Must do better with some things (subs, square pegs etc).
Is hamstrung by others (Glazers, injuries)
I'll judge him at the end of the season.
This is Year One for him really in terms of trying to play his way. Last year, IMO, was on the whole quite pragmatic because it had to be. Let's allow his style to bed in first before being too harsh. IMO I think he just need to tweak the balance a bit but he has been a bit unlucky in that the injuries have occurred to the players who were seemingly vital to his plan.
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
Dealt with things well and had a good first season on the pitch.
Dealt with things less well this season, and has had a poor start on the pitch.
Finish outside the Champs League places, and he could come under a lot of pressure the start of next season.
He did very well last season and shouldn't be judged so early on this season. Once we get players back from injury as well as the general squad up to fitness and can get the players more used to what EtH is after then we'll have a better idea.
I do think any manager in the world would be suffering a bit with the sh-t that's been going on recently at the club. Hopefully now Greenwood has gone, Sancho is not with the first team and the Antony situation gets sorted we can move on from the drama.
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Neither here nor there really.
I've never seen us dash your lot 7-0 before and that's just one of many proper beatings.
The away form. The transfers. He provided some class moments.
Can't wait to get you in the Europa tbh.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 7 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dutch renaissance... though with Utd a bit more like Dutch flatulence
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
-----------------------------------------
Totally agree.
My frustration stems from this, as we were told during the van Gaal either "He hasn't got his players to play his system", we were then told again during the start of the ETH era, "He hasn't got his players to play his system" - Yet, when I watch Brighton, Tottenham etc, players with "less" ability start to perform in-line with the Managers expectations. There is no reason why our players struggle to adapt to his philosophy.
I genuinely do recognise that he has had a great start, we achieved top 4 and won a trophy - That is success for a club like ours that is on a journey towards the Premier League.
His handling of egos is refreshing; Players that challenge the Manager in a negative way need moving on. People forget that ETH has done the 'arm around the shoulder' approach for Sancho and it has not bear fruit.
I'm happy to see ETH as Manager for another season, however, until the club situation is sorted, I can't see us moving forward very far.
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 9 minutes ago
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Have to agree with this, sadly.
I don't understand why we are still comprehensively outplayed in so many games.
We could have few complaints if we'd lost every match so far this season.
We had the veneer of solidity at times last season, but it was only a veneer, as games like Liverpool and Sevilla showed. This season we don't even have that. We are too easy to play against and too easy to score against. The team is mentally fragile and physically below par.
I'd go as far as saying that with the possible exception of Everton there isn't a team in the league that isn't either better organised or better motivated than us, and most of them are both.
The main things Ten Hag has in his favour are that there probably isn't any manager in the world who could fix this mess, and that there are (hopefully) at least three teams in the league who are worse than us.
I'm happy with ETH but once the injury issues have settled we do need to see more progress. Turning United around is a huge task that can't be done overnight but we need something more to point to in order to say we're on the right track.
Progress was made last season, but we need someone more this season; some really good football on display would be nice.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Neither here nor there really.
I've never seen us dash your lot 7-0 before and that's just one of many proper beatings.
The away form. The transfers. He provided some class moments.
Can't wait to get you in the Europa tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He also provided a good league position, a trophy and another final. Which you must admit surpassed your season. I doubt that will repeat this season, he's a lot on his plate, but I think things will improve as time passes.
I can't see you finishing lower than second, and who knows, City aren't a machine.
If you're happy with him that really is all that matters.
BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
-----------------
De Zerbi didn't turn Brighton around. He built on the very good work done by Graham Potter at an exceptionally well run football club.
Ange looks very good so far and I think will take Spurs places in the long term. But he has played 5 games (not very difficult ones at that - we've been their toughest opponent on paper and we were shīte). There were 5 game periods last season where we looked very good. There will be a point where Spurs hit a rough patch like we are in - be it this season or next where you'd think they'll have a few more fixtures to play.
On Ten Hag, I dunno. Worrying signs so far this season (and it feels a bit like Jose/Ole's last season all over again) but there's also a fair bit of recency bias creeping in here. Let's see in a few months.
Its quite simple. This season has to show progress on last season. Despite everything going on. If it doesnt then Ten Hag will be in trouble. Its harsh but that is how it works at United.
Progress will be ideal but I reckon the post Woodward era will be a bit more understanding if they can at least see Eth's methods working and developing. CL qualification should keep him safe for another season and now that 5 qualify this season it should be doable even with our poor start.
For me cup runs aren't important and our squad is too thin to go far in a bunch like we did last season.
He needs a few more windows to create balance in the squad, he can start by clearing deadwood (including Maguire) and getting players so we can finally see the passing, controlled game he's known for from the back.
So far, based on last season, ignoring the away form and beatings I'd say I'm relatively happy. Like many have said though he needs to build on the good work, so far this season is yet to start for us. Unless we are facing loss after loss and languishing in the bottom half by November/December he'll still be here!
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This. We keep looking for a manager who wants to perform in best possible situation when we need someone who can deal with every problem he faces. Tbh if he can open up a bit, be ready to be flexible especially in his selections, he will do a lot better. Look how de Zerbi easily adjusted to his players not being the best of his players. It is how to make the team step up, it's how to make the fans know the team is more than its "stars".
Our club has a bunch of superstars and those type of managers will struggle to make their approach work. I cannot imagine a player Benching Rashford and Bruno without them not burning them out.
One of the issues in comparing us to the likes of Brighton is that they have complete buy-in from the players because they know, rightly or wrongly, if they perform they'll get their move to a bigger club.
With United it won't get any better for the vast majority of these players so if their attitude slacks just a little bit everything in the machine falls down. Some of them are just too comfortable and it shows.
Brighton were rightly lauded for the passage of play for their second goal but the pressing from us wasn't great at all. Half-hearted really.
The good news is though that, even with the Glazers overseeing everything, it need not need a miracle to get the season back on track. We just need a better balance and we need to actually take our chances when we're at 0-0 in games. Goals really do change the narrative.
I know it's easy enough to say but even in our last two games we've been inches away from an extra four points potentially.
comment by Vengeance of Kungfu Pea in a Bun (U23079)
posted 17 minutes ago
He needs a few more windows to create balance in the squad, he can start by clearing deadwood (including Maguire) and getting players so we can finally see the passing, controlled game he's known for from the back.
So far, based on last season, ignoring the away form and beatings I'd say I'm relatively happy. Like many have said though he needs to build on the good work, so far this season is yet to start for us. Unless we are facing loss after loss and languishing in the bottom half by November/December he'll still be here!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unless you want to buy a new 11, or discover 5 young players from the youth team that match fergie's fledglings, this is always going to be the thought process. A manager in our current ownership situation must be the most flexible person. Ole was in a certain way but had faves, a problem ETH has too.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 27 minutes ago
Progress will be ideal but I reckon the post Woodward era will be a bit more understanding if they can at least see Eth's methods working and developing. CL qualification should keep him safe for another season and now that 5 qualify this season it should be doable even with our poor start.
For me cup runs aren't important and our squad is too thin to go far in a bunch like we did last season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Clubs like ManUtd just winning cups like the FLC occasionaly arent a reflection of the clubs progress particulary but are good for the managers ego.
Sounds familiar.
I’m pleased with ETH made a positive impact with the team last season unlucky with injuries so far this season, however Bruno as captain hasn’t been one of his best moves, plus he should be making more use of Garnacho!
He's done well last season, but has he been any better than Ole? We've been here before. The Manager can only do so much. But the structure at United is all wrong. People talk about Brighton but there are reasons why they do well. We don't have the structure that supports continuity so any manager that comes in has to establish their way of playing. Then a new one comes in. If we can settle on what way we want to play and then get in head coaches who match. We also need to get the wage bill down. A bit like what Arsenal did. Short term sacrifices for long term gain. But this won't happen until the Glazers sell. And depending who comes in, and if they are willing, to make the right changes.
I expect us to improve over the course of the season. Some of the late arrivals will be properly bedded in and hopefully the injury situation improves.
Still have faith in him but his substitutions and tactics at times are infuriating.
Not totally convinced about ETH tactically and the 7-0 at the Dippers was a shame on the whole club which would have seen him out of the door the day after at a club like Madrid.
However he deserves this season with a fully fit squad to put his team out as he would like and show that he does possess the qualities needed to take us forward,
CL is a minimum with his spending and it won’t be easy as we all know with us already playing catch up and the competition we face.
Not easy for him working with some of our uninspiring squad members and the general circus around him but that’s being our manager, as he is a very personally wealthy individual it wouldn’t surprise me if at some point he just said feck it and walked if he can’t make the progress needed.
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ETH
Page 1 of 2
posted on 19/9/23
Must do better with some things (subs, square pegs etc).
Is hamstrung by others (Glazers, injuries)
I'll judge him at the end of the season.
This is Year One for him really in terms of trying to play his way. Last year, IMO, was on the whole quite pragmatic because it had to be. Let's allow his style to bed in first before being too harsh. IMO I think he just need to tweak the balance a bit but he has been a bit unlucky in that the injuries have occurred to the players who were seemingly vital to his plan.
posted on 19/9/23
Love his work so far
posted on 19/9/23
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
posted on 19/9/23
Dealt with things well and had a good first season on the pitch.
Dealt with things less well this season, and has had a poor start on the pitch.
Finish outside the Champs League places, and he could come under a lot of pressure the start of next season.
posted on 19/9/23
He did very well last season and shouldn't be judged so early on this season. Once we get players back from injury as well as the general squad up to fitness and can get the players more used to what EtH is after then we'll have a better idea.
I do think any manager in the world would be suffering a bit with the sh-t that's been going on recently at the club. Hopefully now Greenwood has gone, Sancho is not with the first team and the Antony situation gets sorted we can move on from the drama.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Neither here nor there really.
I've never seen us dash your lot 7-0 before and that's just one of many proper beatings.
The away form. The transfers. He provided some class moments.
Can't wait to get you in the Europa tbh.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 7 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Dutch renaissance... though with Utd a bit more like Dutch flatulence
posted on 19/9/23
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
-----------------------------------------
Totally agree.
My frustration stems from this, as we were told during the van Gaal either "He hasn't got his players to play his system", we were then told again during the start of the ETH era, "He hasn't got his players to play his system" - Yet, when I watch Brighton, Tottenham etc, players with "less" ability start to perform in-line with the Managers expectations. There is no reason why our players struggle to adapt to his philosophy.
I genuinely do recognise that he has had a great start, we achieved top 4 and won a trophy - That is success for a club like ours that is on a journey towards the Premier League.
His handling of egos is refreshing; Players that challenge the Manager in a negative way need moving on. People forget that ETH has done the 'arm around the shoulder' approach for Sancho and it has not bear fruit.
I'm happy to see ETH as Manager for another season, however, until the club situation is sorted, I can't see us moving forward very far.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 9 minutes ago
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Have to agree with this, sadly.
I don't understand why we are still comprehensively outplayed in so many games.
We could have few complaints if we'd lost every match so far this season.
We had the veneer of solidity at times last season, but it was only a veneer, as games like Liverpool and Sevilla showed. This season we don't even have that. We are too easy to play against and too easy to score against. The team is mentally fragile and physically below par.
I'd go as far as saying that with the possible exception of Everton there isn't a team in the league that isn't either better organised or better motivated than us, and most of them are both.
The main things Ten Hag has in his favour are that there probably isn't any manager in the world who could fix this mess, and that there are (hopefully) at least three teams in the league who are worse than us.
posted on 19/9/23
I'm happy with ETH but once the injury issues have settled we do need to see more progress. Turning United around is a huge task that can't be done overnight but we need something more to point to in order to say we're on the right track.
Progress was made last season, but we need someone more this season; some really good football on display would be nice.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I taught Szoboszlai how to cushion half volleys (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
Love his work so far
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But I think you will love it less as time passed.
Did you really love it las season;
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Neither here nor there really.
I've never seen us dash your lot 7-0 before and that's just one of many proper beatings.
The away form. The transfers. He provided some class moments.
Can't wait to get you in the Europa tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He also provided a good league position, a trophy and another final. Which you must admit surpassed your season. I doubt that will repeat this season, he's a lot on his plate, but I think things will improve as time passes.
I can't see you finishing lower than second, and who knows, City aren't a machine.
posted on 19/9/23
If you're happy with him that really is all that matters.
posted on 19/9/23
BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
-----------------
De Zerbi didn't turn Brighton around. He built on the very good work done by Graham Potter at an exceptionally well run football club.
Ange looks very good so far and I think will take Spurs places in the long term. But he has played 5 games (not very difficult ones at that - we've been their toughest opponent on paper and we were shīte). There were 5 game periods last season where we looked very good. There will be a point where Spurs hit a rough patch like we are in - be it this season or next where you'd think they'll have a few more fixtures to play.
On Ten Hag, I dunno. Worrying signs so far this season (and it feels a bit like Jose/Ole's last season all over again) but there's also a fair bit of recency bias creeping in here. Let's see in a few months.
posted on 19/9/23
Its quite simple. This season has to show progress on last season. Despite everything going on. If it doesnt then Ten Hag will be in trouble. Its harsh but that is how it works at United.
posted on 19/9/23
Progress will be ideal but I reckon the post Woodward era will be a bit more understanding if they can at least see Eth's methods working and developing. CL qualification should keep him safe for another season and now that 5 qualify this season it should be doable even with our poor start.
For me cup runs aren't important and our squad is too thin to go far in a bunch like we did last season.
posted on 19/9/23
He needs a few more windows to create balance in the squad, he can start by clearing deadwood (including Maguire) and getting players so we can finally see the passing, controlled game he's known for from the back.
So far, based on last season, ignoring the away form and beatings I'd say I'm relatively happy. Like many have said though he needs to build on the good work, so far this season is yet to start for us. Unless we are facing loss after loss and languishing in the bottom half by November/December he'll still be here!
posted on 19/9/23
comment by UmaThurmans_BigToe (U22864)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
I think on the face of it people would argue give him time etc and argue it will take X amount of seasons before we see any chance which is fine BUT we’ve seen recently with Brighton/Spurs and a few others that a good manager can come in and with little or no spend turn teams around 180degrees.
United just can’t seem to get in a manager with an actual plan or a way to actual get his tactics across to the players or getting them playing in any coherent manner.
The problems are top to bottom at the moment.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This. We keep looking for a manager who wants to perform in best possible situation when we need someone who can deal with every problem he faces. Tbh if he can open up a bit, be ready to be flexible especially in his selections, he will do a lot better. Look how de Zerbi easily adjusted to his players not being the best of his players. It is how to make the team step up, it's how to make the fans know the team is more than its "stars".
Our club has a bunch of superstars and those type of managers will struggle to make their approach work. I cannot imagine a player Benching Rashford and Bruno without them not burning them out.
posted on 19/9/23
One of the issues in comparing us to the likes of Brighton is that they have complete buy-in from the players because they know, rightly or wrongly, if they perform they'll get their move to a bigger club.
With United it won't get any better for the vast majority of these players so if their attitude slacks just a little bit everything in the machine falls down. Some of them are just too comfortable and it shows.
Brighton were rightly lauded for the passage of play for their second goal but the pressing from us wasn't great at all. Half-hearted really.
The good news is though that, even with the Glazers overseeing everything, it need not need a miracle to get the season back on track. We just need a better balance and we need to actually take our chances when we're at 0-0 in games. Goals really do change the narrative.
I know it's easy enough to say but even in our last two games we've been inches away from an extra four points potentially.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by Vengeance of Kungfu Pea in a Bun (U23079)
posted 17 minutes ago
He needs a few more windows to create balance in the squad, he can start by clearing deadwood (including Maguire) and getting players so we can finally see the passing, controlled game he's known for from the back.
So far, based on last season, ignoring the away form and beatings I'd say I'm relatively happy. Like many have said though he needs to build on the good work, so far this season is yet to start for us. Unless we are facing loss after loss and languishing in the bottom half by November/December he'll still be here!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unless you want to buy a new 11, or discover 5 young players from the youth team that match fergie's fledglings, this is always going to be the thought process. A manager in our current ownership situation must be the most flexible person. Ole was in a certain way but had faves, a problem ETH has too.
posted on 19/9/23
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 27 minutes ago
Progress will be ideal but I reckon the post Woodward era will be a bit more understanding if they can at least see Eth's methods working and developing. CL qualification should keep him safe for another season and now that 5 qualify this season it should be doable even with our poor start.
For me cup runs aren't important and our squad is too thin to go far in a bunch like we did last season.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Clubs like ManUtd just winning cups like the FLC occasionaly arent a reflection of the clubs progress particulary but are good for the managers ego.
Sounds familiar.
posted on 19/9/23
I’m pleased with ETH made a positive impact with the team last season unlucky with injuries so far this season, however Bruno as captain hasn’t been one of his best moves, plus he should be making more use of Garnacho!
posted on 19/9/23
He's done well last season, but has he been any better than Ole? We've been here before. The Manager can only do so much. But the structure at United is all wrong. People talk about Brighton but there are reasons why they do well. We don't have the structure that supports continuity so any manager that comes in has to establish their way of playing. Then a new one comes in. If we can settle on what way we want to play and then get in head coaches who match. We also need to get the wage bill down. A bit like what Arsenal did. Short term sacrifices for long term gain. But this won't happen until the Glazers sell. And depending who comes in, and if they are willing, to make the right changes.
posted on 19/9/23
I expect us to improve over the course of the season. Some of the late arrivals will be properly bedded in and hopefully the injury situation improves.
Still have faith in him but his substitutions and tactics at times are infuriating.
posted on 19/9/23
Not totally convinced about ETH tactically and the 7-0 at the Dippers was a shame on the whole club which would have seen him out of the door the day after at a club like Madrid.
However he deserves this season with a fully fit squad to put his team out as he would like and show that he does possess the qualities needed to take us forward,
CL is a minimum with his spending and it won’t be easy as we all know with us already playing catch up and the competition we face.
Not easy for him working with some of our uninspiring squad members and the general circus around him but that’s being our manager, as he is a very personally wealthy individual it wouldn’t surprise me if at some point he just said feck it and walked if he can’t make the progress needed.
Page 1 of 2