Sins of our forefathers cannot be used by islamist extremists who his hate us, and want power, IMO.
A few guys such as Blair or Clinton or Bush decide foreign policy, as do arms and oil leaders, so why attack Christians in Egypt, girls in Manchester, drinkers in London, students and tourists in Philippines and Mali, yazidis in Iraq and Syria, Jews I. Israel and Brussels,,gay clubberscin America etc etc.
.........................................
Couldn't you say exactly the same thing about the various groups of people we've killed.....
All the Afghani's after a bunch of Saudi's flew a plane into American buildings...
and then a bunch of Iraqis for good measure, it is all well and good to complain about our innocents, each one is a tragedy.
It is important to acknowledge the hundreds of thousands more tragedies on the other side we cause though.
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 45 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
It isn't the sole reason but without western foreign policy much if it would not happen.
Your constant underplaying of it and talk of smokescreens just play up the stupidity of your position. It is a massive part of the reason for the terrori we suffer today ISIS would be nowhere near the force they are today without the Wests help, the fact an attacker may not specifically have the Iraq war in mind does nothing to diminish the role that and many other policy decisions played in putting him there.
Usually people who would like to deny our own complicity in it seem to think Islam is the only problem, a dangerous ideology.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I've not underplayed or denied complicity, you're making that up. My opinion is just balanced, something you're incapable of being. The stated aim of ISIS is to create a worldwide caliphate, that cannot be pinned on Western Governments, it's their ideology. Sure, events in the Middle East have helped them accelerate their growth, but they've also been heavily bankrolled by wealthy supporters. Some of the people who have joined them have done so because they've been directly affected by Western policy, but if you think the hardcore base of ISIS members don't use the West as a convenient excuse for their actions, for things they would be doing anyway, then you're beyond naive, or just plain stupid.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the fact you think pointing out the West's heavy involvement in growing ISIS is akin to supporting terrorism shows what a nutter you are.
It is all well and good ISIS having wealthy backers but without us creating the situation they wouldn't exist to anywhere near the same degree. Wealthy backers alone do not make a terrorist movement that has managed to do as much as ISIS.
The opportunities the West has given them has certainly been a huge factor in the growth they have achieved and the worldwide attacks that they have carried out.
If you think looking at the causes of things makes you a terrorist sympathiser than politics is probably a bit too emotional for you....
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 35 minutes ago
comment by thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
posted 8 minutes ago
I never see any poster on here say western policy is not partly to blame, or provide an excuse for Isis....weall get that.
I never see posters claiming All Muslims are terrorists, extremists or apologists either.
However, I constantly read posts accusing islamist extremist critics of these two falsehoods...the.west is totally not to blame, and Muslims are terrorists?
Stop spinning and lying when debating this subject, please.
Scores of times I condemn an islamist attack, and then I am accused of cheer leading western foreign policy and hating muslims, when neither are true.
Clever guys on here again are purposely not reading what Weare or terminator say, admitting western policies are part of the islamist extremist package.
Odd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's baffling how much selective reading goes on here. I've lost count of the amount of times I've acknowledged the Wests role in what's happening, yet because I don't think we're 100% to blame, I'm a denialist. And he thinks I'm the stupid one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Speaking of spinning and lying perhaps you could point out the post where I said what you are accusing me of and Term joined in with....?
Whoops....
Best not to spin and lie when people can just check the forum and see what has (or hasn't) been written.
I was questioning Term's underplaying of it, usually seen in people with very dangerous ideologies who start blaming certain large groups of people.
The fact I try and look for root causes making me a terrorist sympathiser show him to be at best unhinged.
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 54 seconds ago
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 45 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
It isn't the sole reason but without western foreign policy much if it would not happen.
Your constant underplaying of it and talk of smokescreens just play up the stupidity of your position. It is a massive part of the reason for the terrori we suffer today ISIS would be nowhere near the force they are today without the Wests help, the fact an attacker may not specifically have the Iraq war in mind does nothing to diminish the role that and many other policy decisions played in putting him there.
Usually people who would like to deny our own complicity in it seem to think Islam is the only problem, a dangerous ideology.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I've not underplayed or denied complicity, you're making that up. My opinion is just balanced, something you're incapable of being. The stated aim of ISIS is to create a worldwide caliphate, that cannot be pinned on Western Governments, it's their ideology. Sure, events in the Middle East have helped them accelerate their growth, but they've also been heavily bankrolled by wealthy supporters. Some of the people who have joined them have done so because they've been directly affected by Western policy, but if you think the hardcore base of ISIS members don't use the West as a convenient excuse for their actions, for things they would be doing anyway, then you're beyond naive, or just plain stupid.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the fact you think pointing out the West's heavy involvement in growing ISIS is akin to supporting terrorism shows what a nutter you are.
It is all well and good ISIS having wealthy backers but without us creating the situation they wouldn't exist to anywhere near the same degree. Wealthy backers alone do not make a terrorist movement that has managed to do as much as ISIS.
The opportunities the West has given them has certainly been a huge factor in the growth they have achieved and the worldwide attacks that they have carried out.
If you think looking at the causes of things makes you a terrorist sympathiser than politics is probably a bit too emotional for you....
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's funny, everything you're saying here, I've already said on numerous occasions.
You're not just pointing out the Wests involvement though, are you? That's what I'm doing. But because I'm not basically also saying that ISIS are justified in their actions with how I'm saying it, which is what you are doing, then I'm a nutter???
As tragic as it is when families get caught up in military actions, we've got to believe that none of it is intentional. And don't forget that the terrorists use these families as human shields, then blame the West when these tragic incidents occur.
There's always two sides to everything, and I've acknowledged that all through this thread. You haven't, which is why you've opened yourself up to being labled.
I didn't once say ISIS are justified in what they are doing the fact you have to make up things to try and prove your point shows how weak it is.
Pointing out the causes of something (which are well known) doesn't make me either a terrorist sympathiser or something who think ISIS are doing good things.
It makes me a realist who wants to look at the causes, the fact you would rather underplay those causes and call people names who point out those facts, it is a dangerous ideology you have there, when you try and lunderplay the actual causes it leaves you left grasping at 'other things'
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
I didn't once say ISIS are justified in what they are doing the fact you have to make up things to try and prove your point shows how weak it is.
Pointing out the causes of something (which are well known) doesn't make me either a terrorist sympathiser or something who think ISIS are doing good things.
It makes me a realist who wants to look at the causes, the fact you would rather underplay those causes and call people names who point out those facts, it is a dangerous ideology you have there, when you try and lunderplay the actual causes it leaves you left grasping at 'other things'
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But the people being killed in England have nothing to do with our governments actions in fact most people oppose it.
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By that logic the white van driver the other night was justified in striking back
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 7 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
I think the problem is two fold, I am not particularly patriotic or nationalistic, people are people and rather than emotional reaction I prefer to try and look for reasons/causes which for some reason is upsetting to some.
comment by Robb Van Nistelrooy (U21234)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By that logic the white van driver the other night was justified in striking back
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There seems to be a huge disconnect here so let me try this the other way around...
All the Islamic extremism going on made the van man attack more likely..
I imagine this statement won't be attacked so passionately or get me labelled as a terrorist sympathiser, I guess people pick and choose the facts they like....
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
The one where the West supported Al Qaeda to fight off the Russians?
Also the West had done much in the ME prior to Iraq but specifically on that point Islamic terrorism certainly seems to have increased in the UK since the Iraq war.
WAs it the wests fault that the Ottoman Empire exterminated 1.5 million Armenians ?
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 20 minutes ago
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of all this is to show that the Middle East wasn't some peaceful ideal before the west showed up.
Nothing the west has done there means Islamic extremists should be killing kids in England. If they really have a beef with the west (which I'm sure they justifiably do) they need to understand that much like Islamic extremists don't mean 'all muslims', the west doesn't mean 'everyone in the west'
It means the ones who give the commands. The politicians who make the decisions.
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 3 hours, 28 minutes ago
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
For once, I agree with you
Simply put, politics and religion are probably responsible for inflicting the most misery on people throughout mankind.
Humans aren't peaceful by nature. We will always fight over resources and for power. It's just a never-ending cycle that we just have to live through. There are many factors at play so trying to pin the blame on just a few of them is unwise. These discussions just end up going around in circles.
comment by Robb Van Nistelrooy (U21234)
posted 8 hours, 10 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 20 minutes ago
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of all this is to show that the Middle East wasn't some peaceful ideal before the west showed up.
Nothing the west has done there means Islamic extremists should be killing kids in England. If they really have a beef with the west (which I'm sure they justifiably do) they need to understand that much like Islamic extremists don't mean 'all muslims', the west doesn't mean 'everyone in the west'
It means the ones who give the commands. The politicians who make the decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the vast majority of violence is wrong but just telling people it is wrong is pointless whilst doing actions which contribute to it.
If moral judgements stopped violence then it would have stopped years ago I would like to be a bit more realistic and try and remove many of the causes instead.
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 3 hours, 31 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 3 hours, 28 minutes ago
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
For once, I agree with you
Simply put, politics and religion are probably responsible for inflicting the most misery on people throughout mankind.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Or maybe humanity isn't as noble or as peaceful as we'd like to think and violence and war is very much a part of our psyche?
Disturbing video..
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=911501655672448&id=190759221080032&refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2FArmyAnonymous%2Fvideos%2F911501655672448%2F&_rdr
"Why do they hate us?" Or rather should be, "why do they hate some of us"?
This tells you some of why..
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
comment by Jordan Henderson £16m AKA Henderlol (U12335)
posted 5 hours, 23 minutes ago
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Religion is so mental
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 3 hours, 10 minutes ago
comment by Jordan Henderson £16m AKA Henderlol (U12335)
posted 5 hours, 23 minutes ago
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Religion is so mental
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Amen to that
God is love.
Man is nuts, and woman bonkers👍
When humans go to work, they can mess anything up.
Do not blame the messenger....blame yourselves.
I do👍
Sign in if you want to comment
Another attack
Page 8 of 9
6 | 7 | 8 | 9
posted on 22/6/17
Sins of our forefathers cannot be used by islamist extremists who his hate us, and want power, IMO.
A few guys such as Blair or Clinton or Bush decide foreign policy, as do arms and oil leaders, so why attack Christians in Egypt, girls in Manchester, drinkers in London, students and tourists in Philippines and Mali, yazidis in Iraq and Syria, Jews I. Israel and Brussels,,gay clubberscin America etc etc.
.........................................
Couldn't you say exactly the same thing about the various groups of people we've killed.....
All the Afghani's after a bunch of Saudi's flew a plane into American buildings...
and then a bunch of Iraqis for good measure, it is all well and good to complain about our innocents, each one is a tragedy.
It is important to acknowledge the hundreds of thousands more tragedies on the other side we cause though.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 45 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
It isn't the sole reason but without western foreign policy much if it would not happen.
Your constant underplaying of it and talk of smokescreens just play up the stupidity of your position. It is a massive part of the reason for the terrori we suffer today ISIS would be nowhere near the force they are today without the Wests help, the fact an attacker may not specifically have the Iraq war in mind does nothing to diminish the role that and many other policy decisions played in putting him there.
Usually people who would like to deny our own complicity in it seem to think Islam is the only problem, a dangerous ideology.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I've not underplayed or denied complicity, you're making that up. My opinion is just balanced, something you're incapable of being. The stated aim of ISIS is to create a worldwide caliphate, that cannot be pinned on Western Governments, it's their ideology. Sure, events in the Middle East have helped them accelerate their growth, but they've also been heavily bankrolled by wealthy supporters. Some of the people who have joined them have done so because they've been directly affected by Western policy, but if you think the hardcore base of ISIS members don't use the West as a convenient excuse for their actions, for things they would be doing anyway, then you're beyond naive, or just plain stupid.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the fact you think pointing out the West's heavy involvement in growing ISIS is akin to supporting terrorism shows what a nutter you are.
It is all well and good ISIS having wealthy backers but without us creating the situation they wouldn't exist to anywhere near the same degree. Wealthy backers alone do not make a terrorist movement that has managed to do as much as ISIS.
The opportunities the West has given them has certainly been a huge factor in the growth they have achieved and the worldwide attacks that they have carried out.
If you think looking at the causes of things makes you a terrorist sympathiser than politics is probably a bit too emotional for you....
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 35 minutes ago
comment by thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
posted 8 minutes ago
I never see any poster on here say western policy is not partly to blame, or provide an excuse for Isis....weall get that.
I never see posters claiming All Muslims are terrorists, extremists or apologists either.
However, I constantly read posts accusing islamist extremist critics of these two falsehoods...the.west is totally not to blame, and Muslims are terrorists?
Stop spinning and lying when debating this subject, please.
Scores of times I condemn an islamist attack, and then I am accused of cheer leading western foreign policy and hating muslims, when neither are true.
Clever guys on here again are purposely not reading what Weare or terminator say, admitting western policies are part of the islamist extremist package.
Odd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's baffling how much selective reading goes on here. I've lost count of the amount of times I've acknowledged the Wests role in what's happening, yet because I don't think we're 100% to blame, I'm a denialist. And he thinks I'm the stupid one
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Speaking of spinning and lying perhaps you could point out the post where I said what you are accusing me of and Term joined in with....?
Whoops....
Best not to spin and lie when people can just check the forum and see what has (or hasn't) been written.
I was questioning Term's underplaying of it, usually seen in people with very dangerous ideologies who start blaming certain large groups of people.
The fact I try and look for root causes making me a terrorist sympathiser show him to be at best unhinged.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 54 seconds ago
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 8 hours, 45 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
It isn't the sole reason but without western foreign policy much if it would not happen.
Your constant underplaying of it and talk of smokescreens just play up the stupidity of your position. It is a massive part of the reason for the terrori we suffer today ISIS would be nowhere near the force they are today without the Wests help, the fact an attacker may not specifically have the Iraq war in mind does nothing to diminish the role that and many other policy decisions played in putting him there.
Usually people who would like to deny our own complicity in it seem to think Islam is the only problem, a dangerous ideology.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I've not underplayed or denied complicity, you're making that up. My opinion is just balanced, something you're incapable of being. The stated aim of ISIS is to create a worldwide caliphate, that cannot be pinned on Western Governments, it's their ideology. Sure, events in the Middle East have helped them accelerate their growth, but they've also been heavily bankrolled by wealthy supporters. Some of the people who have joined them have done so because they've been directly affected by Western policy, but if you think the hardcore base of ISIS members don't use the West as a convenient excuse for their actions, for things they would be doing anyway, then you're beyond naive, or just plain stupid.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the fact you think pointing out the West's heavy involvement in growing ISIS is akin to supporting terrorism shows what a nutter you are.
It is all well and good ISIS having wealthy backers but without us creating the situation they wouldn't exist to anywhere near the same degree. Wealthy backers alone do not make a terrorist movement that has managed to do as much as ISIS.
The opportunities the West has given them has certainly been a huge factor in the growth they have achieved and the worldwide attacks that they have carried out.
If you think looking at the causes of things makes you a terrorist sympathiser than politics is probably a bit too emotional for you....
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's funny, everything you're saying here, I've already said on numerous occasions.
You're not just pointing out the Wests involvement though, are you? That's what I'm doing. But because I'm not basically also saying that ISIS are justified in their actions with how I'm saying it, which is what you are doing, then I'm a nutter???
As tragic as it is when families get caught up in military actions, we've got to believe that none of it is intentional. And don't forget that the terrorists use these families as human shields, then blame the West when these tragic incidents occur.
There's always two sides to everything, and I've acknowledged that all through this thread. You haven't, which is why you've opened yourself up to being labled.
posted on 22/6/17
I didn't once say ISIS are justified in what they are doing the fact you have to make up things to try and prove your point shows how weak it is.
Pointing out the causes of something (which are well known) doesn't make me either a terrorist sympathiser or something who think ISIS are doing good things.
It makes me a realist who wants to look at the causes, the fact you would rather underplay those causes and call people names who point out those facts, it is a dangerous ideology you have there, when you try and lunderplay the actual causes it leaves you left grasping at 'other things'
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 30 minutes ago
I didn't once say ISIS are justified in what they are doing the fact you have to make up things to try and prove your point shows how weak it is.
Pointing out the causes of something (which are well known) doesn't make me either a terrorist sympathiser or something who think ISIS are doing good things.
It makes me a realist who wants to look at the causes, the fact you would rather underplay those causes and call people names who point out those facts, it is a dangerous ideology you have there, when you try and lunderplay the actual causes it leaves you left grasping at 'other things'
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But the people being killed in England have nothing to do with our governments actions in fact most people oppose it.
posted on 22/6/17
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By that logic the white van driver the other night was justified in striking back
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 7 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This.
I think the problem is two fold, I am not particularly patriotic or nationalistic, people are people and rather than emotional reaction I prefer to try and look for reasons/causes which for some reason is upsetting to some.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Robb Van Nistelrooy (U21234)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 minutes ago
But the people being killed in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan have nothing to do with anything..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
By that logic the white van driver the other night was justified in striking back
----------------------------------------------------------------------
There seems to be a huge disconnect here so let me try this the other way around...
All the Islamic extremism going on made the van man attack more likely..
I imagine this statement won't be attacked so passionately or get me labelled as a terrorist sympathiser, I guess people pick and choose the facts they like....
posted on 22/6/17
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/6/17
The one where the West supported Al Qaeda to fight off the Russians?
Also the West had done much in the ME prior to Iraq but specifically on that point Islamic terrorism certainly seems to have increased in the UK since the Iraq war.
posted on 22/6/17
WAs it the wests fault that the Ottoman Empire exterminated 1.5 million Armenians ?
posted on 22/6/17
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 20 minutes ago
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of all this is to show that the Middle East wasn't some peaceful ideal before the west showed up.
Nothing the west has done there means Islamic extremists should be killing kids in England. If they really have a beef with the west (which I'm sure they justifiably do) they need to understand that much like Islamic extremists don't mean 'all muslims', the west doesn't mean 'everyone in the west'
It means the ones who give the commands. The politicians who make the decisions.
posted on 22/6/17
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 3 hours, 28 minutes ago
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
For once, I agree with you
Simply put, politics and religion are probably responsible for inflicting the most misery on people throughout mankind.
posted on 22/6/17
Humans aren't peaceful by nature. We will always fight over resources and for power. It's just a never-ending cycle that we just have to live through. There are many factors at play so trying to pin the blame on just a few of them is unwise. These discussions just end up going around in circles.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Robb Van Nistelrooy (U21234)
posted 8 hours, 10 minutes ago
comment by Yes way Jose (U5768)
posted 20 minutes ago
Was it Islamic extremists fault Adolf slaughtered millions of mainly Jews but others as well?
If your question was a misguided attempt at something else let me clarify something here, Muslims are very capable of doing bad things.
So is everyone else but I almost feel bad for clarifying that everyone can do bad things and not just Muslims which just shows how skewed the conversation has become these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of all this is to show that the Middle East wasn't some peaceful ideal before the west showed up.
Nothing the west has done there means Islamic extremists should be killing kids in England. If they really have a beef with the west (which I'm sure they justifiably do) they need to understand that much like Islamic extremists don't mean 'all muslims', the west doesn't mean 'everyone in the west'
It means the ones who give the commands. The politicians who make the decisions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH the vast majority of violence is wrong but just telling people it is wrong is pointless whilst doing actions which contribute to it.
If moral judgements stopped violence then it would have stopped years ago I would like to be a bit more realistic and try and remove many of the causes instead.
posted on 22/6/17
comment by Terminator1 (U1863)
posted 3 hours, 31 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 3 hours, 28 minutes ago
The fact remains that people, humankind, are capable of hugely evil and destructive things.
Most in a quest for power.
Who was the first government in Gadaffi's tent after the end of sanctions?
Then which government sanctioned action to topple him?
Some world leaders and those that back them pick and choose, flip flop, for self interest.
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For once, I agree with you
Simply put, politics and religion are probably responsible for inflicting the most misery on people throughout mankind.
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Or maybe humanity isn't as noble or as peaceful as we'd like to think and violence and war is very much a part of our psyche?
posted on 22/6/17
Disturbing video..
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=911501655672448&id=190759221080032&refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2FArmyAnonymous%2Fvideos%2F911501655672448%2F&_rdr
"Why do they hate us?" Or rather should be, "why do they hate some of us"?
This tells you some of why..
posted on 22/6/17
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
posted on 23/6/17
comment by Jordan Henderson £16m AKA Henderlol (U12335)
posted 5 hours, 23 minutes ago
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
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Religion is so mental
posted on 23/6/17
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 3 hours, 10 minutes ago
comment by Jordan Henderson £16m AKA Henderlol (U12335)
posted 5 hours, 23 minutes ago
Thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
Mate i totally agree, I don't understand why they want to kill innocent civilians. The same on Africa where militias will just go and wipe out entire villages. It's mad and it's nothing to do with my religion.......it's so unislamic it's ridiculous. My prophet (peace be upon him) once walked around a village for 3 days trying to preach his message, they pelted him with stones until his sandals were stuck to his feet with blood and he described it as the worst time of his life....
Worse than the days he lost a son, wife etc. And the whole he prayed for the people of that village (non believers) he prayed that god forgives them 'for they know not what they're doing'........
We are supposed to follow his example. We're supposed to teach people about our religion and call to Islam. Not just murder people.......who the f do these people think they are that theyre better than the messenger of god who all Muslim's are instructed to try and emulate.
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Religion is so mental
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Amen to that
posted on 23/6/17
God is love.
Man is nuts, and woman bonkers👍
When humans go to work, they can mess anything up.
Do not blame the messenger....blame yourselves.
I do👍
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