Minus the defence add that all up and you get Ali.
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Thoughts are that if "Ali "couldnt even get into your list then its probably not worth reading.
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Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Robinson doesn't come into consideration for ring IQ and your description of him is regurgitated rubbish spouted by those to appear knowledgeable, there is very little footage of the SRR you describe. Maybe against Graziano and the LaMotta VI but both of them were to be hit with alarming regularity, Turpin showed in both fights that if you made Robinson think (Ring IQ) he was less effect.
comment by The Guvnor III V.I.K-We're going to hell ... (U12889)
posted 2 hours, 58 minutes ago
Kash
I think Frazier had a better hook than Ali.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Holyfield also had a mean hook on him.
IQ - Ali for me.
Right- Lewis (when he actually wanted to use it which probably wasn't enough).
Jab - Larry Holmes.
Defence - Jack Johnson(old school).
Just a few answers off the top of my head, not necessarily the best and all Heavyweights.
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Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Ring IQ you'd be looking more at his contemporaries like Moore or Charles possibly Hopkins or Mayweather from the current day.
IQ - Mayweather
Hook - Frasier
Right hand - Haye
Jab - Lewis
Defence - Mayweather
Reflexes - Naz
(Based only on fighters who I've actually seen plenty of)
Not a big fan of these things as there are many other factors that lend themselves to fighters having a good right hand/defence and jabs etc like footwork judging range and reactions (not reflexes cos all boxers will have the same relfex speed) its just so hard to categorise them now. For example Fraziers left hook wouldnt have been anywere near as effective if he didnt have the headmovement and chin to be able to get in close to land that left hook. Lewis' right hand wouldnt have been as effective if he couldnt judge range as well as he could and have a stiff jab to keep opponents at that range etc if you know what i mean.
I think you also have to include some other characteristics in this, for instance the pure will and iron chin that Micky Ward had would be good in any situation, Gatti for the same reason probably.
Ring IQ, I think you should consider Chris Eubank, he had a lot of ring smarts that he probably doesn't get the credit for.
For hooks then at the moment you would have to say GGG. He is a master at hitting to the body, both with power and amazing accuracy. henry Cooper probably deserves a mention in this category, it was his signature punch and did knockdown the greatest of them all!
Jab I would have to say Klitscko has made a career out of it. From the past then maybe someone like Lewis, there was a lot of spite in his jabs I always thought.
Defence is hands down Mayweather, he is a master at it.
A lot of historians would argue Willie Pep had a better defence than floyd did. Personally i havent really seen any of him so i cant say ...Ward is also insanely good defensivley
comment by delboy82 (U7141)
posted 1 hour, 22 minutes ago
A lot of historians would argue Willie Pep had a better defence than floyd did. Personally i havent really seen any of him so i cant say ...Ward is also insanely good defensivley
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Possibly, I can't say for the same reason. i think Mayweather is getting the plaudits in that category simply because he is the best at it in recent times. I have watched boxing since the 80's and I haven't seen anyone as good as him in that time.
IQ - Duran. Very underrated IQ, great subtlety and guise to his aggressive style.
Hook - Frasier
Right hand - Shavers
Jab - Holmes
Defence - Whittaker. Picked over Mayweather because he stayed in better positions to hit back.
Could add some more like:
Chin - Ali
Footwork - Mayweather
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I suppose you could say that they could all for in to other categories as well, depending on the fighter and their style.
Good point on the physical attributes, too. I maybe went too much for power when picking punchers as they're all heavyweights
But then you can get into the argument of how much is reflex and how much is the skill of timing the punch... Everyone always says Mayweather and Ali have great reflexes, and the do, but reflexes can only get you so far. The timing of the punch is definitely a skill, although there are quite a lot of variables so difficult to account for it in terms of the point of the article
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posted on 27/6/15
Minus the defence add that all up and you get Ali.
posted on 27/6/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 27/6/15
Thoughts are that if "Ali "couldnt even get into your list then its probably not worth reading.
posted on 27/6/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 27/6/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 27/6/15
Robinson doesn't come into consideration for ring IQ and your description of him is regurgitated rubbish spouted by those to appear knowledgeable, there is very little footage of the SRR you describe. Maybe against Graziano and the LaMotta VI but both of them were to be hit with alarming regularity, Turpin showed in both fights that if you made Robinson think (Ring IQ) he was less effect.
posted on 27/6/15
comment by The Guvnor III V.I.K-We're going to hell ... (U12889)
posted 2 hours, 58 minutes ago
Kash
I think Frazier had a better hook than Ali.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Holyfield also had a mean hook on him.
IQ - Ali for me.
Right- Lewis (when he actually wanted to use it which probably wasn't enough).
Jab - Larry Holmes.
Defence - Jack Johnson(old school).
Just a few answers off the top of my head, not necessarily the best and all Heavyweights.
posted on 27/6/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 27/6/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 27/6/15
Ring IQ you'd be looking more at his contemporaries like Moore or Charles possibly Hopkins or Mayweather from the current day.
posted on 28/6/15
IQ - Mayweather
Hook - Frasier
Right hand - Haye
Jab - Lewis
Defence - Mayweather
Reflexes - Naz
(Based only on fighters who I've actually seen plenty of)
posted on 29/6/15
Not a big fan of these things as there are many other factors that lend themselves to fighters having a good right hand/defence and jabs etc like footwork judging range and reactions (not reflexes cos all boxers will have the same relfex speed) its just so hard to categorise them now. For example Fraziers left hook wouldnt have been anywere near as effective if he didnt have the headmovement and chin to be able to get in close to land that left hook. Lewis' right hand wouldnt have been as effective if he couldnt judge range as well as he could and have a stiff jab to keep opponents at that range etc if you know what i mean.
posted on 30/6/15
I think you also have to include some other characteristics in this, for instance the pure will and iron chin that Micky Ward had would be good in any situation, Gatti for the same reason probably.
Ring IQ, I think you should consider Chris Eubank, he had a lot of ring smarts that he probably doesn't get the credit for.
For hooks then at the moment you would have to say GGG. He is a master at hitting to the body, both with power and amazing accuracy. henry Cooper probably deserves a mention in this category, it was his signature punch and did knockdown the greatest of them all!
Jab I would have to say Klitscko has made a career out of it. From the past then maybe someone like Lewis, there was a lot of spite in his jabs I always thought.
Defence is hands down Mayweather, he is a master at it.
posted on 30/6/15
A lot of historians would argue Willie Pep had a better defence than floyd did. Personally i havent really seen any of him so i cant say ...Ward is also insanely good defensivley
posted on 30/6/15
comment by delboy82 (U7141)
posted 1 hour, 22 minutes ago
A lot of historians would argue Willie Pep had a better defence than floyd did. Personally i havent really seen any of him so i cant say ...Ward is also insanely good defensivley
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Possibly, I can't say for the same reason. i think Mayweather is getting the plaudits in that category simply because he is the best at it in recent times. I have watched boxing since the 80's and I haven't seen anyone as good as him in that time.
posted on 30/6/15
IQ - Duran. Very underrated IQ, great subtlety and guise to his aggressive style.
Hook - Frasier
Right hand - Shavers
Jab - Holmes
Defence - Whittaker. Picked over Mayweather because he stayed in better positions to hit back.
Could add some more like:
Chin - Ali
Footwork - Mayweather
posted on 1/7/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 1/7/15
I suppose you could say that they could all for in to other categories as well, depending on the fighter and their style.
posted on 1/7/15
Good point on the physical attributes, too. I maybe went too much for power when picking punchers as they're all heavyweights
posted on 1/7/15
But then you can get into the argument of how much is reflex and how much is the skill of timing the punch... Everyone always says Mayweather and Ali have great reflexes, and the do, but reflexes can only get you so far. The timing of the punch is definitely a skill, although there are quite a lot of variables so difficult to account for it in terms of the point of the article
posted on 1/7/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
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