comment by RB&W - Our representative on the pitch (U21434)
posted 26 seconds ago
est of luck to the LNER worker who stood up to the madman apparently "critical but stable", here's hoping he pulls through, I like to think he represents the best of us.


______

Indeed.

And up to this horrific event he was probably regarded as a typical work dodging, moaning, sponging, striking, whanchor of a waste of time railworker by those on The Right, who didnt deserve the oxygen that he breathed, never mind a decent living wage to do what is an essential and demanding job. This is why we need staff on trains, to prorect the safety of rail travellers is all of us..... and they should be paid accordingly.
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Like pilots, they do spend a lot of time not doing an incredible amount while getting paid well

But, like pilots, there will be times when they demonstrate value more than 10x their career earnings

The official government statistical agency, the @ONS, says the productivity of the public sector, and especially the health service, is still falling: “In the most recent quarter, total public service productivity in the UK fell by 0.7% in Quarter 2 (Apr to Jun) 2025 compared with Quarter 2 2024, and healthcare productivity fell by 1.5% over the same period.”

I’m fully of admiration for the train staff after what they did, but this isn’t an argument for staff on trains.

Their job spec isn’t to stand up to attackers and anyone on that carriage could have done the same thing.

By the same token, if a member of staff hid rather than fighting, no one could have blamed them. It’s not their job.

the safety of passengers on trains is very much part of the Trade Unions argement for the need for train guards and marshalls on our trains especially in rural areas late into the evening, and always has been. This is an extreme example and no they are not expected to stand up to armed criminals. That would be stupid. But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains and make passengers, especially women, feel safer on their own. So long may the Unions continue to fight to ensuire that we stop having guardless train services services. Its worth the money to do so.

noone is suggesting we need train conductors still so they can be a human shield but their value is in emergencies and the safety of passengers, something automation will never replace

I didn’t say otherwise re: women on trains.

That’s got nothing to do with an attack like this and the idea that a ticket inspector is a deterrent to someone wishing to kill multiple people is a bizarre claim.

A bizarre claim noone made

comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 9 seconds ago
A bizarre claim noone made
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“But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains”

It isn't.

Any offical presence in most situations acts as a deterrent in some capacity even if it's quite minor.

Most situations? I agree.

However in this situation - that being the one that was being discussed - I don’t agree at all.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 25 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 9 seconds ago
A bizarre claim noone made
----------------------------------------------------------------------

“But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains”


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While someone wishing to kill multiple people as you put it is in no doubt a criminal, it doesn't capture all elements of criminality,.some of which no doubt a conductor will help to deter by their presence

comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 41 seconds ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 25 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 9 seconds ago
A bizarre claim noone made
----------------------------------------------------------------------

“But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains”


----------------------------------------------------------------------
While someone wishing to kill multiple people as you put it is in no doubt a criminal, it doesn't capture all elements of criminality,.some of which no doubt a conductor will help to deter by their presence
----------------------------------------------------------------------

But we were specifically discussing this incident.

So if the definition of criminality in this respect does not include the perpetrator of this incident, then the above point is of complete irrelevance.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 41 seconds ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 25 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 9 seconds ago
A bizarre claim noone made
----------------------------------------------------------------------

“But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains”


----------------------------------------------------------------------
While someone wishing to kill multiple people as you put it is in no doubt a criminal, it doesn't capture all elements of criminality,.some of which no doubt a conductor will help to deter by their presence
----------------------------------------------------------------------

But we were specifically discussing this incident.

So if the definition of criminality in this respect does not include the perpetrator of this incident, then the above point is of complete irrelevance.
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I don't really care to go long on this but you're taking what RB&W said out of context

"This is an extreme example and no they are not expected to stand up to armed criminals. That would be stupid. But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains and make passengers, especially women, feel safer on their own. "

Seems clear to me he's talking about safety in general and not saying we hire train conductors/guards to put their lives on the line/act a deterrent to murderers

Are we talking about 1 guard per carriage? 2? More?
Just wondering. Will they have non lethal weapons such as mace and Tazers?
Also there are some crazies in groups who might just want to target these guards.

comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 41 seconds ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 25 minutes ago
comment by CrouchEndGooner (U13531)
posted 9 seconds ago
A bizarre claim noone made
----------------------------------------------------------------------

“But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains”


----------------------------------------------------------------------
While someone wishing to kill multiple people as you put it is in no doubt a criminal, it doesn't capture all elements of criminality,.some of which no doubt a conductor will help to deter by their presence
----------------------------------------------------------------------

But we were specifically discussing this incident.

So if the definition of criminality in this respect does not include the perpetrator of this incident, then the above point is of complete irrelevance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't really care to go long on this but you're taking what RB&W said out of context

"This is an extreme example and no they are not expected to stand up to armed criminals. That would be stupid. But there is no doubt that having a guard on board would help deter criminals operating on trains and make passengers, especially women, feel safer on their own. "

Seems clear to me he's talking about safety in general and not saying we hire train conductors/guards to put their lives on the line/act a deterrent to murderers
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I’m absolutely not and I suggest you read back to the comment I was replying to.

He was literally claiming that this incident is evidence of why we need guards on trains.

comment by RB&W - Our representative on the pitch (U21434)
posted 2 hours, 35 minutes ago
est of luck to the LNER worker who stood up to the madman apparently "critical but stable", here's hoping he pulls through, I like to think he represents the best of us.


______

Indeed.

And up to this horrific event he was probably regarded as a typical work dodging, moaning, sponging, striking, whanchor of a waste of time railworker by those on The Right, who didnt deserve the oxygen that he breathed, never mind a decent living wage to do what is an essential and demanding job. This is why we need staff on trains, to prorect the safety of rail travellers is all of us..... and they should be paid accordingly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No mention of general safety.

100% referring to this single incident.

Not remotely out of context.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by RB&W - Our representative on the pitch (U21434)
posted 2 hours, 35 minutes ago
est of luck to the LNER worker who stood up to the madman apparently "critical but stable", here's hoping he pulls through, I like to think he represents the best of us.


______

Indeed.

And up to this horrific event he was probably regarded as a typical work dodging, moaning, sponging, striking, whanchor of a waste of time railworker by those on The Right, who didnt deserve the oxygen that he breathed, never mind a decent living wage to do what is an essential and demanding job. This is why we need staff on trains, to prorect the safety of rail travellers is all of us..... and they should be paid accordingly.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No mention of general safety.

100% referring to this single incident.

Not remotely out of context.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is out of context

I don't think RB&W is saying "we need guards to be there to save lives/sacrifice theirs during incidents like Saturday"

I think he's saying we need guards for passenger safety in general.

And as an aside, the conductor in hospital currently, verified the situation to the train driver who moved the train to the slow track so they could stop at Huntingdon rather than going to kings cross or not stopping by the platform.

That definitely saved lives, though RB&W can speak for himself on whether he thinks that's what they're there for

Jesus wept.

Someone literally says that this incident is why we need guards, and then you argue that he’s not saying that at all.

This place hasn’t changed.

I think you guys will be surprised to know that Musk has endorsed Cuomo for the NYC mayoral election

comment by Michael Scofield (U11781)
posted 4 minutes ago
I think you guys will be surprised to know that Musk has endorsed Cuomo for the NYC mayoral election
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Why would anyone be surprised?
He helped one perv become POTUS.
Now he's helping another one become NYC Mayor.

It’s sarcasm young man

Immigration agents crashed into a U.S. citizen on her way to work—then dragged her out and arrested her.

Her family couldn’t find her for hours.
She was later released without charges.

https://x.com/laura_n_rod/status/1985412485185188067?s=46&t=bPTrpdgNggCdz9igvhmVyw

Um wtf?

Trump's America is a failed state

Zohran Mamdani must be deported immediately.

The only thing I want to see him running for is his gate at JFK for his deportation flight back to Uganda.

https://x.com/repfine/status/1985462516705567156?s=46&t=bPTrpdgNggCdz9igvhmVyw

A failed and racist state