In the 15-16 CL Real in the knockouts beat 3 second place teams and 1 3rd place team. Those same teams that season they beat them finished 3rd, 3rd, 4h nd 8th.

comment by Cinciwolf-----JA606 NFL fantasy champ 2023 (U11551)
posted 39 minutes ago
You can win the CL by beating 3rd 4th place league teams from elite leagues.
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But who did those teams beat? What happened to the top teams? They got knocked the fack out by those 3rd 4th place teams so this point carries no water.

comment by Cinciwolf-----JA606 NFL fantasy champ 2023 (U11551)
posted 41 minutes ago
In the 15-16 CL Real in the knockouts beat 3 second place teams and 1 3rd place team. Those same teams that season they beat them finished 3rd, 3rd, 4h nd 8th.
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Didn't the other big teams qualify? Who knocked them out? Why wasn't Madrid also knocked out by those weaker teams when all the other big teams got knocked out by them?
What about the other seasons?

comment by Mamba the Chief Disinformation Officer on JA60... (U1282)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Cinciwolf-----JA606 NFL fantasy champ 2023 (U11551)
posted 39 minutes ago
You can win the CL by beating 3rd 4th place league teams from elite leagues.
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But who did those teams beat? What happened to the top teams? They got knocked the fack out by those 3rd 4th place teams so this point carries no water.
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I dunno, depends really. Real beat Wolfsburg in the knockouts who at the time were the 8th best team in Germany. That is the thing with knockout footy.

I could be swayed either way really, just playing devils advocate. I personally think winning the league is harder than winning the CL.

So to answer the question who did Wolfsburg beat to face Real

Gent, CSKA Moscow, PSV and Man United

So nobody really.

comment by Cinciwolf-----JA606 NFL fantasy champ 2023 (U11551)
posted 50 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Cinciwolf-----JA606 NFL fantasy champ 2023 (U11551)
posted 47 minutes ago
Simeone is definitely elite. Amazing what he has achieved while being clearly the third club in Spain. We could argue who the third club is in England, but regardless none have achieved what he has at Atletico
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He's overachieved at Atletico and turned them into a big club in Europe. Unlucky not to win a CL. His 1st league title is possibly more impressive than any from Klopp or Pep.

If Simeone is an elite manager then I guess so is Ancelotti. Zidane too maybe?
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Ancelotti certainly is. Zidane is as well I guess though I don't personally feel like he is.

I honestly think league titles trump CL in the overall scheme of things. Then doing it at multiple clubs also comes into the equation. Or over achieving perhaps like Simeone.
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If League title trumped CL then why is Madrid the only team that has managed to dominate Europe? United won 13 titles in 25 years, La Liga is exchanged between Madrid and Barca and the occasional Atletico, Bayern have won like the last 12 Bundesligas in a row and have won like a quarter of all Bundesliga titles in history, PSG has won Ligue 1 for I don't know how many years in a row, only 3 teams can ever win the league in Portugal, if it wasn't for Liverpool the Prem would look worse than the SPL with City at the top.

Only the Champions League remains as a true competition. The leagues are weak and produce weak teams to enter the CL which has allowed Madrid to dominate the CL and now it's City's turn.

The European league format always ends up as a pyramid which cannot be undone. The top clubs get the most money and stay top, the other get less and don't bother the top clubs. The richest teams always at the top forever.

I could be swayed either way really, just playing devils advocate. I personally think winning the league is harder than winning the CL
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People say this but I think the observable facts and evidence suggests otherwise. You win your league 12 times in a row but only 1 or 2 CL within same period.

13 titles in 25 years and just 2 CL. PSG can't win the CL despite turning Ligue 1 into Sunday League.

Also, which league you on about? Winning the SPL or Eredivisie isn't harder than winning the CL. Only 3 or so leagues can make that argument IMO and it's still not accurate.

Don't forget, Bayern, PSG, United under Fergie, Arsenal under Wenger and any big team, current or past, qualified for CL every year and could hardly win it as easily as they win their leagues.

Most leagues are just a few top teams and then the rest is just fodder that goes through phases of midtable, occasional European qualification, relegation and promotion. Basically just yoyoing across the whole pyramid except the very top, which is a closes shop already.

Then people reject the Super League because it's a closed shop.

Wish they would do a super league, that is for sure.

Fair points Mamba, like I say, I could be swayed either way. Just seems you would face more tough games in the league than the CL overall.

Lets take say PSV as an example, likely a knockout side regularly but are they even on a par with tenth in La Liga or the prem?

Back to the point of Zidane though. Two league titles and three CLs is probably worthy of elite status. Be good to see him go elsewhere though.

10th in La Liga is Getafe. PSV would whoop those 7or 8 times out of 10. Already whooped Sevilla in Spain this season and held their own against Arsenal. 10th in prem is Newcastle.

CL clearly much harder to win IMO.