comment by SWTN Biggish (U7916)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by The RDBD (demoted to supporting the team manag... (U1062)
posted 17 minutes ago
As already said, the driving forces behind the top PL sides this season have not been England players. Brasil 2014 is laying the fact bare.
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What about Liverpool, surely they counter your claim?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is in my view the support and tactical astuteness of the foreign players in the liverpool squad that has helped sturridge etc shine. These boys are good players. But the players in the england squad behind and at the side of the are not up to scratch. Whilst johnsons work to pass to rooney was great. It was the only good thing he did. We need consistent, quick thinking, creative players to help our forwards. We simply dont produce enough as a nation, and its a shame.
Liverpool have a good set of future players for England who need experience. Only way to get that is too play so no complaints with sterling, Henderson, sturridge, starting. I think to assume they as well as barkley, llalana etc will immediately transform us into something I've personally never seen us been (even when our premiership teams had more English players in I must add) is a bit unrealistic and harsh on calls to Roy out because of it.
Also its not just big premiership teams that rely on.foreign players to carry them. United.had van nistleroy, giggs, Ronaldo, persie, Cantona. This is not a,new problem
Roy's just not good enough and never has been. That's really what it comes down to.
We hired a manager we shouldn't have in the first place and keeping him be cause he did 'OK' generally but cocked up 50% of the WC matches we've had isn't a reason to keep him.
"If you are such a fan, you will know there is a difference between putting attacking players out there and being attacking as a team. The formation played did not suit the players he put out there."
Yes there is, but I can't believe anyone could watch those two games and think we were defensive in our mindset, just look at how all four goals happened against us, it was because the of the massive space left in the midfield and behind the defence from our attacking four, and everyone else, being so high up the pitch.
Even with that, it was individual errors that cost us more than anything. Had Rooney finished from 8 yards out, or Jagielka dropped deep, then the result would have been flipped on its head.
Its a cop out to blame the manager for me. Particularly at international football, players have to step up as there is no formation that can accommodate what all 11 players play at club level.
The only criticism to level at Hodgson is team selection for me, I disagreed with some of the players he chose in the roles. Even with that though, we created more than enough chances in both games to get results, I do not blame him for our players inability to finish.
Rather than blaming every England manager for us being crap at every tournament, I think other issues have to be looked at. First it was sven's fault, then it was mcclaren's fault, then it was capello's fault, now it's hodgson's fault. No matter who is managing the team, they never perform.
"What about Liverpool, surely they counter your claim?"
Suarez vs Henderson/Gerrard/Sturridge.
Following your argument, surely three of their club starting XI MF/attack should have got a win yesterday rather than the other one ??
comment by Citfaninlondon (U19452)
posted 1 minute ago
Liverpool have a good set of future players for England who need experience. Only way to get that is too play so no complaints with sterling, Henderson, sturridge, starting. I think to assume they as well as barkley, llalana etc will immediately transform us into something I've personally never seen us been (even when our premiership teams had more English players in I must add) is a bit unrealistic and harsh on calls to Roy out because of it.
Also its not just big premiership teams that rely on.foreign players to carry them. United.had van nistleroy, giggs, Ronaldo, persie, Cantona. This is not a,new problem
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope its not a new problems. Its been with us for years. And as long a money is the driving factor for the premiership it wont change. Its too easy to fast track a young foreign players into our acadamies under thehome grown rule, to achieve a quicker financial return to the club. Instead of nurturing english born players showing any promise.
I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job.
"I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job."
Exactly.
I don't think Hodgson. did much wrong or the team underperform particularly
That's really as good as we are right now
Unless we can get a quota system so that say at least 6 players must be homegrown on the pitch at all times in the PL,we will continue to be on a downhill path internationally.
If you look at how the U18s/U21s are treated by players and clubs as if it's beneath them,compared with how other European countries utilise them,then you can clearly see an obvious problem without needing to delve much further.
I would like to see someone like Glen Hoddle given a big role in getting the young players ready for the next World Cup and for the FA to insist on players participating in their own age group tournaments regardless of whether they are on the periphery of the full squad
Two defensive lapses + Suarez = defeat.
The game other than that more or less went as some expected.
Without any doubt hodgson should be gone and is the classic case of a yes man rather than the right man.
On paper its a hard group in reality it should have been 7 points minimum. Wrong tactics even when we were 1-0 down we still sat back and tried to counter therefore letting uruguay control the game.
The sad part is rooney will be scapegoated (despite actually putting a shift in) and lazy steven gerrard or negative clueless hodgson will get off Scott free.
What's up with Baines?
Either Roy as told him to not get forward or he's just freezing up on the big stage. It's the best part of his game yet he gets 40 yards out and just stops.
"Wrong tactics even when we were 1-0 down we still sat back and tried to counter therefore letting uruguay control the game."
Eh? It was the complete opposite, Uruguay sat back and tried to counter, not us. We had far more possession than them and pushed too high up which have them the space to counter into.
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
I still think we're going through
Italy winning out is the most likely scenario and we should be able to beat Costa Rica. That put's Uruguay out and we need to make up 1 goal in GD on Costa Rica.
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 24 minutes ago
I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes but RR I hear what you're saying there, he wasn't making fundamental Moyesey mistakes so that is positive. But, do we really want sensible and reasonable?
comment by Shinjisshin (U1700)
posted 3 minutes ago
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Young players need motivational people around them,people they can aspire to be like.
They need people like Hoddle Beckham etc who can inspire them not insipid dinosaurs like Hodgson
Hodgson is not problem. Footballers unfortunately in England are motivated by one thing. I'm sure rooney will be demanding a pay rise after his first world cup goal. This attitude, like in any job does rub off towards everyone else. Let's be honest if you were sturridge and you were playing with rooney who is on 300k/week you'd Prob be thinking "why am I Not". Ashley Cole in the past once said he took more pride (or whatever I never really pay attention to what other teams players say all the Time and this was while back) wining with Chelsea than England as he only got abuse from England fans (abd paid by Chelsea). Now this same player a lot of fans think should still have gone.
I'm short it's not Hodgsons fault the young bunch have,been corrupted by the greed of their seniors as they're the ones who should be teaching them. And we can't blame the young bunch wanting the same thing that their role models have as that is their motivation. Not pleasing the English press that will turn on them after one game.
So true, the days of playing for pride in the England shirt have gone.....
After our last few England games, I keep thinking of JT and the penguin dive against Slovenia. How many of our current squad show anything like that kind of devotion or commitment to the cause.....
While the clip is hilarious to watch, the moment and reaction speaks volumes!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9v684TpDmY
Get rid...
1) D!cking around with the CB pairing in the penultimate friendly was ridiculous, those two needed as much time as possible next to each other in the run up to the WC. Their lack of an understanding has been key to our downfall.
2) Making pre planned substitutions is completely ridiculous, no manager worth their salt would ever do this in competition football.
Bit amateur really, just like our final ball has been most of the time...
Roy has to go IMO. He played two in midfield in international football.
he had a qualifying group to arrive at his favoured tactics and players but in truth he was experimenting at a world cup ,he has to go,populist decisions that disrespected players who could still of contributed to a more defensive system
So G. Nev is being touted as the next England manager
comment by Paulpowersleftfoot #wewentagain (U1037)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Shinjisshin (U1700)
posted 3 minutes ago
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Young players need motivational people around them,people they can aspire to be like.
They need people like Hoddle Beckham etc who can inspire them not insipid dinosaurs like Hodgson
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is totally accurate.
Sign in if you want to comment
Should we replace Hodgson..................
Page 3 of 5
posted on 20/6/14
comment by SWTN Biggish (U7916)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by The RDBD (demoted to supporting the team manag... (U1062)
posted 17 minutes ago
As already said, the driving forces behind the top PL sides this season have not been England players. Brasil 2014 is laying the fact bare.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What about Liverpool, surely they counter your claim?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It is in my view the support and tactical astuteness of the foreign players in the liverpool squad that has helped sturridge etc shine. These boys are good players. But the players in the england squad behind and at the side of the are not up to scratch. Whilst johnsons work to pass to rooney was great. It was the only good thing he did. We need consistent, quick thinking, creative players to help our forwards. We simply dont produce enough as a nation, and its a shame.
posted on 20/6/14
Liverpool have a good set of future players for England who need experience. Only way to get that is too play so no complaints with sterling, Henderson, sturridge, starting. I think to assume they as well as barkley, llalana etc will immediately transform us into something I've personally never seen us been (even when our premiership teams had more English players in I must add) is a bit unrealistic and harsh on calls to Roy out because of it.
Also its not just big premiership teams that rely on.foreign players to carry them. United.had van nistleroy, giggs, Ronaldo, persie, Cantona. This is not a,new problem
posted on 20/6/14
Roy's just not good enough and never has been. That's really what it comes down to.
We hired a manager we shouldn't have in the first place and keeping him be cause he did 'OK' generally but cocked up 50% of the WC matches we've had isn't a reason to keep him.
posted on 20/6/14
"If you are such a fan, you will know there is a difference between putting attacking players out there and being attacking as a team. The formation played did not suit the players he put out there."
Yes there is, but I can't believe anyone could watch those two games and think we were defensive in our mindset, just look at how all four goals happened against us, it was because the of the massive space left in the midfield and behind the defence from our attacking four, and everyone else, being so high up the pitch.
Even with that, it was individual errors that cost us more than anything. Had Rooney finished from 8 yards out, or Jagielka dropped deep, then the result would have been flipped on its head.
Its a cop out to blame the manager for me. Particularly at international football, players have to step up as there is no formation that can accommodate what all 11 players play at club level.
The only criticism to level at Hodgson is team selection for me, I disagreed with some of the players he chose in the roles. Even with that though, we created more than enough chances in both games to get results, I do not blame him for our players inability to finish.
posted on 20/6/14
Rather than blaming every England manager for us being crap at every tournament, I think other issues have to be looked at. First it was sven's fault, then it was mcclaren's fault, then it was capello's fault, now it's hodgson's fault. No matter who is managing the team, they never perform.
posted on 20/6/14
"What about Liverpool, surely they counter your claim?"
Suarez vs Henderson/Gerrard/Sturridge.
Following your argument, surely three of their club starting XI MF/attack should have got a win yesterday rather than the other one ??
posted on 20/6/14
comment by Citfaninlondon (U19452)
posted 1 minute ago
Liverpool have a good set of future players for England who need experience. Only way to get that is too play so no complaints with sterling, Henderson, sturridge, starting. I think to assume they as well as barkley, llalana etc will immediately transform us into something I've personally never seen us been (even when our premiership teams had more English players in I must add) is a bit unrealistic and harsh on calls to Roy out because of it.
Also its not just big premiership teams that rely on.foreign players to carry them. United.had van nistleroy, giggs, Ronaldo, persie, Cantona. This is not a,new problem
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nope its not a new problems. Its been with us for years. And as long a money is the driving factor for the premiership it wont change. Its too easy to fast track a young foreign players into our acadamies under thehome grown rule, to achieve a quicker financial return to the club. Instead of nurturing english born players showing any promise.
posted on 20/6/14
I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job.
posted on 20/6/14
"I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job."
Exactly.
posted on 20/6/14
I don't think Hodgson. did much wrong or the team underperform particularly
That's really as good as we are right now
Unless we can get a quota system so that say at least 6 players must be homegrown on the pitch at all times in the PL,we will continue to be on a downhill path internationally.
If you look at how the U18s/U21s are treated by players and clubs as if it's beneath them,compared with how other European countries utilise them,then you can clearly see an obvious problem without needing to delve much further.
I would like to see someone like Glen Hoddle given a big role in getting the young players ready for the next World Cup and for the FA to insist on players participating in their own age group tournaments regardless of whether they are on the periphery of the full squad
posted on 20/6/14
Two defensive lapses + Suarez = defeat.
The game other than that more or less went as some expected.
posted on 20/6/14
Without any doubt hodgson should be gone and is the classic case of a yes man rather than the right man.
On paper its a hard group in reality it should have been 7 points minimum. Wrong tactics even when we were 1-0 down we still sat back and tried to counter therefore letting uruguay control the game.
The sad part is rooney will be scapegoated (despite actually putting a shift in) and lazy steven gerrard or negative clueless hodgson will get off Scott free.
posted on 20/6/14
What's up with Baines?
Either Roy as told him to not get forward or he's just freezing up on the big stage. It's the best part of his game yet he gets 40 yards out and just stops.
posted on 20/6/14
"Wrong tactics even when we were 1-0 down we still sat back and tried to counter therefore letting uruguay control the game."
Eh? It was the complete opposite, Uruguay sat back and tried to counter, not us. We had far more possession than them and pushed too high up which have them the space to counter into.
posted on 20/6/14
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
posted on 20/6/14
I still think we're going through
Italy winning out is the most likely scenario and we should be able to beat Costa Rica. That put's Uruguay out and we need to make up 1 goal in GD on Costa Rica.
posted on 20/6/14
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 24 minutes ago
I wouldn't replace Hodgson. His tactics and substitutions have been sensible. His selections reasonable. The team seems well prepared and motivated. We have played reasonably well against two good sides and could easily have won both games with better finishing and eliminating individual mistakes - two things Hodgson can't do anything about.
Basically, England doesn't have the players at the moment from which a world class team could be constructed. We were landed with a difficult group. The manager has done a decent job.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes but RR I hear what you're saying there, he wasn't making fundamental Moyesey mistakes so that is positive. But, do we really want sensible and reasonable?
posted on 20/6/14
comment by Shinjisshin (U1700)
posted 3 minutes ago
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Young players need motivational people around them,people they can aspire to be like.
They need people like Hoddle Beckham etc who can inspire them not insipid dinosaurs like Hodgson
posted on 20/6/14
Hodgson is not problem. Footballers unfortunately in England are motivated by one thing. I'm sure rooney will be demanding a pay rise after his first world cup goal. This attitude, like in any job does rub off towards everyone else. Let's be honest if you were sturridge and you were playing with rooney who is on 300k/week you'd Prob be thinking "why am I Not". Ashley Cole in the past once said he took more pride (or whatever I never really pay attention to what other teams players say all the Time and this was while back) wining with Chelsea than England as he only got abuse from England fans (abd paid by Chelsea). Now this same player a lot of fans think should still have gone.
I'm short it's not Hodgsons fault the young bunch have,been corrupted by the greed of their seniors as they're the ones who should be teaching them. And we can't blame the young bunch wanting the same thing that their role models have as that is their motivation. Not pleasing the English press that will turn on them after one game.
posted on 20/6/14
So true, the days of playing for pride in the England shirt have gone.....
After our last few England games, I keep thinking of JT and the penguin dive against Slovenia. How many of our current squad show anything like that kind of devotion or commitment to the cause.....
While the clip is hilarious to watch, the moment and reaction speaks volumes!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9v684TpDmY
posted on 20/6/14
Get rid...
1) D!cking around with the CB pairing in the penultimate friendly was ridiculous, those two needed as much time as possible next to each other in the run up to the WC. Their lack of an understanding has been key to our downfall.
2) Making pre planned substitutions is completely ridiculous, no manager worth their salt would ever do this in competition football.
Bit amateur really, just like our final ball has been most of the time...
posted on 20/6/14
Roy has to go IMO. He played two in midfield in international football.
posted on 20/6/14
he had a qualifying group to arrive at his favoured tactics and players but in truth he was experimenting at a world cup ,he has to go,populist decisions that disrespected players who could still of contributed to a more defensive system
posted on 20/6/14
So G. Nev is being touted as the next England manager
posted on 20/6/14
comment by Paulpowersleftfoot #wewentagain (U1037)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by Shinjisshin (U1700)
posted 3 minutes ago
Glenn Hoddle would be a good shout, providing they stick to football
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Young players need motivational people around them,people they can aspire to be like.
They need people like Hoddle Beckham etc who can inspire them not insipid dinosaurs like Hodgson
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is totally accurate.
Page 3 of 5