Bissouma is loan to sell? What is the value on that?
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 2 minutes ago
Bissouma is loan to sell? What is the value on that?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Won’t be much considering he’s out of contract next summer.
I guess £10m - £15m range
(FERMÍN): Chelsea’s interest in Fermín López is very strong and goes back a while. Chelsea is considering making an offer to sign Fermín. Chelsea has given him 48 hours to make a decision.
Via : @martinezferran [md]
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 14 minutes ago
Dev, as ever you make some salient points but they all come tumbling down when you try to wedge in the fact that "we've added 5". If you think Tel, Danso and Takai represent improvements on last season heading into a CL campaign, you're dreaming. We all know that's a nonsense argument to ultimately massage the figures to once again deliver a more favourable view of Levy.
We're 6 years on from that stadium opening, charge more for season tickets than any other club, host events all year round but spend just 42% of revenue on wages. Now I get that this still puts us in the second pack behidn the traditional elite in terms of wages spent but the fact is that we have far more wiggle room.
https://x.com/SwissRamble/status/1908058978254229573/photo/2
Generally speaking, you're right, we're competitive on transfer fees but if you refuse to pay the wages for the top players they won't be interested in coming before you've even put a bid in. That limits our chances of getting anyone established in. The fallout from a 42% wages to turnover ratio is an expensively assembled squad of kids on low wages with very few leaders. Man City spend similar amounts in terms of transfer fees but blow us out of the water in terms of wages. That's because they know that's where the elite gravitate towards. It's no coincidence that the league table of wages paid is pretty much bang on with the ACTUAL table, albeit with some outliers like United.
I just think you're looking at this all wrong. Sure we spend money (although I question that this summer) but compared to other clubs with similar revenue streams, we're getting bullied. Why? It makes no sense. Even Forest are looking more ambitious than us these days.
I might not be willing to look at the positive side of Levy but you sure as hell won't even entertain the very real negatives staring you in the face.
Like I say, let's regroup Tuesday morning and see where we are. Undercooked is my bet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wages is part of it and we do need to add some more quality, which will inevitably cost more in wages.
But you cannot focus solely on our wages and its % of revenue because that alone can be misleading. City just sold KDB on £400k a week and brought in Reijnders on £160k a week. That is not because they are systematically reducing wages, its because they are rebuilding their squad and moving on from the established to the new will often see this fall. Grealish's £225k a week is gone, Walkers £200k a week off teh books. Ait Nouri on a fraction of that, Cherki on about £140k, Oscar Bobb is an academy product on low wages, Lewis and O'Rielly the same.
Spurs wages had fallen since the departure of Dier Lloris, Kane, PEH, Perisic and other established players but that is not to say the quality has fallen.
But from here we start building it up again and that seems to be what we are doing. Kudus and Paulinha will not be on peanuts, Romero/Spence new deal, Bentancur will be the same. Our targets have been pretty ambitious, none would have been cheap in wages so to me it seems like we are aiming quite high - not at the very top level, where we will struggle to compete but certainly at a level which will add real quality, improve us and costs us big sums in fees and wages.
As for Forest, MacAtee (£25m) Hutchinson (£40m) Igor Jesus (£16m) NDoye (£38m) are not players who would move our dial forward very much and would be roundly criticised as unambitious if that was our summer...you reckon any of them on big wages?
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
none of our unsuccessful approaches have failed on the basis of payment terms. By all accounts, Eze was done and dusted with CP before he called Arteta, and Parish is a tough negotiator so there's no way that would have been a peanuts up front deal.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
none of our unsuccessful approaches have failed on the basis of payment terms. By all accounts, Eze was done and dusted with CP before he called Arteta, and Parish is a tough negotiator so there's no way that would have been a peanuts up front deal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yea no one said they did
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose I include ENIC by association but we know Lewis is not the one who does the negotiating. It is Levy who has some sort of fetish for stringing out deals, lowballing and other characteristics that make transfer deals for Spurs rarely a smooth process.
We were supposed to see some sort of changes going on this time around on account of the terrible league performance last season and yet this window has Levy finger prints still all over it. If anything the good start will only make the failings of this window as acceptable as usual.
I expect to see nothing to get done until the last day of the window and then there may be action but I doubt it's going to be anything that pleases the fans.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 11 minutes ago
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Those NF signings fail to satisfy your demand to up our wages.
On the one hand you call us unambitious, refusing to pay for top players and being tight on wages, and then you call our attempted deals as aiming 'ridiculously high"
So what is it? What do you want? Us to target top players who will demand high wages, or not?
Should we have not boethered with Eze and just gone for cheap option Dibbling? Should we not bother trying to get Savinho and gone for Hutchinson.
I would suggest that if those were who we targeted and ended up with then you'd be fuming that the wages were small and they werent established players.
See what i mean about you spinning everything negatively. You have constructed a scenario there where no outcome satisfies you. We've either been over ambitious or under ambitious. We should have targeted lower level players while also increasing the wage bill substantially.
Man City top ITK
Akanji gone. Still expecting a twist in the Savinho saga.
I can see some very unexpected signings from quite a few clubs out there.
and when quizzed if they reckon Savinho will be replaced said
No idea mate, he clearly wants the move.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
Yh if we had gone for the forest signings there would have (rightly) been more complaints across the fanbase as unambitious.
Id rather save the money and buy a great player we really want (who wants us) than buy more lower level players with potential like Forest have.
However, those players (& say dibling for everton) do represent ambition due to the level of club they are. For us to have similar ambition we need to look at a higher caliber player which, tbf we are
comment by Luka "The List" Brasi (U22178)
posted 15 minutes ago
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The ones they publish each year. Or just go on companies house.
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
comment by BISS Bash BOSSED (U8366)
posted 11 minutes ago
Yh if we had gone for the forest signings there would have (rightly) been more complaints across the fanbase as unambitious.
Id rather save the money and buy a great player we really want (who wants us) than buy more lower level players with potential like Forest have.
However, those players (& say dibling for everton) do represent ambition due to the level of club they are. For us to have similar ambition we need to look at a higher caliber player which, tbf we are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It seems like we are aiming higher but may be forced to go a bit lower to the potential of Dibbling or BEK simply to add players to areas that we are short in.
I think if Madders was fit and Deki back soon then we could may be hold fire and get our top targets at a later time, but as both are out its more urgent that we get someone in and to a degree anyone will do if we cannot get the big targets over the line (by anyone i dont mean literally anyone, but may be more of a younger punt that could come good).
When LFC got VVD, they missed out in the summer and got him in Jan, i am not sure we can afford to do that with the no.10 position with the lack of options available and the amount of games +UCL ahead.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Revenues isn't profit. i.e. are the Lewis family/Levy creaming money off the top? Which is the constant allegation being made.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 11 minutes ago
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Those NF signings fail to satisfy your demand to up our wages.
On the one hand you call us unambitious, refusing to pay for top players and being tight on wages, and then you call our attempted deals as aiming 'ridiculously high"
So what is it? What do you want? Us to target top players who will demand high wages, or not?
Should we have not boethered with Eze and just gone for cheap option Dibbling? Should we not bother trying to get Savinho and gone for Hutchinson.
I would suggest that if those were who we targeted and ended up with then you'd be fuming that the wages were small and they werent established players.
See what i mean about you spinning everything negatively. You have constructed a scenario there where no outcome satisfies you. We've either been over ambitious or under ambitious. We should have targeted lower level players while also increasing the wage bill substantially.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
absolutely.
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Luka "The List" Brasi (U22178)
posted 15 minutes ago
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The ones they publish each year. Or just go on companies house.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe look at them again. Revenues have increased yeat on year for the last 5 years and we make operating profits.
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Revenues isn't profit. i.e. are the Lewis family/Levy creaming money off the top? Which is the constant allegation being made.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell us. You read the accounts....
The club isn't 'making money' in terms of cash profit. However isn't a large proportion of that is due to stadium debt?
So while they are not strictly making money, they are growing their value of a sizeable asset
Stadium debt is serviced over 20 odd years at a very low interest rate.
Around £30-£45m a season.
The club isn't 'making money' in terms of cash profit.
False. We do make operating profit year on year. Clue. It's in the accounts.
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The Tottenham Match day thread
Page 13343 of 13602
13344 | 13345 | 13346 | 13347 | 13348
posted on 26/8/25
Bissouma is loan to sell? What is the value on that?
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 2 minutes ago
Bissouma is loan to sell? What is the value on that?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Won’t be much considering he’s out of contract next summer.
I guess £10m - £15m range
posted on 26/8/25
(FERMÍN): Chelsea’s interest in Fermín López is very strong and goes back a while. Chelsea is considering making an offer to sign Fermín. Chelsea has given him 48 hours to make a decision.
Via : @martinezferran [md]
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 14 minutes ago
Dev, as ever you make some salient points but they all come tumbling down when you try to wedge in the fact that "we've added 5". If you think Tel, Danso and Takai represent improvements on last season heading into a CL campaign, you're dreaming. We all know that's a nonsense argument to ultimately massage the figures to once again deliver a more favourable view of Levy.
We're 6 years on from that stadium opening, charge more for season tickets than any other club, host events all year round but spend just 42% of revenue on wages. Now I get that this still puts us in the second pack behidn the traditional elite in terms of wages spent but the fact is that we have far more wiggle room.
https://x.com/SwissRamble/status/1908058978254229573/photo/2
Generally speaking, you're right, we're competitive on transfer fees but if you refuse to pay the wages for the top players they won't be interested in coming before you've even put a bid in. That limits our chances of getting anyone established in. The fallout from a 42% wages to turnover ratio is an expensively assembled squad of kids on low wages with very few leaders. Man City spend similar amounts in terms of transfer fees but blow us out of the water in terms of wages. That's because they know that's where the elite gravitate towards. It's no coincidence that the league table of wages paid is pretty much bang on with the ACTUAL table, albeit with some outliers like United.
I just think you're looking at this all wrong. Sure we spend money (although I question that this summer) but compared to other clubs with similar revenue streams, we're getting bullied. Why? It makes no sense. Even Forest are looking more ambitious than us these days.
I might not be willing to look at the positive side of Levy but you sure as hell won't even entertain the very real negatives staring you in the face.
Like I say, let's regroup Tuesday morning and see where we are. Undercooked is my bet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wages is part of it and we do need to add some more quality, which will inevitably cost more in wages.
But you cannot focus solely on our wages and its % of revenue because that alone can be misleading. City just sold KDB on £400k a week and brought in Reijnders on £160k a week. That is not because they are systematically reducing wages, its because they are rebuilding their squad and moving on from the established to the new will often see this fall. Grealish's £225k a week is gone, Walkers £200k a week off teh books. Ait Nouri on a fraction of that, Cherki on about £140k, Oscar Bobb is an academy product on low wages, Lewis and O'Rielly the same.
Spurs wages had fallen since the departure of Dier Lloris, Kane, PEH, Perisic and other established players but that is not to say the quality has fallen.
But from here we start building it up again and that seems to be what we are doing. Kudus and Paulinha will not be on peanuts, Romero/Spence new deal, Bentancur will be the same. Our targets have been pretty ambitious, none would have been cheap in wages so to me it seems like we are aiming quite high - not at the very top level, where we will struggle to compete but certainly at a level which will add real quality, improve us and costs us big sums in fees and wages.
As for Forest, MacAtee (£25m) Hutchinson (£40m) Igor Jesus (£16m) NDoye (£38m) are not players who would move our dial forward very much and would be roundly criticised as unambitious if that was our summer...you reckon any of them on big wages?
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
none of our unsuccessful approaches have failed on the basis of payment terms. By all accounts, Eze was done and dusted with CP before he called Arteta, and Parish is a tough negotiator so there's no way that would have been a peanuts up front deal.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 1 second ago
I don’t think the ‘we are skint’ argument doesn’t make sense as we did bid some serious money on MGW/Eze despite how the outcomes ended up
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose it depends how we was trying to structure the deals.
If they was all back loaded with little up front like what got us in to this situation this summer where we had huge transfer payouts to make then we could have little left.
Who knows really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
none of our unsuccessful approaches have failed on the basis of payment terms. By all accounts, Eze was done and dusted with CP before he called Arteta, and Parish is a tough negotiator so there's no way that would have been a peanuts up front deal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yea no one said they did
posted on 26/8/25
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose I include ENIC by association but we know Lewis is not the one who does the negotiating. It is Levy who has some sort of fetish for stringing out deals, lowballing and other characteristics that make transfer deals for Spurs rarely a smooth process.
We were supposed to see some sort of changes going on this time around on account of the terrible league performance last season and yet this window has Levy finger prints still all over it. If anything the good start will only make the failings of this window as acceptable as usual.
I expect to see nothing to get done until the last day of the window and then there may be action but I doubt it's going to be anything that pleases the fans.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 11 minutes ago
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Those NF signings fail to satisfy your demand to up our wages.
On the one hand you call us unambitious, refusing to pay for top players and being tight on wages, and then you call our attempted deals as aiming 'ridiculously high"
So what is it? What do you want? Us to target top players who will demand high wages, or not?
Should we have not boethered with Eze and just gone for cheap option Dibbling? Should we not bother trying to get Savinho and gone for Hutchinson.
I would suggest that if those were who we targeted and ended up with then you'd be fuming that the wages were small and they werent established players.
See what i mean about you spinning everything negatively. You have constructed a scenario there where no outcome satisfies you. We've either been over ambitious or under ambitious. We should have targeted lower level players while also increasing the wage bill substantially.
posted on 26/8/25
Man City top ITK
Akanji gone. Still expecting a twist in the Savinho saga.
I can see some very unexpected signings from quite a few clubs out there.
and when quizzed if they reckon Savinho will be replaced said
No idea mate, he clearly wants the move.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
posted on 26/8/25
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
posted on 26/8/25
Yh if we had gone for the forest signings there would have (rightly) been more complaints across the fanbase as unambitious.
Id rather save the money and buy a great player we really want (who wants us) than buy more lower level players with potential like Forest have.
However, those players (& say dibling for everton) do represent ambition due to the level of club they are. For us to have similar ambition we need to look at a higher caliber player which, tbf we are
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Luka "The List" Brasi (U22178)
posted 15 minutes ago
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The ones they publish each year. Or just go on companies house.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by BISS Bash BOSSED (U8366)
posted 11 minutes ago
Yh if we had gone for the forest signings there would have (rightly) been more complaints across the fanbase as unambitious.
Id rather save the money and buy a great player we really want (who wants us) than buy more lower level players with potential like Forest have.
However, those players (& say dibling for everton) do represent ambition due to the level of club they are. For us to have similar ambition we need to look at a higher caliber player which, tbf we are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It seems like we are aiming higher but may be forced to go a bit lower to the potential of Dibbling or BEK simply to add players to areas that we are short in.
I think if Madders was fit and Deki back soon then we could may be hold fire and get our top targets at a later time, but as both are out its more urgent that we get someone in and to a degree anyone will do if we cannot get the big targets over the line (by anyone i dont mean literally anyone, but may be more of a younger punt that could come good).
When LFC got VVD, they missed out in the summer and got him in Jan, i am not sure we can afford to do that with the no.10 position with the lack of options available and the amount of games +UCL ahead.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Revenues isn't profit. i.e. are the Lewis family/Levy creaming money off the top? Which is the constant allegation being made.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 44 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 11 minutes ago
MacAtee, Hutchinson and Dibling for me all represent decent options for us. They're certainly a lot better than failing aiming ridiculously high because I guarantee you that at least two of those three will be big prem names in the future.
Why on earth are we not looking for smart buys like that rather than these ridiculous pursuits of players like Paz and even Eze. Paz is pretty much owned by R. Madrid. Are they going to take a 50% cut of any deal with Como (meaning roughly 25-30m) or buy him back for 8m Euros next year and sell him on for a much bigger profit? It's such a non-mover I couldn't understand why we bothered wasting time on it. Same for Eze. If we knew he was hellbent on Arsenal, especially given what Frank had said about players wanting to be here, why did we hang around so long. Also the MGW saga - we could have just moved on but just sat and waited for about 3 weeks before he signed a new deal. No one is being realistic or decisive at the club.
I get what you're saying on the wages/rebuild thing but this was the year to go established, particularly as we have CL football to lure the bigger names, but we haven't signed anyone you'd say is near the top tier, as good as Kudus is. We've got 5 days to prove that this isn't a deliberate attempt to drive wage costs down. It's not looking great.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Those NF signings fail to satisfy your demand to up our wages.
On the one hand you call us unambitious, refusing to pay for top players and being tight on wages, and then you call our attempted deals as aiming 'ridiculously high"
So what is it? What do you want? Us to target top players who will demand high wages, or not?
Should we have not boethered with Eze and just gone for cheap option Dibbling? Should we not bother trying to get Savinho and gone for Hutchinson.
I would suggest that if those were who we targeted and ended up with then you'd be fuming that the wages were small and they werent established players.
See what i mean about you spinning everything negatively. You have constructed a scenario there where no outcome satisfies you. We've either been over ambitious or under ambitious. We should have targeted lower level players while also increasing the wage bill substantially.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
absolutely.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Luka "The List" Brasi (U22178)
posted 15 minutes ago
What accounts are you looking at Hawk?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The ones they publish each year. Or just go on companies house.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe look at them again. Revenues have increased yeat on year for the last 5 years and we make operating profits.
posted on 26/8/25
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Hawkeye78 (U22468)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 31 seconds ago
We aren't skint, we're just doing Levy things. This window perfectly encapsulates why people have such a problem with the man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The problem is that Levy is the face of the operation but the true ambition has to come from the Lewis family. They've got the controlling share the club. In many ways Levy does get a hard time because he can only really do so much with the money he's given. The real villains in all this are the entire ENIC operation, not just Levy. He just does their bidding for them. The very fact the Lewis' family live abroad and don't go to games shows everything you need to know about how invested they actually are. They're the ones only in it for the money.
In many ways, the reason Levy is such a disaster is because he's so good at the business side, so good at generating profit that the Lewis family haven't felt the need to invest because he's generated all the funds for them. Levy's abilities are shielding the total and utter neglect of the true owners. Plus this is a cash cow that's going to keep on growing. That's the problem. It's just too lucrative for them to sell a stake but too expensive for them to put money in so where at this awful stalemate. The only way we get sold is if someone from the middle east pays something like 6-7 billion for a club valued at around 4 billion. Problem is, no one is going to do that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at our accounts the club isn't making any money. Levy isn't a great businessman anymore. The club just about supports itself. The value is only if the Lewis family sanction a sale, but they're not which is what I don't get. Unless I'm massively missing something.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are massively missing something.
The club supports itself with ever growing revenues underpinning ever growing spending.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Revenues isn't profit. i.e. are the Lewis family/Levy creaming money off the top? Which is the constant allegation being made.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell us. You read the accounts....
posted on 26/8/25
The club isn't 'making money' in terms of cash profit. However isn't a large proportion of that is due to stadium debt?
So while they are not strictly making money, they are growing their value of a sizeable asset
posted on 26/8/25
Stadium debt is serviced over 20 odd years at a very low interest rate.
Around £30-£45m a season.
posted on 26/8/25
The club isn't 'making money' in terms of cash profit.
False. We do make operating profit year on year. Clue. It's in the accounts.
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