I’m approaching ETH out

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 14 minutes ago
We'll see. In my eyes, unlike the final days of Solskjaer and others, the horrific injury situation is significant mitigation. We're playing with our fourth and fifth choice centre backs much of the time. Martinez and Shaw were absolutely crucial parts of our ability to build from the back last season. ETH clearly wanted better back-up but the club weren't able to buy a CB because Maguire wasn't willing to move on. Mount hasn't played much - not because ETH 'shat the bed' after Wolves, but because we was also out injured for a few weeks (and on what basis are we concluding he's back to match fitness?). Casemiro has been in woeful physical shape and sharpness, and his judgement has suffered as a result. Mainoo looked to offer depth of quality at the base of midfield but has been injured since pre-season. Sancho has been reclining in his gaming chair eating Doritos. Antony was accused of domestic violence.

A number of goals that would have come at critical times have been chalked off for marginal offsides or shots have whistled past the wrong side of the post. With slightly better luck we'd have six points in the CL, have beaten Arsenal at the Emirates, a couple of those ropy wins would look comfortable, Hojlund and Rashford would have a few goals to their name and the confidence that comes from that. I don't think the players aren't playing for their manager. Look at how relatively purposefully we started out the derby yesterday. I just think the system is destabilised by all the injuries and the consequent changes in personnel, and that makes things disjointed, and as a result players lose their rhythm a bit.

But above all we all know that the root problems are in the long-term strategy and recruitment. Does anyone have any confidence at all that the club could currently attract a manager who is better than ETH? What sought-after, ambitious manager is going to look at United and think this is a good career move, a chance to further burnish his reputation? And why would the underlying issues that have held back every manager since Fergie not prevent the next one from succeeding? Do we really think the managers who have gone to other clubs and excelled over recent years would have done just as well at United?
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Very fair post.

I was a bit worried yesterday though that he thought dropping McT deeper was the option when he took Amrabat off. It was a strange move to take him off anyway unless he was injured IMO.

I'm also worried that he thinks he can't drop Bruno and Rashford. I feel for them a bit as I think they've been overplayed and have suffered as a result. A week off here and there would do them wonders IMO.

I'm thinking we should allow him to stick this out though. I am however hoping to see a few of the youngsters playing on Wednesday. I'd get as many as possible of Hannibal, Mainoo, Mount, Garnacho and Hojlund on the field v Newcastle and at least try to inject some energy into the side. If Amrabat unavailable hopefully Casemiro will be to try and get him back into shape and form.

He's got to go blud.

Diafol, Cesario - on the selections yesterday:

We don't know the Varane context: whether he was able to play but 'in the red zone' in terms of susceptibility, whether we was able to play but judged to be unlikely to have 100% sharpness. We do know he's a player who can't play twice a week throughout the season. We also should have spotted the fact that Evans is a significantly better passer of the ball than him, and in the absence of Martinez it's a genuine trade-off between Varane's superior defending vs Evan's superior distribution. If you add to that some physical issue with Varane that's not enough to eliminate him altogether, it perhaps becomes a more marginal call.

Lindelof vs Reguilon - two very different players, giving two different tactical options. Lindelof can tuck in and free midfielders to shift into wider / more advanced positions. Reguilon can't really do that, but can bomb up the flank. It's not axiomatic that one or the other is the right way to set up your team.

Bruno and Rashford: certainly not playing that productively, but is any other player in the front four making a compelling case to replace them? I haven't seen the stats but would guess Bruno is still creating more goal chances than anyone else. Rashford's form is in a hole but his pace means he's still going to get on the end of chances that no one else will.

My point isn't that ETH is doing everything right. It's that the things that seem obviously wrong always tend to have some rational thought behind them, and I think we flatter our own powers of judgement when we assume the manager is a fool and we know better.

And of course we're all pretty miserable about the club at the moment, and all the Dunnings and Krugers of this forum are especially up in arms.

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 3 minutes ago
Diafol, Cesario - on the selections yesterday:

We don't know the Varane context: whether he was able to play but 'in the red zone' in terms of susceptibility, whether we was able to play but judged to be unlikely to have 100% sharpness. We do know he's a player who can't play twice a week throughout the season. We also should have spotted the fact that Evans is a significantly better passer of the ball than him, and in the absence of Martinez it's a genuine trade-off between Varane's superior defending vs Evan's superior distribution. If you add to that some physical issue with Varane that's not enough to eliminate him altogether, it perhaps becomes a more marginal call.

Lindelof vs Reguilon - two very different players, giving two different tactical options. Lindelof can tuck in and free midfielders to shift into wider / more advanced positions. Reguilon can't really do that, but can bomb up the flank. It's not axiomatic that one or the other is the right way to set up your team.

Bruno and Rashford: certainly not playing that productively, but is any other player in the front four making a compelling case to replace them? I haven't seen the stats but would guess Bruno is still creating more goal chances than anyone else. Rashford's form is in a hole but his pace means he's still going to get on the end of chances that no one else will.

My point isn't that ETH is doing everything right. It's that the things that seem obviously wrong always tend to have some rational thought behind them, and I think we flatter our own powers of judgement when we assume the manager is a fool and we know better.

And of course we're all pretty miserable about the club at the moment, and all the Dunnings and Krugers of this forum are especially up in arms.
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Bless ‘em, I do admire your patience when trying to reason with them, are you a child psychologist by profession ?

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 19 minutes ago
Diafol, Cesario - on the selections yesterday:

We don't know the Varane context: whether he was able to play but 'in the red zone' in terms of susceptibility, whether we was able to play but judged to be unlikely to have 100% sharpness. We do know he's a player who can't play twice a week throughout the season. We also should have spotted the fact that Evans is a significantly better passer of the ball than him, and in the absence of Martinez it's a genuine trade-off between Varane's superior defending vs Evan's superior distribution. If you add to that some physical issue with Varane that's not enough to eliminate him altogether, it perhaps becomes a more marginal call.

Lindelof vs Reguilon - two very different players, giving two different tactical options. Lindelof can tuck in and free midfielders to shift into wider / more advanced positions. Reguilon can't really do that, but can bomb up the flank. It's not axiomatic that one or the other is the right way to set up your team.

Bruno and Rashford: certainly not playing that productively, but is any other player in the front four making a compelling case to replace them? I haven't seen the stats but would guess Bruno is still creating more goal chances than anyone else. Rashford's form is in a hole but his pace means he's still going to get on the end of chances that no one else will.

My point isn't that ETH is doing everything right. It's that the things that seem obviously wrong always tend to have some rational thought behind them, and I think we flatter our own powers of judgement when we assume the manager is a fool and we know better.

And of course we're all pretty miserable about the club at the moment, and all the Dunnings and Krugers of this forum are especially up in arms.
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I understood the Varane and Reguilon calls really. If they're not 100% but could offer 30mins then it was worth it. I don't think our defence lost us the game either to be fair.

I'd advocate dropping/resting Bruno and Rashford for a few reasons. They've been played a lot. They need to be aware that they can be dropped/rested if they don't perform. The fringe players (Garnacho, Mount/Eriksen etc) need to feel like they have something to grasp onto if and when they play. Competition isn't a bad thing and if a kick up the backside does the trick then it's worth it IMO. I'd still have them in my best XI when on form.

I, of course, also absolutely agree that a pro football manager knows better than I do on here. Perhaps he is happy with what Bruno is attempting to do and is trying to put the arm round the shoulder of Rashford by trying to play him into form. I'd just like to see something a bit different though at times.

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 13 minutes ago
comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)
posted 15 minutes ago
comment by Gillespie Rd. (U18361)
posted 1 minute ago
The 3rd City goal came on the back of at least 20 unchallenged passes.

It's not about tactics anymore. ETH may be a brilliant manager, but he's clearly lost the dressing room.
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A lot if that comes from his favoritism. He can be very stubborn about it. It will kill him
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About five minutes ago, your key piece of evidence for Ten Hag's stubbornness was his absolute commitment to playing Antony. He'll never drop him, because he's too stubborn to admit his mistake! He's going to pick Antony in the starting line-up because and that will indicate that he's a stupid man!

Will you acknowledge that your prediction that ETH would never drop out Antony was misplaced?
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You assume he has dropped Antony? He came back from his "break" and started immediately. Yesterdays performance will re-affirm his stubbornness. I have not been proven wrong yet.

comment by Redastomatoes- Feels very Moyesian...cleverson forever!If he is good enough he is ready! (U12026)

You assume he has dropped Antony? He came back from his "break" and started immediately. Yesterdays performance will re-affirm his stubbornness. I have not been proven wrong yet.
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He dropped Antony yesterday, whatever he chooses to do in the future.

You've been talking about ETH's insistence on playing Antony and no one else no matter what, due to favouritism/stupidity/arrogance. You can't just brush under the carpet his not picking the player, and then not bringing him on when the person picked instead of him left the right wing, in a crucial game. You're still moaning about favouritism this morning, when your relentlessly promoted Exhibit A evidence of favouritism was knocked off the table last night. Circa last week I predicted that as players come back from injury and ETH sees more options for the right wing, it's likely Antony would get fewer minutes, and if I recall correctly, you weren't having any of it.

We wouldn't be having this conversation if you occasionally qualified your statements. "He is too reliant on Antony and too reluctant to try alternatives, perhaps influenced by making the call to green light the huge investment in the player" is a reasonable statement that I tend to agree with. "He's going to pick Antony today because he always picks Antony because he's a stupid, arrogant man who can't admit his mistakes" is a ridiculously categorical statement.

Antony got dropped yesterday. It would strengthen, rather than weaken, your argument if you acknowledged the details that don't fit neatly into it. If you don't, it comes across more as an agenda.

"If ETH had a clear plan and stuck with it but we were losing I’d back him, but I just can’t see it all."

This is probably the biggest issue, and whilst not entirely his fault, the money we have spent should allow him to have implemented his style by now.

I don't think he has the players to play how he wants and like last season, has reverted to a safety first approach.

"You assume he has dropped Antony? He came back from his "break" and started immediately. Yesterdays performance will re-affirm his stubbornness. I have not been proven wrong yet."

Do you think we'd have done worse with Antony in Brunos position yesterday? Because Grealish and Gvardiol had an absolute field day with Bruno "helping" Dalot.