sanchez that will destabilise the team...
posted on 21/8/18
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 19 hours, 27 minutes ago
comment by rosso is facking happy(U17054)
posted 2 hours, 11 minutes ago
comment by Mumbai Martial (U3867)
posted 28 minutes ago
I didn't actually say they weren't playing for the manager and have downed tools. I believe a lot don't fully buy into his ideas and also believe that others are playing with a fair amount of fear, that is a long way from deliberately not playing for the managers
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"It appears that the relationships with the players... have either broken down completely or are very close to that."
I don't see any persuasive evidence to support that statement.
----------------------
Martial's agent saying he needs to move.
Pogba saying he can't say what he really wants for fear of being fined.
His captain admitting he didn't try as hard as he should have.
A total lack of effort from the players.
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On Martial, he is not 'the players'; he is 'a player'. Find me a squad without a disgruntled player whose agent is seeking a move. Shaw was one twelve months ago.
Linking Pogba's quote about the possibility of being fined if he didn't pick his words carefully directly with a supposed unhappiness with Mourinho is speculation, not fact or even hypothesis supported by remotely persuasive evidence.
And on the players showing "a total lack of effort", we know that:
- Mourinho has said he is very happy with the players' commitment in training since they have returned
- Mourinho demands 100% from his players, and when they do not give it, he will dig them out collectively and/or individually. He has not done that at any point since the start of preseason barring with Martial.
- Mourinho has not criticised the players' commitment in either of the games so far this season, and has suggested they have followed instructions to his satisfaction.
I don't believe they have shown a "total lack of effort" at all. Did they press and harry at the weekend, chasing the game from the start and trying to win the ball back in the opposition's half? No.
Did they do that other than on very rare occasions in the last 24 months? No.
They aren't instructed to do that. It isn't how we play.
I'm afraid you've created or accepted a narrative in your head, as many others have done, that just isn't supported by evidence.