You just knew the Zirkhorst nickname would backfire on Robb!
His skillset is showing through more and more each game.. If the team as a whole starts to improve over the coming months, I think he could become quite a player for us.
He's fun to watch, at least when it goes right. Even when he's not been great he'll nutmeg someone at some point or pull out some really nice control and whilst he may not end up being good enough, I do really enjoy aspects of his game.
I'm a sucker for flair though and will give players a lot more rope if they are capable of at least moments that make me go whaaaat. Nani has always been one of my favourite United players, I can accept frustration if there's a chance of something magical.
Zirkzee was great to watch last night, really enjoyed his performance.
He was great last night.
Looked leaner and much quicker too.
More of the same please, plus a goal or two would do nicely.
I hope those who were falling over themselves to be among the first to write him off as a hopeless flop are starting to reconsider. He's a really talented player. In addition to the close control and tricks, I'm really impressed with the precision, timing and weight of some of his passing in the final third.
There's still plenty of room for improvement, but he has started to look as though he believes he belongs at this level. As I said in my article about the match, I think there's still a question about profile fit. He was never a classic centre forward, much more of a false nine, and you could see that working in ETH's 4-2-3-1 or a 4-3-3 where he's flanked by very rapid wingers. It's fairly clear he's not built to be the channel running centre forward in Amorim's system, so the question is whether Amorim sees him as a long-term fit as one of the 10s, and tweaks his game plan to utilise Zirkzee's profile, or whether it's better to cash in and reinvest in someone who is a more natural fit with the template used at Sporting.
Either way, great to see a player work through a difficult start and begin to show the world what he can do.
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
I know we’re sh-t but fans really need to have a little patience with players, especially ones coming from other countries/leagues and needing time to settle while having so much pressure on them from the very beginning.
It was always clear the lad is technically gifted and was never bought to be a high scoring striker. He seems to be working hard and that’s all you can ask from him. It’s always great to see players getting on with it and doing what the manager wants.
On a separate note I see rumours are flying around that Chelsea have got the wingback from Sporting that Amorim was supposedly desperate to get. Not really sure where he fits in their bloated squad?
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
----------------------------------------------------------------------
United could play 4-4-8 and wouldn't help much tbh
Looks to me like he'd be best deployed in a front 2, Sheringham/Cantona role, starting high but dropping deep.
When he's on it, he's wonderful with the ball at his feet.
Takes up decent positions, often picks the right pass and, maybe most importantly for us at the moment, his out-ball value is pretty significant: he's very often in the right place, gets the ball to stick, retains possession well and can help launch counters from there.
But - and they are big buts for me, and will be big buts for Amorim I think:
- His pressing is just poor in both effort and execution. He doesn't read triggers well, he doesn't know where to go without instruction, he doesn't bend his runs properly.
- More generally, he isn't agile or explosive enough for the PL or Amorimball, and I really don't think he works hard enough.
Watching last night, there were a couple of occasions on which you could hear Amorim telling him to hold in situations you know he'd want his ten to press, and I can only think he's either understanding the lad doesn't have the stamina/energy to do the job for 90 mins, he doesn't trust him to manage his energy levels himself, or he doesn't have faith in him to do it properly.
In short, although some of the shortcomings above can be coached, some can't, and for me, he just doesn't suit an Amorim side.
I expect he'll be a bench option at best as soon as Amorim has either his CM options sorted (allowing Bruno to partner Amad at ten) or a ten more suited to the role.
His General performance last night. 9/10. Thought he was superb.
His finishing was about 1/10 though. Needs to start putting more of his chances away to fully win me over.
I do think the slight switch of Zirkzee to the left 10 and Garnacho to the right 10 has definitely improved us. Just need someone upfront better than Rasmus. He just isn't good enough sadly.
comment by Kaladin (U6638)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
----------------------------------------------------------------------
United could play 4-4-8 and wouldn't help much tbh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, we seem to pick up trophies whatever formation we play, so every cloud and that. How about you?
If he could finish he would be a poor mans Cantona. I was saing there is something there when many wanted to get rid and I am glad he stepped up. If he could finish he would be spectacular. We need to work on that curse at old trafford.
Just need someone upfront better than Rasmus. He just isn't good enough sadly.
**********************************************
If we are patient enough, what Rasmus really needs is a loan at a slightly lower level and let him get a million chances to fail without the pressure. Its obvious half the problem United has is mentality and confidence.
comment by TheFoxOutsideTheBox (U20459)
posted 3 hours, 4 minutes ago
He's fun to watch, at least when it goes right. Even when he's not been great he'll nutmeg someone at some point or pull out some really nice control and whilst he may not end up being good enough, I do really enjoy aspects of his game.
I'm a sucker for flair though and will give players a lot more rope if they are capable of at least moments that make me go whaaaat. Nani has always been one of my favourite United players, I can accept frustration if there's a chance of something magical.
Zirkzee was great to watch last night, really enjoyed his performance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly this
He's EASILY been one of the club's best player since his arrival.
What others (the more ovine/bovine types) have suggested is not really relevant. They just don't know.
Pretty much needs to be partnered 'up top' WITH Hojlund instead of behind him.
Get a proper winger, instead of the deadbeat Dalot, on the other wing to Garnacho and then there is the beginnings of a 'United type' front 6.
as for the back four .... well that's another issue for another day.
Speaking as a (b)ovine type, what is this back four of which you speak?
The issues with Zirkzee are there for all to see, lacks pace, lacks composure, for a big lad he's poor in the air and whilst he sometimes has an amazing touch, he's inconsistent with it.
I do quite like him though, however I feel he'd be best as a CF with movement around him. Happy with him as a squad option, shouldn't be starting every week.
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think one of the problems Rasmus is having this year which he did not last season is self inflicted.
He appears to be getting involved in wrestling matches with CB’s as opposed to getting away from them.
Agreed, VC, but there are signs in the last 2-3 matches that the penny has dropped. In my limited tactical understanding, on paper Amorim's system should be a better fit for his strengths than ETH's: less back-to-goal hold-up play, more running the channels. I guess it can take a while to unlearn lessons, especially when the whole team is having to do the same thing and you're low in confidence.
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
Agreed, VC, but there are signs in the last 2-3 matches that the penny has dropped. In my limited tactical understanding, on paper Amorim's system should be a better fit for his strengths than ETH's: less back-to-goal hold-up play, more running the channels. I guess it can take a while to unlearn lessons, especially when the whole team is having to do the same thing and you're low in confidence.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think there are some signs that his lateral movement - which was an absolutely key facet of Gyokeres' role in Amorim's Sporting side - is starting to improve too.
That should become more and more important as we (hopefully) start to move away from a more transitional style to a more possessionally and territorially dominant game.
I would still wager that Hojlund will have more of a future at United under Amorim than Zirkzee.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 hour, 36 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think one of the problems Rasmus is having this year which he did not last season is self inflicted.
He appears to be getting involved in wrestling matches with CB’s as opposed to getting away from them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree - which in Europe seems to be effective, but in the PL not so much.
Sign in if you want to comment
Zirkzee
Page 1 of 2
posted on 14/3/25
You just knew the Zirkhorst nickname would backfire on Robb!
His skillset is showing through more and more each game.. If the team as a whole starts to improve over the coming months, I think he could become quite a player for us.
posted on 14/3/25
He's fun to watch, at least when it goes right. Even when he's not been great he'll nutmeg someone at some point or pull out some really nice control and whilst he may not end up being good enough, I do really enjoy aspects of his game.
I'm a sucker for flair though and will give players a lot more rope if they are capable of at least moments that make me go whaaaat. Nani has always been one of my favourite United players, I can accept frustration if there's a chance of something magical.
Zirkzee was great to watch last night, really enjoyed his performance.
posted on 14/3/25
He was great last night.
Looked leaner and much quicker too.
More of the same please, plus a goal or two would do nicely.
posted on 14/3/25
I hope those who were falling over themselves to be among the first to write him off as a hopeless flop are starting to reconsider. He's a really talented player. In addition to the close control and tricks, I'm really impressed with the precision, timing and weight of some of his passing in the final third.
There's still plenty of room for improvement, but he has started to look as though he believes he belongs at this level. As I said in my article about the match, I think there's still a question about profile fit. He was never a classic centre forward, much more of a false nine, and you could see that working in ETH's 4-2-3-1 or a 4-3-3 where he's flanked by very rapid wingers. It's fairly clear he's not built to be the channel running centre forward in Amorim's system, so the question is whether Amorim sees him as a long-term fit as one of the 10s, and tweaks his game plan to utilise Zirkzee's profile, or whether it's better to cash in and reinvest in someone who is a more natural fit with the template used at Sporting.
Either way, great to see a player work through a difficult start and begin to show the world what he can do.
posted on 14/3/25
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
posted on 14/3/25
I know we’re sh-t but fans really need to have a little patience with players, especially ones coming from other countries/leagues and needing time to settle while having so much pressure on them from the very beginning.
It was always clear the lad is technically gifted and was never bought to be a high scoring striker. He seems to be working hard and that’s all you can ask from him. It’s always great to see players getting on with it and doing what the manager wants.
On a separate note I see rumours are flying around that Chelsea have got the wingback from Sporting that Amorim was supposedly desperate to get. Not really sure where he fits in their bloated squad?
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
----------------------------------------------------------------------
United could play 4-4-8 and wouldn't help much tbh
posted on 14/3/25
Looks to me like he'd be best deployed in a front 2, Sheringham/Cantona role, starting high but dropping deep.
posted on 14/3/25
When he's on it, he's wonderful with the ball at his feet.
Takes up decent positions, often picks the right pass and, maybe most importantly for us at the moment, his out-ball value is pretty significant: he's very often in the right place, gets the ball to stick, retains possession well and can help launch counters from there.
But - and they are big buts for me, and will be big buts for Amorim I think:
- His pressing is just poor in both effort and execution. He doesn't read triggers well, he doesn't know where to go without instruction, he doesn't bend his runs properly.
- More generally, he isn't agile or explosive enough for the PL or Amorimball, and I really don't think he works hard enough.
Watching last night, there were a couple of occasions on which you could hear Amorim telling him to hold in situations you know he'd want his ten to press, and I can only think he's either understanding the lad doesn't have the stamina/energy to do the job for 90 mins, he doesn't trust him to manage his energy levels himself, or he doesn't have faith in him to do it properly.
In short, although some of the shortcomings above can be coached, some can't, and for me, he just doesn't suit an Amorim side.
I expect he'll be a bench option at best as soon as Amorim has either his CM options sorted (allowing Bruno to partner Amad at ten) or a ten more suited to the role.
posted on 14/3/25
His General performance last night. 9/10. Thought he was superb.
His finishing was about 1/10 though. Needs to start putting more of his chances away to fully win me over.
I do think the slight switch of Zirkzee to the left 10 and Garnacho to the right 10 has definitely improved us. Just need someone upfront better than Rasmus. He just isn't good enough sadly.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Kaladin (U6638)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 4 minutes ago
He looks to me like a left sided player in a 4-4-3. He’s very similar to Gakpo in that he doesn’t look like a traditional wide player with his height, who goes past players with pace but has a good touch and control, can take it past a player and get a shot in.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to see him tried in a 4-4-3
----------------------------------------------------------------------
United could play 4-4-8 and wouldn't help much tbh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, we seem to pick up trophies whatever formation we play, so every cloud and that. How about you?
posted on 14/3/25
If he could finish he would be a poor mans Cantona. I was saing there is something there when many wanted to get rid and I am glad he stepped up. If he could finish he would be spectacular. We need to work on that curse at old trafford.
posted on 14/3/25
Just need someone upfront better than Rasmus. He just isn't good enough sadly.
**********************************************
If we are patient enough, what Rasmus really needs is a loan at a slightly lower level and let him get a million chances to fail without the pressure. Its obvious half the problem United has is mentality and confidence.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by TheFoxOutsideTheBox (U20459)
posted 3 hours, 4 minutes ago
He's fun to watch, at least when it goes right. Even when he's not been great he'll nutmeg someone at some point or pull out some really nice control and whilst he may not end up being good enough, I do really enjoy aspects of his game.
I'm a sucker for flair though and will give players a lot more rope if they are capable of at least moments that make me go whaaaat. Nani has always been one of my favourite United players, I can accept frustration if there's a chance of something magical.
Zirkzee was great to watch last night, really enjoyed his performance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly this
posted on 14/3/25
He's EASILY been one of the club's best player since his arrival.
What others (the more ovine/bovine types) have suggested is not really relevant. They just don't know.
Pretty much needs to be partnered 'up top' WITH Hojlund instead of behind him.
Get a proper winger, instead of the deadbeat Dalot, on the other wing to Garnacho and then there is the beginnings of a 'United type' front 6.
as for the back four .... well that's another issue for another day.
posted on 14/3/25
Speaking as a (b)ovine type, what is this back four of which you speak?
posted on 14/3/25
The issues with Zirkzee are there for all to see, lacks pace, lacks composure, for a big lad he's poor in the air and whilst he sometimes has an amazing touch, he's inconsistent with it.
I do quite like him though, however I feel he'd be best as a CF with movement around him. Happy with him as a squad option, shouldn't be starting every week.
posted on 14/3/25
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think one of the problems Rasmus is having this year which he did not last season is self inflicted.
He appears to be getting involved in wrestling matches with CB’s as opposed to getting away from them.
posted on 14/3/25
Agreed, VC, but there are signs in the last 2-3 matches that the penny has dropped. In my limited tactical understanding, on paper Amorim's system should be a better fit for his strengths than ETH's: less back-to-goal hold-up play, more running the channels. I guess it can take a while to unlearn lessons, especially when the whole team is having to do the same thing and you're low in confidence.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 hour, 8 minutes ago
Agreed, VC, but there are signs in the last 2-3 matches that the penny has dropped. In my limited tactical understanding, on paper Amorim's system should be a better fit for his strengths than ETH's: less back-to-goal hold-up play, more running the channels. I guess it can take a while to unlearn lessons, especially when the whole team is having to do the same thing and you're low in confidence.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think there are some signs that his lateral movement - which was an absolutely key facet of Gyokeres' role in Amorim's Sporting side - is starting to improve too.
That should become more and more important as we (hopefully) start to move away from a more transitional style to a more possessionally and territorially dominant game.
posted on 14/3/25
I would still wager that Hojlund will have more of a future at United under Amorim than Zirkzee.
posted on 14/3/25
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 hour, 36 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 37 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 8 minutes ago
Thought Rasmus was terrific last night, just missing the most important part of a strikers game, he cannot finish.
Worked hard, ran the channels, linked up well, pressed well, hustled the defenders, ran at them. He just cannot score right now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Unlike SE85, who believes there's no chance he'll make it at United, I remember seeing a version of Hojlund who could finish when he wasn't suffering a confidence crisis (and indeed had one of the better goal to shot ratios in the league). If he can re-access that mental space, together with continuing to make the right runs as he did last night and with the whole attack starting to function better, I think he has a real chance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think one of the problems Rasmus is having this year which he did not last season is self inflicted.
He appears to be getting involved in wrestling matches with CB’s as opposed to getting away from them.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree - which in Europe seems to be effective, but in the PL not so much.
Page 1 of 2