Yesterday's result didn't surprise me but the manner of the defeat and the scoreline did.
I think there are two factors to blame here:
Poor Officiating
The referee was awful yesterday. Clearly the game was too big for him and he didn't know how to handle it. That or he was clearly trying to give Spurs the win but I would like to hope the FA aren't that corrupt. He gives away a penalty for a non-existent foul and then sends off Holding after Son runs into him. I could go on but those were the two main decisions.
Awful refereeing yesterday and if it was on point, the scoreline would have been closer I am sure because before the pen, we were actually playing ok.
Capitulation by our team
Clearly our team lacks mental strength and experience. It wasn't the first time I have seen our side capitulate after conceding. Why didn't we keep our heads together after that penalty was given for a non-existent foul? Need to keep it together better because we allowed an extremely average team to seem much better than they really are. Thats what I can't accept.
Hard to take losing to an average team
posted on 13/5/22
It was a penalty
It was a red card
The only positives from this game were that Ramsdale made a couple of fantastic saves.
It could have been 6 or 7
posted on 13/5/22
comment by Maul Person (U12977)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by Emperor Kami (U9880)
posted 58 seconds ago
comment by Maul Person (U12977)
posted 28 seconds ago
I hate that we lost as much as the next Gooner but to put is all on the ref is lazy. However bad the ref may have been:
1. Holding lost his composure and only has himself to blame (Son obviously exaggerated but Holding should have been cleverer about his fouls and tackles).
2. Arteta should have adjusted for Holding after the first yellow.
3. Arteta should have started Tomi on the right. Possibly even have gone with a back three.
Point being, before blaming the ref, there is a lot to look at Arsenal for. This was a bad result but hopefully we see out the last two games and hope that Burnley (more so that Norwich) do us a favour.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven't solely put it on the ref. As my second point in the OP stated, we capitulated after an ok start once we conceded. We let our heads drop
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Capitulation is a reaction to events caused by the ref by your assessment. As you say, if the sending off hadn't happened, it would be a different game / result meaning it was the ref's fault.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But this is the point. Things aren't always going to go the way we want them to.
While my opinion is that the ref was poor, there's always going to be occasions where our players may, rightly or wrongly, feel hard done by, and I've seen little evidence of them dealing with that in a positive way.
posted on 13/5/22
comment by KSE Out (U21076)
posted 48 minutes ago
comment by Maul Person (U12977)
posted 1 hour, 32 minutes ago
comment by Emperor Kami (U9880)
posted 58 seconds ago
comment by Maul Person (U12977)
posted 28 seconds ago
I hate that we lost as much as the next Gooner but to put is all on the ref is lazy. However bad the ref may have been:
1. Holding lost his composure and only has himself to blame (Son obviously exaggerated but Holding should have been cleverer about his fouls and tackles).
2. Arteta should have adjusted for Holding after the first yellow.
3. Arteta should have started Tomi on the right. Possibly even have gone with a back three.
Point being, before blaming the ref, there is a lot to look at Arsenal for. This was a bad result but hopefully we see out the last two games and hope that Burnley (more so that Norwich) do us a favour.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven't solely put it on the ref. As my second point in the OP stated, we capitulated after an ok start once we conceded. We let our heads drop
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Capitulation is a reaction to events caused by the ref by your assessment. As you say, if the sending off hadn't happened, it would be a different game / result meaning it was the ref's fault.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But this is the point. Things aren't always going to go the way we want them to.
While my opinion is that the ref was poor, there's always going to be occasions where our players may, rightly or wrongly, feel hard done by, and I've seen little evidence of them dealing with that in a positive way.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The way they dealt with things is a fair comment to make but the REASON things went wrong to begin with was how they played and how they were set out to play rather than poor officiating.
posted on 13/5/22
What about the 2nd goal? The ref gives a foul against Saka for winning the ball. The fk goes for a corner and boom they score.
posted on 13/5/22
comment by BO$$™ (U6401)
posted 30 minutes ago
What about the 2nd goal? The ref gives a foul against Saka for winning the ball. The fk goes for a corner and boom they score.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't (and wouldn't) say the ref was perfect. I took issue with the OP suggesting that that the ref alone or primarily was why we lost the game.
posted on 13/5/22
comment by Maul Person (U12977)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by BO$$™ (U6401)
posted 30 minutes ago
What about the 2nd goal? The ref gives a foul against Saka for winning the ball. The fk goes for a corner and boom they score.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't (and wouldn't) say the ref was perfect. I took issue with the OP suggesting that that the ref alone or primarily was why we lost the game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Again I never said it was the main sole reason. It was one of 2 reasons
posted on 13/5/22
posted on 13/5/22
comment by Emile Death Rowe (TCM) (U8959)
posted 5 hours, 25 minutes ago
comment by palmers_spur (U8896)
posted 30 minutes ago
Not calling you that btw
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True but there are Spurs fans getting very excited (maybe not literally frothing at the mouth) and it's understandable as to why that is.
It was more of a let them get excited and let's just focus on us type thing. We can still make this result meaningless although this feels like the Palace game with a 3-0 loss as well Holding now out and Gabriel possibly out as well. Considering White wasn't fit enough to play then we it might be Tomiyasu and Xhaka at CB with Cedric and Tavares at full back for Newcastle
----------------------------------------------------------------------
99% of the time if a player is fit enough to be on the bench they'll be ok to start the next game.
Only reason he wasn't brought on when Holding was sent off was to ensure we'd have two CBs available for Monday.
Obviously we weren't expecting Gabriel to pick up an injury, hopefully he'll be ok for Newcastle but otherwise it'll be Tomiyasu at LCB and White RCB.
posted on 13/5/22
comment by SteveF (U22027)
posted 8 hours, 16 minutes ago
Never read so muck cack in one post.
To say the ref stole the game from Arsenal and that, somehow they were the better team and cheated out of it, is ridiculous.
To say the penalty was not a foul, therefore intimating Son was not even touched is ridiculous.
To say Holding "didn't foul anyone, guv " is ridiculous.
To have a manager like Arteta is ridiculous. I am sorry, but he comes across as, at best, totally delusional and like Wenger, totally incapable of accepting a lose, or at worst, someone you would expect to be running a cult somewhere in the Arizona desert. The way he conducted the post match interview was simply weird. Even the interviewer didn't know what was going on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This coming from the guy that makes a zillion articles about conspiracies against Spurs
posted on 13/5/22
We must accept a level of responsibility as must Arteta for getting things wrong. Only thing I'll say is IF the refereeing in the Premier League wasn't so corrupt then Mike Dean wouldn't have been on VAR last night (in fact he wouldn't even be employed) and Son gets sent off 11 minutes in, if he's sent off it's a totally different game, this was at 0-0 before the penalty and red card. So the fact that Paul Tierney & Mike Dean choose to ignore this completely directly affects the result, particularly when Son wins the penalty and gets Holding sent off. This is why it hurts even more when the penalty that was given to them was soft and would never be given to us, in fact you'd very rarely see this penalty given to anyone in my opinion. Also, the freekick that led to their second goal was a foul on Saka not Saka's foul... For me Son is a massive cheat, this we already know and cleverly runs into Holding to get him sent off but Holding allowed this whole situation to arise by playing like an idiot beforehand, allowing the referee to do the damage to us he wanted to and was told to in order to keep the CL race alive a little longer.
We must have realised by now that we can't give the refs any opportunity to do us when they've been progressively screwlng us more and more for the last 15+ years, just a shame we seemed to totally neglect that in this game.