Wrote this on another thread but it's relevant to much that has been expressed here. Southgate is just inept and is lucky to have good players who have a moment in matches that swings them our way.
Southgate seems to stagger his way through matches. But you really must question his ability as a coach and tactically.
For a start, taking just one left back, who was injured and hasn't played for 5 months. WTF??? Mitchell or Chilwell had to go, just to give balance and width and players who run beyond and not have to turn in and slow play down always. With our defensive frailties, even Colwill would have been a better option, he's left footed and although doesn't excel at wing back, would do a hell of a lot more than our other options. He also covers central defence.
Then, the midfield conundrum. He waits until the Euros before he tries to find a partner for Rice. Mainoo did okay last night, at least he was positive in looking to go forward always. But this should have been sorted months back.
Not taking Grealish. He's not one of my favourite players but we are always being told abouot players who offer something different. Well, when we're 1-0 up or 0-1 down, Grealish can actually dribble the ball, change the pace of the game and most importantly draw free kicks.
His reluctance to drop Saka for Palmer. Palmer is a more positive player who wants to get involved in the game, If we are dominating and attacking well, Saka is a danger, but we look better when Palmer comes on because he finds positions to pick up the ball and his intention is always forward. We lack players who want to grab the initiative and Palmer is one.
Bringing Eze on in front of Gordon, who will stay wide and actually run at the full back. It makes no sense. Continuing with Foden and Bellingham taking space away from each other.
In short, balance won´t come just from changing Rice's midfield partner. Mistakes were made even before we got the the Euros in terms of personnel and bigger errors are being commited with team selections during the competition.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 12 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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Exactly, some of these players are over hyped. Foden rarely plays well for England and is surrounded by world class talent at City - he was poor in 2021 Euros as well.
Saka just doesn’t look fit - he has about 45 mins in him and then is finished.
Trips is the worst left back at the tournament - it’s not even debatable. Guehi has been good but he is brand new.
Loads of holes in this side that we’re trying to patch up
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
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What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
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Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 54 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Neo (U9135)
posted 7 minutes ago
Good article Spurtle. I was thinking exactly the same last night.
I genuinely can't remember a worse performance tactically and subs wise from a manager than that one yesterday. The lack of game awareness to make so few substitutions when we were absolutely crying out for them, it was truly astounding.
Can't think of many worse managers out there than Southgate. The only reason we have got far in tournaments is lucky draws and the players he has had at his disposal.
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Neo
Can't believe there are still some oddballs defending Southgate and calling our takes the crazy ones.
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The crazy take is Redknapp being dropped in pre QF - ask Neo if he is up for that?
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I was only semi serious. I just think many other options would be better than Southgate. Potter would be my first choice but in the idea of getting rid mid-tournament and looking for someone to take over just as a temp solution, then Redknapp is as good as any. Obviously I know we won't get rid but we should. We should have got rid after the last World Cup.
Let's see anyway, if we can make it to the final and not get hammered by a decent team you can say you told me so. If we go out before I can say I told you so.
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Not sure you will be able to claim that as you are essentially saying another manager could get more out of this squad? We won’t know that though until the World Cup in 2026 - If Redknapp fails to qualify us or we go out before the Quarters then I will be able to say I told you so
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
Also very bored of pretending that lesser known teams should just be battered.
If there is one thing very clear from this tournament, it’s that the lesser nations have come on leaps and bounds. They’re fit, organised and motivated.
It’s just the normal English arrogance, generally spouted by people who if they’re honest have no real idea about European football.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
comment by Darren The String Fletcher (U10026)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
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Yeah we don’t look particularly fit at all. Kind of hoping it was almost planned so we peak towards the business end.
Spain used to play with Xavi Alonso and Busquets under Del Boy to protect the defence. He used to get pelters for being too defensive.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Darren The String Fletcher (U10026)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
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Yeah we don’t look particularly fit at all. Kind of hoping it was almost planned so we peak towards the business end.
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Let’s hope that’s the case. But players like Bellingham, Kane, Saka and even Walker just don’t look very sharp.
comment by Peks - Comanche Moon (U6618)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 12 minutes ago
I've revised my opinion on this in recent years. I used to be a Southgate apologist because in 2018 and, in part 2020, we relinquished control in midfield because we just didn't have the players to be able to do it. Everyone called him negative then but I backed him because it really was no fault of his that the personnel wasn't there to do it. With the emergence of Bellingham and the maturity of Rice and the guile of Foden though, that argument is no longer an excuse. We still don't control games. Not even close. In fact we look more vulnerable than we ever have without the ball.
Southgate will argue that a weakened defence requires adequate protection in midfield but that only really applies if you don't have control of a game. Spain's great side of 2008-12 boasted Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets. One man holding/dictating and two creators ahead. I'm not for a second suggesting we have talent in that sphere but the principles are the same. If you have the talent to control a game, you don't need to worry too much about protection because if you've got the ball you've less reason to worry. Control the game. Bamboozle the opposition. Tire them out. That's how the best do it and that's how we should be doing it with the talent we have in our squad.
Southgate's admission that we don't have anyone like Philips was the moment I nearly dropped to my knees. Bellingham played an an 8 for Dortmund and got a move to Madrid off the back of it. Play him there, Rice 6 and Foden 10. It's really not that hard but he just won't do it because his obsession will forever be what we do without the ball, not what we do with it. He's a relic. A Mourinho in a Pep era. Football has moved on so whether we scrape a win in this tournament or not, I want him gone. I'm done with this bullllshiiiiiiit. Get Klopp in. Offer him the world because I'm so done with getting out played by part-timers.
Our failings in this tournament are on Southgate and Southgate alone. Anyone who contradicts that is just plain wrong.
Striketeam - sure the other big teams have failed and that's why it's a lop-sided draw but it doesn't stop our side of the draw once again being massively fortunate for us. He's still one lucky basssstard. The truth is that since he's come in, despite getting to a semi, a final and the quarters in each of the last three tournaments, the only big nation we've beaten is Germany. That's it. It's luck of the draw whether you like it or not.
He's done. (although getting rid mid-tournament is madness I'd agree).
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2008 Spain midfield was Senna-Xavi-Iniesta....Senna being the best of the 3 in that tournament
Bellingham cannot control midfield, I've seen that for myself last season.
He loses the ball far too often, dwells on it alot & often makes poor decisions with his passing.....he's no Kroos !
Bellingham is a modern day Platt
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Bellingham is not supposed to control the midfield in the same way Iniesta wouldn’t have been able to if he had Rice and Mainoo next to him.
Non point talking about or comparing to Spains midfield 08-12 - you are talking about gods, may as well moan about how our fullbacks aren’t as good as Cafu and Carlos - these are freaks of nature - Spain and Brazil have not been able to create players of the same quality since - that’s why Real Madrid midfield is distinctly non Spanish and Brazil haven’t got close to a World Cup since Cafu and Carlos retired.
Bellingham is a modern day 10, capable of scoring loads, creating loads, breaking lines, pressing, and getting tackles in. He is our best player by far and is the star of Real Madrid - yesterday he showed some of that star quality at the most pivotal moment
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
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What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
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Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
comment by Eric_Draven (U20260)
posted 4 minutes ago
Wrote this on another thread but it's relevant to much that has been expressed here. Southgate is just inept and is lucky to have good players who have a moment in matches that swings them our way.
Southgate seems to stagger his way through matches. But you really must question his ability as a coach and tactically.
For a start, taking just one left back, who was injured and hasn't played for 5 months. WTF??? Mitchell or Chilwell had to go, just to give balance and width and players who run beyond and not have to turn in and slow play down always. With our defensive frailties, even Colwill would have been a better option, he's left footed and although doesn't excel at wing back, would do a hell of a lot more than our other options. He also covers central defence.
Then, the midfield conundrum. He waits until the Euros before he tries to find a partner for Rice. Mainoo did okay last night, at least he was positive in looking to go forward always. But this should have been sorted months back.
Not taking Grealish. He's not one of my favourite players but we are always being told abouot players who offer something different. Well, when we're 1-0 up or 0-1 down, Grealish can actually dribble the ball, change the pace of the game and most importantly draw free kicks.
His reluctance to drop Saka for Palmer. Palmer is a more positive player who wants to get involved in the game, If we are dominating and attacking well, Saka is a danger, but we look better when Palmer comes on because he finds positions to pick up the ball and his intention is always forward. We lack players who want to grab the initiative and Palmer is one.
Bringing Eze on in front of Gordon, who will stay wide and actually run at the full back. It makes no sense. Continuing with Foden and Bellingham taking space away from each other.
In short, balance won´t come just from changing Rice's midfield partner. Mistakes were made even before we got the the Euros in terms of personnel and bigger errors are being commited with team selections during the competition.
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Well said. I agree with most of what you said. On Grealish I suppose I didn't have the biggest issue with him not going because I felt it wasn't merited and we had enough quality players to compensate. Since there's too much imbalance and he insists on playing Foden on the left rather than Gordon, then yeah Grealish is starting to look more like a miss. Hell even Rashford looks like a miss. He doesn't fancy Gordon but he'd probably play Rashford. Only reason he didn't take him was cause he was afraid of the backlash.
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 7 minutes ago
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
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All valid criticisms - even if we won the tournament these would all be valid criticisms
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 6 minutes ago
Also very bored of pretending that lesser known teams should just be battered.
If there is one thing very clear from this tournament, it’s that the lesser nations have come on leaps and bounds. They’re fit, organised and motivated.
It’s just the normal English arrogance, generally spouted by people who if they’re honest have no real idea about European football.
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Just have to look at Georgia, Switzerland, Austria - every side has a game plan.
How many of that Slovakia side play in Europes top leagues, because I recognised quite a few of them - Skriniar and Lobotka are top players that would get in the England side. Scotland were the only Mickey Mouse side at this tournament
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
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What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
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Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 13 minutes ago
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
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So he wouldn't be getting criticism for bad management if he didn't manage badly?
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
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What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
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Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
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Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
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We were up against 3 of the hottest strikers in Europe - Vlahovic, Rasmus and Sesko - about £250m between them.
If I or you had just dismissed them pre tournament we would have been called arrogant, etc. But now England have neutralised them the narrative changes to how they aren’t that good and those sides aren’t that good blah blah.
It’s boring, we were defensively strong in the group but were poor yesterday - and Slovakia didn’t have an attacker of the level of the other 3 sides, so it was even more frustrating as we were essentially undone by their speed out wide and Walker not holding his position properly
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 10 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
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I can answer this one, what they want is England to be entertaining and winning whilst coming up against all of France, Spain, Italy, Germany, Portugal in the same tournament - anything else and we got a lucky draw
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 10 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
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I can answer this one, what they want is England to be entertaining and winning whilst coming up against all of France, Spain, Italy, Germany, Portugal in the same tournament - anything else and we got a lucky draw
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The amusing thing is all those teams have had equally, if not worse results so far.
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 11 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
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Yes, but even then the results of the formula will always be objective.
Input Values
• Win Rate: 0.6
• Major Tournaments Performance: 0.67 (normalized)
• Player Development: 4 out of 10 (0.4)
• Tactical Decision Making: 3 out of 10 (0.3)
• Team Morale and Cohesion: 6 out of 10 (0.6)
Assuming the following weights:
• w1=0.3w_1 = 0.3w1=0.3
• w2=0.25w_2 = 0.25w2=0.25
• w3=0.2w_3 = 0.2w3=0.2
• w4=0.15w_4 = 0.15w4=0.15
• w5=0.1w_5 = 0.1w5=0.1
Based on the calculated MES of 0.5325, Gareth Southgate just falls into the "Good Manager" category, as his score is between 0.5 and 0.75.
Obviously you may disagree with my scoring related to tactical decision making, team moral and cohesion and player development, so unless you purely speculate on results every bodies result would be different.
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
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What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
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Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
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Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
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We were up against 3 of the hottest strikers in Europe - Vlahovic, Rasmus and Sesko - about £250m between them.
If I or you had just dismissed them pre tournament we would have been called arrogant, etc. But now England have neutralised them the narrative changes to how they aren’t that good and those sides aren’t that good blah blah.
It’s boring, we were defensively strong in the group but were poor yesterday - and Slovakia didn’t have an attacker of the level of the other 3 sides, so it was even more frustrating as we were essentially undone by their speed out wide and Walker not holding his position properly
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Guehi's yellow yesterday was the fault of a hospital pass from Trippier. And the goal comes from all of the defence being drawn to the left to compensate for a perceived weakness. In fact, Walker had an awful game last night, but if you look carefully, the position of the whole defence was skewed a little to the left so Walker had too much space to cover and was being passed both inside and down the line. That's highlighted more by not having an established midfield partnership to help out.
To those still backing Southgate - do you think two shots on target against Slovakia is acceptable?
Technically we've created the fewest chances of any team left in the tournament. For all the supposed defensive solidity (which I think is way overblown - we've played four blunt teams who can't really create much themselves anyway) it's really not working because we're not creating enough to win games.
We are not in the quarters because we've deserved it. We've got here through blind luck.
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Is there a jammier manager than Southgate?
Page 4 of 6
6
posted on 1/7/24
Wrote this on another thread but it's relevant to much that has been expressed here. Southgate is just inept and is lucky to have good players who have a moment in matches that swings them our way.
Southgate seems to stagger his way through matches. But you really must question his ability as a coach and tactically.
For a start, taking just one left back, who was injured and hasn't played for 5 months. WTF??? Mitchell or Chilwell had to go, just to give balance and width and players who run beyond and not have to turn in and slow play down always. With our defensive frailties, even Colwill would have been a better option, he's left footed and although doesn't excel at wing back, would do a hell of a lot more than our other options. He also covers central defence.
Then, the midfield conundrum. He waits until the Euros before he tries to find a partner for Rice. Mainoo did okay last night, at least he was positive in looking to go forward always. But this should have been sorted months back.
Not taking Grealish. He's not one of my favourite players but we are always being told abouot players who offer something different. Well, when we're 1-0 up or 0-1 down, Grealish can actually dribble the ball, change the pace of the game and most importantly draw free kicks.
His reluctance to drop Saka for Palmer. Palmer is a more positive player who wants to get involved in the game, If we are dominating and attacking well, Saka is a danger, but we look better when Palmer comes on because he finds positions to pick up the ball and his intention is always forward. We lack players who want to grab the initiative and Palmer is one.
Bringing Eze on in front of Gordon, who will stay wide and actually run at the full back. It makes no sense. Continuing with Foden and Bellingham taking space away from each other.
In short, balance won´t come just from changing Rice's midfield partner. Mistakes were made even before we got the the Euros in terms of personnel and bigger errors are being commited with team selections during the competition.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 12 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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Exactly, some of these players are over hyped. Foden rarely plays well for England and is surrounded by world class talent at City - he was poor in 2021 Euros as well.
Saka just doesn’t look fit - he has about 45 mins in him and then is finished.
Trips is the worst left back at the tournament - it’s not even debatable. Guehi has been good but he is brand new.
Loads of holes in this side that we’re trying to patch up
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 54 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Neo (U9135)
posted 7 minutes ago
Good article Spurtle. I was thinking exactly the same last night.
I genuinely can't remember a worse performance tactically and subs wise from a manager than that one yesterday. The lack of game awareness to make so few substitutions when we were absolutely crying out for them, it was truly astounding.
Can't think of many worse managers out there than Southgate. The only reason we have got far in tournaments is lucky draws and the players he has had at his disposal.
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Neo
Can't believe there are still some oddballs defending Southgate and calling our takes the crazy ones.
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The crazy take is Redknapp being dropped in pre QF - ask Neo if he is up for that?
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I was only semi serious. I just think many other options would be better than Southgate. Potter would be my first choice but in the idea of getting rid mid-tournament and looking for someone to take over just as a temp solution, then Redknapp is as good as any. Obviously I know we won't get rid but we should. We should have got rid after the last World Cup.
Let's see anyway, if we can make it to the final and not get hammered by a decent team you can say you told me so. If we go out before I can say I told you so.
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Not sure you will be able to claim that as you are essentially saying another manager could get more out of this squad? We won’t know that though until the World Cup in 2026 - If Redknapp fails to qualify us or we go out before the Quarters then I will be able to say I told you so
posted on 1/7/24
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
posted on 1/7/24
Also very bored of pretending that lesser known teams should just be battered.
If there is one thing very clear from this tournament, it’s that the lesser nations have come on leaps and bounds. They’re fit, organised and motivated.
It’s just the normal English arrogance, generally spouted by people who if they’re honest have no real idea about European football.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Darren The String Fletcher (U10026)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
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This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
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Yeah we don’t look particularly fit at all. Kind of hoping it was almost planned so we peak towards the business end.
posted on 1/7/24
Spain used to play with Xavi Alonso and Busquets under Del Boy to protect the defence. He used to get pelters for being too defensive.
posted on 1/7/24
*Xabi
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Darren The String Fletcher (U10026)
posted 22 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 20 minutes ago
I want Southgate to go after this myself.
The acting like we have one of the best squads ever assembled with world class quality front to back is pretty boring though.
About five of them have ever won anything. We have Trippier at LB, no DM to speak of and no LWF of any experience. 12 of the squad are at their first tournament.
And yet weee through to the quarters (again). Booooo!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is true. And due to injuries the preparation for this tournament hasn’t been very good, it’s a worry I had before the tournament and I’ve not seen a lot yo alleviate that worry. A lot of these players look physically in bad shape.
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Yeah we don’t look particularly fit at all. Kind of hoping it was almost planned so we peak towards the business end.
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Let’s hope that’s the case. But players like Bellingham, Kane, Saka and even Walker just don’t look very sharp.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Peks - Comanche Moon (U6618)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 12 minutes ago
I've revised my opinion on this in recent years. I used to be a Southgate apologist because in 2018 and, in part 2020, we relinquished control in midfield because we just didn't have the players to be able to do it. Everyone called him negative then but I backed him because it really was no fault of his that the personnel wasn't there to do it. With the emergence of Bellingham and the maturity of Rice and the guile of Foden though, that argument is no longer an excuse. We still don't control games. Not even close. In fact we look more vulnerable than we ever have without the ball.
Southgate will argue that a weakened defence requires adequate protection in midfield but that only really applies if you don't have control of a game. Spain's great side of 2008-12 boasted Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets. One man holding/dictating and two creators ahead. I'm not for a second suggesting we have talent in that sphere but the principles are the same. If you have the talent to control a game, you don't need to worry too much about protection because if you've got the ball you've less reason to worry. Control the game. Bamboozle the opposition. Tire them out. That's how the best do it and that's how we should be doing it with the talent we have in our squad.
Southgate's admission that we don't have anyone like Philips was the moment I nearly dropped to my knees. Bellingham played an an 8 for Dortmund and got a move to Madrid off the back of it. Play him there, Rice 6 and Foden 10. It's really not that hard but he just won't do it because his obsession will forever be what we do without the ball, not what we do with it. He's a relic. A Mourinho in a Pep era. Football has moved on so whether we scrape a win in this tournament or not, I want him gone. I'm done with this bullllshiiiiiiit. Get Klopp in. Offer him the world because I'm so done with getting out played by part-timers.
Our failings in this tournament are on Southgate and Southgate alone. Anyone who contradicts that is just plain wrong.
Striketeam - sure the other big teams have failed and that's why it's a lop-sided draw but it doesn't stop our side of the draw once again being massively fortunate for us. He's still one lucky basssstard. The truth is that since he's come in, despite getting to a semi, a final and the quarters in each of the last three tournaments, the only big nation we've beaten is Germany. That's it. It's luck of the draw whether you like it or not.
He's done. (although getting rid mid-tournament is madness I'd agree).
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2008 Spain midfield was Senna-Xavi-Iniesta....Senna being the best of the 3 in that tournament
Bellingham cannot control midfield, I've seen that for myself last season.
He loses the ball far too often, dwells on it alot & often makes poor decisions with his passing.....he's no Kroos !
Bellingham is a modern day Platt
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Bellingham is not supposed to control the midfield in the same way Iniesta wouldn’t have been able to if he had Rice and Mainoo next to him.
Non point talking about or comparing to Spains midfield 08-12 - you are talking about gods, may as well moan about how our fullbacks aren’t as good as Cafu and Carlos - these are freaks of nature - Spain and Brazil have not been able to create players of the same quality since - that’s why Real Madrid midfield is distinctly non Spanish and Brazil haven’t got close to a World Cup since Cafu and Carlos retired.
Bellingham is a modern day 10, capable of scoring loads, creating loads, breaking lines, pressing, and getting tackles in. He is our best player by far and is the star of Real Madrid - yesterday he showed some of that star quality at the most pivotal moment
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
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The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
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Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
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Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
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Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
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Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
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He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Eric_Draven (U20260)
posted 4 minutes ago
Wrote this on another thread but it's relevant to much that has been expressed here. Southgate is just inept and is lucky to have good players who have a moment in matches that swings them our way.
Southgate seems to stagger his way through matches. But you really must question his ability as a coach and tactically.
For a start, taking just one left back, who was injured and hasn't played for 5 months. WTF??? Mitchell or Chilwell had to go, just to give balance and width and players who run beyond and not have to turn in and slow play down always. With our defensive frailties, even Colwill would have been a better option, he's left footed and although doesn't excel at wing back, would do a hell of a lot more than our other options. He also covers central defence.
Then, the midfield conundrum. He waits until the Euros before he tries to find a partner for Rice. Mainoo did okay last night, at least he was positive in looking to go forward always. But this should have been sorted months back.
Not taking Grealish. He's not one of my favourite players but we are always being told abouot players who offer something different. Well, when we're 1-0 up or 0-1 down, Grealish can actually dribble the ball, change the pace of the game and most importantly draw free kicks.
His reluctance to drop Saka for Palmer. Palmer is a more positive player who wants to get involved in the game, If we are dominating and attacking well, Saka is a danger, but we look better when Palmer comes on because he finds positions to pick up the ball and his intention is always forward. We lack players who want to grab the initiative and Palmer is one.
Bringing Eze on in front of Gordon, who will stay wide and actually run at the full back. It makes no sense. Continuing with Foden and Bellingham taking space away from each other.
In short, balance won´t come just from changing Rice's midfield partner. Mistakes were made even before we got the the Euros in terms of personnel and bigger errors are being commited with team selections during the competition.
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Well said. I agree with most of what you said. On Grealish I suppose I didn't have the biggest issue with him not going because I felt it wasn't merited and we had enough quality players to compensate. Since there's too much imbalance and he insists on playing Foden on the left rather than Gordon, then yeah Grealish is starting to look more like a miss. Hell even Rashford looks like a miss. He doesn't fancy Gordon but he'd probably play Rashford. Only reason he didn't take him was cause he was afraid of the backlash.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 7 minutes ago
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
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All valid criticisms - even if we won the tournament these would all be valid criticisms
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 6 minutes ago
Also very bored of pretending that lesser known teams should just be battered.
If there is one thing very clear from this tournament, it’s that the lesser nations have come on leaps and bounds. They’re fit, organised and motivated.
It’s just the normal English arrogance, generally spouted by people who if they’re honest have no real idea about European football.
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Just have to look at Georgia, Switzerland, Austria - every side has a game plan.
How many of that Slovakia side play in Europes top leagues, because I recognised quite a few of them - Skriniar and Lobotka are top players that would get in the England side. Scotland were the only Mickey Mouse side at this tournament
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
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Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by The Welsh Xavi (U15412)
posted 13 minutes ago
I think a lot of the criticism wouldn't be there had he planned a lot better given the number of square pegs in round holes.
- Picking one natural left back who at best will be fit for 3 games.
- Foden has spent the past 18 months exclusively playing RW or in midfield for England but he then puts him LW when the tournament starts.
- He's had basically 2 years to find a Kalvin Phillips replacement or adapt tactics if there's no suitable alternative.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So he wouldn't be getting criticism for bad management if he didn't manage badly?
posted on 1/7/24
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
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We were up against 3 of the hottest strikers in Europe - Vlahovic, Rasmus and Sesko - about £250m between them.
If I or you had just dismissed them pre tournament we would have been called arrogant, etc. But now England have neutralised them the narrative changes to how they aren’t that good and those sides aren’t that good blah blah.
It’s boring, we were defensively strong in the group but were poor yesterday - and Slovakia didn’t have an attacker of the level of the other 3 sides, so it was even more frustrating as we were essentially undone by their speed out wide and Walker not holding his position properly
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 10 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can answer this one, what they want is England to be entertaining and winning whilst coming up against all of France, Spain, Italy, Germany, Portugal in the same tournament - anything else and we got a lucky draw
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 10 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can answer this one, what they want is England to be entertaining and winning whilst coming up against all of France, Spain, Italy, Germany, Portugal in the same tournament - anything else and we got a lucky draw
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The amusing thing is all those teams have had equally, if not worse results so far.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 11 minutes ago
Can you provide some kind of formula/equation for what counts as good and what doesn’t please?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, but even then the results of the formula will always be objective.
Input Values
• Win Rate: 0.6
• Major Tournaments Performance: 0.67 (normalized)
• Player Development: 4 out of 10 (0.4)
• Tactical Decision Making: 3 out of 10 (0.3)
• Team Morale and Cohesion: 6 out of 10 (0.6)
Assuming the following weights:
• w1=0.3w_1 = 0.3w1=0.3
• w2=0.25w_2 = 0.25w2=0.25
• w3=0.2w_3 = 0.2w3=0.2
• w4=0.15w_4 = 0.15w4=0.15
• w5=0.1w_5 = 0.1w5=0.1
Based on the calculated MES of 0.5325, Gareth Southgate just falls into the "Good Manager" category, as his score is between 0.5 and 0.75.
Obviously you may disagree with my scoring related to tactical decision making, team moral and cohesion and player development, so unless you purely speculate on results every bodies result would be different.
posted on 1/7/24
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 45 seconds ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 32 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 21 seconds ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by Striketeam7 - confident for Southgate’s nearly slaaaags (U18109)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
I heard a stat that Southgate's England has played a top 10 ranked team 24 times in his 100 games and won 4 of them..
What makes me chuckle is that for all England's careful possession and tippy tappy ball retention based tactics and setup, its a long throw and 2nd phase from a corner which got us through.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The long ball thing was ridiculous. We've got all these quality attacking players and Southgate wants us to be Stoke City under Pulis.
I wish the FA had the balls to do what's right before it's too late.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What sack him on the eve of a quarter final with Switzerland - yer faaaacking mental if you think that’s happening.
He will be here for the duration of our tournament - however long that may be, get over it.
The worst his record will read now is:
Semi final
Final
Quarter final
Quarter final
Statistically he is Englands second greatest tournament manager.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes sack him. It's only going one way. You can see the players are being held back by negative tactics. He's a nice guy and might get on with the players, who want to protect him, but the set up and coaching is not good enough. As the saying goes, nice guys finish last. You actually need to take risks if you want to be truly successful.
I'd get in touch with Redknapp to see if he would be willing to take over for the remainder of the Euros.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you are delusional
Faaaacking Redknapp who’s legendary level of tactics amount to “run around a bit”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Redknapp who has won things, got into a top 4 twice with Spurs, got 5th with West Ham.
Who has been a better English manager in the PL era?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why hasn’t Redknapp worked for years?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Happy with retirement I assume, I don't know. Who has been a better English manager than him in the last 30 years? Has Redknapp not been as good as Southgate then?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He has had virtually no competition in the time period - Potter, Dyche, Curbs.
It’s not exactly a great yard stick is it
You could argue Eddie Howe has done more with less. You could mention Redknapp got Southampton relegated and Pompey went financially tiiits up after he left having spent quite a bit.
But yes, Redknapp was a good manager a decade ago - the blokes not managed for years - you are clearly mental if you think he is the answer for England now
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I don't know if he is the answer but I'd have more faith in that than carrying on with this same riskless manager who persists with not changing what doesn't work.
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It doesn’t work but we’re in the Quarter final whilst Italy and Croatia are at home and 2 of France, Spain, Germany, Portugal cannot progress further than us. After we’re won our group - which France and Belgium didn’t.
We are unbeaten - Portugal aren’t
But clearly nothing is working
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They've played better teams or had less luck than we have. You cannot convince me we haven't progressed via luck. Absolutely got away with it last night.
I don't really care what other teams are doing, teams by the way who have won things, where we haven't.
Pretty sure you were hyping our defensive record in this tournament the other day too, when we looked particularly shaky at times yesterday. Hardly any of our defenders had a good game. Be interesting to see how it holds up against Switzerland.
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We had statistically the second best defence in the group stage - I stated that, it isn’t hype, it’s a fact.
At the same time I have been slaughtering the use of Trippier at LB - it’s ridiculous, but Southgate painted himself into a corner by A) picking an unfit Luke Shaw B) picking Wharton over a left back
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Best defence in the group stages means very little though. There'd be what, only 1 or 2 goals in it between us and other teams? We still haven't played anyone of note either. It's just not a stat even worth bringing up to try and justify England doing well in this tournament so far.
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I didn’t use it for that purpose, I was asked what the positives were for England at the end of the group stage - and used that fact. We never really looked like conceding in the group stage whereas yesterday we were woeful and Slovakia had they kept attacking us would have almost certainly scored again
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Our defence was solid in the group almost by default. Weak teams in the group and a couple of those (Slovenia mostly) were just happy to put players behind the ball and get a point out of us by making it difficult for us to penetrate them.
If it looks solid against the better teams then it may be worth mentioning.
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We were up against 3 of the hottest strikers in Europe - Vlahovic, Rasmus and Sesko - about £250m between them.
If I or you had just dismissed them pre tournament we would have been called arrogant, etc. But now England have neutralised them the narrative changes to how they aren’t that good and those sides aren’t that good blah blah.
It’s boring, we were defensively strong in the group but were poor yesterday - and Slovakia didn’t have an attacker of the level of the other 3 sides, so it was even more frustrating as we were essentially undone by their speed out wide and Walker not holding his position properly
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Guehi's yellow yesterday was the fault of a hospital pass from Trippier. And the goal comes from all of the defence being drawn to the left to compensate for a perceived weakness. In fact, Walker had an awful game last night, but if you look carefully, the position of the whole defence was skewed a little to the left so Walker had too much space to cover and was being passed both inside and down the line. That's highlighted more by not having an established midfield partnership to help out.
posted on 1/7/24
To those still backing Southgate - do you think two shots on target against Slovakia is acceptable?
Technically we've created the fewest chances of any team left in the tournament. For all the supposed defensive solidity (which I think is way overblown - we've played four blunt teams who can't really create much themselves anyway) it's really not working because we're not creating enough to win games.
We are not in the quarters because we've deserved it. We've got here through blind luck.
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