Merseysidefox
Well done on your victory. Hope the rest of the season continues in this vain for yous.
BlackStarr (U12353)
It's just a get out.
Effectively, I could say anything and hide behind it being an opinion.
We all know when something is stupid, and when it's not. This is one of those occasions.
Common sense required here.
What really annoys me is rank hypocrisy. The push on Rafael and the dive by Vardy are dealt the usual 'oh how can United complain after all the decisions they've got down the years' by opposition fans and the media. The incidents are then deleted from memory.
If it happens at the other end then it just get added to the list of favourable decision United get, and this list gets trotted out every time United benefit from an incorrect decision.
BlackStarr (U12353)
You need to learn to use common sense, you really do.
Most decisions in football are subjective.
That doesn't mean that there aren't decisions that are very clear.
You're effectively saying that no foul is ever conclusive. There's always a valid, alternative opinion.
Which lacks common sense.
Winston I'm saying that on the subject of this penalty decision, someone holds the right to have an opinion on it that's different to yours. Or do they not have the right because you and I deem it to be clear cut?
BlackStarr (U12353)
This is just a technicality.
Of course they have the right. It's a free world - people can say what they like.
I'm a great advocator of opinions, when it comes to subjective decisions. You will find I post a lot in defence of referees for that, and don't like talking in absolutes.
But sometimes you have to step back and use a bit of common sense.
In no way was that incident a penalty. You know that, and I know that.
Sometimes just hiding behind an opinion doesn't make the suggestion any less nonsensical.
I believe the reason that LVG was so annoyed after the match, and the reason that a lot of United fans are showing so much bitterness, is because we have just shown the rest of the PL how to beat United.
Sit back and not even try, as QPR did, get dicked 4 nil.
Attack and run at them with pace, as we did, and they simply cannot cope.
Unless their back four improves dramatically, I can't even see them finishing in the top half this season*. If we can put five past them, what the hell are Chelsea and Man City going to do???
*disclaimer, this is my personal opinion. No need to get upset about it.
Winston do you have a list of which incidents should fit in the clear cut section? That should help us all
Clear cut foul: Vardy shove on Rafael
Clear cut dive: Vardy/Rafael incident #2
Clear cut pen: Blackett chop from behind
Clear cut ball out of play: Vardy cross for first goal
Hope this helps
BlackStarr (U12353)
I don't have a list, no.
But watch the video of this penalty incident. Rafael runs past Vardy, who steps to his right and throws himself into the air, and down.
There's simply no perspective where that can be classed as a foul.
As I said, if you want to talk technicalities, then of course people are entitled to their opinion.
But when there's no basis, no logic and simply no sense whatsoever, I don't see the problem with dismissing it.
Do you understand what I mean?
If not, fair enough. You stance is admirable, but I feel lacking in a bit of common sense.
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
"United fans are showing so much bitterness"
Are they?
Most I know have congratulated Leicester on a good performance and slated the United performance.
Just because I am saying Vardy dived does not mean that the above does not apply.
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 12 seconds ago
BlackStarr (U12353)
I don't have a list, no.
But watch the video of this penalty incident. Rafael runs past Vardy, who steps to his right and throws himself into the air, and down.
There's simply no perspective where that can be classed as a foul.
As I said, if you want to talk technicalities, then of course people are entitled to their opinion.
But when there's no basis, no logic and simply no sense whatsoever, I don't see the problem with dismissing it.
Do you understand what I mean?
If not, fair enough. You stance is admirable, but I feel lacking in a bit of common sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with your view of the incident. But fundamentally what makes us human and different is the fact that 100 people can look at the same incident and interpret it in different.
Granted for this incident 99 out of 100 would agree, but who are you or I to dismiss the 1 person who doesn't? It's their view, they are entitled to it
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As was I
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As was I
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How very dare you.
BlackStarr (U12353)
As I say though, that's just a technicality.
I know this is a bit extreme, but what about views that would be classed as racism?
Are people still entitled to their views?
Now, granted, they're not entitled to make racist comments.
But the point I'm getting at is there are many things that are technically subjective, but that common sense tells us whether that person is talking nonsense or not.
The idea that everyone is always entitled to an opinion and we're not allowed to dismiss it is a bit airy fairy to me.
"Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not"
This suggests you really are missing the point.
Common sense doesn't have boxes you can put things in. It doesn't work like that.
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
Yeah I think I understand where you're coming from. The way I look at it is this-
Everyone within the law is entitled to their opinion. However if someone says something I consider utterly stupid then I'm entitled to call them up on it
I guess that's what you were doing really
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 21 seconds ago
Yeah I think I understand where you're coming from. The way I look at it is this-
Everyone within the law is entitled to their opinion. However if someone says something I consider utterly stupid then I'm entitled to call them up on it
I guess that's what you were doing really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 55 seconds ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Would you "accept" my opinion then if I said that Luis Suarez had never dived - because it is subjective?
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 55 seconds ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Would you "accept" my opinion then if I said that Luis Suarez had never dived - because it is subjective?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd strongly disagree but it's your opinion. I would think your nuts but you have a right to it
Sign in if you want to comment
Enough of this rubbish!
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posted on 23/9/14
Merseysidefox
Well done on your victory. Hope the rest of the season continues in this vain for yous.
posted on 23/9/14
BlackStarr (U12353)
It's just a get out.
Effectively, I could say anything and hide behind it being an opinion.
We all know when something is stupid, and when it's not. This is one of those occasions.
Common sense required here.
posted on 23/9/14
Jesus......
posted on 23/9/14
What really annoys me is rank hypocrisy. The push on Rafael and the dive by Vardy are dealt the usual 'oh how can United complain after all the decisions they've got down the years' by opposition fans and the media. The incidents are then deleted from memory.
If it happens at the other end then it just get added to the list of favourable decision United get, and this list gets trotted out every time United benefit from an incorrect decision.
posted on 23/9/14
BlackStarr (U12353)
You need to learn to use common sense, you really do.
Most decisions in football are subjective.
That doesn't mean that there aren't decisions that are very clear.
You're effectively saying that no foul is ever conclusive. There's always a valid, alternative opinion.
Which lacks common sense.
posted on 23/9/14
Winston I'm saying that on the subject of this penalty decision, someone holds the right to have an opinion on it that's different to yours. Or do they not have the right because you and I deem it to be clear cut?
posted on 23/9/14
BlackStarr (U12353)
This is just a technicality.
Of course they have the right. It's a free world - people can say what they like.
I'm a great advocator of opinions, when it comes to subjective decisions. You will find I post a lot in defence of referees for that, and don't like talking in absolutes.
But sometimes you have to step back and use a bit of common sense.
In no way was that incident a penalty. You know that, and I know that.
Sometimes just hiding behind an opinion doesn't make the suggestion any less nonsensical.
posted on 23/9/14
I believe the reason that LVG was so annoyed after the match, and the reason that a lot of United fans are showing so much bitterness, is because we have just shown the rest of the PL how to beat United.
Sit back and not even try, as QPR did, get dicked 4 nil.
Attack and run at them with pace, as we did, and they simply cannot cope.
Unless their back four improves dramatically, I can't even see them finishing in the top half this season*. If we can put five past them, what the hell are Chelsea and Man City going to do???
*disclaimer, this is my personal opinion. No need to get upset about it.
posted on 23/9/14
Winston do you have a list of which incidents should fit in the clear cut section? That should help us all
posted on 23/9/14
Clear cut foul: Vardy shove on Rafael
Clear cut dive: Vardy/Rafael incident #2
Clear cut pen: Blackett chop from behind
Clear cut ball out of play: Vardy cross for first goal
Hope this helps
posted on 23/9/14
BlackStarr (U12353)
I don't have a list, no.
But watch the video of this penalty incident. Rafael runs past Vardy, who steps to his right and throws himself into the air, and down.
There's simply no perspective where that can be classed as a foul.
As I said, if you want to talk technicalities, then of course people are entitled to their opinion.
But when there's no basis, no logic and simply no sense whatsoever, I don't see the problem with dismissing it.
Do you understand what I mean?
If not, fair enough. You stance is admirable, but I feel lacking in a bit of common sense.
posted on 23/9/14
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
posted on 23/9/14
"United fans are showing so much bitterness"
Are they?
Most I know have congratulated Leicester on a good performance and slated the United performance.
Just because I am saying Vardy dived does not mean that the above does not apply.
posted on 23/9/14
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 12 seconds ago
BlackStarr (U12353)
I don't have a list, no.
But watch the video of this penalty incident. Rafael runs past Vardy, who steps to his right and throws himself into the air, and down.
There's simply no perspective where that can be classed as a foul.
As I said, if you want to talk technicalities, then of course people are entitled to their opinion.
But when there's no basis, no logic and simply no sense whatsoever, I don't see the problem with dismissing it.
Do you understand what I mean?
If not, fair enough. You stance is admirable, but I feel lacking in a bit of common sense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with your view of the incident. But fundamentally what makes us human and different is the fact that 100 people can look at the same incident and interpret it in different.
Granted for this incident 99 out of 100 would agree, but who are you or I to dismiss the 1 person who doesn't? It's their view, they are entitled to it
posted on 23/9/14
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
posted on 23/9/14
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As was I
posted on 23/9/14
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
Sorry Robben I meant in general, because Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In case you didn't detect it, I was extracting urine
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As was I
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How very dare you.
posted on 23/9/14
BlackStarr (U12353)
As I say though, that's just a technicality.
I know this is a bit extreme, but what about views that would be classed as racism?
Are people still entitled to their views?
Now, granted, they're not entitled to make racist comments.
But the point I'm getting at is there are many things that are technically subjective, but that common sense tells us whether that person is talking nonsense or not.
The idea that everyone is always entitled to an opinion and we're not allowed to dismiss it is a bit airy fairy to me.
posted on 23/9/14
"Winston seems to have a list of what's subjective in football and what's not"
This suggests you really are missing the point.
Common sense doesn't have boxes you can put things in. It doesn't work like that.
posted on 23/9/14
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
posted on 23/9/14
Yeah I think I understand where you're coming from. The way I look at it is this-
Everyone within the law is entitled to their opinion. However if someone says something I consider utterly stupid then I'm entitled to call them up on it
I guess that's what you were doing really
posted on 23/9/14
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 21 seconds ago
Yeah I think I understand where you're coming from. The way I look at it is this-
Everyone within the law is entitled to their opinion. However if someone says something I consider utterly stupid then I'm entitled to call them up on it
I guess that's what you were doing really
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 23/9/14
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
posted on 23/9/14
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 55 seconds ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Would you "accept" my opinion then if I said that Luis Suarez had never dived - because it is subjective?
posted on 23/9/14
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by BlackStarr (U12353)
posted 55 seconds ago
comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 44 seconds ago
I agree with Winston here, where do you draw the line on "allowing someone to have a differing opinion"? If I said this top is blue and 98 others said it is blue, do we have to say that the one person that says it is red is entitled to their opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a bit different because you have a factual frame of reference. The colour spectrum for a start. We are talking about subjective issues and penalties are problematic because a stonewall penalty to one fan is a dive to another
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Would you "accept" my opinion then if I said that Luis Suarez had never dived - because it is subjective?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd strongly disagree but it's your opinion. I would think your nuts but you have a right to it
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