The Saints did exceptionally well. Arguably better than the Leinster win at the Gardens when you consider that Leinster have an unbelievably win ratio in the HC. I was personally not all that disappointed. Leinster don't wear the favourites tag all that well so i'm pretty happy that they will lose that. And we are still welland truly in control of the group so no big deal really.

From an english perspective i thought the back to back victories for Quins was great and indeed delighted to see their manager O'Shea wade in in support of the Heineken cup stating how special it is. Tho i suppose he got an ear full from the rats at the top of the PRL for doing that. Still O'Shea is a rugby man a real rugby man. He is about the game. Not the $$$$ But i suppose i will get slated because he is irish. There is always an excuse lined up.

Alright people, how is everyone?

I'll be getting another Six Nations thread up like last time early in the new year. Hope to see you all on there again.

Have a good Christmas

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theresgonnaebeashow

On another note. You're a Saints fan if im not mistaken?
Great to see them being applauded off the field by the Leinster supporters. In stark contrast to the way the Gloucester players were treated by their OWN fans who proceeded to Boo them off the field. What the hell was that all about!?

Bit harsh that Ding.

As you say this board is quiet when international's are not on but that is just the way it is. I am always around but generally post elsewhere on club rugby (I would say where but don;t want to advertise other forums).

This weekend I watched Quins, Saints and half of Leicester (2nd). I thought Quins were great but Racing Mercenaries are just not a team, no idea why Ranger isn't playing because he is awesome. Phillips is $hit and it seemed Sexton was on his own in the backline. Hernandez is finished. Wallace was brilliant and Walker played well too, Brown was Brown again!
Saints played brilliant, despite Pisi doing his best to ruin it for them. North was good at OC, perhaps he would be better suited there but would need time to adapt. I thought Lawes, Manoa, Clark and Hartley all had good games in the pack and they really didn't let Leinster get up steam. Not convinced by Madigan myself and I thought SOB (who I am a huge fan) had a very quiet game. That pin drop interception at the end was a great finish and it would have been cruel had Leinster gone over at the end which brings me on to Leicester.
Tigers really were struggling to play, I thought they had thrown away a QF place. Tuilagi (as with England) makes a massive difference to the threat they cause. Similar to the Munster game (which I caught the end of) in that they probably didn't deserve to win.

Sean O'Brian was injured and was not playing.

We missed him and his ability a lot.

That would be why

Some would say its your style of talking to people that make them not want to chat to you Ding, but hey.

Aristo

You'll find that Ding is a bit harsh sometimes. Good on him. Say what you believe without fear or favour. If someone is a far weather rugby follower, then he needs to be taken to task. Probably only watches live rugby if he gets some corporate hospitality at Twickers or elsewhere.



Ding

I am indeed a Saints fan. Many years ago I lived in Northampton for a few years, so got the bug then. A good, down to earth and knowledgeable crowd who would/will give the opposition players a bit of stick, but share a pint with them after the game. Moore and Skinner come to mind. Enjoyed their company in the members bar.

Sad to hear about Glawster though. Back in the day they were equally down to earth and knowledgeable. Mind you Kingsholm is a bit too close to the Forest of Dean for comfort.

Cobnob me and you have always gotten on. But when i see BS i call it out and always have. RKW's posts consist of swooping in when the big games are on and jumping on the bandwagon. If you take exception to my comment directed at him and those like him then i suggest you look inward for the feeling of perhaps guilt at doing the same? But i have to say. I would never have painted you with that brush as you have been on here posting regularly for ages.

As for perhaps my attitude Re: European cup rugby.... Well I haven't even gotten started! Out of respect for the regular english commenters here i have done my best to point out the facts. Yet i get toilet paper thin arguments in return. The 5(6) Unions of europe that matter including the RFU are well bloody aware that the PRL rats at the top are trying to take over. How F..***..ing dare they demand to sell the TV rights to a pan european tournament without so much as a by your leave. How dare they try to install BT are the only tv network to cover European rugby! How Dare they sell the HC out and attempt a Coup d'état where by BT rats own the tv rights to IRELAND ITALY SCOTLAND WALES FRANCE and ENGLISH top level teams

Everything i have stated is fact. There is no argument. and as i have said before read an article outside of the UK about this and you might find it enlightening as t the views of every other union.

Cobnob mate. I'm absolutely gutted about the HC and the loss of the English teams. It hurts us all. But it hurts the Premiership more in the long run. To boycott a competition when its organisers have literally given you everything you asked for. Except bend over and take a BT deal up the backside. Well F them the PRL have sold out the English clubs simple as that. and they can't even swallow their pride enough to attend ONE meeting to try and solve it.

So ye. perhaps thats a bit strong. but the truth has that effect on some

Ding - mate.

Some things just need saying, and you are far more erudite than me in such matters.

Ding

I think its the abrasive way you go about your work that can put some people off.

You seem very knowledgable and passionate but seem to have a possibly blinkered view and don't seem to take others idea's on board. I very rarelt post on here anymore, mainly due to the fools on the football boards, just don't want the rugby to become like those.

I like debate, debate can often make you change your mind, what I hate is people sticking to one argument with no room for maneuver and name calling.

Apologies if I caused offense, this board makes me tired sometimes, I think more debate should be encouraged, debate it they will come.

P.S. The heineken cup mess is just pants, as is every bloody players leaving Wales for greener grass.

Hi there Cobnob - impressive extended name you now have!

As our resident Welsh expert, and since the apparent departure of tha chap whose name was (I think Captain Hook, CCFC), our only Welsh focussed mind, I meant to ask you as to your thoughts on where the Welsh game is and where its going.

It seems odd to have such a prodigious, if somewhat schizophrenic, national side and for the club game to be in such a sad state. Wht do you think is driving this, is it that fans haven't been enthused by the regions and want the return - as do I - of the town sides, the hallowed Pontypridd, Pontypool, Caersws et al or something else?

Also, how should the clubs go forward, would joining the English clubs in a Premiership be the way forward - it would simplify the promotion, relegation issue, and might lead to better development for all English and Welsh sides - though I'm not sure what would happen to the Scots - Show your thoughts? or the Irish - Ding?

Do you think the Welsh regions would stay as they are in such a move - if indeed it happens - or would it go back to smaller sides?

Alternately, is the Pro-12 the best way forward - their certainly seem a lot of issues at the moment

Finally, if you could arrange for the assasination of the tannoy annnouncer at the Cardiff Blues I would be much obliged and delighted as his inane "Lets get behind the Bluuuuuuuuues" would turn even the most hospitable person against them, and I rather like Cardiff - very friendly annd kind football fans (despite their sometimes grim reputation) - if you're in the area of the world is the Cardiff Coal Exchange still wokring as a music venue, I alwasy thought it was wonderful!

PS - like your "every bloody players leaving Wales for greener grass" - almost had me whistling Tom Jones

I have a couple questions about Wales too.
Would all the regions survive relegation and if so would that be detrimental to English clubs and if not detrimental to the Welsh?
Will the success of the two Welsh football teams affect the numbers of youngsters playing the game?
Is a 6 year deal for Gatland a good thing for Wales?

Personally I don't want the Welsh clubs in the AP because it will hurt one or the other. It is a great league already. I think Gatland has done a very good job with Wales but six years is a very long time and much can change in that time. I think it was silly.

Hmmm, I live in Brighton now so have less contact with goings on back in Wales.

The change into regions was a massive shift and some people still haven't bought into it all these years down the line despite the affect its had on the national team.

Im from Swansea so from an Ospreys view, sharing the stadium with the Swans although good finacially means its often half empty if that. It will be bustling for games like the Scarlets at xmas etc, but not enough people get down there.

Not sure joining the English league would work, unless it was somehow incorporated into a european league, but then there will always be arguements from the english as they have more teams etc.

There will always be issues with so many unions wanting their part of the pie. We can't even sort it out in Wales with one union.

I think the Dragons could be relegated as they are seen as a feeder club of sorts, it would be a disaster for the other 3 I think.

Rugby/Football in schools was always pretty well spilt in my days, not sure what it will be like now. Back in my day it was always a dream to star in rugby over football but the two football clubs always had heathly followings.

6 years seems like madness to be honest, not sure why it needs to be that long, things can go wrong pretty quickly in Wales. Show of faith I suppose, he is doing pretty well.

Im passing Cardiff on the 24th, I'll see what I can do.

SARS

My opinion on Scottish clubs is not really that valid. I've been doing missionary work down south for the last 30 years. I'd love to think that Hawick, Gala, Boroughmuir etc could compete on the elite stage but sadly I think those days are long gone.

I suppose the saddest thing is that the Border Reivers never took off. A bit of border parochialism (verging on xenophobia) did for that I think.

As for the future of Scottish rugby, God only knows. The current model seems to be to be content to have a few playing in France, using Glasgow and Edinburgh as development clubs for young players. Mind you, I don't see the sense in the SRU (for it is they who control the clubs) hiring journeymen from all over the world to take the places of Brown, Strokosch, Barclay, Evans etc. If your going to have SRU controlled clubs, why the hell not make them a purely Scottish affair. It could only you more options for the future of the national team - God knows they are pretty sparse.

They probably couldn't afford it, but I wouldn't object to seeing central contracts issued to key players.

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As for my abrasive attitude. Sorry cobnob but hey look at it this way. I got you all in here talking about rugby didn't I. Now if only the PRL would have the same attitude and take part in negotiations instead of throwing their toys out of the pram things might be more comfortable for all.

Ding

You managed to get Scots and elite players in the same comment. Wish I could do that.

Elite to Scotland mate hahaha But jokes aside. Grey- Elite in my opinion. Another Lawes in a few years if he can regain his early form. Brown and Barkley also. You guys have the same problem/Blessing as Ireland. A conveyor belt of top class back row forwards. I reckon the right coach is all thats missing from Scotland. Maybe not world beaters, but certainly capable of beating anyone on the right day. For Ireland we desperately need a front row. Healy is world class best also a great player. But Mike ross... He's a throw back to a bygone day. and as the tight head he's the most important at scrum time. And also just because he's big and bulky doesn't make him a good prop. New laws have seen to that. England for sure are going to mince us in the scrum this coming 6 nations. BUt i have seen lots of Ireland teams and provinces win games and lose badly in the scrum. Providing it's a dry day in twickers, we will have a good go at them. but if its raining we are in the brown stuff. big time

I come a lot of times here to discuss but no one to find,

I am a passionate rugby fan and lover but a lot of times this board is dead.

One thing I have seen from the Saints game is that Hartley is not captain material for England. Í would stick with Chris Robshaw.
Saints would have won comfortably If he didnt went for the line out to get a try.

Fair play Ding.

I have a question, what is with the new process of referring decisions to the TMO, then the ref watching on the big screen and not listening to the TMO decision and making the decision themselves?? Forward pass in the Wales game as an example.

Its madness, the TMO see's more angles than gets shown on the big screens, I thought the match officials weren't allowed to view the big screens?? Anyone got any idea's?

Thats the new rules cobnob. Ref is given power to also view the replay on the big screen. Kind makes the TMO redundant in my opinion. But for me its not a good idea at all!!!! Because of course you have a partisan crowd screaming at the ref to give a try or deny a try or what ever. Only the mentally strong refs of the world can block them out. And apart from Nigel Owens i cant think of a ref capable of ignoring 70,000 screaming and clamouring french fans just for example. Once the punters realize they can have an impact on the ref....hell they will use it won't they. Thats why the TMO should have the final word in my opinion. As he's sitting in an editing van in the car park watching a live feed and far removed from the fans.