Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Lubo - Get Excited for Leeds United (U14008)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
It's a grey area topic. But then so is the death penalty and guilty verdicts. I am anti-death penalty for numerous reasons. Feel bad for the families involved in this.
Hopefully the lad gets the help he needs, sees the error in his ways, undergoes the punishment and comes out in 20 years time seeking to better society and make up for the horrible thing that he did.
More likely, he will be dead by 30.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lubo, I respect your view but disagree on what should be the outcome. The young woman concerned has paid the ultimate price. If he is released in 20 or so years time, he will be mid forties, enough time to have a career of sorts, plus perhaps raise a family. All things that he has denied to his victim. I don't believe in the death penalty, but I am firmly convinced that life should mean life in its truest sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The downside of that is how do you motivate someone who knows they will ever get out not to be a tad mental
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Zachsda, I'm not familiar with how the prison system motivates those who have already have a full life tariff. Perhaps something along the lines of more visitation rights, private facilities within the prison compound for family visits and so on?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 57 seconds ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 35 seconds ago
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Lubo - Get Excited for Leeds United (U14008)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
It's a grey area topic. But then so is the death penalty and guilty verdicts. I am anti-death penalty for numerous reasons. Feel bad for the families involved in this.
Hopefully the lad gets the help he needs, sees the error in his ways, undergoes the punishment and comes out in 20 years time seeking to better society and make up for the horrible thing that he did.
More likely, he will be dead by 30.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lubo, I respect your view but disagree on what should be the outcome. The young woman concerned has paid the ultimate price. If he is released in 20 or so years time, he will be mid forties, enough time to have a career of sorts, plus perhaps raise a family. All things that he has denied to his victim. I don't believe in the death penalty, but I am firmly convinced that life should mean life in its truest sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The downside of that is how do you motivate someone who knows they will ever get out not to be a tad mental
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Zachsda, I'm not familiar with how the prison system motivates those who have already have a full life tariff. Perhaps something along the lines of more visitation rights, private facilities within the prison compound for family visits and so on?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m not saying some folk need licking up just saying if there’s nothing to aspire too then fook it would be the mentality
It’s a waste of money as well
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wouldn't the privileges method be a way of achieving this? The money aspect is secondary to seeing justice being served in my view. How would the victims parents view his release in 20 years time I wonder?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
It's a conundrum wrapped up in a dilemma!
I’d assign the lad to be the chief “soap picker-upper” in the prison rugby team showers for the term of his sentence.
Lock him up for good, let him stew & hopefully suffer Had his chance & blew it. Poppy does not get another chance.
Terrible story and one that has no positive outcome. For a long time I was in favour of the death penalty but more recently I've lost faith in the justice system. Equally, a) prison doesn't ordinarily work and b) what about the cost to the tax payer?
Lots of questions but no answers on this one.
Let's not forget that the perpetrator of this crime is also someone's child, the parents could be perfectly innocent law abiding citizens. His "one moment of madness" is a life sentence for them too.
Always been against the death penalty.. it's just stupid and childish. Achieves nothing. Also costs more than life imprisonment.
Only morons and religious zealots want it.
And take it from someone who has a serious offender (in the eyes of most folk) in their close family.. all it takes is one drunken night. That's all it took for my brother. He's gonna pay for that night with the rest of his life.
I'm not so sure that you can dismiss the death penalty as "stupid and childish" and equally, I'm not a moron or a religious zealot!
I too have experience of crime within the family, I married into a family closely associated with Birmingham's "mafia" spending 12 months of life under police protection from a brother-in-law.
So I see it from a 360 degrees perspective.
There's plenty of reasons to support either school of thought for those who commit multiple murders continually reoffending.
It's not black or white.
People are responsible of what they put in their body. So saying drink & drugs are to blame, are a factor is irrelevant.
Regardless of drink & drugs, people have to be responsible for their actions. If they choose to abuse these things to excess they are responsible.
We have to feel for Poopys family & also that feckin idiots family too. Both will suffer
"Regardless of drink & drugs, people have to be responsible for their actions. If they choose to abuse these things to excess they are responsible."
That's very true, the problem is people see after and try and help excuse them!..
Not read through all of this but I've seen in some both sides of an argument that'll go on and on, but I'm one for the people that stand by the victims family, they are the ones that have to go through life missing one of their own, and having said that, they'll also be missing any family member that could have followed on if the victim was alive!..
Family bonding is more important than anybody that wants to take it away, and it the victims family that suffer the most!..
The person committing the crime, their family can cope knowing that their member of family is still alive, even when they've had their freedom taken away!..
Life should be exactly what it says, they should be put away never to come out again, it cant be any worst than the suffering a Mother and Father that have lost a loved one have to go through!..
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope knowing that their member of family is still alive"
Spoken like someone who had no experience of a close family member whose committed a serious crime.
The families of offenders go through hell. It's no picnic.
I do not think their hell is like that for the victims!..
Like I said, their family member is still alive, the others isn't!..
As I said.. you have no idea what you are talking about unless you've been through it
And I said I'm more for the victims family!..
Who do you think is suffering the most?..
comment by LufcGermany (U6066)
posted 14 minutes ago
And I said I'm more for the victims family!..
Who do you think is suffering the most?..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not about who suffers most, I'm simply correcting you when you say that families of offenders can cope and live normal lives.
Unless you've been in that situation you are unqualified to comment on it.
"It's not about who suffers most, I'm simply correcting you when you say that families of offenders can cope and live normal lives."
Point out where I have said that please!..
"Unless you've been in that situation you are unqualified to comment on it."
I think anyone saying what they think has a right to comment!..
Like I said in my first post, this is one that'll go on and on!..
X-Army I've seen a bit and I think I know a little more than you think!..
Point out where I have said that please!..
You asked who suffers most
You also said,
"I do not think their hell is like that for the victims"
And,
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope"
"X-Army I've seen a bit and I think I know a little more than you think"
Your fellow soldiers caulks in the shower?
Sorry, that was uncalled for
"You asked who suffers most"
Is that saying your side don't suffer?..
"I do not think their hell is like that for the victims"
Funny, that's only saying the victims family suffer more!..
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope"
Something like "their family can cope better"!..
Or do you think they can cope as well with one they've lost?..
I said it can go on and on, here's the pruf!..
So, you stay by your's I'll stay by mine!..
And yes, that last comment is the bollox you seem to play with!..
When you have a family member who's committed a serious crime, it changes your opinion of them and your feelings towards them.
It's equivalent to losing them as you realise that the person who you thought they were is not who they are.
It changes other people's opinions of you as a family.. "How did they not know?" "There must be a reason why they turned our like that" "If he's capable of that, what are his family capable of" etc.
There's never any support for families of serious offenders. Completely forgotten about and just expected to carry on as if nothings changed.
Sign in if you want to comment
What if he was your son or brother?
Page 3 of 3
posted on 17/4/19
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 17/4/19
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Lubo - Get Excited for Leeds United (U14008)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
It's a grey area topic. But then so is the death penalty and guilty verdicts. I am anti-death penalty for numerous reasons. Feel bad for the families involved in this.
Hopefully the lad gets the help he needs, sees the error in his ways, undergoes the punishment and comes out in 20 years time seeking to better society and make up for the horrible thing that he did.
More likely, he will be dead by 30.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lubo, I respect your view but disagree on what should be the outcome. The young woman concerned has paid the ultimate price. If he is released in 20 or so years time, he will be mid forties, enough time to have a career of sorts, plus perhaps raise a family. All things that he has denied to his victim. I don't believe in the death penalty, but I am firmly convinced that life should mean life in its truest sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The downside of that is how do you motivate someone who knows they will ever get out not to be a tad mental
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Zachsda, I'm not familiar with how the prison system motivates those who have already have a full life tariff. Perhaps something along the lines of more visitation rights, private facilities within the prison compound for family visits and so on?
posted on 17/4/19
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 17/4/19
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 57 seconds ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 35 seconds ago
comment by Zachsda(2019/20 going for 55) (U1850)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Sgt Wilko 92 (U5983)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Lubo - Get Excited for Leeds United (U14008)
posted 1 hour, 1 minute ago
It's a grey area topic. But then so is the death penalty and guilty verdicts. I am anti-death penalty for numerous reasons. Feel bad for the families involved in this.
Hopefully the lad gets the help he needs, sees the error in his ways, undergoes the punishment and comes out in 20 years time seeking to better society and make up for the horrible thing that he did.
More likely, he will be dead by 30.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lubo, I respect your view but disagree on what should be the outcome. The young woman concerned has paid the ultimate price. If he is released in 20 or so years time, he will be mid forties, enough time to have a career of sorts, plus perhaps raise a family. All things that he has denied to his victim. I don't believe in the death penalty, but I am firmly convinced that life should mean life in its truest sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The downside of that is how do you motivate someone who knows they will ever get out not to be a tad mental
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Zachsda, I'm not familiar with how the prison system motivates those who have already have a full life tariff. Perhaps something along the lines of more visitation rights, private facilities within the prison compound for family visits and so on?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m not saying some folk need licking up just saying if there’s nothing to aspire too then fook it would be the mentality
It’s a waste of money as well
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wouldn't the privileges method be a way of achieving this? The money aspect is secondary to seeing justice being served in my view. How would the victims parents view his release in 20 years time I wonder?
posted on 17/4/19
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 17/4/19
It's a conundrum wrapped up in a dilemma!
posted on 18/4/19
I’d assign the lad to be the chief “soap picker-upper” in the prison rugby team showers for the term of his sentence.
posted on 18/4/19
Lock him up for good, let him stew & hopefully suffer Had his chance & blew it. Poppy does not get another chance.
posted on 19/4/19
Terrible story and one that has no positive outcome. For a long time I was in favour of the death penalty but more recently I've lost faith in the justice system. Equally, a) prison doesn't ordinarily work and b) what about the cost to the tax payer?
Lots of questions but no answers on this one.
Let's not forget that the perpetrator of this crime is also someone's child, the parents could be perfectly innocent law abiding citizens. His "one moment of madness" is a life sentence for them too.
posted on 19/4/19
Always been against the death penalty.. it's just stupid and childish. Achieves nothing. Also costs more than life imprisonment.
Only morons and religious zealots want it.
And take it from someone who has a serious offender (in the eyes of most folk) in their close family.. all it takes is one drunken night. That's all it took for my brother. He's gonna pay for that night with the rest of his life.
posted on 19/4/19
I'm not so sure that you can dismiss the death penalty as "stupid and childish" and equally, I'm not a moron or a religious zealot!
I too have experience of crime within the family, I married into a family closely associated with Birmingham's "mafia" spending 12 months of life under police protection from a brother-in-law.
So I see it from a 360 degrees perspective.
There's plenty of reasons to support either school of thought for those who commit multiple murders continually reoffending.
It's not black or white.
posted on 19/4/19
People are responsible of what they put in their body. So saying drink & drugs are to blame, are a factor is irrelevant.
Regardless of drink & drugs, people have to be responsible for their actions. If they choose to abuse these things to excess they are responsible.
posted on 19/4/19
We have to feel for Poopys family & also that feckin idiots family too. Both will suffer
posted on 19/4/19
"Regardless of drink & drugs, people have to be responsible for their actions. If they choose to abuse these things to excess they are responsible."
That's very true, the problem is people see after and try and help excuse them!..
Not read through all of this but I've seen in some both sides of an argument that'll go on and on, but I'm one for the people that stand by the victims family, they are the ones that have to go through life missing one of their own, and having said that, they'll also be missing any family member that could have followed on if the victim was alive!..
Family bonding is more important than anybody that wants to take it away, and it the victims family that suffer the most!..
The person committing the crime, their family can cope knowing that their member of family is still alive, even when they've had their freedom taken away!..
Life should be exactly what it says, they should be put away never to come out again, it cant be any worst than the suffering a Mother and Father that have lost a loved one have to go through!..
posted on 19/4/19
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope knowing that their member of family is still alive"
Spoken like someone who had no experience of a close family member whose committed a serious crime.
The families of offenders go through hell. It's no picnic.
posted on 19/4/19
I do not think their hell is like that for the victims!..
Like I said, their family member is still alive, the others isn't!..
posted on 19/4/19
As I said.. you have no idea what you are talking about unless you've been through it
posted on 19/4/19
And I said I'm more for the victims family!..
Who do you think is suffering the most?..
posted on 19/4/19
comment by LufcGermany (U6066)
posted 14 minutes ago
And I said I'm more for the victims family!..
Who do you think is suffering the most?..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not about who suffers most, I'm simply correcting you when you say that families of offenders can cope and live normal lives.
Unless you've been in that situation you are unqualified to comment on it.
posted on 19/4/19
"It's not about who suffers most, I'm simply correcting you when you say that families of offenders can cope and live normal lives."
Point out where I have said that please!..
"Unless you've been in that situation you are unqualified to comment on it."
I think anyone saying what they think has a right to comment!..
Like I said in my first post, this is one that'll go on and on!..
X-Army I've seen a bit and I think I know a little more than you think!..
posted on 19/4/19
Point out where I have said that please!..
You asked who suffers most
You also said,
"I do not think their hell is like that for the victims"
And,
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope"
posted on 19/4/19
"X-Army I've seen a bit and I think I know a little more than you think"
Your fellow soldiers caulks in the shower?
posted on 19/4/19
Sorry, that was uncalled for
posted on 19/4/19
"You asked who suffers most"
Is that saying your side don't suffer?..
"I do not think their hell is like that for the victims"
Funny, that's only saying the victims family suffer more!..
"The person committing the crime, their family can cope"
Something like "their family can cope better"!..
Or do you think they can cope as well with one they've lost?..
I said it can go on and on, here's the pruf!..
So, you stay by your's I'll stay by mine!..
And yes, that last comment is the bollox you seem to play with!..
posted on 19/4/19
When you have a family member who's committed a serious crime, it changes your opinion of them and your feelings towards them.
It's equivalent to losing them as you realise that the person who you thought they were is not who they are.
It changes other people's opinions of you as a family.. "How did they not know?" "There must be a reason why they turned our like that" "If he's capable of that, what are his family capable of" etc.
There's never any support for families of serious offenders. Completely forgotten about and just expected to carry on as if nothings changed.
Page 3 of 3